Really need help

[cloverpie]

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Hi everyone,

Here goes my sob story. I applied to the Tufts and BU SMP's and the UT-Dallas Post-bac this fall. 2.55 GPA, 1500 GRE, lots of research experience, volunteering for about a year, health care consulting. I applied in mid-June and was complete by early July. I now do NOT know what to do this fall. I'll get my MCAT score back next week (7/16/2010) after voiding in May. I was very unprepared and tried to rush apps with the MCAT so I'm not sure how that went. I'm ready to re-take in January though if need be.

Would it look bad if I took a full semester load of science courses at Northeastern and Harvard Extension (8 credit hours each at both if I don't get into Northeastern's program? HES requires a 3.1 to get into their post-bac). What should I do now? My family doesn't live near any major university so I feel SOL.

 

[chibrown01]

Just take classes at a state university if you cannot get into a formal program. Make sure you stay busy with volunteering and shadowing.

 

[cloverpie]

Just take classes at a state university if you cannot get into a formal program. Make sure you stay busy with volunteering and shadowing.

Okay, plan to do all of that. So it's not a big deal if I take classes at two different universities in case I can't take more than 8 credits at each?

 

[de_la_soul]

I wouldn't get bogged down on not being accepted to those three SMPs. You applied without an MCAT score and you applied late. They probably didn't even look at your application since you didn't have an MCAT. You should apply early this fall for the SMPs and even look into the DO SMPs (unless you're hellbent on not doing DO).

It wouldn't look bad to take undergrad courses at Northeastern or Harvard. Actually it would be good because it would raise your undergrad GPA. Those schools are pretty expensive though...if it's affordable then go for it but you could also look at cheaper routes. Maybe public state schools or even community college classes although some contest that the latter are not looked as favorably -- I really don't know but you can search SDN for previous threads on that topic. You don't need a designed postbac program to take undergrad classes. You could take them as a non student if you wanted. By just taking the undergrad classes -- in a structured program or not -- will help your undergrad gpa. anyway just know that taking undergrad classes this year will look favorably on SMPs because it shows you're invested into med school and will raise your gpa...be sure to write them a letter of intent updating your fall or winter quarter grades

 

[cloverpie]

I wouldn't get bogged down on not being accepted to those three SMPs. You applied without an MCAT score and you applied late. They probably didn't even look at your application since you didn't have an MCAT. You should apply early this fall for the SMPs and even look into the DO SMPs (unless you're hellbent on not doing DO).

It wouldn't look bad to take undergrad courses at Northeastern or Harvard. Actually it would be good because it would raise your undergrad GPA. Those schools are pretty expensive though...if it's affordable then go for it but you could also look at cheaper routes. Maybe public state schools or even community college classes although some contest that the latter are not looked as favorably -- I really don't know but you can search SDN for previous threads on that topic. You don't need a designed postbac program to take undergrad classes. You could take them as a non student if you wanted. By just taking the undergrad classes -- in a structured program or not -- will help your undergrad gpa. anyway just know that taking undergrad classes this year will look favorably on SMPs because it shows you're invested into med school and will raise your gpa...be sure to write them a letter of intent updating your fall or winter quarter grades

I'm quite annoyed with UT-Dallas' administration. They rejected me over a week ago and I had to call and pull teeth with them this week to get my rejection e-mail. Not even snail mail. They just forgot to send me the e-mail, it looks like. Anyway, I'm glad to know that there is some hope. Thanks, everyone!

Would i be more competitive for SMP's if I waited until January to apply? I'd have a good semester of fall grades to boost my GPA (I plan to work my butt off) and hopefully some good science recs. I just don't want to rush and find out that I would have been more competitive had I applied in the winter instead of the fall.

 

[chibrown01]

You can def apply to Smps once you get your gpa up a little. Usually SMPs want a 3.0. If you apply in January, which is early, and have an MCAT score above a 25. I think you have a great shot. Then you can update them on your spring grades in may (incase you are waiting on a decision).

It's ok to take classes at 2 schools. It gets a little weird when you attended 7 schools. it becomes a hassle to get transcripts

Def look into cheaper options because SMPs/med schools don't care if you took prereqs at Harvard or kentucky state.

