Should I give up yet?

[alphahmed]

Hi eveybody,

This is my third season of Match and Post-Match scrambling, and I never even had an interview... Should I just give up and work as a taxi-driver?

The following points describe my situation:
- Step 1, second attempt, passing score of 75.
- Step 2 CK, third attempt, score of 80.
- Step 2 CS, first attempt, passed.
- Step 3, Three failures (the most dumb thing I have ever done in my life).
- Graduation year: 2002, from a non-US medical school.
- Having Work Authorization Document, may be granted Green Card by Next Year.
- Two months of Ameican Clinical Experiance with two great Recommendation Letters from American physicians.

Any feed back from you guys? anything you would say is totally accepted by me, just be honest please.

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[ShyRem]

You need to have passed step 3 to even have a shot. Even then, there are states where you won't be able to practice... make sure you check each state's restrictions regarding how many attempts are allowed.

Even then, FP will be difficult. So many failures can't look good. Are you doing research? Anything medical?

 

[alphahmed]

Well, thanks for your reply.

I am not doing any research, and don't really know what you mean by a research? All what I have done is a paid, insured, clinical rotation in Internal Medicine for two months.

But may I ask you again? Do you think that I have to give up and work as a taxi driver or something else like that? It seems that I represent numbers only to these programs.

Appreciate any feedback from you....

 

[Speculatrix]

There are a number of ways to get a residency in America. One, simply through numbers and a great CV. Another, by nepotism and showing extreme interest in a set of programs and focusing your energy heavily there. I think this is your only bet, as your numbers are insufficient. Look at the unmatched list this year when it comes out, and the unmatched list for the past several years, and find places / programs in FP that are near you that generally go unmatched and aren't high on the radar. Place yourself near those places and volunteer, do research, wahtever it takes at those places. You may get luck from there. And, obviously, pass step 3 (take a course if you have to). You haven't tried the whole 'extreme interest/nepotism' approach yet, and only once you've done that can you really start to maybe reevaluate your options.

 

[MSmentor018]

There are a number of ways to get a residency in America. One, simply through numbers and a great CV. Another, by nepotism and showing extreme interest in a set of programs and focusing your energy heavily there. I think this is your only bet, as your numbers are insufficient. Look at the unmatched list this year when it comes out, and the unmatched list for the past several years, and find places / programs in FP that are near you that generally go unmatched and aren't high on the radar. Place yourself near those places and volunteer, do research, wahtever it takes at those places. You may get luck from there. And, obviously, pass step 3 (take a course if you have to). You haven't tried the whole 'extreme interest/nepotism' approach yet, and only once you've done that can you really start to maybe reevaluate your options.

good advice but before all that, look at shy rems' advice on the states licensing boards. some will not grant you a medical license if you've take the steps x amount of times. with that being said concentrate your efforts on states that will give you the opportunity and hold off on ditching medicine for being a cabbie until you've checked out all the avenues

 

[Micrococcus]

Give-up?!?...Is that really an option?? Come on!!! Just consider all the work & effort you've devoted thus far. Recollect your thoughts (& attitude!!) and go pass step-3 on your next attempt; then evaluate the States that will permit you to practice (and yes, you DO meet the standards to practice in a great many of them). Keep in mind that most of the nay-sayers here have never truly encountered adversity...Good Ol' silver spoon in mouth syndrome.

 

[DRJJ1]

well, thanks for your reply.

I am not doing any research, and don't really know what you mean by a research? All what i have done is a paid, insured, clinical rotation in internal medicine for two months.

But may i ask you again? Do you think that i have to give up and work as a taxi driver or something else like that? It seems that i represent numbers only to these programs.

Appreciate any feedback from you....

if you have to ask what research is then do taxi driver after all the schooling you say you had and all exams taken

look up the word research too

 

[Micrococcus]

Could you elaborate a bit more on this "paid" 2-month IM rotation?

 

[Proverbs31]

Could you elaborate a bit more on this "paid" 2-month IM rotation?

