Rejected from my only II during my gap year/ 3.6, 514, no clue how to move forward.

[Sharknad0]

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I applied to 27 schools (21 in September, 6 in October), only had 1 II that was in December, and I just got denied. From my UG state school. I need to start looking at how to fill my most likely 2nd gap year.

I have a 3.61 cGPA, 3.44 sGPA, and a 514 that I got in June 2018.

Activities:
Shadowing - 50 hours cardiology, 50 hours GI
Volunteering - 210 hours in sober driving group on campus, 60 hours dance marathon, 50 hours service fraternity, ~30 hours at campus hospital doing housekeeping.
Research - 3 years in child development lab (3 posters), 1.5 years immunotherapy research, 250 hours/1 summer doing lipid research.
Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad
Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team
Misc - 200 hours working for my real estate company I helped co-found

I'm just so defeated. I haven't had any good news this entire cycle and it looks like I'm gearing up for another year. I worked as a scribe for like 2 months but the doctor decided to can the scribe program, and after that I just focused on the real estate stuff and did some more shadowing here and there.

I don't know what to do other than start looking at things like Masters programs and start rewriting essays.

Any help? Sorry if this post isn't detailed enough, just got the rejection and I'm still reeling.

 

[eaglebaseball4]

1. You likely need more clinical experience. Volunteer at a hospital or hospice program. 2. It would also help to get some primary care shadowing (FM, peds, IM). 3. Also your gpa is a little low. There are several ways to remedy this with post bacc or smp. 4. Also apply early next time. Are you in a competitive state for premeds? In an easy state like Mississippi or Georgia you would more likely be admitted with your current app. I hate it for you but I wish you the best of luck!

 

[965978]

You seem to lack clinical experience by a wide margin from the acceptable amount.

Your sGPA being below 3.5 might be hurting you as well (can you comment on the year by year trend on this?)

What state are you from? Are you suspecting any bad letters? What was your school list?

You also applied kinda late.

 

[Goro]

I applied to 27 schools (21 in September, 6 in October), only had 1 II that was in December, and I just got denied. From my UG state school. I need to start looking at how to fill my most likely 2nd gap year.

I have a 3.61 cGPA, 3.44 sGPA, and a 514 that I got in June 2018.

Activities:
Shadowing - 50 hours cardiology, 50 hours GI
Volunteering - 210 hours in sober driving group on campus, 60 hours dance marathon, 50 hours service fraternity, ~30 hours at campus hospital doing housekeeping.
Research - 3 years in child development lab (3 posters), 1.5 years immunotherapy research, 250 hours/1 summer doing lipid research.
Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad
Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team
Misc - 200 hours working for my real estate company I helped co-found

I'm just so defeated. I haven't had any good news this entire cycle and it looks like I'm gearing up for another year. I worked as a scribe for like 2 months but the doctor decided to can the scribe program, and after that I just focused on the real estate stuff and did some more shadowing here and there.

I don't know what to do other than start looking at things like Masters programs and start rewriting essays.

Any help? Sorry if this post isn't detailed enough, just got the rejection and I'm still reeling.

1) Get off campus and out of your comfort zone
2) delete any mention of the mission trip. We view those as medical tourism,
3) Drop the clubs
4) Get > 150 hrs of patient contact experience
5) Get > 150 hrs of service to others less fortunate than yourself
6) No more research
7) Rewrite all essays and have multiple eyeballs vet them
8) Work on interview skills.
9) Take a gap year to do all the above.

What was your school list? I suggest the following, but invest in MSAR and remove schools where your GPAs are < their 10th %iles for acceptees.
U VM
U Toledo
Miami
St. Louis
Albany
Albert Einstein
Rochester
Rush
Rosy Franklin
NYMC
EVMS
Wake Forest
Jefferson
Temple
Drexel
Creighton
Tulane
USC/Keck
Dartmouth
Seton Hall
MCW
Loyola
Emory
BU
Pitt
Hofstra
Tufts
Oakland-B
Western MI
Uniformed Services University/Hebert (just be aware of the military service commitment)
Nova MD
Your state school(s).
Any DO program. I can't recommend Touro-NY, Nova, Wm Carey, LUCOM, for different reasons. MSUCOM? Read up on Larry Nasser and you decide. LMU has an accreditation warning, which concerns me.

You need DO programs on the list due to the below avg sGPA and that you're a reapplicant, and beggars can't be choosy.

 

[Sharknad0]

1. You likely need more clinical experience. Volunteer at a hospital or hospice program. 2. It would also help to get some primary care shadowing (FM, peds, IM). 3. Also your gpa is a little low. There are several ways to remedy this with post bacc or smp. 4. Also apply early next time. Are you in a competitive state for premeds? In an easy state like Mississippi or Georgia you would more likely be admitted with your current app. I hate it for you but I wish you the best of luck!

1. Definitely gonna start applying to any programs at hospitals
2. Gonna add some IM shadowing in Feb
3. I looked into post-baccs vs. SMP's and don't know what to do because schools won't have my PB grades when I apply, so they won't see my increased (hopefully) GPA.
4. Abso-freaking-lutely
5. Missouri

You seem to lack clinical experience by a wide margin from the acceptable amount.

