Research for med school?

[NP545]

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I was thinking about doing research at my college and talked to a few professors. They said that to do research in their labs I would have to commit 15 hours per week for 4-5 semesters doing research. I already have alot of other commitments (intramural sports, hospital volunteering, and eventually shadowing) and also an intense schedule and I think that I will probably not have this needed time to do research. Are med schools really adamant about research or are there other extracurriculars I can use in place of research?

 

[OneDayDoctor]

Research (in my opinion) is a great asset to your application. Not only that, but the skills you learn from attending journal clubs really help you think like a scientist outside of the classroom (read: MCAT passages!). It's not unheard of for professors to want 10-15 hours/week, although in my experience the commitment is usually around one year. Keep e-mailing, especially some newer profs, and you'll find a position that fits your schedule.

We all have to juggle these expectations placed on the premed... it's a challenge but doable!

 

[jeffreylei]

Make it work. I know it is extremely difficult, but this is how it is. Most undergrads did it simultaneously with other commitments including volunteering, part time job, leadership roles, and full time school. Just have to plan your time more carefully and put in the research hours. My PI requested me to work for 25 hours/wk while I did 18 credits with 2 leadership and volunteering position. Just have to sacrifice your weekend time a little bit. However, there are definitely other PIs only require 8-12 hours a week, maybe try to find another lab that is less demanding.

 

[jturkel]

i'll take the other route. as a graduating fourth yr medical student (who has done research during college and during medical school), research is NOT necessary to get into a great school. Leadership and more time spent working in a hospital/clinical setting >> research. Is research nice? yes. will it make you stand out a little bit? maybe. is it necessary? no.

 

[OneDayDoctor]

Lowly premed here, but I don't think we can say research is a less important aspect? Agreed that it may not be necessary, but to say it is below other things?

 

[jturkel]

Lowly premed here, but I don't think we can say research is a less important aspect? Agreed that it may not be necessary, but to say it is below other things?

i would say it is lowly compared to volunteer hours in a clinical/hospital setting. yes. also less important than leadership. yes.

many programs have a hidden requirement of a minimum number of clinical/hospital volunteer hours so you know what you're getting yourself into (aka the medical field). there is no program that has a hidden requirement for research...as you are applying for medical school to be a clinician...not to graduate school to do research. /

 

[BeancheBlanco]

You don't have to do research, but if you don't that is a disadvantage. Doing some research for a few semesters (especially if you are able to do some independent projects eventually) will help your application more than an additional volunteering experience (assuming you already have some) or an intramural sport. True, clinical experience is probably more important, but you really should do some of both. You've got 4+ years...plenty of time. It would be foolish to shoot yourself in the foot by not doing any research IMO.

 

[Microglia]

I was thinking about doing research at my college and talked to a few professors. They said that to do research in their labs I would have to commit 15 hours per week for 4-5 semesters doing research. I already have alot of other commitments (intramural sports, hospital volunteering, and eventually shadowing) and also an intense schedule and I think that I will probably not have this needed time to do research. Are med schools really adamant about research or are there other extracurriculars I can use in place of research?

Research: essentially a must for top 20-30ish

Less of a must after that. 15/week is pretty reasonable. I did around 25 throughout undergrad, and probably 60 in the summer. If you don't have the time, try and do at least a summer of research full time.

 

[Ismet]

i'll take the other route. as a graduating fourth yr medical student (who has done research during college and during medical school), research is NOT necessary to get into a great school. Leadership and more time spent working in a hospital/clinical setting >> research. Is research nice? yes. will it make you stand out a little bit? maybe. is it necessary? no.

Depends on the school. Very very few people get into my school with zero research experience.

 

[jturkel]

Depends on the school. Very very few people get into my school with zero research experience.

even if it's wash u, it is possible to get in without research...and that's the most research oriented school IMO

 

[Ismet]

even if it's wash u, it is possible to get in without research...and that's the most research oriented school IMO

Of course it's possible to get in without research, but it's a rather slim chance. 94-95% of those accepted to my school (Pitt) have research experience, compared to 89% with medical/clinical volunteering. Of course you could be one of the 7 or so people in a 150 person class who never did research and still got in, but that's not a chance I think is worth taking.

 

[ruedjgtc]

Research is very valuable, at the school I matriculated into about 90% of accepted students had prior research experience (via MSAR). I think clinical and some community service is par for course (around 70% of my entering class). But really, what matters the most is the level of responsibility on the research project and total time commitment -- publishing is a plus but not necessary, though if you don't have time to publish go on a lot of conferences instead, it helps.