I "think" he means he paid and paid to be insured to rotate somewhere. In my experience with friends who were IMGs...they would pay to do a rotation but oftentimes it turned into a "shadowing" experience and not a true rotation which wasnt as helpful as should/could have been for them. I feel you OP. But please dont give up. Get more advice, work hard and try to talk to other IMGs who have got to the place that you hope to be one day! Dont give up....Best wishes.

 

[alphahmed]

Hi guys,
I am back after finishing the 2-months paid clinical experience, it wasn't that bad, it actually let me work and see patients, i got two good LoRs, but the problem is that even the MDs that I worked under their supervision asked me to get the hell out of there and just go and prepare for Step 3, they said that I have to score high in this next attempt, and that would be the only way to prove that I am good enough for being accepted as a resident.
Concerning connections, forget about it, though those physicians found me as a real good clinician, but they denied any connection that might be possible to serve me to get into a residency program.
Now I am studying for step 3, after I have registered for a program to be more prepared.
I still feel like I may not be able to make it, all the people who used to encourage me and ask me to keep going have gave up on me, I feel like I am a real loser, even some of them said that GC means nothing and isn't really going to make a big difference.
I really feel like lost, I don't know what to believe and what are the real chances that I have.
But I will try to sit again for step 3, and then reapply for the Match.

Thanks again for all your replies.

 

[Proverbs31]

Hi guys,
I am back after finishing the 2-months paid clinical experience, it wasn't that bad, it actually let me work and see patients, i got two good LoRs, but the problem is that even the MDs that I worked under their supervision asked me to get the hell out of there and just go and prepare for Step 3, they said that I have to score high in this next attempt, and that would be the only way to prove that I am good enough for being accepted as a resident.
Concerning connections, forget about it, though those physicians found me as a real good clinician, but they denied any connection that might be possible to serve me to get into a residency program.
Now I am studying for step 3, after I have registered for a program to be more prepared.
I still feel like I may not be able to make it, all the people who used to encourage me and ask me to keep going have gave up on me, I feel like I am a real loser, even some of them said that GC means nothing and isn't really going to make a big difference.
I really feel like lost, I don't know what to believe and what are the real chances that I have.
But I will try to sit again for step 3, and then reapply for the Match.

Thanks again for all your replies.

Im glad you had a good experience these past 2 mos...AND I am happy to lend encouragement when I can...However, You have got to Believe in yourself...You have got to be YOUR source of BELIEF and truth....If you dont believe that you can do it and that you are good enough and come hell or high water, One day you are going to be a doctor and match god willing...then no one can ever encourage you enough. You need to do whatever it takes to keep yourself positive and proactive..read motivational books, quotes, watch a movie that inspires (I love: "Gifted Hands" -a clip here http://www.wingclips.com/movie-clips/gifted-hands/its-a-miracle; "Patch Adams", "Something the lord made" or anything about Hardy Hendren---all true stories of doctors), Pep talk yourself, make a picture of all the dreams or things you wish to do etc...Seriously...whatever works for you...do it! Im not trying to be rude or hateful to you but Medicine is hard my friend...even those of us who havev a true strong passion for it and if you dont find the strength and encouragement and believe in yourself then no one else can do it for you and at some pt you will surely get broken from others. You can not depend on Others for your self worth. YOU KNOW YOU CAN DO THIS! YOU KNOW YOU WERE MEANT TO BE A DR! Personally, I have a strong faith and that holds me grounded everytime...But whatever you need to do...you do that. And then when you falter every now and then, as humans do...we will be here to encourage you. Do not be so easy to give up on yourself. YOU CAN DO this...determine it will be done...determine you will pass that step 3 with high scores and you will find a way to do it! Repeat daily!

Best wishes.