 

[theWUbear]

cloverpie - i had a ~2.5 GPA a year ago, i knew i wouldn't be competitive for SMP's, also i knew that even with a year of SMP, ACOMs would still be looking at a guy with a 2.5. I took classes at the university closest to me, all BCPM, while keeping my healthcare research/volunteering up. Got a 3.9 (boosting me to ~2.85, with the best upward trend there can be) and I'm into the SMP of my choice for the upcoming year. This is the way to go, as chibrown has also stated

 

[cloverpie]

Wow, you guys are great. Thanks so much for the advice. Applied to a couple of more post-bacs with later deadlines and was accepted to one on Monday! I also received my MCAT score today. It was a 27...I'm definitely re-taking in January because I'll need a better score to offset my low, low GPA. Can I just note that I'll be re-taking when I submit my SMP apps this fall? Will this second MCAT (hopefully higher) be considered at all in my final decision? I'm so worried about being rejected again with a low GPA/low MCAT.

 

[chibrown01]

A 27 is not that bad. Just apply to smps really early (as soon as the applicationas are available). Do you plan to apply to med school during the smp?

 

[cloverpie]

I would like to, seeing as I'm not getting any younger. 😉 What do you think of that plan?

 

[deleted248403]

A 27 is bad when you have a 2.55 cGPA.

I wouldnt bother applying to anymore SMPs until you get a solid year of classes at a decent grade. Then i'd apply to SMPs.

Most have cutoffs of cGPA of 3.0 or higher. If you had a 2.9, but a 30+ MCAT then they might swing it a little. But you are a long way from both.

You should aim to do what wubear did. A full year of good classes, then apply early, and not to the top SMPs. Tufts and BU are amongst the better ones; you should set your sights a little lower IMO

 

[chibrown01]

Retake you MCAT only if you are scoring 30+ on aamc exams. You should take as much time as you need. Possibly take it in April, you need classes to boost your gpa. Are you having trouble with the material, or are you just a bad test taker??

Either way, take your time and STUDY your butt off. Apply to med school next year if your mcat comes back 30 or higher.

Time shouldn't be an issue unless you are 30 right now.

 

[cloverpie]

Retake you MCAT only if you are scoring 30+ on aamc exams. You should take as much time as you need. Possibly take it in April, you need classes to boost your gpa. Are you having trouble with the material, or are you just a bad test taker??

Either way, take your time and STUDY your butt off. Apply to med school next year if your mcat comes back 30 or higher.

Time shouldn't be an issue unless you are 30 right now.

I'm not going to rush it anymore. Rushing is what made me half-ass the MCAT at the very end. I plan to apply to a wide range of SMP's this go-around. What I'm confused over is whether to apply as soon as the SMP applications open or to apply at the end of next spring when I have a full set of classes under my belt. I've never been a bad test-taker, which is why I'm determined to do better on the MCAT. This seemed to be a matter of not having taken classes in years/not knowing material well enough/not finding the best study materials or strategies for me until too late.

Also, lol about time not being an issue until 30. It sucks to not think of making money until my mid-thirties but so be it.

 

[chibrown01]

As soon as they come out. Waiting for classes to end in may will probably only cause your gpa to go from a 2.65 to a 2.73. (just an example) Applying early will give you a better chance of getting in

 

[deleted248403]

As soon as they come out. Waiting for classes to end in may will probably only cause your gpa to go from a 2.65 to a 2.73. (just an example) Applying early will give you a better chance of getting in

I disagree. I think you need to add a whole another year into your calculations.

If you apply early, when the apps come out in Nov/Dec, there will be nothing diff on your app other than a 27 MCAT.
That's not really going to wow them when you have a cGPA of 2.55. IMO, you need to do a whole year of solid grades, and then apply. If you apply with a 3.9 GPA for a whole year of classes then you can at least say 'hey i have shown i can do this for a year' whereas if you apply this fall - you won't have anything new or remotely impressive on your plate, maybe one semesters grades but still, not really showing a turn around after 4 yrs of not-so-great.

I think you need to add a year of post-bac classes, and then a gap year of sorts to do either do more classes/volunteer/work and then apply to SMPs

 

[cloverpie]

I disagree. I think you need to add a whole another year into your calculations.

If you apply early, when the apps come out in Nov/Dec, there will be nothing diff on your app other than a 27 MCAT.
That's not really going to wow them when you have a cGPA of 2.55. IMO, you need to do a whole year of solid grades, and then apply. If you apply with a 3.9 GPA for a whole year of classes then you can at least say 'hey i have shown i can do this for a year' whereas if you apply this fall - you won't have anything new or remotely impressive on your plate, maybe one semesters grades but still, not really showing a turn around after 4 yrs of not-so-great.

I think you need to add a year of post-bac classes, and then a gap year of sorts to do either do more classes/volunteer/work and then apply to SMPs

I worked in a neuroscience lab and continue to volunteer and shadow. I already have almost five years of research under my belt. I'm going to take classes until I apply to med school. At least from what I could tell, SMP's didn't give a damn about my research/volunteer experience which I thought was pretty extensive. Do I really need another gap year of working and shadowing? I don't think my GPA will budge much after a year which is why I'm asking about applying to SMP's for next year.

