Research Lab Size

[Stewie32]

So I am beginning to look to do work in a research lab. When I have been researching potential labs and talking with friends, I have noticed that some labs are going to be huge (lots of undergrads/grads) while others will be small. I am wondering what the advantages/disadvantages are to each. Thanks in advance!

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[ThaliaNox]

I worked in a very small lab. There was only the professor, myself and 2-4 other research students. All the students were undergrads, as the department I did research in did not have grad students. The advantages were that I worked directly with the professor, and got to do actual procedures and keep a lab notebook of my own from day one. This led to a lot of responsibility, being able to be front and center of any discoveries made, help write proposals, edit presentations, posters, etc. I also formed a close relationship with the professor, which led to a great LOR. Other perks included being eligible to travel to conferences with the professor because there were no grad students, being able to bounce ideas back and forth with your PI about the research, and learning that scientists are human too.

Possible disadvantages are that smaller labs can be less prestigious, send out papers at longer intervals and require more personal responsibility because there is nobody to pick up your slack if you mess up.

 

[Stewie32]

ThaliaNox, thanks for the response. It sounds like you had a great experience with the small lab.

 

[broken tibula]

I work in a lab with two other students and as ThaliaNox said, it's great because I get lots of one-on-one interaction with the professor, I get to do every step of my own project, make decisions... I feel very intimately involved.

My friend works in a lab with about thirty other people, and she openly admits that she has no idea what the research is even about. She just goes in, runs the tests that they tell her to and hands over the data.

The upside is that while I have to go in at all hours of the night to deal with genetic crosses and count egg yields before my worms hatch, she goes in at her set hours and that's it. She can also ask someone else to go in for her, whereas if I miss a day of lab, the entire project gets set back.

 

[Xcited392]

I will be starting undergraduate research in the fall in a very small lab group.

In fact, including me, there are about 4 undergrads and 2 masters--no doctoral students (since my school doesn't offer a PhD).

Advantages, like Thalia stated, include a more personal relationship with the PI (resulting in a stronger LOR) and you could have more say in the lab, like suggesting specific projects that you want to do, as opposed to being assigned something in a huge graduate-dominated lab.

Since I'm in a small lab group, at a small university, the main disadvantage is lack of equipment. My PI has told me that there will be some things that will have to be done at the local medical school (in the graduate biomedical sciences facilities), as they have a wide range of equipment.

 

[JJMrK]

Small is better IMO. Greater chance for funding, your own project, and authorship.

 

[NickNaylor]

Mostly repeating what other people said. Large labs will more than likely give you the chance to get involved in multiple things and do some interesting work. A friend of mine worked in a pretty huge lab (by my standards - about 20 or so grad students) and got to do some pretty awesome things. One of the bad things, though, was that he didn't think his PI knew him personally even after 3 summers of work. Yikes.

Smaller labs will probably let you do more meaningful work since there's less available labor. You'll also more than likely get to work with the PI much more (which may be good or bad). I worked in a small lab and loved it; we were a close group and it made the work much more enjoyable.

In the end, it'll be what it'll be. There's so much variation in labs that I doubt it'll matter much. A large lab doesn't mean a good lab, and the same for smaller labs.

 

[Ilovewater]

I like the feeling of a small lab better for the reasons listed above. Also, it's easier to form close relationships with other people in your lab. For instance, the lab I was in had 10 people (a few Ph.D students and a few undergrads), and we all were extremely good friends and literally hung around each other all the time. It's great and fun! That would be more difficult in a bigger lab.

 

[LaserJet]

The lab I work in only has 3 people: 1 grad, 2 ugrads.

 

[ShinyDome19]

So Iv been working in research for the past 7 years and have been in both a very small lab (me and PI) for the past 2 years, and prior to that I worked and went to grad. school in a decent sized lab (~9 graduate students + 1 Post-Doc)...