 

[MSmentor018]

GC?
glad to hear you had 2 decent months of training and received some LOR's. obviously you need to do well on step 3 but here's another option. where did you go to school? have you thought about practicing there, getting some exp, then reapplyinig? if academically you're having a hard time, try to excel clinically to strengthen your app

 

[alphahmed]

Im glad you had a good experience these past 2 mos...AND I am happy to lend encouragement when I can...However, You have got to Believe in yourself...You have got to be YOUR source of BELIEF and truth....If you dont believe that you can do it and that you are good enough and come hell or high water, One day you are going to be a doctor and match god willing...then no one can ever encourage you enough. You need to do whatever it takes to keep yourself positive and proactive..read motivational books, quotes, watch a movie that inspires (I love: "Gifted Hands" -a clip here http://www.wingclips.com/movie-clips/gifted-hands/its-a-miracle; "Patch Adams", "Something the lord made" or anything about Hardy Hendren---all true stories of doctors), Pep talk yourself, make a picture of all the dreams or things you wish to do etc...Seriously...whatever works for you...do it! Im not trying to be rude or hateful to you but Medicine is hard my friend...even those of us who havev a true strong passion for it and if you dont find the strength and encouragement and believe in yourself then no one else can do it for you and at some pt you will surely get broken from others. You can not depend on Others for your self worth. YOU KNOW YOU CAN DO THIS! YOU KNOW YOU WERE MEANT TO BE A DR! Personally, I have a strong faith and that holds me grounded everytime...But whatever you need to do...you do that. And then when you falter every now and then, as humans do...we will be here to encourage you. Do not be so easy to give up on yourself. YOU CAN DO this...determine it will be done...determine you will pass that step 3 with high scores and you will find a way to do it! Repeat daily!

Best wishes.

I really appreciate all of what you have said in your post. I feel now like everybody is giving up on me, some of my friends even stopped commenting about my chances of being an MD at a residency, some have even said that it would need a miracle to be accepted at clinical residency.
Each time I look at my scores, age, time being away from clinical practise; I feel like I am really a loser, and I should stop trying to convince myself that I might be able to do it one day.
I am really lost, and I really don't know what would happen to me since, I am so negative right now.
I read your post and it made me feel better, I will try to watch one of the movies you suggested, thanks again my friend.

 

[alphahmed]

You need to have passed step 3 to even have a shot. Even then, there are states where you won't be able to practice... make sure you check each state's restrictions regarding how many attempts are allowed.

Even then, FP will be difficult. So many failures can't look good. Are you doing research? Anything medical?

So are you saying that I should just give up and find another profession?

 

[alphahmed]

GC?
glad to hear you had 2 decent months of training and received some LOR's. obviously you need to do well on step 3 but here's another option. where did you go to school? have you thought about practicing there, getting some exp, then reapplyinig? if academically you're having a hard time, try to excel clinically to strengthen your app

Thank you buddy for your reply.
GC=Green Card.
Man, if I would even go back to my country for any other reason then I would be DEAD... No kidding. So there is no way for me to have practise over there.

 

[PharmaTope]

So are you saying that I should just give up and find another profession?

well i cant offer much on the exam side, BUT i can offer advice on how to get what you want in life.

what are you doing right now? how are you earning a living. what is research going to do for you.... not much. sure its cool to have a publication here and there but is it going to get you what you want? probably not.

you need to go grab the bull by the horns. life isnt easy and it certainly isnt fair but this WAS (in the past) the land of opportunity. yes a lot of doors will be shut in your face and you need to just keep on moving.

what are your skills? what type of jobs can you work?

I recommend this:

contact a variety of physicians in the area, cold call, (MAKE SURE YOU INTRODUCE YOURSELF AS DR SO AND SO) and bypass the secretaries and leave a message for the physician.

tell them, i am interested in practicing in _________________ i would like to shadow you if you dont mind.

but you arent a hs kid shadowing. they can help keep clinical stuff fresh in your mind. what i would do is find PRECEPTORS from the medical schools that have residencies/internships affiliated with them. reason is, it is all about networking and marketting. if they can put in some good words for you and introduce you to colleagues this will be more helpful.

i wish you the best, you are in a tough situation.

go and pass step 3 get it done with.

 

[MSmentor018]

nail step 3 then try to get a transition year, or maybe a teaching job? enlist in the military and practice as a general medical officer.

