***** Research Questions - $$$ and ???

[santabanta]

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im gonna throw just 2 questions your way:

but first, a brief background..
im gonna be a frosh at UCB and I just finished by summer research job at UCSF which I will continue for the next 4 years in hopes of getting published

1) my lab will reimburse me for all commute costs and has also decided to pay me an hourly wage for 12 hrs a week...what do you guys think is fare per hour? what do ppl typically get? what should i be satisfied with? is it even common to be paid at the undergrad level?

2) how much of an impact is getting published and/or a commitment to research at the same lab for 4 years on med school applications?
lets say the overall applicaiton is average, but the dude got published, is that a big deal for the top 10-20 med schools?

3) do you think working at UCSF will improve my chances of getting into UCSF at all? 😉


im just a frosh guys, and a noob at this forum, so bear with me

 

[nogolfinsnow]

im gonna throw just 2 questions your way:

but first, a brief background..
im gonna be a frosh at UCB and I just finished by summer research job at UCSF which I will continue for the next 4 years in hopes of getting published

1) my lab will reimburse me for all commute costs and has also decided to pay me an hourly wage for 12 hrs a week...what do you guys think is fare per hour? what do ppl typically get? what should i be satisfied with? is it even common to be paid at the undergrad level?

You should get paid something, after all you are working for them. I don't know if they'll pay you the same as a technician (technicians usually have a bachelor's degree already and start around 15/hr at UCSF). Someone at UCB might be able to give you guidelines as to what students have done in the past.

2) how much of an impact is getting published and/or a commitment to research at the same lab for 4 years on med school applications?
lets say the overall applicaiton is average, but the dude got published, is that a big deal for the top 10-20 med schools?

ECs stand out best if they are coupled with competitive numbers. If you have a 3.3/30 you're going to have a tough time getting into UCSF even if you are published. But being published will definitely not hurt

3) do you think working at UCSF will improve my chances of getting into UCSF at all? 😉

Didn't help me........but again it won't hurt (unless you manage to royally piss off some powerful people)

Just something to think about; since you'll already be commuting to the city, look to take advantage of your time at UCSF; maybe sign up for some volunteering or look to shadow some docs for a couple hours on days you'll already be there.

 

[santabanta]

thanks for the advice...yeah i was thinking of doing some other stuff up there too...
yea by average i meant perhaps a bit above average..
any other thoughts?

 

[shiftingmirage]

my opinions
-research is a nice ec for several reasons, but these days most applicants have researched somewhere so the adcom wont be overly impressed
-idk about being published. After promary I was coauthor (one of many) on a paper in PNAS (the third scientific journal in the country), and tried to included it on secondaries that asked for updates since AMCAS, but no one seemed to care. But I also did not apply to research savy schools and want to go into medical treatment verus research
-I live in chicago and don't know how the price of living compairs with where you live. In my lab, I was paid $10/hr. That's prob a little low but it worked. I would think $12 is prob more where it should be.
-If your PI has friends on UCSF adcom, than it could help you out. I would assume (and when you assume...) that faculty at a given school would respect fellow faculty at that school more than from a school that they don't know.

 

[santabanta]

thanks for the input guys..

@ floja2:

- being first author seems like an impossible dream, but 2nd author seems feasible...being "an" author seems very doable (again since i am starting so early)
- time-wise: 12 hrs a week (2 nights 6 hrs each) is not too bad as i can get work done on the train and during long incubation periods for my cDNA generation and qRT-PCRs 😉
but it is totally worth working at UCSF...
- trust me, i WILL have a social life...the reason i opted to go the berkeley WAS for a social life
- yea i am gonna aspire to get a 3.6+ gpa and ~36+ MCAT but we'll see

@ shiftingmirage

- yea most applicants have researched, for the summer, or 1 year...but 4 years? i thought that should carry some weight...and that too at the same lab
- im hoping getting published is something unique
- hmmm, so you suggest 10-12 bucks an hour...point taken
- its a relatively new lab, but thats not to say the PI wont have friends up high...at least i hope so 😀

once again, thanks guys, what a great forum

 

[sleepy12]

Another option is you could get units at ucb for doing research. With those extra units coupled with even a few AP units you could even have a chance at graduating in 3 years.

