Should I give up just yet?

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freeandtime_23

freeandtime_23

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Hi,
I'm an undergrad majoring in Biology at NYU, and going into my second year.
As of now, I have a 3.38 cGPA, and a 3.43 Science GPA.
I'm planning on volunteering at the hospital this summer as well as shadowing a doctor. In addition, I also plan to be a research assistant next academic year with my school's Biology Lab.
Many people, from my friends, to my academic advisor, to my premed advisor, have told me to give up on my major and on premed. My parents look at me as a failure.
I really want to be a doctor but not for reasons one thinks (money, prestige, etc.). I hope to specialize in infectious diseases and go abroad to help third world countries in the face of a disease epidemic. I'm focused on what route I need to go to and I want to get there.
Of course, I am willing to take a gap year in order to have more time to raise my GPA and to have more time to study for the MCAT, as well as getting more experience in that gap year. In addition, I will look forward to applying to DO schools as I see virtually no difference between DO and MD schools, right?
So the question I'm asking you all very intelligent people (no sarcasm intended):
Is it worth it to keep going or should I give up while I have the time? To give up on my major would mean graduating a year later anyways.

Furthermore, I am taking Organic Chemistry and Molec and Cell Bio I next semester, so I was wondering if I could ask any of you guys on how to study? I've asked my friends and they study at 2 am by themselves in the library and don't seem to give me concrete advice on how to study for science classes. I'm a person who studies before midnight (weird, eh?) and likes a good night's sleep.

Any advice moving forward as a premed, and how can I break it to my parents that I can't do premed because I'm not cut out for it intellectually without them (possibly) kicking me out?
 
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Infectious disease, FTW.

You are fine, you just need to work on your study skills. Talk to an academic advisor, get a tutor (might as well get one now for OChem), and buckle down.

Spaced repetition is important for learning facts and practice questions are going to help you a long way in science. Best of luck!
 
LilKangaroo said:
Infectious disease, FTW.

You are fine, you just need to work on your study skills. Talk to an academic advisor, get a tutor (might as well get one now for OChem), and buckle down.

Spaced repetition is important for learning facts and practice questions are going to help you a long way in science. Best of luck!
Click to expand...

Thanks! 🙂 The only thing is my academic advisor only tells me to drop premed and pursue an easier major even though this is what I want to do. She says there's no way I can get a 3.6+ gpa before I graduate college at this rate :/.
Also, thanks for the study tips!
 
freeandtime_23 said:
Thanks! 🙂 The only thing is my academic advisor only tells me to drop premed and pursue an easier major even though this is what I want to do. She says there's no way I can get a 3.6+ gpa before I graduate college at this rate :/.
Also, thanks for the study tips!
Click to expand...
What I meant by academic advisor was more like a "study advisor." At my med school our academic advisor helps with our study skills, so I kind of forgot that it has a different meaning in undergrad ^_^;;; I would think place like NYU would have some sort of study aid department for you all. My undergrad had a tutoring service that also held workshops about study skills, time management, etc. If there is anything on your campus like that I would hook up with them ASAP and work your butt off!
 
LilKangaroo said:
What I meant by academic advisor was more like a "study advisor." At my med school our academic advisor helps with our study skills, so I kind of forgot that it has a different meaning in undergrad ^_^;;; I would think place like NYU would have some sort of study aid department for you all. My undergrad had a tutoring service that also held workshops about study skills, time management, etc. If there is anything on your campus like that I would hook up with them ASAP and work your butt off!
Click to expand...

Ah okay! Yep they have a ton of workshops about test-taking, study skills, etc, which I probably should go to. It's never too late I guess!
 
freeandtime_23 said:
Hi,
I'm an undergrad majoring in Biology at NYU, and going into my second year.
As of now, I have a 3.38 cGPA, and a 3.43 Science GPA.
my premed advisor have told me to give up on my major and on premed. My parents look at me as a failure.
Click to expand...

2iiaem1_medium_medium_medium.gif
 
MerciMerci said:
2iiaem1_medium_medium_medium.gif
Click to expand...
Hey, I'm seriously loving that meme because that's the look upperclassmen give me when I talk to them. :cyclops:
But honestly, to get at least a 3.6 by the time I graduate, I literally have to get an A in every single course for every semester. Kind of aiming too high?
 