 

[markglt]

alpha, check out www.usmleforum.com. many other people with your same issues who gather and commiserate.

 

[alphahmed]

well i cant offer much on the exam side, BUT i can offer advice on how to get what you want in life.

what are you doing right now? how are you earning a living. what is research going to do for you.... not much. sure its cool to have a publication here and there but is it going to get you what you want? probably not.

you need to go grab the bull by the horns. life isnt easy and it certainly isnt fair but this WAS (in the past) the land of opportunity. yes a lot of doors will be shut in your face and you need to just keep on moving.

what are your skills? what type of jobs can you work?

I recommend this:

contact a variety of physicians in the area, cold call, (MAKE SURE YOU INTRODUCE YOURSELF AS DR SO AND SO) and bypass the secretaries and leave a message for the physician.

tell them, i am interested in practicing in _________________ i would like to shadow you if you dont mind.

but you arent a hs kid shadowing. they can help keep clinical stuff fresh in your mind. what i would do is find PRECEPTORS from the medical schools that have residencies/internships affiliated with them. reason is, it is all about networking and marketting. if they can put in some good words for you and introduce you to colleagues this will be more helpful.

i wish you the best, you are in a tough situation.

go and pass step 3 get it done with.

Thanks for your advice... I would like to tell you that I have really tried hard in contacting MDs, they all have the same excuse: (I cannot let an unlicensed MD attend my clinic, it is a medicolegal issue).
I have PAID to wok with two MDs for two months, they really liked me a lot, and they thought that I can be a real good doctor, but when it came finally to asking them if hey can introduce me to somebody or let me know what is the best way to pursue: same reply "Oh, I wish I know somebody, but you know, I have been so busy for the last few years and I know nobody that can help you... Soooooooooooooooooooory"
The only job that I can do is "Medical Interpritation", currenly dependent on my family (who are all outside the United States, because I from Iraq and I am on Political Asylum in the United States).
I am now paying for a "course" to prepare well for Step 3, I really don't know what is going to happen after this...
I hope you would still have some "encouragements" after you had read these extra info. Thanks.

 

[alphahmed]

nail step 3 then try to get a transition year, or maybe a teaching job? enlist in the military and practice as a general medical officer.

Hi again and thanks for your reply,
Getting a transitional year is sometimes harder than getting a normal residency...
Is there any info that you may offer me to know how to get enlisted in the military? I believe that it is almost impossible since I am not a citizen yet?

Thanks anyway.

 

[alphahmed]

alpha, check out www.usmleforum.com. many other people with your same issues who gather and commiserate.

Thanks for the great website that you provided. I took it as a great suggetion to help on one side, and a nice way of telling me to give up on the other.

 

[MSmentor018]

Hi again and thanks for your reply,
Getting a transitional year is sometimes harder than getting a normal residency...
Is there any info that you may offer me to know how to get enlisted in the military? I believe that it is almost impossible since I am not a citizen yet?

Thanks anyway.

don't have to be a citizen. my friend is almost retired, he's not a citizen yet! call your local military recruiter of the branch of your choice and tell them you're a physician. they'll guide you from there. it's a no brainer

 

[PharmaTope]

Thanks for your advice... I would like to tell you that I have really tried hard in contacting MDs, they all have the same excuse: (I cannot let an unlicensed MD attend my clinic, it is a medicolegal issue).
I have PAID to wok with two MDs for two months, they really liked me a lot, and they thought that I can be a real good doctor, but when it came finally to asking them if hey can introduce me to somebody or let me know what is the best way to pursue: same reply "Oh, I wish I know somebody, but you know, I have been so busy for the last few years and I know nobody that can help you... Soooooooooooooooooooory"
The only job that I can do is "Medical Interpritation", currenly dependent on my family (who are all outside the United States, because I from Iraq and I am on Political Asylum in the United States).
I am now paying for a "course" to prepare well for Step 3, I really don't know what is going to happen after this...
I hope you would still have some "encouragements" after you had read these extra info. Thanks.

that is incorrect, you can shadow legally. how do you think these HS students and college students do it? the main thing is you need to pass step 3 asap so you have a perm license this is priority number 1 on your list.

do not avoid it, get to it.

from there work on getting your foot in the door. im telling you, go to med schools in teh areas websites to findout who the preceptors are..... simple as that

 

[markglt]

never give up.