I had clinical hours (who doesn't?), but I think my sells point for my application was my research experience, and depth of background (co-investigator on electrophysiology project, current ethics officer for animal/human research). There's a caveat, if the research position is serial pipetting for a year or cleaning glassware it's probably better to do either more clinical or deep community involvement as you'll have nothing to write about on your secondary anyways.

But, if the schools you are applying to don't really care about research (check with MSAR membership), then feel free to pile on more clinical hours if it floats your boat.

 

[Espadaleader]

Since a growing amount of schools require research to graduate vis-a-vis scholarly projects it's safe to say its a requirement.

 

[NP545]

If I did research only full time in the summer and not during the fall or spring semesters, is that satisfactory for the med school preference?

 

[jturkel]

If I did research only full time in the summer and not during the fall or spring semesters, is that satisfactory for the med school preference?

yes because research is not a requirement. it'll only help if you have your clinical volunteer hours/shadowing/leadership requirements fulfilled.

 

[Redpancreas]

Lowly premed here, but I don't think we can say research is a less important aspect? Agreed that it may not be necessary, but to say it is below other things?

Be careful. I thought this and while I had a succesful application cycle, I think the lack of research really hurt me when being considered for the top research schools (often considered the top schools).

 

[Lucca]

I'm surprised that more people seem to have research experience than clinical experience when admitted to med school.

 

[Ismet]

I'm surprised that more people seem to have research experience than clinical experience when admitted to med school.

If you're referring to the percentages I posted above, that's just clinical volunteering, not clinical experience. I couldn't find a public number for % who have clinical experience, but it's pretty much 100%.

 

[Lucca]

If you're referring to the percentages I posted above, that's just clinical volunteering, not clinical experience. I couldn't find a public number for % who have clinical experience, but it's pretty much 100%.

Ahh okay, I imagined that would be the case. Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[Ismet]

If I did research only full time in the summer and not during the fall or spring semesters, is that satisfactory for the med school preference?

Yes, that would be fine or more than fine for most schools.

Look at it this way: Having research experience can only help you. Some is better than none, more is better than less. Not having research has the potential to hurt you, depending on the schools you're applying to.

 

[NP545]

I am planning to be some type of biology major, but recently I found some psychology research labs that seem interesting to me. Biology research involves more scientific procedures like PCR, pipetting, assays, etc whereas in the psychology lab I basically conduct interviews and surveys, etc. Would it be fine if I worked in a psychology lab or would med schools prefer that I do something more related to my major? And also, would the lack of scientific techniques in the psychology lab hurt me?

 

[Microglia]

I am planning to be some type of biology major, but recently I found some psychology research labs that seem interesting to me. Biology research involves more scientific procedures like PCR, pipetting, assays, etc whereas in the psychology lab I basically conduct interviews and surveys, etc. Would it be fine if I worked in a psychology lab or would med schools prefer that I do something more related to my major? And also, would the lack of scientific techniques in the psychology lab hurt me?

You can do psych research. Especially if you relate it to an interest in psychiatry later. Med schools tend not to care too much about what the research was (unless MD/PhD, in which case...well yah), but just that you have learned the scientific method, a way of thinking about problems, and the evils of anecdote.

 

[Spica]

I am planning to be some type of biology major, but recently I found some psychology research labs that seem interesting to me. Biology research involves more scientific procedures like PCR, pipetting, assays, etc whereas in the psychology lab I basically conduct interviews and surveys, etc. Would it be fine if I worked in a psychology lab or would med schools prefer that I do something more related to my major? And also, would the lack of scientific techniques in the psychology lab hurt me?

As long as you communicate clearly what research in this particular lab has taught you (i.e., scientific method, also you get to talk to people, etc), you should be fine. As was brought up before, an independent project at said lab is the most beneficial thing. Then you will learn a ton: how to design and conduct an experiment, how to interpret and analyze data, how to present your research, etc. In my experience, psych labs usually give you a lot of freedom to do your own projects so you really have the opportunity to do grad-level work (it is very time-consuming, however).

 

[TexasSurgeon]

I was thinking about doing research at my college and talked to a few professors. They said that to do research in their labs I would have to commit 15 hours per week for 4-5 semesters doing research. I already have alot of other commitments (intramural sports, hospital volunteering, and eventually shadowing) and also an intense schedule and I think that I will probably not have this needed time to do research. Are med schools really adamant about research or are there other extracurriculars I can use in place of research?

Lol this guy. Thinking about doing research because it'll make others happy.

Look, only do research if you're actually curious about stuff happening at your university. Otherwise it's a waste of time. You will be unhappy. Your PI will be unhappy, and you will be forced to work long hours making solutions while waiting for your bacteria to grow or your PCR to finish. Sorry to sound harsh, but I see a lot of premeds asking the same question because they wanna get a pub and/or impress schools. Med schools value it, but it's not make or break.