 

[santabanta]

i always thought med schools dont like applicants who graduate in 3 yrs

 

[amph119]

In terms of getting published or not...

It helps to be published. After all, being published as an undergraduate puts you in a very small group. That being said, being published is not nearly as important as, in fact it pales in comparison to, getting something from your research and being able to talk about what you did. I, for one, discovered that I want to continue research throughout my entire career in biology, chemistry, or some interdisciplinary field that I identify later on (I will see what opportunities I get in medical school).

In terms of the application, research will of course help, but at some schools for than others. An example that comes mind immediately (outside of obvious schools like Harvard, Hopkins, etc) is Case Western. The CCLCM program at Case Western blatantly asks you on the secondary "describe your research experience."

Good luck to you. If you already know that you want to continue research for several years, I know for a fact that you will love what you find and learn while doing it.

 

[UVAbme2009]

1. You are very lucky to be getting paid.
2. You are very lucky to be getting paid that much. I made only $8/hour this summer. I could have made more making bagels across the street. Part of the reason I get paid so little though is that I work within the Division of Nephrology rather than an academic department.

 

[amph119]

And yeah, getting paid as a freshman is pretty crazy cool (though I don't think by any means it sets you apart in any way). I work in my lab literally about 50-60 hours a week for credit hours that I really don't need, lol. Though I was lucky enough to receive a research grant that I applied for, but that is all of the funding that I have ever had.

 

[santabanta]

UVAbme, you are also at UCSF?

@amph

thanks for the encouraging words...NO DOUBT i love what i am doing at the lab...thats what keeps me going...but i hate to ask these what-will-look-good-on-med-school-application questions because i have to think of the future

sometimes on the bench i want to forget pursuing an MD and go get a PhD

btw, you mentioned something about getting a grant you applied for...was that at the undergrad level? can you tell me some details about this?

thanks guys i really appreciate all this talk

 

[amph119]

UVAbme, you are also at UCSF?

@amph

thanks for the encouraging words...NO DOUBT i love what i am doing at the lab...thats what keeps me going...but i hate to ask these what-will-look-good-on-med-school-application questions because i have to think of the future

sometimes on the bench i want to forget pursuing an MD and go get a PhD

btw, you mentioned something about getting a grant you applied for...was that at the undergrad level? can you tell me some details about this?

thanks guys i really appreciate all this talk

There are undergraduate summer research grants out there, and yeah I got it between my junior and senior year. I'm blanking on the names, but I'm sure some graduate students around you or the head of some department can elaborate more.

 

[santabanta]

anyone know of such and can elaborate on them please?

 

[amph119]

I'm sure they vary from university to university. Ask around to people that are more in the know than I am. But still, research isn't about getting paid for it, it's about what you learn and take out of the experience.

 

[jellie]

anyone know of such and can elaborate on them please?

I don't know of any at UCSF, but there are some fellowships and grants at UCB. Most of them are probably UCB-specific, but I can't see why you shouldn't apply to some of them anyway. If your PI has some friends at UCB, you could ask around and see if any will sponsor your work at UCSF ... though that's kinda an end-around the system 😛

http://research.berkeley.edu/

Edit: Have fun looking through all the links on the page. Anyway, I noticed there are some UCSF summer programs, like the Summer Research Training Program (http://saa.ucsf.edu/summerprogram/), though it only applies to juniors and seniors (as do many others).

 

[santabanta]

thanks for the help, jellie
i will def. look into these
but my gut feeling is that they require you to work in a specific lab...like, i doubt there are undergrad "grants" that sponsor an undergrad's research at any lab of their choice
furthermore, i am not eligible for financial aid, and most of these grants are for those who require aid....

