Research vs Pharmacy Experience

[CaptainKev]

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Hi all,

I was wondering how important (if at all) experience in pharmacy-related jobs/shadowing is in your school application, and if undergrad research is a reasonable alternative? I work in a research lab running westerns on post-methamphetamine or cocaine addicted rat brain tissue, which I would prefer to continue doing far more than volunteering or shadowing at a local pharmacy.

Thanks!

-Kevin

 

[confettiflyer]

Hi all,

I was wondering how important (if at all) experience in pharmacy-related jobs/shadowing is in your school application, and if undergrad research is a reasonable alternative? I work in a research lab running westerns on post-methamphetamine or cocaine addicted rat brain tissue, which I would prefer to continue doing far more than volunteering or shadowing at a local pharmacy.

Thanks!

-Kevin

you'll get 4 years of pharmacy experience in pharmacy school, research is more unique. While you'll get a head start when school begins regarding pharmacy workflow and drug names, the best pharmacists i know didn't necessarily have substantial experience coming into school.

 

[owlegrad]

Hi all,

I was wondering how important (if at all) experience in pharmacy-related jobs/shadowing is in your school application, and if undergrad research is a reasonable alternative? I work in a research lab running westerns on post-methamphetamine or cocaine addicted rat brain tissue, which I would prefer to continue doing far more than volunteering or shadowing at a local pharmacy.

Thanks!

-Kevin

Does your work completely preclude you from ever shadowing one day at a pharmacy?

I wouldn't quit a job you enjoy just to get some experience. Most of your classmates will not have experience in a pharmacy, so you will not be behind the curve.

I miss my time in the lab to be honest. So much more relaxed than working in retail or even at my hospital. sigh

 

[pharmerbird]

I would stick with the research(personally it sounds super interesting!). But as owlegrad said, I'm sure you can do some sort of shadowing just to get a feel for the pharmacy environment. I just shadowed at the VA clinic today which was my first time in a setting outside of retail and it was nice just to see different options for pharmacists and I even got to network and meet a clinical psychiatric pharmacist who I will be shadowing next. Point is, stick with the research but always take up new ventures if you have time.. you never know where they will lead you

 

[CaptainKev]

Thanks for the replies!

Perhaps I could find the time next summer to shadow in a pharmacy... new ventures are always fun. The research is super interesting and incredibly fun, so I'm glad that staying is a reasonable option. Just hope I get published before I start applying, I think that'll look pretty good 🙂

 

[megandupe]

You should consider pharmd/phd! its not an easy walk in the park, but it opens more doors for you!

 

[Passion4Sci]

You should consider pharmd/phd! its not an easy walk in the park, but it opens more doors for you!

Oh, does it?

I mean, I guess you can make the supposition that more degrees = more opportunities but I don't think that is necessarily the case. Can it be proven that a PharmD+PhD gets more job offers (doors) than someone with just a PharmD? You could say, well they have TWO fields open to them! But why wouldn't a company just hire someone who has one degree and will likely therefore request a lower salary? I dunno, I see just as many counter-points to a concurrent PharmD/PhD as I can see positive ones and blanket statements like "It opens more doors" to be disingenuous.

 

[owlegrad]

Thanks for the replies!

Perhaps I could find the time next summer to shadow in a pharmacy... new ventures are always fun. The research is super interesting and incredibly fun, so I'm glad that staying is a reasonable option. Just hope I get published before I start applying, I think that'll look pretty good 🙂

I have yet to find a subtle way to work it into a conversation. It just never comes up organically. "Oh, speaking of natural products chemistry, anyone ever read that investigational report of maylingamide A&B? Pretty neat stereochemistry huh? Want to hear more about the isolation techniques used to purify the compound?"

Take this post for example, I have to go out of my way to mention it and make it seem relevant to the discussion. It is "neat", but I can't say that it has helped me beyond that. 😉 I have never been very good at selling myself though, so perhaps it will be more relevant to you.

 

[phathead]

I've known more people who were denied admission for lack of pharmacy experience (i.e. none) vs those who have a lack of research experience.

But to each their own.

 

[JonPrePharmD]

Thanks for the replies!

Perhaps I could find the time next summer to shadow in a pharmacy... new ventures are always fun. The research is super interesting and incredibly fun, so I'm glad that staying is a reasonable option. Just hope I get published before I start applying, I think that'll look pretty good 🙂

I think that the research is a great plus...I feel like working as a tech in a pharmacy kind of shows them that you're serious and dedicated to the idea of becoming a pharmacist as you know first hand how their day goes, and what it takes.

