SGU 2009 Match List

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Dunno if it's just me, but the list looks a little light this year numbers-wise, and quite a few staple programs seem conspicuously absent...
Any particular reason for that?
 
yep it's because the list is still being updated. all the advanced programs aren't listed at all. thus there are no Rads matches and other advanced programs as well. That list is just what NRMP provided to the school, prematches come in through out the year because students have to report them individually.
 
I seriously doubt that any significant number of students from SGU ever "prematch" in any of the competitive specialties like Rads. The list is what it is. The number of students that matched through the regular match.

As it was already said...not very impressive.
 
BrainBuff said:
I seriously doubt that any significant number of students from SGU ever "prematch" in any of the competitive specialties like Rads. The list is what it is. The number of students that matched through the regular match.

As it was already said...not very impressive.
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Rads doesn't offer prematches. the most "competitive" programs i know of that offer prematching are Gen Surgery and Anesthesia. but for the most part IM, FM, and Peds are the main ones that offer prematching, so it's possible that many prematched into those fields but no one prematched into Rads simply because they don't do that.

It's impressive that one guy got IM at Yale, it's impressive that 42 people matched into EM, the 2 that matched Ortho is very impressive, the one guy that matched Neurosurgery at Cambridge UK is super impressive. There were also a lot of Solid University programs for IM like Georgetown, University of St. Louis, U of Arizona, University of Florida, USC.

one guy got Anesthesia at Stanford.

otherwise it's a bunch of community programs, but what do you expect it's a foreign med school. I was impressed more with last years match list.
 
BrainBuff said:
I seriously doubt that any significant number of students from SGU ever "prematch" in any of the competitive specialties like Rads. The list is what it is. The number of students that matched through the regular match.

As it was already said...not very impressive.
Click to expand...

I disagree.
Each year there are an increasing number of US grads and DOs that will try to take good res spots from competitive Carib applicants. With that in mind, I feel this is an impressive list of matches and prematches.
After thoroughly reviewing the list of PGY1 (2009) and PGY2 (2010) spots, its exactly what I expect from a strong SGU class. Tons of university-based IM and Peds programs; a handful going into neuro, rads, and cat surgery specialties. Also, I am very impressed by the Anesthesia, PMNR and EM placements. Very strong showing in EM, good work future ER docs.

Big Picture: Every time an SGU grad takes a foot in the door of a big institution like Stanford, its opening the doors for the rest of us!
Congrats to all SGU students!

An SGU graduate has nearly every opportunity available to them in the match, they just need to go out and pursue it.

rlxdmd
 
BrainBuff said:
I seriously doubt that any significant number of students from SGU ever "prematch" in any of the competitive specialties like Rads. The list is what it is. The number of students that matched through the regular match.

As it was already said...not very impressive.
Click to expand...
Not supposed to be impressive or unimpressive but merely a link for anyone interested in applying to check out.

Chill out buddy.
 
I think it's actually pretty impressive. Many US med schools are comparable: EVMS, OU, etc.
 
Neurosurgery in the UK is not the same as neurosurgery in the US. It is a wonderful achievement, but it reflects on the UK citizen who matched, not on SGU, per se.

Did anyone find out if the Johns Hopkins match in surgery was categorical or preliminary?

BTW- Once again, one of the Ortho matches was in Canada and I am not sure if that is more impressive or not (depending on the connections the person has back home).
 
turtledog said:
I think it's actually pretty impressive. Many US med schools are comparable: EVMS, OU, etc.
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Except SGU has a class size of 800, while EVMS and OU have a class size of 140 each. You do the math.
 
Guinea said:
Except SGU has a class size of 800, while EVMS and OU have a class size of 140 each. You do the math.
Click to expand...

Can you show us the link to this information?

I would be shocked to see that the SGU class size is nearing 800.... Last I heard they were planning a 1000 seat lecture hall (just an old rumor), but seriously, has it reached 800?

rlxdmd
 
relaxedMD said:
Can you show us the link to this information?

