Salary after Fellowship in REI/MFM

[community]

I am at that point in my residency where I am deciding whether or not to pursue fellowship. I am looking for all of the MFM/REI attendings out there who can be honest about their starting salary after fellowship…..and can also tell me what the earning potential is after fellowship in these specialties. Also, what are the benefits/drawbacks of fellowship. Thank you!!!!!

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[nykka3]

check out mdjobexhange.com. there is a personal doc story from someone doing rei and mis stuff. not sure about mfm. you could also PM mdjobexchange. i got some good info from him.

 

[community]

Thanks for the reply. The site was helpful.

 

[boyob]

Hey I am just entering my mfm fellowship and also looked into this. I will tell you there is a large range of salary for both ob/gyn and fellowship trained folks. I don't know much about REI but can comment on this at least in CA and some other places.

Most MFM attendings at the university earn about 220-280 depending on level associate/assistant/full
MFM attendings at say HMO like Kaiser start about 310
MFM through private earn somewhere 300-400, but work sig more than others

In contrast many ob/gyn attendings do pretty well here as well
University 180-220
Kaiser 210-220
Private 200-300+

Basically, a ob/gyn in private practice makes a lot of money but takes a few years to get rolling...of course fellowship is 3 years!

This includes an extra set of oral/written boards and being someone's slave for 3 more years!

I think overall doing the fellowship gives you a slight increase in pay and probably a better schedule if you can set it up. The hardest thing is giving up stuff. Remember if you are an REI you probably won't do a hyst anytime soon.....and forget about delivering babies. etc etc
Think about what you want really want as the money can be made regardless.
Good luck
PS MFM fully matched this year as did REI, my director says the most competitive it has ever been. Gyn Onc 4 open programs

 

[OBGirlie]

MFM is really that high paid? Is this for MFM's who continue to deliver, b/c I know there are some MFM's that just do consults. Also, how about the malpractice? I imagine that its pretty high since you are dealing with a population that inherently is high risk. . . and I'm guessing that REI malpractice would be lower since well, they couldn't get pregnant before they came so what are they going to do? Bring forth legal action b/c they couldn't get pregnant?

Hopefully programs will go through the differences b/t the two fields which us and what the upside/downsides are to both!

 

[pruritis_ani]

MFM is paid well, those numbers are accurate (actually, from my research maybe even on the low side). Malpractice is likely a bit higher, but all salary quotes are AFTER malpractice insurance is paid.

 

[nykka3]

MFM is paid well, those numbers are accurate (actually, from my research maybe even on the low side). Malpractice is likely a bit higher, but all salary quotes are AFTER malpractice insurance is paid.

so what are the avg. salaries s/p malpractice for urogyn or gynonc ?

 

[Global Disrobal]

Their pay is in similar range when in Academia or HMO, however once in private practice you have to factor in the specifics of each subspecialty. While MFM & REI spend a substantial portion of their time in the office coding for consultations & procedures, GYN/ONC and URO/GYN need to dedicate many hours to the O.R. resulting in a slightly lower pay.

All else aside, subspecialty training generally equals higher pay & better life style. But honestly, you can always gear your general practice to more money and/or better life style... Just do what makes you happy!

 

[nykka3]

Their pay is in similar range when in Academia or HMO, however once in private practice you have to factor in the specifics of each subspecialty. While MFM & REI spend a substantial portion of their time in the office coding for consultations & procedures, GYN/ONC and URO/GYN need to dedicate many hours to the O.R. resulting in a slightly lower pay.

All else aside, subspecialty training generally equals higher pay & better life style. But honestly, you can always gear your general practice to more money and/or better life style... Just do what makes you happy!

wow, gynonc makes LESS than mfm. i find that hard to believe. how did you find this out?

 

[Global Disrobal]

I'm speaking of the trends here in the Mid-Atlantic area. Realize that ultrasounds are an immense source of income. This is also a reflection of the continually lower reimbursements for surgical procedures. Ask GYN/ONC and GYN surgeons at your program regarding this and you'll see scary trends. Also, keep in mind that there is a large demand for MFM's in the market right now, which is a downstream effect of the decline in the number of people that sought subspecializing in this field several years ago.

 

[nykka3]

I'm speaking of the trends here in the Mid-Atlantic area. Realize that ultrasounds are an immense source of income. This is also a reflection of the continually lower reimbursements for surgical procedures. Ask GYN/ONC and GYN surgeons at your program regarding this and you'll see scary trends. Also, keep in mind that there is a large demand for MFM's in the market right now, which is a downstream effect of the decline in the number of people that sought subspecializing in this field several years ago.

ok i get it! thanks. economics sucks.

 

[OBGirlie]

Okay so how about this scenario? An MFM that just does consults, but does not come in to deliver? Are they still in the 250K? Just wondering?

 

[chrisisinnocent]

Okay so how about this scenario? An MFM that just does consults, but does not come in to deliver? Are they still in the 250K? Just wondering?

Yes maybe even more if they don't deliver. Deliveries as far as time spent per money reimbursed is much less profitable than doing ultrasounds all day and consults for high risk pregnancies.

 

[GYN DOC]

How much would you suspect someone would make that practices gyn only, in office gyn procedures,and gyn surgery after a laparoscopic minimally invasive fellowship? Someone who in private practice works in office 2.5 days a week and the OR 2 days a week?

What do you guys think about OB/GYN that do inoffice noninvasive aesthetic procedures?

 

[Diane L. Evans]

Some perople are doing ablations in the office with cervical blocks and get reimbursed well 3K+ after expenses paid. Some also also doing office hysteroscopy and essure (coil tubal ligations). A lot perform LEEPS and cryo surgeries too.