Try and land a part-time tech job, just to cover shifts, you would benefit more than just shadowing. You have no idea how much you learn as a tech...it's really good stuff. If you have until next year, you can certainly start asking around at local pharmacies for a tech job. Stress that you want part-time and you want it solely for experience, strike up a conversation with a pharmacist (that looks bored). If they say they aren't hiring, ask to leave your info anyway just in case they do. I have friends who have landed tech jobs that way, because as soon as something opens up they go, "oh yeah, that one kid!"...

Good luck with whatever you end up doing!

 

[phathead]

After giving this a bit more thought, why are you so focused on doing research instead of finding out what pharmacy is truly like by working in one or shadowing? How do you know that it is something you truly want to do, yet you don't really want to put the effort into learning about it first hand?

If you can't adequately answer that question, maybe pharmacy isn't for you.

 

[confettiflyer]

I've known more people who were denied admission for lack of pharmacy experience (i.e. none) vs those who have a lack of research experience.

But to each their own.

I know more people admitted partly because of their research experience (unique) vs. those admitted for their pharmacy experience (dime a dozen).

I had both, so I'm not in the "or" bucket like the OP.

 

[owlegrad]

I think it's possible - just possible - that we are being somewhat disingenuous here. None of us are adcoms and I doubt we really know why most people do or do not get into pharmacy school. Sorta like confirmation bias - if you think pharmacy experience is more important you will focus on all the examples of students who had experience, or vise versa.

In truth, it shouldn't be hard to get some experience in a pharmacy while working in a lab. The thing I keep thinking of is (as long as you have some pharmacy experience) that the research experience is quite a bit more unique and much harder to fake. Anyone can claim to have shadowed 500 hours in a pharmacy, it would take guts to fake research experience.

But the bottom line is - do not be an "or". Just do both. 👍 Even if you cannot get an actual job in a pharmacy, you should be able to do something to get a taste of pharmacy.

 

[Lagunatic]

Oh, does it?

I mean, I guess you can make the supposition that more degrees = more opportunities but I don't think that is necessarily the case. Can it be proven that a PharmD+PhD gets more job offers (doors) than someone with just a PharmD? You could say, well they have TWO fields open to them! But why wouldn't a company just hire someone who has one degree and will likely therefore request a lower salary? I dunno, I see just as many counter-points to a concurrent PharmD/PhD as I can see positive ones and blanket statements like "It opens more doors" to be disingenuous.

As in all situations in life, there are multiple sides. More specifically however, when R&D budgets are being cut due to a focus shift, a sales dip, or acquisition - one's versatility becomes desirable. I have personally been involved in the hiring process for our innovation group and our roles are generally evolving quarter to quarter. We generally do not have the headcount to allocate to specialized roles and so we hire those with diverse technical skills, who can adapt to the task at hand. Having great ability in the clinical setting and having strong research skills can save our group time and money.

To your point, I am not sure getting a PharmD/PhD will open the doors to more jobs either, but I do see the need for people with those degrees.

 

[Passion4Sci]

Well, one thing's for certain: With a PharmD+PhD, you'd be exempt from the argument whether a pharmacist should/can be/is called "Doctor" since, well, no one argues how to address the holder of a PhD- It's always "Doctor."

 

[deleted289008]

Speaking for myself, I applied to pharmacy school with more research experience (3 years as an undergraduate researcher) than pharmacy experience (1 year shadowing). I think that research experience is fulfilling because it teaches you many things that a pharmacy volunteering experience doesn't. You learn a lot of pharmacy related experience in pharm school anyway, so perhaps take the opportunity to do something else! As long as you've extensively understood the responsibilities and lifestyles of different kinds of pharmacists, I think you'll be in good standing.

As for PharmD/PhD, the PhD really gives you the opportunity to see the bench to bedside effect. Though one can argue that you can do research as a PharmD, you get a different training during school as a PharmD/PhD. When it comes down to it, what you want to do with your career will determine what degree will benefit you the most. Don't be quick to dismiss anything, be open minded and explore your options!

 

[R2pharmD2]

I've known more people who were denied admission for lack of pharmacy experience (i.e. none) vs those who have a lack of research experience.

But to each their own.

I find it a little hard to believe that otherwise qualified applicants are getting denied solely because they lack pharmacy experience. I'm definitely in the "get as much pharmacy experience as possible" camp, but far too many people get in without experience for that to be a legit reason why people are routinely denied. If you said they were denied because they were clueless about the field and it was painfully obvious in their interview/personal essay, I'd buy that though.