I would be shocked to see that the SGU class size is nearing 800.... Last I heard they were planning a 1000 seat lecture hall (just an old rumor), but seriously, has it reached 800?

rlxdmd
Click to expand...
Well, the total number of MD students in the 4-year program is 3,004, which comes out to be about 750 per year. Take into account attrition and smaller class sizes 3 years ago, they are certainly well past 800 now.
See: http://www.sgu.edu/about-sgu/SOM-student-bodypg2.html#1

For Fall 2007, the total number of MD students entering that semester to the Grenada campus is 392, in addition to another 117 at the England campus. So that's over 500 for just one semester (they have two entering semesters).
See: http://www.sgu.edu/about-sgu/SOM-student-bodypg2.html#18
 
Guinea said:
Well, the total number of MD students in the 4-year program is 3,004, which comes out to be about 750 per year. Take into account attrition and smaller class sizes 3 years ago, they are certainly well past 800 now.
See: http://www.sgu.edu/about-sgu/SOM-student-bodypg2.html#1

For Fall 2007, the total number of MD students entering that semester to the Grenada campus is 392, in addition to another 117 at the England campus. So that's over 500 for just one semester (they have two entering semesters).
See: http://www.sgu.edu/about-sgu/SOM-student-bodypg2.html#18
Click to expand...

I don't get why a high attrition rate is necessarily a bad thing.
The caribbean will give you a chance but if you dont deserve to be in medical school you dont deserve to be there.
 
medhearter said:
I don't get why a high attrition rate is necessarily a bad thing.
The caribbean will give you a chance but if you dont deserve to be in medical school you dont deserve to be there.
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a high attrition rate is a bad thing for the school to have because it gives it a bad rap. this means the school is careless in it's admission process and that the school is possibly malignant forcing people to fail out. This all means that the school gives people false hope in order to just take their money, which for the students is a bad thing, when applying to any school not just med school you want to make sure that you have a great chance of graduating after being accepted. what's the point of being accepted and wasting your time and money if you're only going to fail out. Med schools should have a strict admission process in the first place so that those that aren't smart enough don't get in, and they shouldn't accept everyone and then weed them out by making a certain percent of the class fail each exam by having a bell shaped curve.
 
RussianJoo said:
a high attrition rate is a bad thing for the school to have because it gives it a bad rap. this means the school is careless in it's admission process and that the school is possibly malignant forcing people to fail out. This all means that the school gives people false hope in order to just take their money, which for the students is a bad thing, when applying to any school not just med school you want to make sure that you have a great chance of graduating after being accepted. what's the point of being accepted and wasting your time and money if you're only going to fail out. Med schools should have a strict admission process in the first place so that those that aren't smart enough don't get in, and they shouldn't accept everyone and then weed them out by making a certain percent of the class fail each exam by having a bell shaped curve.
Click to expand...

Very true in theory, but very difficult in practice for Caribbean schools. First of all, you're already dealing with generally underqualified applicant pool in terms of GPA and/or MCATs. The challenges these schools face is looking at this applicant pool, seeing the negatives and knowing where to say "yes, but..." So what options do Caribbean admissions committees really have:

1) They can set basic cutoffs, similar to US admissions policy, looking for the typical "smart" applicants. Of course they would be lower, but not drastically lower. So you say nobody with under a 3.4 and a 26. This would certainly lead to a more selective class, but are you really getting the right US school rejects.

2) You have more fluid admissions standards. You look at the student with a 2.8 GPA but with a 34 on the MCATs. You look at the student with a 3.9 but with a 24. And you continue to look at the 3.4 and 26's. That's casting a much wider net and pretty much ensures that if there's good students out there, good future doctors, slipping through the US school cracks, you'll catch them. Of course, you also catch a lot of duds, hence attrition.

3) You have more fluid admissions standards, still acknowledging that the 2.8/34's are qualified, but just have a more rigorous and thorough application process to really narrow down what's really a vast number of such marginal applicants into only the absolutely qualified. Essentially a fluid yet exclusive admissions policy.

Which approach is really best? Well, anyone with experience in the Caribbean knows that some of the best students would not have made the cut in admissions policy 1 while some of the worst would. So some of the best students only make it because of a very forgiving admissions policy like option 2. Option 1 is probably the worst in my opinion, because let's face it, the narrow group of people above a Caribbean cutoff in both areas but below the US cutoff, well there's not much exceptional in that group. And additionally it's completely antithetical to the founding policies of these schools, that the numbers don't tell the story of a candidate. And Option 3 is just asking way too much of an admissions committee from a practical standpoint. So you're left with Option 2 and the logic that continues to drive expansion at the expense of attrition.

Personally, I'm all for casting a wide net in Caribbean schools, but culling the herd mercilessly. If the quality of entrants isn't impressive, at least the quality of graduates will be...
 
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I agree with RussianJoo on this.
I would be wary of any Carib school with a high attrition rate...or that doesn't pass 80% + (hopefully 90% or more) on the USMLE. It means they either are taking the $ of people who shouldn't be down there because they can't cut it as a med student, or the school is not teaching the students well.

