Rejected from UCSF today

[kutastha]

Hi folks.

Today I was rejected from UCSF because my "application was not looked favorably upon by the admissions committee." This causes me great distress. I have four years of leadership for my graduate student association, a 36 on my MCAT (11v, 12p, 13b), volunteer experience, published papers, I discovered a gene that when deleted causes melanoma and ovarian cancer, and by the time I graduate in May a PhD in Biochemistry and Molecular Biology. How in the hell can this not be looked favorably upon? They didn't even ask me for a secondary. This is terrible news as UCSF was one of my top choices. For those familiar or who have secondaries, what the hell do they want?

Andrew

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[Optimistic]

Iam sorry to know that.However with that good scores and other credentials ,Iam sure you will get in one of the top schools. MAY BE YOU DESERVE SOME PLACE BETTER THAN UCSF!!!!!!

 

[The Fly]

How many times have you applied to medical school? I suspect that may be the answer to your question...I am really sorry, that really sucks.

 

[none]

hm...that letter seems really direct and nasty. Are most rejections like that?

 

[jmejia1]

Originally posted by kutastha:
•Hi folks.

Today I was rejected from UCSF because my "application was not looked favorably upon by the admissions committee." This causes me great distress. I have four years of leadership for my graduate student association, a 36 on my MCAT (11v, 12p, 13p), volunteer experience, published papers, I discovered a gene that when deleted causes melanoma and ovarian cancer, and by the time I graduate in May a PhD in Biochemistry and Molecular Biology. How in the hell can this not be looked favorably upon? They didn't even ask me for a secondary. This is terrible news as UCSF was one of my top choices. For those familiar or who have secondaries, what the hell do they want?

Andrew•

Hey Kutastha, sorry to hear about the rejection. From what I hear and from experience, UCSF places great emphasizes on life experiences which standout. They don't have to be extraordinary but different enough. They guage this from your personal statement. In my personal statement I never once mentioned research experience, grades, but I did emphasize my work with emotinally disturbed boys. In fact, my personal statement is mainly about my experiences working at a boy's facility.

I recieved their secondary. I think every top-gun premed researcher applies to UCSF and thus they kinda get tired of hearing about people's research. I've followed your posts as well as many others, and you sound like an excellent applicant with lots to offer a medical school. I will make an assumption and guess that your personal statement talks for the most part about your research experience? DOnt' be afraid to write about deeper things like wanting to be a doctor because you yourself have diabetes and want share with others how to care for themselves. It's too late to change your PS, but maybe in your upcomming interviews you should be honest and not afraid to reveal your true motivations.

 

[praying4MD]

I'm really sorry to hear about this. I don't know what to say. After following your posts, I am really rooting for you in this process, especially since there is absolutely nothing lacking in your application! Maybe you are "over-qualified," whatever that means.

This is just the beginning and it is still very early, so don't get too discouraged. You can have a million rejections, but it only takes ONE acceptance letter. In the end, I sincerely believe it is their loss.

 

[SnudgeMuffin]

I am sure you are more than qualified and you will get lots and lots of interviews and acceptance letters from top schools. But I agree with jmejia on the point that maybe you should have talked about more personal stuff and what drives YOU to become a doctor. They have all your information about your research and leadership experiences, but they don't know who you are as a person. If you did write in your PS stuff about yourself not your qualifications, I don't know what to tell ya. I think they are too stupid to deserve you. Wish you the best with the rest of your application process. Don't be so down.

 

[nashtrash]

kutastha! i'm so upset for you--don't doubt yourself because I really can't see anything that you're lacking in your application. It may be the "applying multiple times" factors--I just don't know. Maybe you could talk to someone on the committee and see what "unfavorably" means or see if you can talk them into giving you a secondary at least because of your strong interest in the school. I know you will get into great schools so don't let this get you down. good luck with everything

 

[gooloogooloo]

what what what? you must be kidding me! No secondary? PhD in May?

 

[audeo]

Why is UCSF not sending rejection to me I wonder. No secondaries either. I know I have 0.00001% chance at this school and they are dangling with me.

