Should we do something productive?

[DynamicDidactic]

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I think the site does a decent job at warning people about the pitfalls of non-accredited programs and high-debt programs. SDN also ranks pretty high (if not top) when one tries to search these topics. But maybe we can do better on the debt portion. Are we interested in starting a new, single thread that we can pin? A thread that would be updated continuously in which we summarize the actual costs of debt. We can include programs that have smaller levels of thread as a resource and we can highlight the particular offending programs. Include testimonials from other threads and maybe find outside articles on the topic. Include the APPIC debt data every year it comes out. Maybe a one-stop shopping for questions related to programs and debt?

Or do I have too much time on my hands right now b/c of the Nor'Easter that has hit me.

 

[WisNeuro]

I think the site does a decent job at warning people about the pitfalls of non-accredited programs and high-debt programs. SDN also ranks pretty high (if not top) when one tries to search these topics. But maybe we can do better on the debt portion. Are we interested in starting a new, single thread that we can pin? A thread that would be updated continuously in which we summarize the actual costs of debt. We can include programs that have smaller levels of thread as a resource and we can highlight the particular offending programs. Include testimonials from other threads and maybe find outside articles on the topic. Include the APPIC debt data every year it comes out. Maybe a one-stop shopping for questions related to programs and debt?

Or do I have too much time on my hands right now b/c of the Nor'Easter that has hit me.

May be helpful to show some general examples of something like "with X level of debt" here are your monthly payments compared to what the median salary is. This is what you have to live on monthly. I really don't think (most) people really understand what a budget looks like. Or what they actually need for retirement if they want to eventually stop working. Or what it takes to buy a house without PMI, etc. With the "offending" programs theme, we'd be fine as long as we do what we have been doing and stick to the objective stats (e.g., yearly tuition, match stats, etc). We'd hopefully want to avoid it becoming a beacon for the accounts where it's painfully obvious some faculty/admin at that school quick creates an account to shill for it.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

not a bad idea.

Title it something like:

- Common financial pitfalls in the pursuit of clinical psychology
- Debt, opportunity cost, and a stunted financial future
- How to pursue clinical psychology without mortgaging your future
- The new generation of indentured servants: Clinical psychologists

 

[DynamicDidactic]

We'd hopefully want to avoid it becoming a beacon for the accounts where it's painfully obvious some faculty/admin at that school quick creates an account to shill for it.

Could it become a locked thread? Is that an option for SDN? And we can directly send posts for the moderator to add.

 

[WisNeuro]

Could it become a locked thread? Is that an option for SDN? And we can directly send posts for the moderator to add.

Possibly, we'll have to ask @AcronymAllergy and see what the guidelines would be.

 

[Groupthink]

Lots of the posters who are considering applying to unfunded PsyD programs that have cohorts of 30+ are, if I had to guess, still in their undergraduate programs. Consider the developmental level of the 21 and 22 year olds who are thinking about grad school. They have not had to maintain a budget based on a full time job, and cannot fully appreciate just how much of a lifestyle reduction taking on such a debt load can cause.

As much as I would hope that an individual considering doctoral education would have the skills to critically analyze outcome data for psychologist income, a part of me is biased and believes that people attending these inflated PsyD programs likely do not have the same level of data analytic skill that individuals with heavy research emphasis maintain.

Just a hypothesis, I have no data to support this.

 

[deleted343839]

I would suggest two threads: one for people considering a debt-laden path (unfunded training programs) and another for people who are post-degree or well into their training and coming to terms with their finances. These groups have very different needs with respect to information and advice.

And please, keep these threads constructive and practical.

 

[Justanothergrad]

It seems like we should and I think the more explict we are in how the debtload results in reducing earning (and, evidently this is needed, in reducing long term savings since we've had several say 'I have 150,000 that I don't need so it wont matter'). This information, including infographics supporting the average debt loans and average earnings, could help make a resource for folks and reduce the amount of time we spend responding.

There are some advantages to locking it and only allowing things to be added by a moderator, the risk there is that we will continue to get questions/threads and respond (as with the WAMC). It'd be easier to tag it in there and just have moderators move it into the thread imho.

 

[smalltownpsych]

I think the site does a decent job at warning people about the pitfalls of non-accredited programs and high-debt programs. SDN also ranks pretty high (if not top) when one tries to search these topics. But maybe we can do better on the debt portion. Are we interested in starting a new, single thread that we can pin? A thread that would be updated continuously in which we summarize the actual costs of debt. We can include programs that have smaller levels of thread as a resource and we can highlight the particular offending programs. Include testimonials from other threads and maybe find outside articles on the topic. Include the APPIC debt data every year it comes out. Maybe a one-stop shopping for questions related to programs and debt?

Or do I have too much time on my hands right now b/c of the Nor'Easter that has hit me.

Great idea. It would be very important for prospective students to be educated about the realities of the financial aspects of our profession. We might aslo be able to talk about how to negotiate higher wages effectively and maybe challenge or critically assess some of the data on salary surveys that seem skewed a bit low. Such as, do these high debt programs that are cranking out graduates also skew the salaries lower?

 

[PsyDr]

I started working on a document with some numbers.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

It's certainly possible, if folks are interested, and if (as mentioned above) information remains objective.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

I started working on a document with some numbers.

Please tell us more