 

[CaptainKev]

After giving this a bit more thought, why are you so focused on doing research instead of finding out what pharmacy is truly like by working in one or shadowing? How do you know that it is something you truly want to do, yet you don't really want to put the effort into learning about it first hand?

If you can't adequately answer that question, maybe pharmacy isn't for you.

Perhaps I should elaborate on my initial statement: it's not that I'm opposed to working in a pharmacy setting or learning about it first hand. After reading all the responses (thanks you all by the way!) it is certainly clear that shadowing at a pharmacy is in my future. I could never make a career in research (figured that out a while ago), but the connections, both professional and personal, that I am experiencing by working in a lab is invaluable. That was the reasoning behind the initial post 🙂

On a side note, everyone on this forum is SO much nicer than those lurking in the pre-med section... Spent some time there as well (just for fun) and it seems to have an infestation of pretentious *******s.

 

[phathead]

I find it a little hard to believe that otherwise qualified applicants are getting denied solely because they lack pharmacy experience. I'm definitely in the "get as much pharmacy experience as possible" camp, but far too many people get in without experience for that to be a legit reason why people are routinely denied. If you said they were denied because they were clueless about the field and it was painfully obvious in their interview/personal essay, I'd buy that though.

Depends on the school you're applying to. There are a few that have a level-head on them and will not admit people who haven't set foot within a pharmacy.

 

[owlegrad]

Perhaps I should elaborate on my initial statement: it's not that I'm opposed to working in a pharmacy setting or learning about it first hand. After reading all the responses (thanks you all by the way!) it is certainly clear that shadowing at a pharmacy is in my future. I could never make a career in research (figured that out a while ago), but the connections, both professional and personal, that I am experiencing by working in a lab is invaluable. That was the reasoning behind the initial post 🙂

On a side note, everyone on this forum is SO much nicer than those lurking in the pre-med section... Spent some time there as well (just for fun) and it seems to have an infestation of pretentious *******s.

Stop you are making me blush. 😳

 

[owlegrad]

I find it a little hard to believe that otherwise qualified applicants are getting denied solely because they lack pharmacy experience. I'm definitely in the "get as much pharmacy experience as possible" camp, but far too many people get in without experience for that to be a legit reason why people are routinely denied. If you said they were denied because they were clueless about the field and it was painfully obvious in their interview/personal essay, I'd buy that though.

Agree with this. I have a hard time imagining a school that refuses to accept tuition checks from students with little to no experience. I am not saying that it is untrue, it is simply different than my experience with pharmacy schools. I had zero experience when I first applied and I got in everywhere I applied. Some questioned why I had not gotten any experience but they all excepted me just the same. Obviously I didn't all to all pharmacy schools though, it is simply my n=1 experience.

 

[Rouelle]

To the OP: I was in a somewhat similar situation when I applied to pharmacy school. My gpa and pcat were fine. I had a TON of research experience, but my pharmacy experience was pretty anemic. I was pretty worried about it because, to me, it was a gaping hole in my application. In the end, it didn't matter...I got accepted. It didn't even come up in the interviews. I tend to think that a weakness or two in the application can be overcome by a particular strength somewhere else that offsets it. I'm guessing that very few "perfect applicants" (4.0 gpa, 99 pcat, 2 yrs pharmacy tech, published research) exist, so go with what you have.

 

[Rouelle]

Oh, does it?

I mean, I guess you can make the supposition that more degrees = more opportunities but I don't think that is necessarily the case. Can it be proven that a PharmD+PhD gets more job offers (doors) than someone with just a PharmD? You could say, well they have TWO fields open to them! But why wouldn't a company just hire someone who has one degree and will likely therefore request a lower salary? I dunno, I see just as many counter-points to a concurrent PharmD/PhD as I can see positive ones and blanket statements like "It opens more doors" to be disingenuous.

I think the PharmD/PhD issue can be a double edged sword with regard to job opportunities. On the one hand, it opens the academic doors wide open. The PhD tends to be the premier degree for academic positions, and the combination allows for the possibility of working in a wider variety of departments than would typically be possible with either degree alone. I also subscribe to the opinion that a PharmD coupled with a basic science PhD makes one more competitive for industrial positions...I have seen this combination work for several.

Where the PhD might be a bit restrictive is in the retail / hospital staff settings (simply due to the perception of overqualification), and these undoubtedly make up the bulk of pharmacy jobs. From personal experience, I am a PhD chemist and am starting my P1 year next month. I have filled out numerous applications for part time pharmacy tech positions at major retail chains. All ask for highest educational degree attained, and I answer honestly. None of the major chains gave me a second look, and I seriously wonder if my PhD hurt me there.