 

[slptodoc]

Wow, that's pretty perplexing!
Did you think about calling and asking one of the admissions counselors what was wrong with your application and what you might be able to do to improve your chances??? Just a thought......
but as all of the others stated, your credentials are fantastic and I'm sure that there are PLENTY of great schools who'd love to have you as a future student!
Good luck and hang in there!!!!!
L

 

[BeckyG]

Andrew,

That really sucks. I would ask admissions about the reasoning behind it and/or appeal the decision. You definitely have the MCATs -- what is your gpa. Actually don't answer, but if it's below 3.2 for some reason, that would be a factor (that's UCSF's magical "cutoff"). I have a feeling it's not an issue though. Anyway, if you really like UCSF, then appeal the decision. They told us a few appeals are granted every year (you can appeal up through the interview stage - once a decision is made you can't appeal that). But, I must say I am disappointed in UCSF that they did not even send you a secondary if you do have so many great attributes and experiences - and the scores to boot! Anyway, don't let one school's decision get you down - everyone who said this is right - if a school can't see your inherent strengths and want you, then they do not deserve you. Take care and keep your chin up,

Becky

 

[Vader]

Originally posted by kutastha:
•Hi folks.

Today I was rejected from UCSF because my "application was not looked favorably upon by the admissions committee." This causes me great distress. I have four years of leadership for my graduate student association, a 36 on my MCAT (11v, 12p, 13p), volunteer experience, published papers, I discovered a gene that when deleted causes melanoma and ovarian cancer, and by the time I graduate in May a PhD in Biochemistry and Molecular Biology. How in the hell can this not be looked favorably upon? They didn't even ask me for a secondary. This is terrible news as UCSF was one of my top choices. For those familiar or who have secondaries, what the hell do they want?

Andrew•

I haven't been following your story as closely as some of the other folks on this site have, but I did want to ask a few questions:
1) Were you applying out-of-state?
2) How many times have you applied previously?
3) Did you include meaningful personal information that describes your motivation for medicine in your personal statement, or was it simply a re-hashing of everything else on your AMCAS application?
4) Your MCATs are good, but how is your GPA? Do you have any grades that might be tripping you up?

UCSF (and many other schools) does not generally look favorably on people who have applied multiple times. This could be the main problem, as others have suggested.

Whatever the reason, please realize that the process is somewhat of a crapshoot. Although it is frustrating, a rejection is not the end of the world and definitely does not reflect on you as a person. It is probably best to figure out what went wrong with the application so that you can fix it for other schools. Good luck and keep that chin up!

 

[kutastha]

Thank you for your input guys. I'm keeping your ideas in mind as a I fashion a letter appealing the rejection.

Now, on to Vader's questions:

Originally posted by Vader:
•I haven't been following your story as closely as some of the other folks on this site have, but I did want to ask a few questions:
1) Were you applying out-of-state?
2) How many times have you applied previously?
3) Did you include meaningful personal information that describes your motivation for medicine in your personal statement, or was it simply a re-hashing of everything else on your AMCAS application?
4) Your MCATs are good, but how is your GPA? Do you have any grades that might be tripping you up?

UCSF (and many other schools) does not generally look favorably on people who have applied multiple times. This could be the main problem, as others have suggested.

Whatever the reason, please realize that the process is somewhat of a crapshoot. Although it is frustrating, a rejection is not the end of the world and definitely does not reflect on you as a person. It is probably best to figure out what went wrong with the application so that you can fix it for other schools. Good luck and keep that chin up! •

1) No, I was born and raised in CA

2) I've applied twice previously, but the last time was in 1996 prior to my going to grad school.

3) My AMCAS personal statement was a very well-put together diatribe that gave a whole picture about myself and my drive to be a physician - nothing was weighed too heavily upon, as someone mentioned earlier about my research experience.

4) My undergrad GPA was a 3.3, and I highlighted that in my essay - and it's greatly improved in graduate school.

Thank you all for your input, but after all I've been through, a crapshoot and it's the schools loss won't cut it anymore, and they will indeed hear from me.

Thanks again,

Andrew

 

[guardian]

Originally posted by kutastha:
•they will indeed hear from me.