Your sGPA being below 3.5 might be hurting you as well (can you comment on the year by year trend on this?)

What state are you from? Are you suspecting any bad letters? What was your school list?

You also applied kinda late.

1. Yeah, I had a solid chunk of clinical hours when scribing but that wasn't factored into AMCAS
2. MO, GPA trend attached

3. I don't think I had bad letters, but one of my science letters might not have been the best, could have just been average.

School list, yes there's a bunch of reaches but I thought since I had ~20 decent chance schools I could add some reaches
Waiting on
Rosalind Franklin
Thomas Jefferson
Albert Einstein
Brown
Saint Louis
Tufts
U Rochester
Columbia
Ohio State
Temple
Wake Forest
Loyola
Morsani
U Illinois
U Miami

Rejected
Stanford
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Hofstra
BU
USC
VCU
Mizzou
Dartmouth
Michigan
Georgetown
GW

 

[Sharknad0]

@Goro Aside from getting these hours before the new cycle starts (definitely want to be submitting on day 1 now), what should I do over the next gap year? Post-bacc to raise sGPA (even though these courses won't be counted for my GPA before application), or an SMP (even though, again, AMCAS won't have the SMP information for my app)

 

[965978]

1. Definitely gonna start applying to any programs at hospitals
2. Gonna add some IM shadowing in Feb
3. I looked into post-baccs vs. SMP's and don't know what to do because schools won't have my PB grades when I apply, so they won't see my increased (hopefully) GPA.
4. Abso-freaking-lutely
5. Missouri



1. Yeah, I had a solid chunk of clinical hours when scribing but that wasn't factored into AMCAS
2. MO, GPA trend attachedView attachment 249276
3. I don't think I had bad letters, but one of my science letters might not have been the best, could have just been average.

School list, yes there's a bunch of reaches but I thought since I had ~20 decent chance schools I could add some reaches
Waiting on
Rosalind Franklin
Thomas Jefferson
Albert Einstein
Brown
Saint Louis
Tufts
U Rochester
Columbia
Ohio State
Temple
Wake Forest
Loyola
Morsani
U Illinois
U Miami

Rejected
Stanford
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Hofstra
BU
USC
VCU
Mizzou
Dartmouth
Michigan
Georgetown
GW

Some of those schools have already had massive R waves so there is some hope for this cycle but I would suggest going full force preparing for the next one

 

[MKO]

1. Definitely gonna start applying to any programs at hospitals
2. Gonna add some IM shadowing in Feb
3. I looked into post-baccs vs. SMP's and don't know what to do because schools won't have my PB grades when I apply, so they won't see my increased (hopefully) GPA.
4. Abso-freaking-lutely
5. Missouri



1. Yeah, I had a solid chunk of clinical hours when scribing but that wasn't factored into AMCAS
2. MO, GPA trend attachedView attachment 249276
3. I don't think I had bad letters, but one of my science letters might not have been the best, could have just been average.

School list, yes there's a bunch of reaches but I thought since I had ~20 decent chance schools I could add some reaches
Waiting on
Rosalind Franklin
Thomas Jefferson
Albert Einstein
Brown
Saint Louis
Tufts
U Rochester
Columbia
Ohio State
Temple
Wake Forest
Loyola
Morsani
U Illinois
U Miami

Rejected
Stanford
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Hofstra
BU
USC
VCU
Mizzou
Dartmouth
Michigan
Georgetown
GW

Your school list is horrendous. You applied to schools way out of your reach, like:

UMich,
Darthmouth
USC
BU
Vandy
BU
Cornell
Stanford
Columbia
Einstein
Brown

Those were more-or-less donations. Your application also looks basic to me. There is no “X factor” or anything that would even minutely impress me. Admissions is in a way a game. You need to stand out when there are 10,000+ other applicants. That is done through kickass ECs and then writing passionately about those ECs. Only then will more adcoms consider putting your application on the side to consider you for an II

 

[Goro]

These were all donations.


Albert Einstein
Brown
U Rochester
Columbia
Ohio State
Morsani
U Illinois
Stanford
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Hofstra
BU
USC
Mizzou
Dartmouth
Michigan

@Goro Aside from getting these hours before the new cycle starts (definitely want to be submitting on day 1 now), what should I do over the next gap year? Post-bacc to raise sGPA (even though these courses won't be counted for my GPA before application), or an SMP (even though, again, AMCAS won't have the SMP information for my app)

You're in a marathon now, not a sprint. For your gap year I recommend either: getting clinical employment (like scribing, phlebotomy etc) that has patient contact experience. Beef up your app and then apply for the 2020-2021 cycle

OR

Do a post-bacc or SMP. Ace that, and then apply for the 2020-2021 cycle. You are not going to be able to fix your app in time for the 2019 app cycle. You apply when you have the best possible app.

As a teaching moment to SDNers, a single good SR year doesn't rescue a weak sGPA or cGPA, even with a nice MCAT score.

 

[965978]

These were all donations.
...