 

[Itskinetic]

This whole conversation is really interesting to me. If I've worked 3 years in a lab working about 10 hours/week just doing PCR, western blots, and random assays-- is this "research experience" at the level of top 20 med schools? i feel like i have a lot of responsibilities, but I haven't designed my own project or anything like that or even gotten published. My lab published the end of my first year but I wasn't included on the paper.

Unfortunately, I don't feel like I have a lot to say other than generic things about my research experience. I could barely tell you what data goes to what projects and what the projects are trying to do.

 

[Uafl112]

i'll take the other route. as a graduating fourth yr medical student (who has done research during college and during medical school), research is NOT necessary to get into a great school. Leadership and more time spent working in a hospital/clinical setting >> research. Is research nice? yes. will it make you stand out a little bit? maybe. is it necessary? no.

I needed to hear that again (I cant stand doing research in a wet lab). Ive heard it so many times but im incessant on assuming its necessary.

 

[WillburCobb]

I am planning to be some type of biology major, but recently I found some psychology research labs that seem interesting to me. Biology research involves more scientific procedures like PCR, pipetting, assays, etc whereas in the psychology lab I basically conduct interviews and surveys, etc. Would it be fine if I worked in a psychology lab or would med schools prefer that I do something more related to my major? And also, would the lack of scientific techniques in the psychology lab hurt me?

As others have said, it won't hurt you and can only help you. You'd be surprised how little of your time 10-15 hrs/week consumes. Also, nothing wrong with doing psych research (though I'm a bit biased...). You should do research in an area which interests you, not in an area that you think will impress med schools. The vast majority of my research experience was in a social psych lab where I honestly did very little "research". During one of my interviews an adcom member spent about 15min talking to me about the experience. He could've cared less as to what I did in the lab and was much more interested in what I learned and gained from the experience. Plus, it being an area outside of his expertice, it was fun explaining and discussing the theories and concepts behind the research with him; which I feel made the conversation/interview more engaging.

 

[Patros]

This whole conversation is really interesting to me. If I've worked 3 years in a lab working about 10 hours/week just doing PCR, western blots, and random assays-- is this "research experience" at the level of top 20 med schools? i feel like i have a lot of responsibilities, but I haven't designed my own project or anything like that or even gotten published. My lab published the end of my first year but I wasn't included on the paper.

Unfortunately, I don't feel like I have a lot to say other than generic things about my research experience. I could barely tell you what data goes to what projects and what the projects are trying to do.

Did you understand why you had to run that PCR to generate that gene, or why you needed to detect that protein in the western? If an interviewer asks what the results of the project is, what the significance is, and what future work needs to be done, could you answer? Are you knowledgeable enough to present your work to other scientists in a poster (you should, at least once)? If you only know the vague things about your research, then you have to change that. Ask the postdocs to explain the work, read some review articles for background, make sure you know what/why for your own experiments.

Getting published is a big deal for an undergrad, so I wouldn't sweat that. Working 10hr/week is somewhat low to be honest, it certainly wouldn't be enough exposure for MD/PhD, but I doubt anyone would ask in MD interviews. However the important thing is that you have some intellectual ownership of the work you did, more even importantly, you have the ability to communicate it.

 

[NP545]

Did you understand why you had to run that PCR to generate that gene, or why you needed to detect that protein in the western? If an interviewer asks what the results of the project is, what the significance is, and what future work needs to be done, could you answer? Are you knowledgeable enough to present your work to other scientists in a poster (you should, at least once)? If you only know the vague things about your research, then you have to change that. Ask the postdocs to explain the work, read some review articles for background, make sure you know what/why for your own experiments.

Getting published is a big deal for an undergrad, so I wouldn't sweat that. Working 10hr/week is somewhat low to be honest, it certainly wouldn't be enough exposure for MD/PhD, but I doubt anyone would ask in MD interviews. However the important thing is that you have some intellectual ownership of the work you did, more even importantly, you have the ability to communicate it.

Getting published IS a big deal, or ISN'T as an undergrad? Typo or is it important to get published for med schools to impress them?

 

[Patros]

Getting published IS a big deal, or ISN'T as an undergrad? Typo or is it important to get published for med schools to impress them?

Unclear phrasing on my part. It IS a big deal, in the sense that it is uncommon and quite impressive. However it is not necessary since every lab is different, and every PI has a different opinion on what constitutes an appropriate amount of work for an undergrad to earn authorship. It is much more important to get a good letter of recommendation from the PI than it is to be included as an author. Being a first-author is obviously different and that achievement speaks for itself.
In any case, don't worry about being published. I was accepted to an MSTP with no publications (although I assume it would help a lot for the extremely competitive ones), so I seriously doubt having publications for regular MD will make much difference.