You are definitely not going to have to 4.0 everything. Don't stress, as you are doing fine if you truly want to go down this career path. Just make sure to know all the ways you can improve. My freshman GPA was a 2.85 and I will graduate with over a 3.5.
 
3.38 freshmen year
3.66 sophomore year
3.52 average over freshmen and sophomore year

3.66 junior year
3.66 senior year
3.66 average junior and senior year

Total cumulative GPA: 3.59

This really isn't that complicated

And if that wasn't enough 3.4/3.4 is clearly sufficient to be competitive for DO schools. Settle down big guy.
 
GrapesofRath said:
3.38 freshmen year
3.66 sophomore year
3.52 average over freshmen and sophomore year

3.66 junior year
3.66 senior year
3.66 average junior and senior year

Total cumulative GPA: 3.59

This really isn't that complicated

And if that wasn't enough 3.4/3.4 is clearly sufficient to be competitive for DO schools. Settle down big guy.
Click to expand...

the only thing is, many premeds see anything less than a B+ as the end of the world. I think I got my fair share of Bs this year (no Cs thankfully). How is it even possible to get As in everything is what I'm asking?
Now, I'm not aiming for some Ivy League med school, but ANY med school. And I know there's no excuse for bad grades. To be a competitive applicant you have to be near the top of the applicant pool (3.7+) and I don't want to be the applicant who just barely has a chance.
 
freeandtime_23 said:
the only thing is, many premeds see anything less than a B+ as the end of the world. I think I got my fair share of Bs this year (no Cs thankfully). How is it even possible to get As in everything is what I'm asking?
Now, I'm not aiming for some Ivy League med school, but ANY med school. And I know there's no excuse for bad grades. To be a competitive applicant you have to be near the top of the applicant pool (3.7+) and I don't want to be the applicant who just barely has a chance.
Click to expand...
You sound like you're not willing to take mediocrity in a field filled with high-achieving people. Time to consider a career change if you're locked into this mentality this early on.

I'd say you're not cut out for it. Go MPH as a backup. You can do as much ID as you want there.
 
My friend had a 2.7 gpa in college freshman year. He ended up with a 3.5 and is in one of the top DO schools in the country.

Give up? Your advisors and friends are not being advisors and friends.
 
Stop comparing yourself to others. Do what you have to keep upping your GPA. You said your are just fine with DO so just keep focusing on that. Find a few DOs to shadow. I know an absolutely fab DO in ID at University of Chicago. Your dreams are certainly possible .
 
Gandy741 said:
My friend had a 2.7 gpa in college freshman year. He ended up with a 3.5 and is in one of the top DO schools in the country.

Give up? Your advisors and friends are not being advisors and friends.
Click to expand...

Nobody on this forum knows you so we cannot say really say whether your advisors or friends are right or wrong at the end of the day. Try to seek other, honest opinions from people you know. Your GPA by itself is really not that meaningful to determine what you should do, it is not unrectifiable, but there are obviously underlying issues (e.g. are you watching too much netflix or are the sciences just tough for you even when studying properly?).
 
Get new friends and a new advisor. Ignore your parents.


Many people, from my friends, to my academic advisor, to my premed advisor, have told me to give up on my major and on premed. My parents look at me as a failure.


You're only a freshman! You have plenty of time to improve. Your GPAs are low for MD as of right now, but there's still plenty of time to improve! Your stats are fine for any DO, BTW. I know DO Infectious Disease specialists, too.

I really want to be a doctor but not for reasons one thinks (money, prestige, etc.). I hope to specialize in infectious diseases and go abroad to help third world countries in the face of a disease epidemic. I'm focused on what route I need to go to and I want to get there.

Way too early to be thinking about gap year.
Of course, I am willing to take a gap year in order to have more time to raise my GPA and to have more time to study for the MCAT, as well as getting more experience in that gap year. In addition, I will look forward to applying to DO schools as I see virtually no difference between DO and MD schools, right?


C'mon kid...what does your heart tell you????
Is it worth it to keep going or should I give up while I have the time? To give up on my major would mean graduating a year later anyways.