Mizzou

OP is from Missouri so I'm guessing Mizzou is where they got an II from and subsequently rejected

 

[Pharaoh95]

Low sGPA, seemingly cookie cutter EC’s, abysmal clinical experience (different from shadowing), very late applications, possibly poor primary and secondary application writing and essays, questionable school list, and poor interview skills. There are many, many areas you can improve upon. As a re-applicant, I've been in your shoes and I completely understand the sinking feeling of defeat and helplessness after realizing that you're not going to get in this year. But keep your chin up and keep working on your weaknesses. You've got this. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.

 

[puahate]

OP i know you getting a lot thrown at you. I just wanted to say: stay strong, you got this.

 

[DrFortiusNatando]

Like Goro, I think you will be much better off if you plan to do all the things possible to strengthen your application and plan to apply in 2020-2021 cycle. You will also then be able to get your application in early that year, which makes a difference for all students except the truly exceptional high stats kids (who can apply later and will still stand out).

In the meantime, select those activities that you will truly enjoy from the recommended categories. This is a marathon, but you really should enjoy the running part! Find volunteer and clinical activities that tell a story and make sense to the story of who you are and who you want to be.

 

[efle]

I honestly don't think your app has any major EC problems that need to be patched up. You just needed to aim a lot lower with your school list b/cus of the 3.4 sGPA. Apply super early to 20+ places where you're more competitive and you'll get IIs.

 

[ciestar]

I honestly don't think your app has any major EC problems that need to be patched up. You just needed to aim a lot lower with your school list b/cus of the 3.4 sGPA. Apply super early to 20+ places where you're more competitive and you'll get IIs.

I disagree on the ECs. OP mentioned their only clinical experience is a missions trip.

But yes, OP’s school list was bad.

 

[efle]

I disagree on the ECs. OP mentioned their only clinical experience is a missions trip.

But yes, OP’s school list was bad.

100 hrs shadowing and 30 hrs hospital volunteering too though. Checks the box better than a lot of my old friends who are now in med school. The only person I knew that struggled a lot with a top decile MCAT, eventually got into their state school + 1 low private, also was a science major with a 3.4 though

 

[candbgirl]

I disagree on the ECs. OP mentioned their only clinical experience is a missions trip.

But yes, OP’s school list was bad.

This and the nonclinical is all campus/fraternity based. Your ECs are a problem and your school list isn’t realistic. Did you use the MSAR to develop your list? Did you apply to any DO schools? The good news is that your MCAT is current so you have time to fix your application and reapply when you are ready.

 

[solitarius]

I'm just so defeated. I haven't had any good news this entire cycle and it looks like I'm gearing up for another year. I worked as a scribe for like 2 months but the doctor decided to can the scribe program, and after that I just focused on the real estate stuff and did some more shadowing here and there.

I don't know what to do other than start looking at things like Masters programs and start rewriting essays.

Any help? Sorry if this post isn't detailed enough, just got the rejection and I'm still reeling.

You have no idea what you are signing up for. You have no clue as to how elite MD admissions is, or the caliber of student admitted to any MD program.

 

[Dwight Snoot]

Definitely mix in some DO next cycle.
I agree with the above posts that you are missing any significant clinical exposure. Try to become a medical assistant, EMT, phleb, and do that for a year or so. Keep up the hard work and good luck!

 

[doc05]

Please get some real clinical experience. You have nothing.

Your “service” activities are a joke, better off not listing them because they’re ridiculous, like most frat activities.

Any particular reason why you applied to so many top schools, like Stanford, Columbia, etc?

 

[Goro]

You have no idea what you are signing up for. You have no clue as to how elite MD admissions is, or the caliber of student admitted to any MD program.

I wouldn't say elite, but rather competitive.

 

[Lifeblood_20]

Dang, lots of tough love here. The OP does need some work but no need to be harsh.

Your school list is horrendous. You applied to schools way out of your reach, like:

UMich,
Darthmouth
USC
BU
Vandy
BU
Cornell
Stanford
Columbia
Einstein
Brown

Those were more-or-less donations. Your application also looks basic to me. There is no “X factor” or anything that would even minutely impress me. Admissions is in a way a game. You need to stand out when there are 10,000+ other applicants. That is done through kickass ECs and then writing passionately about those ECs. Only then will more adcoms consider putting your application on the side to consider you for an II

OP, this is the best advice you've gotten so far, especially the bolded. Make a better school list and rewrite your essays. Your experiences are only as meaningful or as impressive as you make them out to be. Your application has to have a "story" about you, with your passion and character shining through. You don't have to re-do any ECs, just gotta find a way to frame a convincing narrative.

 

[Goro]

Dang, lots of tough love here. The OP does need some work but no need to be harsh.
OP, this is the best advice you've gotten so far, especially the bolded. Make a better school list and rewrite your essays. Your experiences are only as meaningful or as impressive as you make them out to be. Your application has to have a "story" about you, with your passion and character shining through. You don't have to re-do any ECs, just gotta find a way to frame a convincing narrative.

Penguin, you know better! This is advice so bad that it's almost malicious.
To reiterate Op's mistakes:

• Low sGPA,
• seemingly cookie cutter EC’s. And 100% on campus.
• abysmal clinical experience (different from shadowing). With 0 hrs of domestic clinicals, my own student interviewers would eat OP alive.
• very late applications,

There is no "story" or narrative here that the OP could possibly spin to make him/herself a competitive candidate.