These are the Pros and Cons of both:

Large Lab Pros:
- More worker bees..means more potential for projects drawing in funding.
- More grant funding which could mean more funded preliminary projects that undergrads (UG) can take on when they show the Graduate Students (GS) or PI that they are capable to do so.
- If you end up not enjoying research or just not very good at it, you will be less of a hurt on the lab and GS and may still be able to get an okay LOR from the PI should you need one since it may go unnoticed..
- A large lab will likely have GS of every level: noob Masters students, PhD candidates and PhD students ready to graduate in a year or so...You will have a large variety of projects to possibly get involved in and see differnt stages of each.

Large Lab Neutral:
- No lab becomes big without good funding...which means a decent lab output. However, if that output is due to motivated GS or just a slave driving PI is important. Motivated GS = good...Slave driving PI = Bad for UGs who the PI demands be there all the time when the UG is just there for volunteer work or a credit hour or two. Slave driving PI may = bad for new GS who will already be overwhelmed with having to teach + take courses + do research..etc. Dont expect a whole lot of 1:1 time with the GS then.

Large Lab Cons:
- As an UG, you'll likely be one of many UGs, hence you can easily get lost in the crowd making it more difficult to show the GS and PI that you are ready for a solo project.
- Depending on how strict the lab PI is, with a large number of GS and decent funding coming in to the lab, lazy GS may not be pushed very hard and as such may result in a very poor lab experience for an UG.

Small Lab Pros:
- More 1 on 1 time with PI / GS, meaning it will be easier for you to show the GS and PI what you are capable of in terms of taking on a project solo.
- Small labs at non-research universities and Liberal arts schools attract professors by giving them funding directly from the school allowing the PI to focus their work primarily on teaching and not having to devote all their lab time to finding funding. This allows them to hand out small projects to the UG as teaching tools rather than full blown research projects.

Small Lab Cons:
- If you end up hating research or just being poor at the lab work, it will likely play a larger role in the lab and will be a lot more noticable...Kiss a LOR good bye.
- Small labs often lack access to equipment such as Electron Microscopy (EM), dedicated sequencing facilities, mass specs etc... This can really put a dent in what type of research you are capable of and how much of it you actually get to do. For instance, if your lab has ties to someone who can do EM, you'll send the samples to them and just get some pictures back in a month of two...you dont get to learn the actual process of doing it and as such results in a slight lack in understanding of what it really shows. Also, sit around twidling your thumbs for a month or two waiting for the data to return to you.
- for liberal arts schools, since these schools often offer funding to professors, these schools often get professors who are not highly interested in research, but more so teaching. Labs under these professors will likely be of lower output and because a lot of these professors do not have to do a Post-Doc prior to their employment, their research "quality" (quality isnt the word i am really looking for..but close enough) may be slightly lower than that of the professor who did a 2-4 year post-doc and then joined a university.


You'll notice I didnt mention anything about publishing. Personally, i think if you go in to a lab chasing publications, your bound to be dissapointed since getting published has a lot to do with getting a lucky project, having the time to put in to that project, realizing the project has potential, beating other labs to the end stage of that project, getting it written up to where reviewers from any part of the world can understand it..etc..etc... So, go in to a lab looking to learn about what research is and how it is done...nothing else. This can be done in both a large lab and a small one just the same. And I dont say this to be mean, but you are the lowest stump on the totem pole as an UG, hence you doing your own research project and what not isnt the priority of the GS/PI necessarily...graduating is the GS's primary goal and the PI is going to often be consumed with making sure theres money. So, just be cool, pay attention to what the GS/PI says and does, ask questions...(but dont be one of those UG's who think they are ready to cure cancer because they got an A in bio I). Do this and your more likely to be given a more important role in the actual research.

 

[oaklandguy]

I worked at a small lab that recently became big, when I started working there it was literally me and the P.I. and then a doctoral candidate joined, and then a post doc, and then more and more. By big now, I mean 4 undergraduate students, 2 post docs, 2 doctoral candidates, and 1 M.S. who is the lab tech.

I personally enjoy the bigger lab experience more, because there are more projects going on and I am a part of each of these projects rather than just having my own project for myself. Although, I do have my own project, some projects are just too large to conquer on your own as an undergrad student. Plus, it's hard for me to be in lab everyday, so if I cannot make it I can throw a text to a post doc and have them treat my cells or inject my mice. Things like dissection I can always do in my spare time during after hours, but certain things need to be done between 9-5 and classes really interfere with that, so it's really nice being part of a crew.

