Ross University

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Cassiboo

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10+ Year Member
I was thinking about applying for the Ross University School of Veterinary Medicine, but I found out about PETA's campaign against their cruel animal procedures. I'm an animal lover and want to be a vet to help animals, not hurt them. Why can't Ross just teach their students with humane alternatives? http://getactive.peta.org/campaign/ross_university
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Deleted because I really don't know enough about Ross to answer!
 
Generally, I take everything I hear from PETA with a grain of salt. Their campaigns are often inflammatory and intended to get a knee-jerk reaction rather than being geared towards inducing discussion. I also do not like their objectification of women in the pursuit of preventing objectification of and cruelty towards animals.

If I were you, I'd ask some Ross students about what things are actually like at the school right now. I've never been to Ross and don't know anyone who goes there, so I can't tell you, but maybe someone else on the board can.
 
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Cassiboo said:
I was thinking about applying for the Ross University School of Veterinary Medicine, but I found out about PETA's campaign against their cruel animal procedures. I'm an animal lover and want to be a vet to help animals, not hurt them. Why can't Ross just teach their students with humane alternatives? http://getactive.peta.org/campaign/ross_university
😕
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There is a difference between doing procedures in school (terminal surgeries) and being inhumane. I am willing to bet everything they do at Ross is under the supervision of veterinarians and follows the standard of care with regard to pain management, technique, etc. Anyway, I'm not a fan of PETA. All personal feelings aside, I found this interesting: http://aspcacommunity.ning.com/group/animalcrueltypetitions/forum/topic/show?id=658300%3ATopic%3A600880
 
You are probably going to see and DO a lot worse then this in the course of becoming and practicing as a veterinarian.

If you were actually considering applying there, and have since changed your mind, I would question your understanding and desire to enter this field as well as your ability to serve as a compassionate yet pragmatic veterinarian.

Considering you have 1 post under your belt, that it is a defamatory post linked to PETA, I assume you are just trying to 'spread the good word'.
 
I agree that you should get with students that are attending Ross to find out what is actually happening. You could also ask the school itself.

I have found, after asking, the classes that were objectionable to me were electives or club activities that were not necessary for completion of the degree. Also, some of the things I had heard weren't exactly true. I have not found a university, that I was interested in, that penalized students for wanting an alternative option. The one I hope to go to has its animal use policy right in the admissions brochure so everyone can look at it.

Ross's site is pretty tight lipped about everything. I'd send an e-mail, or request further information on the site.
 
While the procedures might be done under supervision, I would still have a problem with operating on animals who were healthy and wouldn't otherwise need to undergo surgery. There are plenty of other ways to learn. And while PETA does have a campaign against the Ross University School of Veterinary Medicine, it was an actual student who filed the lawsuit. Ross told her she wouldn't have to harm any animals during her training, and then refused to give her an option (see the link i posted).

It's really upsetting to me because Ross seemed like a good option for me, but I would like to speak with some students who currently attend Ross. So are there any Ross students on here?
 
Cassie, is your problem with using healthy teaching dogs, or with terminal surgery? Every (and if not every, almost every) vet school in the US uses teaching dogs - for learning anesthesia, endoscopy, exploratory celiotomy in some cases, spays/neuters, if we do not get enough client dogs, etc. They also are useful to help people learn anatomy, to do physical exam, neurological exame, optho exams, etc.

They also usually keep or have nearby healthy horses and cows for people to practice rectal exams, anesthesia, nerve blocks, etc.

These dogs are always brought back. I do agree that I do have a bit of an issue with terminal surgeries, however.

Everyone keeps talking about humane alternatives. How can you learn to properly intubate a dog if you have only practiced on models? How can you properly close an abdominal wall if you've only practiced on models and computer programs? Place a IV or urinary catheter? All sorts of things. You can't, plain and simple.
 