Volunteering - 210 hours in sober driving group on campus, 60 hours dance marathon, 50 hours service fraternity, ~30 hours at campus hospital doing housekeeping.
Research - 3 years in child development lab (3 posters), 1.5 years immunotherapy research, 250 hours/1 summer doing lipid research.
Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad
Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team

 

[Ad2b]

At OP:

1. go to a homeless shelter and offer to help; it can be smelly, it can be dirty and likely will be both; mostly, what i've found is while stocking the shelves and helping women and men in the clothing "department", their lives are not so different than mine, I just had better luck; not only do you get an eye opening story but hopefully, you learn a little more about yourself and how lucky you are vs. feeling defeated

2. go to an animal shelter and clean pens; seriously, clean up the guano on the floor and pet the dogs/cats; hear the stories of why they ended up there; some were strays but many were throw aways by family's who just ceased caring anymore which should remind you of #1

Volunteer anywhere that helps someone else: meals on wheels, American Red Cross; if you're an Alpha Phi, this should be accessible to you via the frat (I'm a former Gamma Sig); find a home where orphans are left and ask to help; go to the Ronald McDonald house and ask to serve supper for the families of sick children...

You'd be amazed at what you learn about them, but better yet, what you learn about yourself

 

[Lifeblood_20]

Penguin, you know better! This is advice so bad that it's almost malicious.
To reiterate Op's mistakes:

• Low sGPA,
• seemingly cookie cutter EC’s. And 100% on campus.
• abysmal clinical experience (different from shadowing). With 340 hrs only of domestic clinicals, my own student interviewers would eat OP alive.
• very late applications,

There is no "story" or narrative here that the OP could possibly spin to make him/herself a competitive candidate.

Volunteering - 210 hours in sober driving group on campus, 60 hours dance marathon, 50 hours service fraternity, ~30 hours at campus hospital doing housekeeping.
Research - 3 years in child development lab (3 posters), 1.5 years immunotherapy research, 250 hours/1 summer doing lipid research.
Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad
Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team

I suppose I could have phrased my post better. By "not needing to re-do ECs" I meant the OP doesn't have to patch up major holes or discredit things they've done up to this point, which the other posters seem to suggest. Just because the non-clinical volunteering are non-congruent/campus based, or that the clinical experiences aren't impressive, doesn't mean the OP can't write a coherent story based on the experiences they already have.

Why did you do this activity, what did you learn from it, how did this drive you to service/medicine?

Sure, more experience helps, and better experiences lead to better essays, but not every applicant has to be Harvard/Stanford caliber to get into ANY med school. OP needs to find a better way to sell themselves and a better list of schools to sell themselves to.

 

[Master Thinker]

I think your ECs are pretty cookie cutter and GPA is on the low end for many schools that you applied to. I would mix in some DO schools and apply earlier next cycle if I were you. SMP/post-bacc not really necessary unless you really want MD.

 

[ReginaZ0403]

1) Get off campus and out of your comfort zone
2) delete any mention of the mission trip. We view those as medical tourism,
3) Drop the clubs
4) Get > 150 hrs of patient contact experience
5) Get > 150 hrs of service to others less fortunate than yourself
6) No more research
7) Rewrite all essays and have multiple eyeballs vet them
8) Work on interview skills.
9) Take a gap year to do all the above.

What was your school list? I suggest the following, but invest in MSAR and remove schools where your GPAs are < their 10th %iles for acceptees.
U VM
U Toledo
Miami
St. Louis
Albany
Albert Einstein
Rochester
Rush
Rosy Franklin
NYMC
EVMS
Wake Forest
Jefferson
Temple
Drexel
Creighton
Tulane
USC/Keck
Dartmouth
Seton Hall
MCW
Loyola
Emory
BU
Pitt
Hofstra
Tufts
Oakland-B
Western MI
Uniformed Services University/Hebert (just be aware of the military service commitment)
Nova MD
Your state school(s).
Any DO program. I can't recommend Touro-NY, Nova, Wm Carey, LUCOM, for different reasons. MSUCOM? Read up on Larry Nasser and you decide. LMU has an accreditation warning, which concerns me.

You need DO programs on the list due to the below avg sGPA and that you're a reapplicant, and beggars can't be choosy.

Why not Touro-NY?

 

[Goro]

Why not Touro-NY?

DO a search, please

 

[puahate]

I'm going to be the odd one out here any say an SMP or post bacc is low-yield for OP. OP's sGPA is not deadly and coupled with the MCAT should be fine.. I think his ECs are just really bad

 

[Goro]

I suppose I could have phrased my post better. By "not needing to re-do ECs" I meant the OP doesn't have to patch up major holes or discredit things they've done up to this point, which the other posters seem to suggest. Just because the non-clinical volunteering are non-congruent/campus based, or that the clinical experiences aren't impressive, doesn't mean the OP can't write a coherent story based on the experiences they already have.

Why did you do this activity, what did you learn from it, how did this drive you to service/medicine?

Sure, more experience helps, and better experiences lead to better essays, but not every applicant has to be Harvard/Stanford caliber to get into ANY med school. OP needs to find a better way to sell themselves and a better list of schools to sell themselves to.

No amount of salesmanship is going to get OP anywhere with the holes in their app.