 

[OBGirlie]

How much would you suspect someone would make that practices gyn only, in office gyn procedures,and gyn surgery after a laparoscopic minimally invasive fellowship? Someone who in private practice works in office 2.5 days a week and the OR 2 days a week?

What do you guys think about OB/GYN that do inoffice noninvasive aesthetic procedures?

The starting mean for gyn only is 150K, that's what I found on google and the mdjobexchange.

 

[TheJayBee]

Always remember to do what you love- in your life and your career. We all know that Money should never be the sole criteria.

Some objective data and source is below. See the link for details by region.

Malpractice rates vary. MFM rates may actually be lower than OB/Gyn generalists in some states.

2007 PHYSICIAN COMPENSATION SURVEY by the American Medical Group Association (AMGA)

http://www.cejkasearch.com/compensation/amga_physician_compensation_survey.htm

OB GYN SPECIFIC All Physicians
Gynecological Oncology $358,297
Gynecology $225,182
Gynecology & Obstetrics $270,793
Obstetrics $297,887
Perinatology $349,807
Reproductive Endocrinology $299,620

 

[mdjobexchange]

Most of the numbers in the replies are on target. The MGMA and AMGA salary surveys are pretty accurate. Keep in mind that there are big regional differences. Docs in San Francisco make peanuts. Docs in the Southeast do much better. Denver is another area that has poor pay. It basically boils down to supply and demand. Popular places with lots of training programs don't pay well.

As far as REI goes, my wife had a starting salary of $200,000. She quit that practice because it sucked and the person who ran it was running it into the ground. You can check out my blog on starting a fertility practice. From the numbers we have been running, a RE doc who owns their own clinic can make around $500k, but it is a business and chews up lots of time.

Docs who work for Integramed make around $400k. They do not have the business hassles, so they make somewhat less. They do work reasonably hard, but there is still minimal night work.

We know some people who work for Sher, and they start around $200k and work up to around $350 or so. Kaiser is about the same.

For MFM, you can do pretty well. With our population getting more obese and having more medical problems, as well as waiting longer to start families, their services are in big demand. All those ultrasounds add up. My wife refers many pts to a MFM here in town who is doing quite well. The $350-400 numbers are probably on the low side. I would say those are for an employed MFM. If you own your own practice and run it right, you can do better.

 

[OBGirlie]

Most of the numbers in the replies are on target. The MGMA and AMGA salary surveys are pretty accurate. Keep in mind that there are big regional differences. Docs in San Francisco make peanuts. Docs in the Southeast do much better. Denver is another area that has poor pay. It basically boils down to supply and demand. Popular places with lots of training programs don't pay well.

As far as REI goes, my wife had a starting salary of $200,000. She quit that practice because it sucked and the person who ran it was running it into the ground. You can check out my blog on starting a fertility practice. From the numbers we have been running, a RE doc who owns their own clinic can make around $500k, but it is a business and chews up lots of time.

Docs who work for Integramed make around $400k. They do not have the business hassles, so they make somewhat less. They do work reasonably hard, but there is still minimal night work.

We know some people who work for Sher, and they start around $200k and work up to around $350 or so. Kaiser is about the same.

For MFM, you can do pretty well. With our population getting more obese and having more medical problems, as well as waiting longer to start families, their services are in big demand. All those ultrasounds add up. My wife refers many pts to a MFM here in town who is doing quite well. The $350-400 numbers are probably on the low side. I would say those are for an employed MFM. If you own your own practice and run it right, you can do better.

I wonder if anyone could speak to the lifestyle (not money) of an MFM doc? The one I worked with was always SUPER stressed! I think MFM is also very interesting but I don't want to get all depressed and be an emotional wreck, b/c then the money/good hours wouldn't be worth it at all, even if I am interested. . . on the bright side, isn't it awesome that OB has so many options!

 

[amy2003uva]

As far as REI goes, my wife had a starting salary of $200,000. She quit that practice because it sucked and the person who ran it was running it into the ground. You can check out my blog on starting a fertility practice. From the numbers we have been running, a RE doc who owns their own clinic can make around $500k, but it is a business and chews up lots of time.

Thank you for starting your blog and sharing your experiences with starting your wife's practice. My husband and I are going to be a two-physician household and I also want to do REI so all of your advice and knowledge is very helpful.

 

[OBGirlie]

Wow, this thread brings up memories! Can't believe I am in fellowship now! I ended up deciding MFM, hoping that the future will be all that I hoped it would!

 

[GLENMARK]

Hey I am just entering my mfm fellowship and also looked into this. I will tell you there is a large range of salary for both ob/gyn and fellowship trained folks. I don't know much about REI but can comment on this at least in CA and some other places.

Most MFM attendings at the university earn about 220-280 depending on level associate/assistant/full
MFM attendings at say HMO like Kaiser start about 310
MFM through private earn somewhere 300-400, but work sig more than others

In contrast many ob/gyn attendings do pretty well here as well
University 180-220
Kaiser 210-220
Private 200-300+

Basically, a ob/gyn in private practice makes a lot of money but takes a few years to get rolling...of course fellowship is 3 years!

This includes an extra set of oral/written boards and being someone's slave for 3 more years!

I think overall doing the fellowship gives you a slight increase in pay and probably a better schedule if you can set it up. The hardest thing is giving up stuff. Remember if you are an REI you probably won't do a hyst anytime soon.....and forget about delivering babies. etc etc
Think about what you want really want as the money can be made regardless.
Good luck
PS MFM fully matched this year as did REI, my director says the most competitive it has ever been. Gyn Onc 4 open programs [/QUOTE




This is a very useful information. Can someone update it?

 

[toutou]

Wow, this thread brings up memories! Can't believe I am in fellowship now! I ended up deciding MFM, hoping that the future will be all that I hoped it would!

OBGirlie, how has your experience been so far?