Go visit your school's learning or education center and ask them this question.
Furthermore, I am taking Organic Chemistry and Molec and Cell Bio I next semester, so I was wondering if I could ask any of you guys on how to study?
 
freeandtime_23 said:
Hey, I'm seriously loving that meme because that's the look upperclassmen give me when I talk to them. :cyclops:
But honestly, to get at least a 3.6 by the time I graduate, I literally have to get an A in every single course for every semester. Kind of aiming too high?
Click to expand...

I would definitely suggest taking a math class at NYU because you can definitely get close to a 3.7-3.8 if you get all As
How is it aiming too high to get all A's? If you want it enough, anything is possible.

I just came off a semester including Orgo II, Physics II, Physio II, and Cell Bio. All A's although it took some effort.

Recommendation for Orgo: Study up this summer. If you go through the whole Second Language book (Amazon product ASIN 111801040X) you will know pretty much everything expected for you in Orgo I.

Recommendation for Cell Bio/ Molecular: I would talk to people that previously took NYU's class and see what they say because every school is different. If you want a jumpstart and don't know anyone, look at the syllabus and see what is covered in the course. Usually a schedule is posted online that correlates to a textbook. Get the textbook, and if you are feeling ambitious, look at a chapter or two every once in a while this summer. You could probably self-study for the first 2 exams without trying if you did that.
 
shtumpa said:
Nobody on this forum knows you so we cannot say really say whether your advisors or friends are right or wrong at the end of the day. Try to seek other, honest opinions from people you know. Your GPA by itself is really not that meaningful to determine what you should do, it is not unrectifiable, but there are obviously underlying issues (e.g. are you watching too much netflix or are the sciences just tough for you even when studying properly?).
Click to expand...

I think you replied to the the wrong person. I'm not the OP.

Also, I dont think school is "too tough" for anyone. Almost everyone should be able to get a good gpa in undergrad premed if they work hard enough.

Its not rocket science. Not even close.
 
Nah, you are good; if you work hard, I think you absolutely stand a chance go be accepted to medical school. So what if you get a few B's. Just start treating your grades a little more seriously, and schools will be impressed with your upwards grade trend. If people say you can't do it, don't listen to them.
 
It is way too early in the game to be thinking that. Not many of my friends or family really went to college so I was pretty alone in finding help, but the resources are usually there (at school and online). I started out like you low in the beginning and high at the end...teh nice thing is even if your GPA ends up not being a 3.7+, there are schools that like seeing the upward trends. You also have to remember that you have the MCAT to do. If you do well on that, you can make up a little for a lower gpa. I would recommend looking into it now. You also have DO schools if your gpa were to stagnate.
Do you have other EC's? I know you're doing volunteering, research, and shadowing. Sometimes these things (especially more interesting or meaningful ECs) can make schools look at you more even if your grades and MCAT aren't stellar.

It's not as bleak as the ppl around you want you to think. You really need to be surrounded by more positive ppl. You're just starting out, there is no need to be so negative and unsupportive as they are.
 
Hey there, OP.

You're just entering your second year of undergrad? Ahh, to be young! You'll find that many would trade every dollar they've ever earned to be 19 or 20 again. Right now, yours is the blessing of youth. The entire world lies open before you; filled with endless possibilities for success and happiness.

Please listen to the collective wisdom of those who have posted here and do not be afraid of the uncertainties of tomorrow. Remember that fear cripples reason, and reason will lead you to discover the necessary steps you must take in order to accomplish your dreams.

You're undoubtedly intelligent, youthful, have very worthy ambitions, and are most importantly, alive. Nothing is too late!
 
Hi, this is the OP here.
I think I forgot to include one thing-
I don't party. Actually, I haven't went out a single day during my freshman year- partially because I have no money to go bar hopping, and partially because I don't have a fake ID to drink alcohol.
I do take my academics seriously. I don't remember a single day I wasn't at the library. Hard work does equate to good grades, but not for everyone.
However, reading all of your comments have made me realize that I have to change the way I study in order to improve. In addition, it shouldn't be "study everyday, every hour". You guys introduced me with various ways on how I should approach my undergraduate years as a premed. Also, I've began to look at DOs more positively.
The only reason I seek to take a gap year is because I plan on studying abroad in Fall of Junior Year, which impacts when I'll take Biochemistry (making up almost 25% of the MCAT, apparently).
Thanks for making me realize I'm not hopeless- and I'm beginning to see that SDN is more of a support group rather than another version of the PreMed Hunger Games (which it is at NYU....ugh).
Does anyone advise transferring out of NYU in order to get better grades, say, at a state school?
Thanks!
 