 

[jslo85]

I worked in a neuroscience lab and continue to volunteer and shadow. I already have almost five years of research under my belt. I'm going to take classes until I apply to med school. At least from what I could tell, SMP's didn't give a damn about my research/volunteer experience which I thought was pretty extensive. Do I really need another gap year of working and shadowing? I don't think my GPA will budge much after a year which is why I'm asking about applying to SMP's for next year.

That's interesting. All of the SMPs I got accepted into and interviewed at, open file format, emphasized my LORs and clinical experiences as being the strongest aspects of my application and well, my GPA as my most glaring deficiency. May I ask which SMPs you talked to to get that impression?

5 years of research is a long time and is a pretty strong statement imo. But for such an extensive amount of time, you need to have something to "show" for it. Do you have any publications, papers under your name or abstracts completed in peer reviewed journals? Strong LOR from your PI?

What everyone "needs" for e.c.s is highly subjective. If you want to look at some of the successful medical students and their resumes in applying to medical school, you'll see things like OR experience, clinical preceptorship style mentoring learning differential diagnosis and patient history taking skills, scribe, clinical/lab assistant doing blood draws, volunteer at a diabetes conference with the local medical school and health organizations, working at a sliding scale non-profit clinic in the inner city, etc . They have many different activities which show them another part of "medicine" as well as patient interaction.

I really do agree with Rob. Your GPA as it stands right now will not only get you pre-screened out of most osteopathic and allopathic schools but I'm not sure any SMP worth their salt will take a chance on you. SMPs usually only take students who they feel have a realistic shot at matriculating into medical school after successful completion of their program. WUbear brings up a legit point where he shown that he's had a troubled past but demonstrated that he can excel in upper division courses harder than those he took before with a year's worth behind his belt. To me it shows perserverence in continuing undeterred towards your goal and two, it shows an upward trend which SMPs like to see in a troubled applicant.

 

[cloverpie]

That's interesting. All of the SMPs I got accepted into and interviewed at, open file format, emphasized my LORs and clinical experiences as being the strongest aspects of my application and well, my GPA as my most glaring deficiency. May I ask which SMPs you talked to to get that impression?

5 years of research is a long time and is a pretty strong statement imo. But for such an extensive amount of time, you need to have something to "show" for it. Do you have any publications, papers under your name or abstracts completed in peer reviewed journals? Strong LOR from your PI?

What everyone "needs" for e.c.s is highly subjective. If you want to look at some of the successful medical students and their resumes in applying to medical school, you'll see things like OR experience, clinical preceptorship style mentoring learning differential diagnosis and patient history taking skills, scribe, clinical/lab assistant doing blood draws, volunteer at a diabetes conference with the local medical school and health organizations, working at a sliding scale non-profit clinic in the inner city, etc . They have many different activities which show them another part of "medicine" as well as patient interaction.

I really do agree with Rob. Your GPA as it stands right now will not only get you pre-screened out of most osteopathic and allopathic schools but I'm not sure any SMP worth their salt will take a chance on you. SMPs usually only take students who they feel have a realistic shot at matriculating into medical school after successful completion of their program. WUbear brings up a legit point where he shown that he's had a troubled past but demonstrated that he can excel in upper division courses harder than those he took before with a year's worth behind his belt. To me it shows perserverence in continuing undeterred towards your goal and two, it shows an upward trend which SMPs like to see in a troubled applicant.

I got strong letters (they enthusiastically agreed to write) from 3 PI's, 6 abstracts at major conferences and a paper in the works. I don't think it's too shabby. I didn't want to write all of my experience out but I know I could boost my clinical hours.

I'm intending to take a year of classes as a full-time post-bac. That wasn't in question. What I was asking robflbanker about is why I needed an extra year of employment before an SMP. WUBear had approximately the same GPA as me and is matriculating into an SMP after one year of post-bac GPA repair. I thought one year of full-time GPA repair plus a hopefully higher MCAT score could at least get me into an SMP next fall.

 

[deleted248403]

I didnt say you needed a full year of employment, i was suggesting something to do.

Seen as your GPA is clearly not going to win you anything, you need to ensure your ECs are rockstar. It sounds like your research is solid BUT what about clinical exposure? volunteering? shadowing?

You haven't given us everything yet but I was suggesting something to do in the year while you are applying to SMPs, as you'll need to either take a gap or keep taking classes while you apply to SMPS after having a full-year of 3.9 under your belt.

You need a >3.9 in your classes - anything less simply isnt going to cut it. A GPA of 3.6 is good, but not when you are trying to recover from a 2.55