shelf-life of a surgeon

[Igor4sugry]

---

Members do not see this ad.

I want to ask some of the experienced people on here regarding the length of time surgeons are actually able to practice. In my school we have a number of teaching/guest faculty who are surgeons that can no longer practice due to medical conditions (so they work by teaching). What is scary is that they are relatively young (late 40s) and would have been at the peak of their career.

It seems to me that surgery is a high risk career mainly because you have to be 100% physically to be able to do your job. Any medical/life event (car accident, broken arm, tremor) that would have small impact on an internist would be disabling for the work-life of a surgeon.

Is there data out there that shows how long surgeons typically stay in practice?

 

[Winged Scapula]

I want to ask some of the experienced people on here regarding the length of time surgeons are actually able to practice. In my school we have a number of teaching/guest faculty who are surgeons that can no longer practice due to medical conditions (so they work by teaching). What is scary is that they are relatively young (late 40s) and would have been at the peak of their career.

It seems to me that surgery is a high risk career mainly because you have to be 100% physically to be able to do your job. Any medical/life event (car accident, broken arm, tremor) that would have small impact on an internist would be disabling for the work-life of a surgeon.

Is there data out there that shows how long surgeons typically stay in practice?

According to the American College of Surgeons, the average age of retirement for surgeons is 62. I once saw a surgeon in his early 80s still working at the VA but the difficulty in operating depends on the type of work you do. Longer operations requirement more fine motor movements might require younger hands; but there's a great deal of variability in skill and techniaue.

Frankly no one is safe from potential medical problems necessitating retirement. Hence the need for own occupation disability insurance.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

At least in my field (ENT), I think it's common for people to scale back their practice to more general type work as they age. Start out doing all the big whacks and working tons of hours and then as father time calls you start doing more tonsils, straight ahead sinus work, neck lumps/bumps, etc.

You don't have to spend your entire career doing the hardcore stuff. The bread and butter short and fast cases can make a very good living for a surgeon in any field.

 

[NJA61479]

I think that it all depends on the economy. It seems that when the economy is in a recession and many surgeons have lost money in their pensions, IRA, 401k, etc. that they end up working later in their life. There are also surgeons who have been incredibly busy for their entire career and don't know how to enjoy life, so they continue working until they have a medical problem or are forced to retire. I would say that a 30 year career is the average, but I don't know the true figures.
When I ask my attendings when they are going to retire, they all tell me when their stocks rebound to their pre recession level.

 

[njbmd]

I want to ask some of the experienced people on here regarding the length of time surgeons are actually able to practice. In my school we have a number of teaching/guest faculty who are surgeons that can no longer practice due to medical conditions (so they work by teaching). What is scary is that they are relatively young (late 40s) and would have been at the peak of their career.

It seems to me that surgery is a high risk career mainly because you have to be 100% physically to be able to do your job. Any medical/life event (car accident, broken arm, tremor) that would have small impact on an internist would be disabling for the work-life of a surgeon.

Is there data out there that shows how long surgeons typically stay in practice?

Many of those surgeons might be teaching because they prefer teaching to practice. This has been my experience in my practice. Many of the folks who trained in the late 1980s are pretty "burned out" by the direction healthcare has taken and "chucked" practice to teach. Teaching isn't a bad "gig" if you achieve tenure and certainly the hours are more predictable and better.

I had a couple of professors and faculty advisers in residency who were well into their 70s and thoroughly enjoying practice. One was by far, the wealthiest surgeon on staff but loved his practice. Also keep in mind, that operating with residents and fellows can greatly extend the years of practice thus academic surgery is a good deal for longevity practice wise.

A couple of my colleagues in their late 50s who are at private hospitals are pretty driven in terms of the hours that they spend covering their patients and taking trauma call. They seem to enjoy practice far less that those of us who are academic surgeons.

It isn't always "age-related" issues that will point a surgeon to retirement but the other "demands" of practice such as low reimbursements for long hours that will get people thinking that something else has to be "better than this".

 

[remo]

What surgical fields are best for a non-trad applicant? I would be starting residency at about the same age as most of the attendings I would be working with. I like trauma and also ortho but I don't know if it's realistic to get started in these professions in at age 40.

 

[MattD]

I know it's not entirely relevant, and isn't about a surgeon per se, but I still thought this was neat and on-topic...

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/health/2010/02/25/natpkg.100.year.old.doctor.cnn?hpt=C2

 

[toxic-megacolon]

This thread reminds me of this video

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/worlds_oldest_neurosurgeon_turns

 

[Llenroc]

Those 80 year surgeons you see hanging around surgery departments and doing cadaver dissections for the med students aren't being paid $400,000... Just as long as you know that. 😴

 

[Darksmurf]

Those 80 year surgeons you see hanging around surgery departments and doing cadaver dissections for the med students aren't being paid $400,000... Just as long as you know that. 😴

What are they getting paid?

 

[GuzzyRon]

This thread reminds me of this video

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/worlds_oldest_neurosurgeon_turns

lol...

 

[JackADeli]

....It seems to me that surgery ...you have to be 100% physically to be able to do your job. Any medical/life event (car accident, broken arm, tremor) that would have small impact on an internist would be disabling for the work-life of a surgeon...

Unfortunately, that is just NOT correct statement/s and/or assumptions.... I know of 80 yr old vascular surgeons, similarly a good percentage of Cardvasc surgeons are over 65 years old....

This link touches along similar lines of discussion... though in relation to a specific ailment:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=708540

...I don't know of any surgeons that do not have stiff bones and/or sore backs...

Having said all that, I know of very few surgeons that actually retire when they should. Most practice well beyond their prime and into any number of complications and poor outcomes... If you become a surgeon you will likely practice as long as you choose... for whatever reason is adequate for you...

 

[PostCall]

had an attending on one of my rotations who is a few years shy of 80 and still going strong. seen him rounding by himself even before the residents start and still taking 24hr in-house call. dude just loves what he does and is an awesome teacher.

 

[Cruzinman]

DeBakey was doing valve replecements into his 90's.

 

[karatekid]

DeBakey was doing valve replecements into his 90's.

No he was not! He walked between the ORs and "instructed" the surgeons the last decade or so of of his career.

 

[JackADeli]

DeBakey was doing valve replecements into his 90's.

Stuff like that might be good for fame, fortune, ego, and entertainment (i.e. nothing else to do) of the surgeon.... but I am just not convinced it is the right thing or good thing for the patients. With the shortages, etc... I expect we will continue to see too many surgeons practicing well beyond their time. Too many famous surgeons have a long list of malpractice claims and unfortunate outcomes towards the end of their careers.... Better to walk out with your head high then because your colleague comes in (or an attorney) and tells you, "you just don't have it" or "that little girl's life should not have been lost......"

...I know of very few surgeons that actually retire when they should. Most practice well beyond their prime and into any number of complications and poor outcomes...