Leg said:
Hey there, OP.

You're just entering your second year of undergrad? Ahh, to be young! You'll find that many would trade every dollar they've ever earned to be 19 or 20 again. Right now, yours is the blessing of youth. The entire world lies open before you; filled with endless possibilities for success and happiness.

Please listen to the collective wisdom of those who have posted here and do not be afraid of the uncertainties of tomorrow. Remember that fear cripples reason, and reason will lead you to discover the necessary steps you must take in order to accomplish your dreams.

You're undoubtedly intelligent, youthful, have very worthy ambitions, and are most importantly, alive. Nothing is too late!
Click to expand...

THANK YOU! Seriously, I needed that more than anything 🙂:highfive:
 
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freeandtime_23 said:
Hi, this is the OP here.
I think I forgot to include one thing-
I don't party. Actually, I haven't went out a single day during my freshman year- partially because I have no money to go bar hopping, and partially because I don't have a fake ID to drink alcohol.
I do take my academics seriously. I don't remember a single day I wasn't at the library. Hard work does equate to good grades, but not for everyone.
However, reading all of your comments have made me realize that I have to change the way I study in order to improve. In addition, it shouldn't be "study everyday, every hour". You guys introduced me with various ways on how I should approach my undergraduate years as a premed. Also, I've began to look at DOs more positively.
The only reason I seek to take a gap year is because I plan on studying abroad in Fall of Junior Year, which impacts when I'll take Biochemistry (making up almost 25% of the MCAT, apparently).
Thanks for making me realize I'm not hopeless- and I'm beginning to see that SDN is more of a support group rather than another version of the PreMed Hunger Games (which it is at NYU....ugh).
Does anyone advise transferring out of NYU in order to get better grades, say, at a state school?
Thanks!
Click to expand...

I think if you look at other schools and find an environment that better fits you, that's fine. Med schools may ask you why you switched and why you had any improvements in grades as a result of that move. I didn't like being at a big school so I switched to a smaller one where I felt there was a supportive environment because I needed it.

The gap year is fine, many of us do it for various reasons (I needed to improve my application). Just make sure that you continue volunteering and doing other things during that gap year(s) so it doesn't make you look lazy. I worked and volunteered and did some soul searching during my gap years and it helped me quite a lot.

SDN can be bad at times and a beacon of hope at other times. Just remember to always take everyone's advice with a grain of salt.
 
If you get a 3.7 (A-) average from now on, you will break 3.6 easily by the end of senior year. Buckle down and get to it if you really want it.
 
freeandtime_23 said:
Hi, this is the OP here.
I think I forgot to include one thing-
I don't party. Actually, I haven't went out a single day during my freshman year- partially because I have no money to go bar hopping, and partially because I don't have a fake ID to drink alcohol.
I do take my academics seriously. I don't remember a single day I wasn't at the library. Hard work does equate to good grades, but not for everyone.
However, reading all of your comments have made me realize that I have to change the way I study in order to improve. In addition, it shouldn't be "study everyday, every hour". You guys introduced me with various ways on how I should approach my undergraduate years as a premed. Also, I've began to look at DOs more positively.
The only reason I seek to take a gap year is because I plan on studying abroad in Fall of Junior Year, which impacts when I'll take Biochemistry (making up almost 25% of the MCAT, apparently).
Thanks for making me realize I'm not hopeless- and I'm beginning to see that SDN is more of a support group rather than another version of the PreMed Hunger Games (which it is at NYU....ugh).
Does anyone advise transferring out of NYU in order to get better grades, say, at a state school?
Thanks!
Click to expand...