@ amph...

i totally understand research is not for getting paid...but i still need the money
i have a pretty unique financial background and even though i am not on financial aid, i still have racked up a bunch of merit scholarships as i do need the $$
so why not do something i love (research) and get paid for it? = re$earch

 

[shiftingmirage]

i always thought med schools dont like applicants who graduate in 3 yrs

I don't think they necessarily look down on the three years part, rather they are concerned for young people signing up for med school. Individuals that are slightly older 24-28 with same stats have higher chances of getting accepted than the 21 or 22 yo that are just leaving college. Part of it is maturity another is being able to evaluate/decide if medicine is for you. The average age of matriculants is 24.

 

[santabanta]

okay now i am interested in graduating in 3 yrs...
so im going to make that a separate thread and get opinions on that...
man, what a great site!!!
appreciate it bros!!!

 

[jellie]

Yeah, they might require you to work in a UCB lab. I did URAP (unpaid) for a year and a half, and then my advisor applied to SURP or SURF or some other program (up to a $2500 stipend for the summer), which was pretty cool. A lot of them are need-based, but quite a few aren't.

 

[santabanta]

any grants for work during the school year at all?
thanks, jellie for your input

 

[flaahless]

im gonna throw just 2 questions your way:

but first, a brief background..
im gonna be a frosh at UCB and I just finished by summer research job at UCSF which I will continue for the next 4 years in hopes of getting published

1) my lab will reimburse me for all commute costs and has also decided to pay me an hourly wage for 12 hrs a week...what do you guys think is fare per hour? what do ppl typically get? what should i be satisfied with? is it even common to be paid at the undergrad level?

2) how much of an impact is getting published and/or a commitment to research at the same lab for 4 years on med school applications?
lets say the overall applicaiton is average, but the dude got published, is that a big deal for the top 10-20 med schools?

3) do you think working at UCSF will improve my chances of getting into UCSF at all? 😉


im just a frosh guys, and a noob at this forum, so bear with me

1. Yeah, definitely go for the cheese. Get as much as you can. I was paid $10/hr.

2. Publications are great. But it's UCSF and they have the ability to choose whoever they want. A pub may not help an average app too much. BUT, if you have something they are looking for, then you still have a shot.

3. Maybe. It depends on your networking skills and the type of impact you have with your job. Keep in mind that it is UCSF, they are a medical powerhouse and plenty of students work there with hopes to get one of the ~150 seats.

If you really want to go to UCSF, then work to create a solid, well-rounded app by striving for greatness in and out of the classroom, and networking on campus and show them you are truly interested in being a (insert mascot here... we don't have one). Coming from Cal you should have a good shot, there are a lot of yall here. Best of luck to you. 👍

 

[Wylde]

im gonna throw just 2 questions your way:

but first, a brief background..
im gonna be a frosh at UCB and I just finished by summer research job at UCSF which I will continue for the next 4 years in hopes of getting published

1) my lab will reimburse me for all commute costs and has also decided to pay me an hourly wage for 12 hrs a week...what do you guys think is fare per hour? what do ppl typically get? what should i be satisfied with? is it even common to be paid at the undergrad level?

2) how much of an impact is getting published and/or a commitment to research at the same lab for 4 years on med school applications?
lets say the overall applicaiton is average, but the dude got published, is that a big deal for the top 10-20 med schools?

3) do you think working at UCSF will improve my chances of getting into UCSF at all? 😉


im just a frosh guys, and a noob at this forum, so bear with me

1) I am getting paid for my research via a new grant in my department. They only pay you 20 hours a week (even though we work much longer), so your 12 hour limit is not uncommon.

Pay rates:

Fresh: 6
Soph: 7
Junior: 8
Senior: 9

I dont know if i agree with the pay scale (especially because im only making 6 dollars), since it should probably be based on prior research experience if anything. That is just something for you to compare against, im sure a lot of other people get paid much better.

2) The general consensus is that being published is a lot about luck (ie whether you are in a good lab, whether your PI wants to let you on the paper, what kind of respect UGs have in your particular lab, etc.) and because of that, an authorship is not a "requirement". It will help your application, especially at top schools, but it won't hurt if you don't have one. I think the fact that you will be in a lab for such a long time (most people don't start school in a lab!) will be a bigger advantage than an authorship. I would stay in the lab for the research time and potentially great letter of recommendation, not whether you will get published.