 

[Instatewaiter]

http://www.fsmb.org/usmle_eliinitial.html

Almost all states give a maximum of 7-10 years to pass step 3 (from the time you take step 1). Many will give you a maximum of 3-4 attempts at step 3.

Make this one count and find a state that will fit your needs. Good luck.

 

[krust3]

yes. give up on U.S. residency.

your best bet to utilize your degree at this point is gonna be in a medicine related field: pharmaceutical, research, or teaching. all can be very rewarding and garner plenty of respect and reimbursement.

 

[markglt]

nope, don't agree.
you have one more chance at step 3, 4th and final buddy...pass it before sept 1st and apply to 900-1000 programs, you'll get picked up somewhere.

 

[alphahmed]

yes. give up on U.S. residency.

your best bet to utilize your degree at this point is gonna be in a medicine related field: pharmaceutical, research, or teaching. all can be very rewarding and garner plenty of respect and reimbursement.

Thank you for your feed back.
It seems that you really know how it feels to be a physician...

 

[alphahmed]

nope, don't agree.
you have one more chance at step 3, 4th and final buddy...pass it before sept 1st and apply to 900-1000 programs, you'll get picked up somewhere.

I really appreciate it markglt...
I think it was a good example of what I was talking about earlier regarding all the encouargements you may get from people around you...

I am now studying hard to nail Step 3 before September as you said, and I am going to apply for 500-1000 programs. Please wish me luck.

 

[alphahmed]

http://www.fsmb.org/usmle_eliinitial.html

Almost all states give a maximum of 7-10 years to pass step 3 (from the time you take step 1). Many will give you a maximum of 3-4 attempts at step 3.

Make this one count and find a state that will fit your needs. Good luck.

I will go according to your advice and apply to all the openings in those states if I have to.
Thanks...

 

[markglt]

what are u using to study for step 3
what field are you applying to?

 

[alphahmed]

what are u using to study for step 3
what field are you applying to?

Hello again Markglt,

I am not supposed to make any advertisement on the forum, but I may tell you that I am doing a test preparation course by a famous test prep company.
I am interested in Internal Medicine, I love to be a cardiologist, I actually used to think that I was born to be a cardiologist and nothing else.

What do you think? is it a hard one to get with my circumstances? Thanks for your interest...

Regrades

 

[markglt]

i hate to bust a cap in your dreams, but i honestly think your only chance of matching is gonna be in family.
but hey, apply wide my brother, and see what happens..

if you did get im, i think you would have to:
1. be a complete rockstar in residency
2. do a chief year.
3. have a solid cardio. connection
to even have a chance at cardio, and that is a very very small chance. i hate to say it, but i know peeps with solid scores and were solid residents and still didnt get cardio..okay i only know 1, but still, you get my point
but **** it stay +ve and try.

 

[alphahmed]

i hate to bust a cap in your dreams, but i honestly think your only chance of matching is gonna be in family.
but hey, apply wide my brother, and see what happens..

if you did get im, i think you would have to:
1. be a complete rockstar in residency
2. do a chief year.
3. have a solid cardio. connection
to even have a chance at cardio, and that is a very very small chance. i hate to say it, but i know peeps with solid scores and were solid residents and still didnt get cardio..okay i only know 1, but still, you get my point
but **** it stay +ve and try.

Okay buddy, but my LoRs are from Internists, and they recommend me as an Internist too, I don't think that they will agree to change the letters for me and make it for Family Medicine.

Do you think that there is a big difference between FM and IM? aren't both of them Primary Health Specialities?

I wish that I will get accepted at IM and try to establish all of what you have adviced me with...

Thank you so much...
Regards,

 

[radiodoc99]

Dont give up. Start shadowing a local medical school residency director for a year and study. There is always a way. You have passed some of the hardest exams. You can do it.