 

[Sharknad0]

This and the nonclinical is all campus/fraternity based. Your ECs are a problem and your school list isn’t realistic. Did you use the MSAR to develop your list? Did you apply to any DO schools? The good news is that your MCAT is current so you have time to fix your application and reapply when you are ready.

My list had like 20 schools where I thought I had a decent shot but the late app might have done it in for me. Didn't do any DO this cycle and if I didn't get in I was planning on adding them for cycle 2. And the service isn't a "fraternity", it's an actual international service organization.

Please get some real clinical experience. You have nothing.
Your “service” activities are a joke, better off not listing them because they’re ridiculous, like most frat activities.
Any particular reason why you applied to so many top schools, like Stanford, Columbia, etc?

They might sound ridiculous because I haven't explained them and you're just seeing them at face value, but yes I do agree that I need a lot more clinical experience. I added schools like that because I had a larger than average list of "normal" schools and thought "might as well," which yeah is pretty dumb, but again I thought I had a good list of normal schools.

To expand on my activities, I can definitely write a more descriptive feature on them as I have in the past but deleted for privacy.

1. Shadowing - 50 hours cardiology, 50 hours GI
2. Campus Volunteering - 210 hours over 3 years in an organization that provides safe/sober rides home for students.
3. Campus Volunteering - 60 hours over 3 years in our school's dance marathon. Raised about $3,000 for Women's and Children's Hospital on my various teams and I was both a member and team leader through the years.
4. Campus/Underserved Volunteering - 50 hours over 1 year in a national service fraternity working various projects such as food shelters and neighborhood clean ups, was also a Pledge Trainer and Fellowship Chair.
5. Clinical Volunteering - 30 hours at University hospital doing housekeeping, which yes is very minimal and I definitely could have improved upon this one.
6. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities, poster presentation.
7. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities phase 2, poster presentation.
8. Research - Child development and obesity research aimed at finding home/parental based causes for children's unhealthy eating habits, poster presentation.
9. Research - 1.5 years immunotherapy research, mostly basic lab work but I also helped fix the lab's protocols so that work could be more efficient.
10. Research - 250 hours over 1 summer doing mouse-model research at a T10 school do find new pathways to combat high blood pressure and heart disease.
11. Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad, will delete if I can replace this with a much better clinical experience, but my PS is based on this (not how magical an experience it was, but on introspection and what it taught me moving forward)
12. Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team, just a fun activity I did that shows committment
13. Misc - 200 hours working for my real estate company I helped co-found building/remodeling houses, my roles are accountancy/site management.

It might seem kinda basic but I can string it together fairly well.

I don't see anything really glaring other than underserved/clinical experience. Which, yes, is very important and missing. Also going to start shadowing an abdominal transplant surgeon and an internist.

 

[ciestar]

My list had like 20 schools where I thought I had a decent shot but the late app might have done it in for me. Didn't do any DO this cycle and if I didn't get in I was planning on adding them for cycle 2. And the service isn't a "fraternity", it's an actual international service organization.



They might sound ridiculous because I haven't explained them and you're just seeing them at face value, but yes I do agree that I need a lot more clinical experience. I added schools like that because I had a larger than average list of "normal" schools and thought "might as well," which yeah is pretty dumb, but again I thought I had a good list of normal schools.

To expand on my activities, I can definitely write a more descriptive feature on them as I have in the past but deleted for privacy.

1. Shadowing - 50 hours cardiology, 50 hours GI
2. Campus Volunteering - 210 hours over 3 years in an organization that provides safe/sober rides home for students.
3. Campus Volunteering - 60 hours over 3 years in our school's dance marathon. Raised about $3,000 for Women's and Children's Hospital on my various teams and I was both a member and team leader through the years.
4. Campus/Underserved Volunteering - 50 hours over 1 year in a national service fraternity working various projects such as food shelters and neighborhood clean ups, was also a Pledge Trainer and Fellowship Chair.
5. Clinical Volunteering - 30 hours at University hospital doing housekeeping, which yes is very minimal and I definitely could have improved upon this one.
6. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities, poster presentation.
7. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities phase 2, poster presentation.
8. Research - Child development and obesity research aimed at finding home/parental based causes for children's unhealthy eating habits, poster presentation.
9. Research - 1.5 years immunotherapy research, mostly basic lab work but I also helped fix the lab's protocols so that work could be more efficient.
10. Research - 250 hours over 1 summer doing mouse-model research at a T10 school do find new pathways to combat high blood pressure and heart disease.
11. Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad, will delete if I can replace this with a much better clinical experience, but my PS is based on this (not how magical an experience it was, but on introspection and what it taught me moving forward)
12. Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team, just a fun activity I did that shows committment
13. Misc - 200 hours working for my real estate company I helped co-found building/remodeling houses, my roles are accountancy/site management.

It might seem kinda basic but I can string it together fairly well.

I don't see anything really glaring other than underserved/clinical experience. Which, yes, is very important and missing. Also going to start shadowing an abdominal transplant surgeon and an internist.

For the housekeeping, were you working with patients? If not, this isn’t clinical, either.

 

[Sharknad0]

For the housekeeping, were you working with patients? If not, this isn’t clinical, either.

