1. Dismiss Notice
  2. Download free Tapatalk for iPhone or Tapatalk for Android for your phone and follow the SDN forums with push notifications.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Visit Interview Feedback to view and submit interview information.

Short MD after PhD, a myth?

Discussion in 'Nontraditional Students' started by VSL, Jun 1, 2008.

  1. VSL

    VSL

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Pre-Medical
    I was wondering if there is such Medical School/programs which offer a 'fast track' MD program (2 years) to students that have previously completed their PhD degree in biological sciences. I have heard of such mythical program in Miami but cannot seem to find more info about this. Is this for real? If so, how good can it be?
     
  2. Note: SDN Members do not see this ad.

  3. tbo

    tbo MS-4
    10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2002
    Messages:
    324
    Likes Received:
    2
    Status:
    Medical Student
    I've heard of this happening at MIT/Harvard (that is, friend finishing PhD and was being badgered to becoming a MD/PhD), although I'm not certain if that was part of a formal program or people pulling strings (I wouldn't be surprised if it was the latter).
     
  4. 177983

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2007
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Pre-Medical
    For what it's worth, I've never heard of this. I have to admit I find it pretty unlikely. Even in pre-planned MD/PhD program, I think the majority of the time is spent on the MD, i.e. my understanding is the first two years are spent on med school classes, plus extra classes for your PhD topic. Years 3 and 4 are then spent finishing your dissertation, defending, etc. Then, years 5 & 6 are normal, clinical years for med school. An actual MD/PhD can feel free to correct me here...

    If you're very interested in practicing medicine, maybe research becoming a Physician Assistant. They spend their days much like a physician, and you only have 2 years of training and no residency. Or go for broke and get the MD. Whatever makes you happy.
     
  5. Scottish Chap

    Physician PhD Moderator Emeritus 15+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2003
    Messages:
    1,630
    Likes Received:
    56
    One such program did exist and it was very successful (see PUBMED):http://www6.miami.edu/UMH/CDA/UMH_Main/0,1770,2600-1;17585-3,00.html
     
  6. QofQuimica

    QofQuimica Seriously, dude, I think you're overreacting....
    Administrator Physician PhD Faculty Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2004
    Messages:
    18,888
    Likes Received:
    4,104
    Status:
    Fellow [Any Field], Attending Physician
    Sorry, but you're over twenty years too late. Miami disbanded their program in 1987. The fastest track that I know of for PhD-to-MD is to go to Duke, where they only do one year of basic sciences and spend the third year doing research. If you come in with a PhD, they'll let you skip the research year and go straight to fourth year, so you'll finish in three years instead of four.
     
  7. viostorm

    viostorm Senior Member
    10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2005
    Messages:
    619
    Likes Received:
    4
    Status:
    Medical Student
    The "basic science" taught outside a medical school to PhD is not equivalent to the first two years of medical school which are focused on integrating disease with basic science. I sat next to a PhD in microbiology my 1st two years and although many things were easier for him, the vast majority of was unfamiliar.

    There is no way a PhD in anything completely prepares you for the science to be a physician.

    There seems to be a movement to integrate more clinical science into the basic science years and vice versa. So in the future it is even more unlikely a PhD would give you credit for any year of school.
     
  8. QofQuimica

    QofQuimica Seriously, dude, I think you're overreacting....
    Administrator Physician PhD Faculty Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2004
    Messages:
    18,888
    Likes Received:
    4,104
    Status:
    Fellow [Any Field], Attending Physician
    As a PhD who has finished the first two years of medical school, I agree with this completely. The focus in grad school is much narrower and does not cover anywhere close to all of the subjects that will be covered in medical school. I would guess that someone with a PhD in pathology would have the greatest curricular overlap. But even then, they'd still be missing huge chunks of the med school curriculum, including really important subjects like pharm, micro, etc.
     
  9. leolad

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2008
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Dear QofQuimica,
    as a phd graduate, how easy or how difficult do you think it is to get into med school. From your personal experience, what do you think is needed or how do you sell your case to the committee. also for Mcats, how much of prep time is needed. Im trying to perusade my husband who graduated last year with a phd that its still not too late to consider it. he thinks he too mature (32) plus family et all ....but you see i am willing to help him in his struggle and dream.
    what do u suggest/advice?
     
  10. Law2Doc

    Law2Doc 5K+ Member
    Physician Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2004
    Messages:
    30,989
    Likes Received:
    9,849
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    A number of schools offered this PhD to MD 2 year path for select candidates in the 80s. It was an accelerated program, with no vacations, few weekends off. University of Miami was one of the bigger such programs. It was reportedly quite good, and folks who made it through the program got a top notch, albeit intense education. But the LCME put the nix on this on these programs were closed. You won't find such a program any more.
     
  11. QofQuimica

    QofQuimica Seriously, dude, I think you're overreacting....
    Administrator Physician PhD Faculty Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2004
    Messages:
    18,888
    Likes Received:
    4,104
    Status:
    Fellow [Any Field], Attending Physician
    His age is the least of his problems as far as making him competitive or not competitive for medical school. What he needs to do are the same things that everyone who wants to go to med school need to do: take any missing pre-reqs (generally one year each of gen chem, organic, physics, and bio each with lab); take the MCAT and ideally score 30+ on it; and get some sort of clinical experience. Time to prep for the MCAT will vary by the individual; the average is probably around 2-3 months, but some people will do much more or much less. Note also that some schools have additional course requirements (ex. English, calculus, biochem). These courses are not needed for MCAT prep, but he will need to take any additional courses required by his med school before he matriculates, even if he has already been accepted.

    I compiled a bunch of threads in the Physician Scientist forum for people who are interested in going PhD-to-MD. Your husband (or you) may find some of these links helpful.

    Best of luck to you. :)
     
  12. PhDtoMD1988

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2017
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    14
    Status:
    Post Doc
    This is incredible info, that is perhaps not obvious when researching which MD schools to apply to...do you know if Duke still follows this system? I really appreciate you and your response! thanks
     
  13. backside_attack

    Joined:
    May 11, 2016
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    395
    Status:
    Medical Student
    Doesn't Columbia have this program (or one of the other NYC schools) where you can do 3 years (basically skip MS1) if you have a PhD and they audit your previous coursework and some kind of exam. I think I heard about it on one of my admissions tours?

    There are some PhD's in my med school class and the only thing they're allowed to skip is the required research.
     
  14. wholeheartedly

    Administrator 7+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    4,890
    Likes Received:
    2,806

    The Columbia website still has this program listed.
     
    backside_attack likes this.
  15. PhDtoMD1988

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2017
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    14
    Status:
    Post Doc
    Yes, does anyone know the class size of the PhD to MD program at Columbia? It was started in 2013, and Unfortunately, the class size is not found online.
     
  16. wholeheartedly

    Administrator 7+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    4,890
    Likes Received:
    2,806

    I would guess its very small. they prbably don't get someone every year. of course i'm guessing on that.
     
  17. JJRousseau

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    283
    Likes Received:
    295
    Status:
    Medical Student (Accepted)
    The class size is 4, and it's a top notch program - well-designed and well thought out. They had around 95 applicants this year and interviewed about 15% of them.


    Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
     
  18. wholeheartedly

    Administrator 7+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2009
    Messages:
    4,890
    Likes Received:
    2,806

    Good to know. Yeah, I figured as high caliber as the program would be, it would be very competitive and have a small class size. It's bigger than I thought. I am a bit surprised there are that many people interested in the PhD to MD route.
     

Share This Page