Every prospective medical student without perfect stats (in the US or prospective Carib student) thinks he/she is a "diamond in the rough" but the admissions committee's job is to realistically assess the applicants and choose only the ones who REALLY are capable and ready for medical school. Of course, no process is perfect and people will fall through the cracks...it definitely happens with US and Canadian schools, and I'm sure SABA and/or St. George has occasionally taken people who didn't do well, at the expense of a student who would have, though he/she didn't look good on paper. However, for someone who is determined, it would be better to improve the application (or choose another health care career) and get into a better Caribbean school (or US or Canadian school) than get a worthless degree from some place that is a med school in name only. If hardly any students from a school actually make it into US or Canadian residencies, that is a bad prognostic indicator for both the quality of your future classmates and the quality of the education you're going to get at the school. Don't just take admission at any place that calls itself a med school because you are desperate.
 
dtwalrus said:
Personally, I'm all for casting a wide net in Caribbean schools, but culling the herd mercilessly. If the quality of entrants isn't impressive, at least the quality of graduates will be...
Click to expand...


I agree with this.
If a carib school with its lower requirements took 800 students a year, and graduated 700..... i dont think there would be ANY respect for these graduates...
 
dragonfly99 said:
Every prospective medical student without perfect stats (in the US or prospective Carib student) thinks he/she is a "diamond in the rough"
Click to expand...
The wonderful consequence of our feel-good education system. Many aren't realistic of their capabilities and determination.
 
Why is it that in the match, there is only one PGY-1 radiologist but over 10 PGY-2 Daignostic Radiologists? How does PGY-2 work? Do people from other residency switch into Rad?
 
medhearter said:
I agree with this.
If a carib school with its lower requirements took 800 students a year, and graduated 700..... i dont think there would be ANY respect for these graduates...
Click to expand...

If they do well on the step and get a residency, what would be your logic?

How would they be any different than a US med student?
 
Guinea said:
The wonderful consequence of our feel-good education system. Many aren't realistic of their capabilities and determination.
Click to expand...

And for some the road is rough and they are ground into the dirt.

Others change their ways and blossom.

Then there are the diamonds in the rough.

Realism is for sheep. Realpolitik is for goats.
 
siliconknight00 said:
Why is it that in the match, there is only one PGY-1 radiologist but over 10 PGY-2 Daignostic Radiologists? How does PGY-2 work? Do people from other residency switch into Rad?
Click to expand...

No such thing as a PGY1 radiologist, technically speaking.
 
Guinea said:
The wonderful consequence of our feel-good education system. Many aren't realistic of their capabilities and determination.
Click to expand...

That's not what I meant. And anyone who thinks that med school represents a "feel good education system" has very likely never gone to med school. I have, and I'd say that being an average med student is nothing to feel ashamed about...in a group comprised pretty much of former straight-A college students who scored >> average on the MCAT, a test generally only taken by premeds (= mostly bright, ambitious overachievers) it isn't surprising that most incoming med students don't realize they have only a small chance of being on the "good"/high extreme end of the med school grading bell curve.
 
dragonfly99 said:
That's not what I meant. And anyone who thinks that med school represents a "feel good education system" has very likely never gone to med school. I have, and I'd say that being an average med student is nothing to feel ashamed about...in a group comprised pretty much of former straight-A college students who scored >> average on the MCAT, a test generally only taken by premeds (= mostly bright, ambitious overachievers) it isn't surprising that most incoming med students don't realize they have only a small chance of being on the "good"/high extreme end of the med school grading bell curve.
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I think he was talking about K-12 and some colleges, which give people an inflated sense of entitlement without having earned it. Thus many of these people will fall on their faces during medical school, especially medical school in the Caribbean.

Notice he was quoting your "prospective medical student" comment.
 
AngryBaby said:
for anyone that's interested:

SGU Match List 2009
Click to expand...

What % of SGU graduates are matched to Allopathic residencies in the U.S.? I'm applying this year (MDapp) and am trying to figure out whether I would have a greater chance at an Internal Medicine residency from SGU or Ross versus DO schools like Western or Touro. Also, what is the average USMLE score for a SGU graduate? What do you guys think?
 
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i say go to a DO school. i think like 74% of SGU students match.. and then a good chunk get prematches but still some don't match. also in4 years a lot will change.. Maobama is the working very hard to change things.. so it might get harder or might get easier to match but no one knows what will happen all we know is that change is coming.
 
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