It was smelling distance but I wasn't propping pillows. I was more-so swapping linens in drawers and taking out trash.

 

[stickgirl390]

My list had like 20 schools where I thought I had a decent shot but the late app might have done it in for me. Didn't do any DO this cycle and if I didn't get in I was planning on adding them for cycle 2. And the service isn't a "fraternity", it's an actual international service organization.



They might sound ridiculous because I haven't explained them and you're just seeing them at face value, but yes I do agree that I need a lot more clinical experience. I added schools like that because I had a larger than average list of "normal" schools and thought "might as well," which yeah is pretty dumb, but again I thought I had a good list of normal schools.

To expand on my activities, I can definitely write a more descriptive feature on them as I have in the past but deleted for privacy.

1. Shadowing - 50 hours cardiology, 50 hours GI
2. Campus Volunteering - 210 hours over 3 years in an organization that provides safe/sober rides home for students.
3. Campus Volunteering - 60 hours over 3 years in our school's dance marathon. Raised about $3,000 for Women's and Children's Hospital on my various teams and I was both a member and team leader through the years.
4. Campus/Underserved Volunteering - 50 hours over 1 year in a national service fraternity working various projects such as food shelters and neighborhood clean ups, was also a Pledge Trainer and Fellowship Chair.
5. Clinical Volunteering - 30 hours at University hospital doing housekeeping, which yes is very minimal and I definitely could have improved upon this one.
6. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities, poster presentation.
7. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities phase 2, poster presentation.
8. Research - Child development and obesity research aimed at finding home/parental based causes for children's unhealthy eating habits, poster presentation.
9. Research - 1.5 years immunotherapy research, mostly basic lab work but I also helped fix the lab's protocols so that work could be more efficient.
10. Research - 250 hours over 1 summer doing mouse-model research at a T10 school do find new pathways to combat high blood pressure and heart disease.
11. Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad, will delete if I can replace this with a much better clinical experience, but my PS is based on this (not how magical an experience it was, but on introspection and what it taught me moving forward)
12. Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team, just a fun activity I did that shows committment
13. Misc - 200 hours working for my real estate company I helped co-found building/remodeling houses, my roles are accountancy/site management.

It might seem kinda basic but I can string it together fairly well.

I don't see anything really glaring other than underserved/clinical experience. Which, yes, is very important and missing. Also going to start shadowing an abdominal transplant surgeon and an internist.

Somehow elaborating on your ECs made the app sound worse. I agree strongly with what’s already been said: you need more clinical experience and WAY more volunteering with the underserved. This isn’t just box checking: your current application does not reflect that you are aware of a doctor’s role in their patients’ lives, or the community. The current app very much comes off as “I think I’ll go to med school today.”

I do not doubt that you worked your tail off to come up with the app you did, but regardless you have to accept that you have a LOT of improvements to make. Recognizing and accepting our shortcomings is imperative to surviving medical school. As a reapplicant myself, I suggest skipping the next application cycle as you improve your app. You cannot make the changes you need between now and June.

(Adding that Adcoms really don’t care about more shadowing, as that just helps you not others.)

 

[echogecko]

Just to chime in, I personally think your shadowing is perfectly fine - you have plenty - it's really just the volunteering that needs work.

 

[doc05]

It was smelling distance but I wasn't propping pillows. I was more-so swapping linens in drawers and taking out trash.

This is not worth mentioning, it is of no value.

 

[doc05]

My list had like 20 schools where I thought I had a decent shot but the late app might have done it in for me. Didn't do any DO this cycle and if I didn't get in I was planning on adding them for cycle 2. And the service isn't a "fraternity", it's an actual international service organization.



They might sound ridiculous because I haven't explained them and you're just seeing them at face value, but yes I do agree that I need a lot more clinical experience. I added schools like that because I had a larger than average list of "normal" schools and thought "might as well," which yeah is pretty dumb, but again I thought I had a good list of normal schools.

To expand on my activities, I can definitely write a more descriptive feature on them as I have in the past but deleted for privacy.

1. Shadowing - 50 hours cardiology, 50 hours GI
2. Campus Volunteering - 210 hours over 3 years in an organization that provides safe/sober rides home for students.
3. Campus Volunteering - 60 hours over 3 years in our school's dance marathon. Raised about $3,000 for Women's and Children's Hospital on my various teams and I was both a member and team leader through the years.
4. Campus/Underserved Volunteering - 50 hours over 1 year in a national service fraternity working various projects such as food shelters and neighborhood clean ups, was also a Pledge Trainer and Fellowship Chair.
5. Clinical Volunteering - 30 hours at University hospital doing housekeeping, which yes is very minimal and I definitely could have improved upon this one.
6. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities, poster presentation.
7. Research - Child development research aimed at improving children's math skills with physical activities phase 2, poster presentation.
8. Research - Child development and obesity research aimed at finding home/parental based causes for children's unhealthy eating habits, poster presentation.
9. Research - 1.5 years immunotherapy research, mostly basic lab work but I also helped fix the lab's protocols so that work could be more efficient.
10. Research - 250 hours over 1 summer doing mouse-model research at a T10 school do find new pathways to combat high blood pressure and heart disease.
11. Clinical - 1 week/35 hours in medical mission abroad, will delete if I can replace this with a much better clinical experience, but my PS is based on this (not how magical an experience it was, but on introspection and what it taught me moving forward)
12. Clubs - 180 hours/2 years involvement in school spirit team, just a fun activity I did that shows committment
13. Misc - 200 hours working for my real estate company I helped co-found building/remodeling houses, my roles are accountancy/site management.