WhtsThFrequency said:
Everyone keeps talking about humane alternatives. How can you learn to properly intubate a dog if you have only practiced on models? How can you properly close an abdominal wall if you've only practiced on models and computer programs? Place a IV or urinary catheter? All sorts of things. You can't, plain and simple.
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I've learned to do many of the things you have mentioned in a perfectly humane manner. You study, then practice on models, then do. You don't need to do terminal or unnecessarily invasive procedures in order to learn these things. Yes, your first time is likely to be on an animal who genuinely needs the procedures. But my first attempts at all the skills you mentioned - placing IV catheters, urinary catheters (both male and female), intubating - were successful because I had studied and practiced enough that I was genuinely ready to perform the skill. As for closing an abdominal wall, I've actually done that once, too - after a necropsy. And I'm a tech, not even a vet student!
 
*waves hands in the air* OOH! ME! I'm a Ross student! So, I'm only a first semester, but I also know people in upper semesters and whatnot, and I live down here, so I think I've got a pretty good idea of what's going on.

First of all, I'm also not a fan of PETA- they tend to blow things out of proportion and give "animal rights" a bad name. The things they say on that site are just ridiculous, and they don't happen here. Our professors here yell at us if we're too rough with palpating animals, so to think that they would tell us to hack up a live donkey is almost laughable.

I don't know about terminal surgeries here, but as optimistic 13 said, dogs that are euthanized in shelters die much more needlessly than a dog that is used for educational purposes in a vet school. I'm pretty sure they don't do unnecessary surgeries on healthy animals here, but I would have to check.

Right now, in first semester, we're dissecting a dog in anatomy lab. I don't know for sure, but we think she died because of heartworms (her heart was full of them- it was neat to look at). We share a dog between 6 people, so we're not using more dogs than is necessary. While it saddens me that this dog died (of course), I think it would be even worse for me to never have seen the inside of a dog when I do my first surgery.

Basically, I think you should take what PETA says with a grain of salt. The accusations on that website are crazy, and I think their info may be outdated. I don't know what went on before I got here, but I know that my class was one of the first classes to start after they changed the curriculum around a bit. I don't know if these practices did exist before and getting rid of them was part of the curriculum change, or if they never existed in the first place. But I don't think I'd be here if something like that was going on.

If you have any other questions about Ross, let me know or PM me. I'd be happy to help. 🙂
 
No Imagination said:
You are probably going to see and DO a lot worse then this in the course of becoming and practicing as a veterinarian.

If you were actually considering applying there, and have since changed your mind, I would question your understanding and desire to enter this field as well as your ability to serve as a compassionate yet pragmatic veterinarian.

Considering you have 1 post under your belt, that it is a defamatory post linked to PETA, I assume you are just trying to 'spread the good word'.
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Dang! That's quite a statement. Animal usage for the purpose of teaching veterinary students has dropped way off in the USA (and Ross too though maybe not as much as in some US schools).

Many terminal surgery labs have been replaced with models to teach hand skills and procedures. Some use already humanely euthanized cadavers. The profession has changed dramatically with animal use in teaching labs being critically evaluated. Statements like "they would have been euthanized anyway, so why not give students the benefit of experience" have given way to other objective assessments of the various teaching options.

It is absolutely ok to question the use of animals at a prospective school. Some schools have offered tracks using alternative techniques. The debate will go on and on and there is no one right answer. One side will feel that live animal training is essential, other sides worry what all the euthanasia in the name of teaching does to student's compassion. Everyone's entitled to an opinion and I for one am very glad to see students today learning without the trail of carnage I saw 20 years ago when I was in vet school.
 
I don't attend Ross, so I can't speak for them. But I do know that you have to take PETA as a grain of salt and everything they say or do. I am not a fan of PETA. In my anatomy lab we were talking about them the other day becuase my professor was talking about how they wanted to ban dissecting of animals becuase they think it is bad or whatever. At times I don;t think what they say or do is logical, in fact sometimes down right stupid. But anyways, I would not not apply to a school because of something PETA says. Do your research and take thier info (or lack of) as a grain of salt.
 