Thanks again,

Andrew•

Maybe you shouldn't write them *that letter* if you're referring to the one you've sent sometime earlier.

 

[TwoSteveSquared]

If it makes you feel any better, they rejected me today, with the same letter they sent you.

You gotta go through this with thick skin, or it's gonna hurt.

I'm sure you'll end up at another fine institution.

Hate to sound too passive here,
but sometimes, it's just not meant to be.

Late UCSF.

 

[ken]

Andrew,

You're talking about one of the top medical institutions in the country. While a 36 is certainly a good score, don't think that they don't get a ****-load of applicants with such scores...as well as high gpa's. Whether you have an explanation for it or not, a 3.3 undergraduate gpa coupled with the fact that you have taken the MCAT 3 times definitely hurts your chances of getting into a top-10 medical school.

 

[Vader]

Originally posted by kutastha:
•Thank you for your input guys. I'm keeping your ideas in mind as a I fashion a letter appealing the rejection.

Now, on to Vader's questions:

1) No, I was born and raised in CA

2) I've applied twice previously, but the last time was in 1996 prior to my going to grad school.

3) My AMCAS personal statement was a very well-put together diatribe that gave a whole picture about myself and my drive to be a physician - nothing was weighed too heavily upon, as someone mentioned earlier about my research experience.

4) My undergrad GPA was a 3.3, and I highlighted that in my essay - and it's greatly improved in graduate school.

Thank you all for your input, but after all I've been through, a crapshoot and it's the schools loss won't cut it anymore, and they will indeed hear from me.

Thanks again,

Andrew•

Yeah, the multiple applications are definitely not in your favor. That and your undergraduate GPA might have combined to hinder your application. It is definitely within your rights to appeal, and I've even heard of some appeals being successful, but it is probably rare. I wish I could say more, but keep on trying. The best of luck to you...

 

[lady in red]

I already sent you an email. I think the stuff about multiple apps is total BS. Who cares that you applied 5 years ago? I don't think that has any bearing on your appl. now whatsoever. I would definitely appeal, and even call them if you can. Your application is too outstanding, i think, not to even get a secondary!!!! and whatever they say about mcat, I think UCSF still cares a lot about this damn test--look at their admitted averages--all 11s and 12s--AVERAGES!!!!

 

[BeckyG]

I would agree with Lady in Red on most of what she said - but the GPA and personal statement seem to be far more important to UCSF than MCAT. The average GPA is 3.7+ and the bulletin on-line clearly says that if you do not have at least a 3.2 GPA, you will not be considered favorably. They also strenously highlight the importance of the personal statement in the bulletin. There is no mention of specific MCAT cutoffs in the bulletin. I personally did not have high MCATs and got in and I know a classmate who also had my combined MCAT score who got in (but had a strong GPA). This is by no means telling of anything in particular, but I thought I'd share. Also, as has been said before, admissions at UCSF - like all other med schools - is not a science and there is no way to tell where you'll be received favorably or unfavorably -- but it does not mean anything in particular about you or your application. Anyway, good luck to all. Take care,

Becky

 

[racergirl]

K,

There's got to be a red flag somewhere, and you need to root it out. I know you've applied before. Have you ever gone over your previous apps with an admissions dean to determine what's wrong?

 

[Epi]

Well, sometimes medical schools have a weird way of rejecting people and inviting others for interviews. I don't think anybody will be able to understand what goes on inside an admissions committee meeting. Just say positive.

 

[nochaser]

I agree with racergirl. Did you ever get feedback from your previous applications? If so, what did you change? What are you going to do if---gasp--you don't get in this time around? I think that if you are willing to give it another shot, you really must find out what the heck is going on! It's just too consuming--mentally, emotionally, and financially--to go through it all over and things are still not quite up to snuff. If I am not mistaken, you have been on interviews already, right? Feel good about those, and don't trip on the rejection. I have been following your posts, and from what I can gather, you seem to be made of the right stuff! Best of luck to you, K.