Just a few points:

-You mentioned that you were studying in the library every day and didn't go out at all. The key to studying is studying smart, rather than studying hard. You should try to meet with academic advisors to improve your study skills. In addition, you also need to do stuff you enjoy outside of school. I know it can be hard to do sometimes when you're on a limited budget, but I can almost guarantee that NYC has a lot more to offer than alcohol.

-Going to a state school may help, but it won't guarantee that you'll get better grades. Is your current major something that you enjoy AND can succeed at? You still have to complete the usual pre-med pre-reqs successfully, however, it might help if you pursue something in the humanities, arts, or social sciences if you are interested. If not, transferring may make a difference if you will be happier as a whole at a new school. Pre-meds can be pretty neurotic, regardless of the school, but losing some of the resources that NYU has to offer for a less toxic environment may be worthwhile.

-Lastly, you definitely still have time to improve your GPA! Focus on improving your study skills and try to enjoy yourself from time to time.
 
No need to give up yet - your GPA can be brought up. You have a clear vision and a plan for what you want to do, which is something a lot of premeds don't have. If you keep up your discipline you'll improve.

For ochem, learn patterns. If you understand the "why" behind everything, and practice new problems a lot, you start to see the patterns and t becomes somewhat easy. As for cell bio - it's a lot of memorization, but one thing that made it relevant for me was taking it together with ochem. Some of the mechanisms you learn in ochem are employed by cellular systems - this makes them more relevant and easier to remember! In general, I'd say learning to cross-connect the content from multiple science classes will help make them more understandable.
 
meowfish6868 said:
Just a few points:

-You mentioned that you were studying in the library every day and didn't go out at all. The key to studying is studying smart, rather than studying hard. You should try to meet with academic advisors to improve your study skills. In addition, you also need to do stuff you enjoy outside of school. I know it can be hard to do sometimes when you're on a limited budget, but I can almost guarantee that NYC has a lot more to offer than alcohol.

-Going to a state school may help, but it won't guarantee that you'll get better grades. Is your current major something that you enjoy AND can succeed at? You still have to complete the usual pre-med pre-reqs successfully, however, it might help if you pursue something in the humanities, arts, or social sciences if you are interested. If not, transferring may make a difference if you will be happier as a whole at a new school. Pre-meds can be pretty neurotic, regardless of the school, but losing some of the resources that NYU has to offer for a less toxic environment may be worthwhile.

-Lastly, you definitely still have time to improve your GPA! Focus on improving your study skills and try to enjoy yourself from time to time.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll definitely look at ways to study smarter instead of harder. NYU's Academic Resource Center offers a lot of sessions on Study Skills, Test-Taking, and even Test Anxiety (something which I have), so I'll look into them 😀.
Transferring has been in my mind for quite a while because tuition is being raised significantly (lol it IS nyu) and I doubt I'll be able to afford it much longer. The benefit to being here in the city is the number of hospitals I can volunteer at, but the downside is that it's hard to enjoy the city on a budget. If there was one reason I could transfer, it would probably be for financial reasons.
I'm going to genuinely see if I enjoy biology after this semester. If not, I've been looking into Public Health as a major (not so similar) but it aligns with my interests in infectious diseases.
Anyways, I'm taking everyone's advice with a grain of salt and also trying to think for myself if being a premed is the right route for me. I have some time to go before I'm old and being a thirty something loser haha.
 
UNMedGa said:
No need to give up yet - your GPA can be brought up. You have a clear vision and a plan for what you want to do, which is something a lot of premeds don't have. If you keep up your discipline you'll improve.

For ochem, learn patterns. If you understand the "why" behind everything, and practice new problems a lot, you start to see the patterns and t becomes somewhat easy. As for cell bio - it's a lot of memorization, but one thing that made it relevant for me was taking it together with ochem. Some of the mechanisms you learn in ochem are employed by cellular systems - this makes them more relevant and easier to remember! In general, I'd say learning to cross-connect the content from multiple science classes will help make them more understandable.
Click to expand...

Thanks so much for this advice! Cross connecting has always been a useful skill, I'll make sure to apply it in the future!
 