 

[saveourpens]

I'd do with a big lab. The small lab that I was at did not even pay their undergrad researchers over the summer. They also published pretty seldom.

The big lab I'm at now obviously can afford to pay their undergrads and has so many funds that anyone's project is never going to be scrapped because the lab has run out of money. They also publish frequently and you have a pretty good chance to get your own pub or get your name tagged on to another.

also just because it's a big lab doesn't mean everyone is running around not talking to anyone. Sure, I only speak on a regular basis to 3 out of maybe 20 people there, but I never feel lost in the crowd. I can also come in whenever I want. Someone calls me up to play some puck, I'll go and no one will care..in my small lab, that wasn't the case.

 

[mdeast]

It depends on what stage you're at in your career. As a post-doc for instance...big lab is ideal. It means it's well funded and has a good PI who's going to advance your career.

As an undergrad though it matters less. Most people aren't going to publish...or if they do, they won't be first author. I think you opportunities to do meaningful research and learn skills that make you a better thinker are way easier to do in a small lab. I worked in a small lab as an undergrad and as a post-graduate gig...both advisors knew me really well and I think wrote great recs for me. My friends who work in larger labs barely ever talk to their PIs...and those are the only recs that really count (so their letter were significantly less genuine...but probably came from a more prestigious faculty member).

I personally prefer the small lab experience for a longer term thing. If you're just doing a 10 week summer program though (that you won't follow through on), the large lab might be better. You won't accomplish much then anyway, and it might be more beneficial to work in a more dynamic atmosphere and learn about the many, many projects that your colleagues will doing alongside you.

 

[oaklandguy]

I'd do with a big lab. The small lab that I was at did not even pay their undergrad researchers over the summer. They also published pretty seldom.

The big lab I'm at now obviously can afford to pay their undergrads and has so many funds that anyone's project is never going to be scrapped because the lab has run out of money. They also publish frequently and you have a pretty good chance to get your own pub or get your name tagged on to another.

also just because it's a big lab doesn't mean everyone is running around not talking to anyone. Sure, I only speak on a regular basis to 3 out of maybe 20 people there, but I never feel lost in the crowd. I can also come in whenever I want. Someone calls me up to play some puck, I'll go and no one will care..in my small lab, that wasn't the case.

👍 +1

Also my PI is usually extremely busy, so it's nice having multiple people to be able to go to when I'm having trouble using a machine or if I forgot how much Acrylamide I need to make a gel etc. They usually have an overview of the project too, and if I'm working on something different they will at least know different techniques or like why my ladder isn't working for my genotyping etc.

 

[Stewie32]

Thanks for all the great responses.

 

[obgyny]

So I am beginning to look to do work in a research lab. When I have been researching potential labs and talking with friends, I have noticed that some labs are going to be huge (lots of undergrads/grads) while others will be small. I am wondering what the advantages/disadvantages are to each. Thanks in advance!

I started out in a BIG lab (TONS of undergrads... the team I was on had 25 undergraduate students! And there are a few teams...). I did that research for over 1 year. I pretty much hated it until I got a promotion and got to supervise the team. Finally got to know the grad student and learned a lot more about the actual research. There were LOTS of opportunities to get undergrad funding, do posters/talks, etc. However, I never officially met my PI. I assumed all labs were like this, so I didn't think much of it at the time.

However, I switched to a much smaller lab (~10 people). So I've gotten to know the PI really well (he hired me after graduation). We've grown a lot over the past year (~26 people). (I'm including everyone- undergrads, grad students, post-docs, lab techs, the PI, etc). There are plenty of opportunities to join someone's project or start your own.

So I would definitely recommend joining a smaller lab over a large lab. However, joining a newly started lab can be difficult do to limited funding. I'd look into smaller labs that are somewhat established already (lots of funding and publications). Just my opinion. Good luck!