 

[kutastha]

Hi everyone. Thanks for the input. To answer some of the various questions -

I applied last in 1996. That would make this my third time applying - certainly not too out of the ordinary, especially since it has been five years since I last appplied. I did try to get specific information in the past as to why I was not accepted, yet was always told the same 'Too many qualified people for too few spaces'. And what have I changed since then? I mentioned a lot of it in my first post - a PhD, an even higher MCAT, a whole boatload of leadership positions - including starting up a Student Activites office on the HSC campus at USC - volunteer work, an improved GPA, ad nauseaum. And if I don't get in, I will most likely apply for a post-doctoral position. Perhaps I'm not the typical student, but the only red flag I can think of is the undergrad GPA - if they just decide secondaries by the 'magic formula' then I'm screwed - even if the bad grades I received were 9-10 years ago. It's also frustrating b/c they aren't even looking at AMCAS apps, and there's so much info in there that wouldn't fit on the UC app - kinda makes me wonder if it is a formulaic rejection.

Anyhoos, I'll let you know what happens with my appeal.


Andrew

 

[sunflower79]

Hey Andrew, I'm so sorry to hear about that. Not even a secondary?!?!?! I'll also be reapplying later and am absolutely TERRIFIED that a low undergrad GPA may scar one for life. But then I'm not sure I buy it yet. After all, UCSF has a post-bac program, and they have accepted people from it, so something else must be up... but then, those ppl who were accepted were URMs (NO, I am not about to get in a discussion about this on this thread!)

Also, I don't get this thing about reapplying multiple times. Why/how does that hurt one?

I have a good friend who is a UCSF med student, and I can tell you her profile: 3.8 from Berkeley, 36Q, editor of our medical issues journal, volunteered in a hospital for a year, did tutoring and etc -- always active. Decent but not extraordinary essay. One summer of research. This girl has a wonderful, kind personality, but otherwise did not go abroad, nor publish scientific papers, nor go into outer space. Andrew, I don't understand what in hell you haven't done that my friend has. If someone else knows, please share it with us.

 

[Vader]

Originally posted by kareniw:
•Hey Andrew, I'm so sorry to hear about that. Not even a secondary?!?!?! I'll also be reapplying later and am absolutely TERRIFIED that a low undergrad GPA may scar one for life. But then I'm not sure I buy it yet. After all, UCSF has a post-bac program, and they have accepted people from it, so something else must be up... but then, those ppl who were accepted were URMs (NO, I am not about to get in a discussion about this on this thread!)

Also, I don't get this thing about reapplying multiple times. Why/how does that hurt one?

I have a good friend who is a UCSF med student, and I can tell you her profile: 3.8 from Berkeley, 36Q, editor of our medical issues journal, volunteered in a hospital for a year, did tutoring and etc -- always active. Decent but not extraordinary essay. One summer of research. This girl has a wonderful, kind personality, but otherwise did not go abroad, nor publish scientific papers, nor go into outer space. Andrew, I don't understand what in hell you haven't done that my friend has. If someone else knows, please share it with us.•

From my understanding, it is unlikely that any school will look favorably on one's application if he/she has applied more than a couple of times. This is not because persistence is bad, but rather that the admissions people have made a decision on the person's application already. Unless something has changed radically, it is unlikely that the application will suddenly be considered favorably. Now, in Andrew's case, it seems that there have been several dramatic improvements in his application. Thus, I think it is worth his while to explore the reasons for not receiving a UCSF secondary. It could be the undergraduate GPA, or another factor. I think he can reasonably make a case for appeal, however, considering the obvious improvements in his application.

Another thing--it's very misleading to compare two individual applications side-by-side like you did above. That's not how it's done in the admissions process, and it only creates an aura of suspicion and uneasiness, which tends to throw blame on particular groups. Again, it is a better use of time for someone like Andrew to find out first if there are any errors on the application which might be throwing things off. If so, the situation may easily be rectified. If not, then he will have to seek out the thing damaging his application and try to get it resolved. I'm sure he has evaluated all of this already and that's why he wants to appeal. Again, considering the improvement, I'm sure he can make a good case for having his application reevaluated.

Hope this clears things up. And good luck to Andrew with his case.