It might seem kinda basic but I can string it together fairly well.

I don't see anything really glaring other than underserved/clinical experience. Which, yes, is very important and missing. Also going to start shadowing an abdominal transplant surgeon and an internist.

Being more descriptive isn’t the issue. I guarantee that your rejections weren’t because of inadequate descriptions. We all know that a dance marathon can raise money for charity, but it’s really just some college kids having fun.

One issue is that your “volunteering” was mostly on campus. Driving drunk college kids home may be worth something, but not much. Consider that your competition will have much more meaningful and interesting volunteer experiences.

Try not to be so defensive. We’re pointing out your weaknesses to help for next time.

 

[NicMouse64]

OP: what people are saying here is accurate. I had your MCAT score, a 3.37 GPA, and got FIVE interview invites. I am a white, upper-middle class male so no, it's not that. I got 2 acceptances (albeit off the waitlist). Things you didn't do: patient contact--hugely important, get at least 1000 hours. Volunteer for those less fortunate--rural or urban charities. I worked as a delivery driver for those who couldn't afford food in an inner city for those who had HIV/AIDs or other illnesses.

Being defensive in medicine and in an interview will get you more rejections, even if you do get more interview invites. Maybe find a mentor or someone you trust and ask them what your three biggest personality flaws are. Defensiveness has always been one of mine, but it is something I am working on and it is doing dividends to learn to control it in medical school.

 

[candbgirl]

...
I'm just so defeated. I haven't had any good news this entire cycle and it looks like I'm gearing up for another year....

One thing you need to keep in mind is that every cycle only about 40 percent of applicants are accepted to med school. Every year applicants with stellar applications are rejected. You should probably consider sitting out the next cycle and work hard on you application. You have been given very good advice in this thread. Of course it’s up to you if you want to use this advice to your advantage. But if you do then slow down, make a plan to fill the gaps and weaknesses in your application and then do something about them.

 

[chlorocruorin]

You need to stand out in terms of EC. Nothing jumps out, I'd do a community service trip, something that shows u truly care about underserved ppl. Your stats are fine, yeah GPA could be a little higher, but there's SOMETHING that is making the committee hesitant on you. It's most likely due to the fact they have doubts ab what kinda of person you are. This could arise from subpar LORs coupled with stale EC's or a personal statement with red flags, such as are you just blabbering on about your EC's? Peace Corps or AmeriCorps would be perfect for you.

 

[differentiating]

Yeah, this is definitely an issue of poor ECs, with no real clinical experience/volunteering and no volunteering actually aimed at helping those who need it. Don't waste your time with extra shadowing; you have plenty, and it won't fill these gaps in your application. Consider volunteering at a homeless shelter, at an underserved clinic, etc. etc.

I also don't think it helps that you spent such a short time (both in hours and overall commitment length) to these issues but spent a lot of time on more "fun" activities like being part of your school spirit squad. There's nothing wrong with the latter, but when all of your big activities are fun ones and your volunteering is minimal, it suggests box-checking and that you don't really care about helping those in need.

 

[Ad2b]

It's unfortunate you can't seem to understand:

Your college volunteering has very limited value when compared to the rest of your applicant peers... that means, compared to your peers, your volunteering is substandard not only in quantity but worse, quality

Sadly, your responses also come across as arrogant which indicates someone with a self-esteem issue. A confident response is:

Dang, you're all right and I really didn't see it from your point of view. I am checking into the homeless shelter or runaway kids school and other things to shore that up. Thank you for the help.

You aren't the first person to get chewed up a little here (I did too) BUT I learned from the responses and fixed what was broken/off-mark. You have sitting adcoms giving you advice and you're not listening.

Why?

 

[Osteosaur]

I know its rough. I didn't get in my first try either, and I laugh at how ill-thought out my first try was. It took me a few to get in and I had very similar stats to yours: good MCAT, mediocre GPA.

Here is the good news:
-You can improve yourself.
-Your research is great!
-Your college volunteering activities check the "non-clinical" box and give you some cool hobbies, like dance, to discuss!
-Your real estate is cool! Play the founding up as leadership in your essays.

Here is what you need to work on:
-Volunteer at a local hospital for 2-4 per week. No mission trips. US medical schools (especially on the lower end of stats) by and large have missions to train doctors here in the US. 35 hours of clinical volunteering is not much; most have hundreds of hours. Discuss how interacting with sick people has made you want to be a doctor.
-You have a GPA on the lower end of the spectrum. You can struggle in some SMP or you can bite the bullet and go DO. I wish I had done this sooner. DO is a great option for people in the ~3.5-3.6 area who would otherwise struggle. Matriculate averages for MD are pushing like 3.7 now.
-Don't half-ass DO apps either. Find one. Shadow one.
-Share your school list here. It might be poorly thought out.