3) The general consensus is that working at a medical school (ie in a lab) does not give you an advantage in their admissions process.

Good luck man, you are off to an amazing start (compared to a bunch of amazing people). The most important part, however, is maintaining and impeccable GPA. Do not sacrifice your GPA for ANYTHING and try to maintain at least a 3.9 gpa. Anything else (MCAT, ECs, research, LORS, etc.) can be fixed, but you can never change an undergraduate GPA.

 

[santabanta]

wow thanks guys...def. feel the player lovin on this site!

@ flaahles..you said "coming from cal i have a good shot" what does that mean? ppl from cal tend to go to UCSF?

@ wylde...im hoping to get paid more than that!! sucks that working at the school does not give you an advantage

@ all...im hoping to get as involved with UCSF as possible, in terms of shadowing a doc there, getting affiliated with their hospital etc...and ofcourse the research part...i hope this gets me somewhere when it comes time to apply there...
UCB was my dream --> got it
UCSF is my biggeer dream, and i hella hope it workss outt

 

[fhowie88]

santabanta, congrats on attending cal. hope you are getting ready for school. first, i have to admit that it is extremely uncommong for ucb freshman to start doing research, so congrats on starting so early. second, most people who work at ucb doing research (real research, not washing dishes, etc) do not get paid. there is options for mcb 99/199 research credit which is really easy to get, but if you work at ucsf, you need a mcb professor to sponsor you (relaly just a signature) like a prev poster mentioned to get the mcb research credits. but i do know that ucsf tend to pay students who work there, not sure why, but hey it's money. during the summer, like a prev poster mentioned, there is summer stipend of about 2-3k, nothing really like it during the semester unless you have financial need (through the biology scholars program). in regards to going to a lot of people have aspirations to go to ucsf by working there, but truthfully it doesn't really help. enjoy your time at cal, u'll like it.

 

[santabanta]

thanks flowie,
im actually not MCB. Im Public Health...do you know if they also accept research credits?
sucks that there are no grants for paying me during the school year
well, i will be getting paid by my lab (not sure how much yet), and the commuting reimbursement, but i just wanted to make something over the top too...hehehhe

anyways, yea the dream is to go to UCSF and i know its a rather difficultimpossiblehardnotgonnahappen type
but they can't reject me even for dreaming


or can they?

 

[flaahless]

Santa...

Cal and Stanford have the largest representation of my class, and the classes before me. It's very well respected by UCSF and the world for that matter ahaha.

Just do your best to create a solid and well-rounded app. Take some interesting humanities classes, get involved in the community projects that truly interest you and be active on campus. My class is very outgoing and socially active. I guess that's the stuff they look for... unless you're aiming for MD-PhD, then you'll need some heavy research.

 

[santabanta]

thanks flah
any tips on when is a good time to start volunteering and/or shadowing?
thanks

 

[flaahless]

thanks flah
any tips on when is a good time to start volunteering and/or shadowing?
thanks

Whenever you are ready.

I also recommend doing intramural sports or some type of non-medical activity you enjoy.

Just make sure you do the stuff that you want to do, not what you think looks good.

 

[santabanta]

thanks man
will keep all this in mind
any other suggestions/tips/advice are welcome!!!

 

[jellie]

Most of them are not specifically for summer programs. I would look at some of the programs on that page, or some of the other grants listed under the financial aid page. (http://students.berkeley.edu/finaid/) Some of them are academic, and others service/leadership based.

Virtually all majors accept research credit, though I doubt you're going to be short on units anyway. To get credit, though, you'll need to be in a formal research program, or at least have one of the faculty sign off for the credit. But I don't think you should worry about units. Like other posters said, you're already in a good position because you have a paid research position before you even started college.

Sorry I couldn't be of more help. I majored in engineering, not any of the bio or chem majors, so I'm not too familiar with some of those things 😛

 

[santabanta]

"you couldn't be to much of help"? wtf
hells no
thanks for all that