Cassiboo said:
I was thinking about applying for the Ross University School of Veterinary Medicine, but I found out about PETA's campaign against their cruel animal procedures. I'm an animal lover and want to be a vet to help animals, not hurt them. Why can't Ross just teach their students with humane alternatives? http://getactive.peta.org/campaign/ross_university
😕
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I’m a Ross student –
The Dean is a veterinarian; all of the associate Deans are veterinarians and 99% of the professors are veterinarians – all graduates from AVMA accredited schools or excellent international universities, with years of experience in private practice, public health, research and/or teaching institutions.
All of a sudden they come to St. Kitts and become butchers - ANNNNDD force their students to butcher animals too??!!!?
Come on…..part of entering the veterinary profession is becoming informed so I hope that you will take a closer look at Peta and Ingrid Newkirk. Shady
 
aggiegolf said:
I would be much more concerned about the crime rate on that island than PETA lol.
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Definitely a “heightened sense” of real life issues – kind of ironic, being on a teeeeny tropical island and all.
……but the school is ethically and morally sound and the academic program is solid.
 
Jeterfan1 said:
I’m a Ross student –
The Dean is a veterinarian; all of the associate Deans are veterinarians and 99% of the professors are veterinarians – all graduates from AVMA accredited schools or excellent international universities, with years of experience in private practice, public health, research and/or teaching institutions.
All of a sudden they come to St. Kitts and become butchers - ANNNNDD force their students to butcher animals too??!!!?
Come on…..part of entering the veterinary profession is becoming informed so I hope that you will take a closer look at Peta and Ingrid Newkirk. Shady
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I also agree with what Jeterfan1 said. And from the interactions I've had with Dean de Young, I think he's really nice and would never condone anything like this going on.

By the way, Jeterfan, how have you been? Enjoying the 3 huge exams coming up all in a row? 🙄 I know I've sat in the classroom with you every day for the past two months, but I don't think I've really met you... 🙂
 
zpinkpanther said:
I also agree with what Jeterfan1 said. And from the interactions I've had with Dean de Young, I think he's really nice and would never condone anything like this going on.

By the way, Jeterfan, how have you been? Enjoying the 3 huge exams coming up all in a row? 🙄 I know I've sat in the classroom with you every day for the past two months, but I don't think I've really met you... 🙂
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Hi zpinkpanther!
Seems like a million yrs ago that we were freakin out about getting in, huh?!
Things are good, but school is a challenge to say the least! How bout you – everything good?
I haven’t been on this forum since I got down here, but last night I was totally procrastinating when I should have been studying (as I am now)and there it was - Peta! Gets my blood boiling. Seems to me the last thing a so-called animal advocacy group should be doing is targeting a vet school . How’s about Pam Anderson come down (Newkirk is banned from the country) and take a walk around town to see some cruelty… And then speak to all of the actual non-disgruntled students about the bazillion ways Ross students are making a difference in the lives of these animals.
Shady, shady group of people! Too bad, once upon a time they did great stuff.
 
Jeterfan1 said:
Hi zpinkpanther!
Seems like a million yrs ago that we were freakin out about getting in, huh?!
Things are good, but school is a challenge to say the least! How bout you – everything good?
I haven’t been on this forum since I got down here, but last night I was totally procrastinating when I should have been studying (as I am now)and there it was - Peta! Gets my blood boiling. Seems to me the last thing a so-called animal advocacy group should be doing is targeting a vet school . How’s about Pam Anderson come down (Newkirk is banned from the country) and take a walk around town to see some cruelty… And then speak to all of the actual non-disgruntled students about the bazillion ways Ross students are making a difference in the lives of these animals.
Shady, shady group of people! Too bad, once upon a time they did great stuff.
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I know! It does seem like forever ago. Things are good with me, school is definitely challenging, but I'm managing. I do come on here once in a while though, because I like to procrastinate. 😉

Ick, I really hate PETA. Seriously, it does seem counterintuitive for an animal activist group to target a vet school. I don't believe any of that stuff for a second- PAWS would be all over their butts if that was actually going on. We'd get bombarded with petitions and such every day. I think they should do an article about the students that are always rescuing the local dogs from bad situations and using their own money to get them medical care before finding them foster homes. Then see what they think of us.

Grrrr.
 
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