 

[Deecee2DO]

Your school list is horrendous. You applied to schools way out of your reach, like:

UMich,
Darthmouth
USC
BU
Vandy
BU
Cornell
Stanford
Columbia
Einstein
Brown

Those were more-or-less donations. Your application also looks basic to me. There is no “X factor” or anything that would even minutely impress me. Admissions is in a way a game. You need to stand out when there are 10,000+ other applicants. That is done through kickass ECs and then writing passionately about those ECs. Only then will more adcoms consider putting your application on the side to consider you for an II

lol are you an adcom?

 

[MKO]

@Deecee2DO not at all, not even a med student yet lol. Just got accepted to med school actually. Advice was based on 1.) common sense (i.e. gotta stand out when competing against so many applicants) 2.) MSAR (wtf are you applying to Stanford and Columbia with 3.6/514 lol) and 3.) personal experience (had subpar stats, but lit ECs + decent writer. Was accepted to several MD schools first cycle)

 

[Sharknad0]

It's unfortunate you can't seem to understand:
Sadly, your responses also come across as arrogant which indicates someone with a self-esteem issue.

I've used this forum for a while and I pulled a lot of schools I applied to from WAMC posts and had people on here check-off my EC's. No they didn't say it was extravagant by any means but they weren't saying I was a garbage applicant either, which is basically what this thread has turned into. I don't know where people are getting the idea I was arrogant. The only sentence I said in this thread that was remotely like that was

"They [my EC's] might sound ridiculous because I haven't explained them and you're just seeing them at face value, but yes I do agree that I need a lot more clinical experience."

Nevertheless, I've been taking all the advice I'm receiving (even though some of it is overtly harsh for the sake of being harsh) and have started looking into homeless shelters/hospitals to get some new and better quality volunteering in.

Here is what you need to work on:
-Volunteer at a local hospital for 2-4 per week. No mission trips. US medical schools (especially on the lower end of stats) by and large have missions to train doctors here in the US. 35 hours of clinical volunteering is not much; most have hundreds of hours. Discuss how interacting with sick people has made you want to be a doctor.
-You have a GPA on the lower end of the spectrum. You can struggle in some SMP or you can bite the bullet and go DO. I wish I had done this sooner. DO is a great option for people in the ~3.5-3.6 area who would otherwise struggle. Matriculate averages for MD are pushing like 3.7 now.
-Don't half-ass DO apps either. Find one. Shadow one.
-Share your school list here. It might be poorly thought out.

Thanks, I've started applying to volunteer positions throughout the city for both underserved groups as well as clinical positions.

 

[kepler16b]

People are really ragging on you here unnecessarily OP. Keep your head up man!

 

[Deecee2DO]

I know its rough. I didn't get in my first try either, and I laugh at how ill-thought out my first try was. It took me a few to get in and I had very similar stats to yours: good MCAT, mediocre GPA.

Here is the good news:
-You can improve yourself.
-Your research is great!
-Your college volunteering activities check the "non-clinical" box and give you some cool hobbies, like dance, to discuss!
-Your real estate is cool! Play the founding up as leadership in your essays.

Here is what you need to work on:
-Volunteer at a local hospital for 2-4 per week. No mission trips. US medical schools (especially on the lower end of stats) by and large have missions to train doctors here in the US. 35 hours of clinical volunteering is not much; most have hundreds of hours. Discuss how interacting with sick people has made you want to be a doctor.
-You have a GPA on the lower end of the spectrum. You can struggle in some SMP or you can bite the bullet and go DO. I wish I had done this sooner. DO is a great option for people in the ~3.5-3.6 area who would otherwise struggle. Matriculate averages for MD are pushing like 3.7 now.
-Don't half-ass DO apps either. Find one. Shadow one.
-Share your school list here. It might be poorly thought out.

Trying to clarify your comment about SMP program for OP. are you insinuating SMPs are more challenging than medical school (DO)? Or are you saying that OP should stop trying for the MD acceptance and go DO instead

 

[Osteosaur]

Trying to clarify your comment about SMP program for OP. are you insinuating SMPs are more challenging than medical school (DO)? Or are you saying that OP should stop trying for the MD acceptance and go DO instead

I wrote that in haste, exam this week...

I think the OP has an MD shot for sure. I got MD II's with stats like that, but its obviously not as sure a thing as DO for them.

I think the benefit of putting 2 years of sweat, blood, and tears into an SMP to raise a 3.61/3.44 to something more palatable to MDs is a big risk (if you do bad no acceptance!) and has diminished returns. They aren't that far off the mark to begin with, and 2 years of stress and lost income put toward a worthless degree seems a bit much. Unless they're gunning for some competitive specialty DO is a better solution to slightly below average numbers.

 

[Deecee2DO]

I wrote that in haste, exam this week...

I think the OP has an MD shot for sure. I got MD II's with stats like that, but its obviously not as sure a thing as DO for them.

I think the benefit of putting 2 years of sweat, blood, and tears into an SMP to raise a 3.61/3.44 to something more palatable to MDs is a big risk (if you do bad no acceptance!) and has diminished returns. They aren't that far off the mark to begin with, and 2 years of stress and lost income put toward a worthless degree seems a bit much. Unless they're gunning for some competitive specialty DO is a better solution to slightly below average numbers.

Yes I agree 100%