I'm not sure I'm reading this correctly..is your advisor counting you out of medicine because you have a 3.4 science gpa after your freshman year of college? If that is correct, please do not listen to anyone giving you such crazy advice. You just finished your freshman year as a bio major, analyze your mistakes, change up some study habits and go on an upward trend for 3 years...I mean really, you have 3 more years! It's absurd that people are already saying you've failed when you've only just begun college. Prove them wrong 🙂
 
HuskyBabe said:
I'm not sure I'm reading this correctly..is your advisor counting you out of medicine because you have a 3.4 science gpa after your freshman year of college? If that is correct, please do not listen to anyone giving you such crazy advice. You just finished your freshman year as a bio major, analyze your mistakes, change up some study habits and go on an upward trend for 3 years...I mean really, you have 3 more years! It's absurd that people are already saying you've failed when you've only just begun college. Prove them wrong 🙂
Click to expand...

Sorry for the extremely late response, but thank you 🙂. I know with Orgo and Molec Cell Bio, I need to work extremely hard to see an upward trend, but it will work out for the better.
 
Wow, the NYU advising sounds like they're trying to discourage anything near borderline...sure makes the whole "we get XX% of premeds into med school!" meaningless
 
OP,

I finished my first semester of college with a 1.0. Ended up graduating with a cGPA of 3.895, and an AMCAS cGPA 3.61 & sGPA 3.75. It can be done. You just need to buckle down and use all the outside negativity as motivation to do your best.
 
freeandtime_23 said:
I really want to be a doctor but not for reasons one thinks (money, prestige, etc.). I hope to specialize in infectious diseases and go abroad to help third world countries in the face of a disease epidemic. I'm focused on what route I need to go to and I want to get there.
Click to expand...

actually, if that is what you want, you're better off studying something else, maybe get an MPH. You definitely don't need an MD for that path. And "DO" isn't recognized in the third world, so I doubt it will help.
 
Sigh, I feel both discouraged and encouraged by many of these replies.
I just got kicked out of my school's honor's program and I feel devastated.
So my question- what is your motivation after all these setbacks?
 
freeandtime_23 said:
Sigh, I feel both discouraged and encouraged by many of these replies.
I just got kicked out of my school's honor's program and I feel devastated.
So my question- what is your motivation after all these setbacks?
Click to expand...
You're fine. NYU just sounds like a terrible place to be a pre-med, tbh. Work hard and your GPA will be fine, as posters above have noted. Worse comes to worse transfer to a different school. AFAIK kicking someone out of the honors program after 1 year with a 3.4/3.4 is a seriously d*ck move.

Also, you don't have to major in Bio to get into med school. If non pre-med courses required by the Bio major are hurting you, switch to something you're better at.
 
md-2020 said:
You're fine. NYU just sounds like a terrible place to be a pre-med, tbh. Work hard and your GPA will be fine, as posters above have noted. Worse comes to worse transfer to a different school. AFAIK kicking someone out of the honors program after 1 year with a 3.4/3.4 is a seriously d*ck move.

Also, you don't have to major in Bio to get into med school. If non pre-med courses required by the Bio major are hurting you, switch to something you're better at.
Click to expand...
I just want to point out how sad it is that this is good advice. "Pick an easier school" or "take an easier major" becomes more important than challenging yourself or studying what you enjoy. **** this premed game.
 
efle said:
I just want to point out how sad it is that this is good advice. "Pick an easier school" or "take an easier major" becomes more important than challenging yourself or studying what you enjoy. **** this premed game.
Click to expand...

It's discouraging and both encouraging at the same time. Of course I love bio- but if I can't perform stellar, then I have to shove it aside. My second option WAS being a history major, so I decided to sit in on a class. By visiting the history department, viewing the course offerings, and reading the course reviews, I now understand why students say "Taking this history class made me hate history". Sigh, I literally go through the Majors list on NYU's website and can't find anything that really fits me- everything is free range right now, and I don't want to just switch to something easy but have no interest in it for the sake of my GPA (stupid as it sounds....)
 
Its way to early to be getting down on yourself! As others have mentioned, just buckle down and maybe get set up with a tutor.
As for how to study, check out this link: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4031794/. They may seem obvious, but the tips in the article were things I hadn't tried before. I found the article at the end of my first semester of grad school, and by following the study tips, I was able to study about half as much during my second semester yet I improved my GPA by ~0.3 points.
 
You're probably competitive for osteopathic schools
 
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