So…APA has granted its first master’s program accreditation and it’s concerning

[Therapist4Chnge]

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I hope you are fellowship trained and can develop a niche....bc the conflation of mid-level training and doctoral-level training is EVERYWHERE now.

 

[Sanman]

Y’all—I received this in my inbox today:

https://www.apa.org/education-career/grad/national-standards-masters

This was shared in a student list-serve. APA is now fully invested in this BS under the guise of “Psychology Workforce Optimization” 💀

Like why tf are they doing this!!!!! Instead of cleaning up their s*** show with crappy PsyD programs and the internship crisis!!!!!! Which was absolutely awful this past Spring!!!!!!

So after working my ass off for 6+years (coming from a clinical science PhD program here), by the time I am ready to join the “workforce” (in this economy, mind you), I will now have to compete with MA “Psych” folks and have to prove to employers that no, I have more credentials/experience/competency and am entitled to get paid more?!?!??!

How do I not lose my sh**t here?! Why are more folks not as outraged?! They are really getting away with this circus…

Here's the thing. That horse left the barn years ago. Because midlevels are part of other professions, we are not always even qualified to supervise them. You, unfortunately, are graduating at a terrible time for research and a not so great time for clinical practice (plenty of experienced VA folks will be emptying out in the near future).

As for competing with master's level folks? You really should not have to do that. The level of job they are applying for should be extremely different. You should not be working in community mental health with that background.

 

[Sanman]

I hope you are fellowship trained and can develop a niche....bc the conflation of mid-level training and doctoral-level training is EVERYWHERE now.

A good niche is important. Fellowship training really depends on the specialty in question. I am not so sure it is worth the headache in many instances outside of neuropsych right now. I would not want to be a health psych or gero psych applying at the VA right now for a post-doc or as a new grad. Outside the VA, the frequency of those jobs decreases significantly.

 

[WisNeuro]

Here's the thing. That horse left the barn years ago. Because midlevels are part of other professions, we are not always even qualified to supervise them. You, unfortunately, are graduating at a terrible time for research and a not so great time for clinical practice (plenty of experienced VA folks will be emptying out in the near future).

As for competing with master's level folks? You really should not have to do that. The level of job they are applying for should be extremely different. You should not be working in community mental health with that background.

It ain't just community health, the general hospital systems around here aren't really hiring psychologists for general therapy roles anymore. Jobs aren't plentiful in some of those settings unless you have a niche that requires more advanced training.

 

[Sanman]

It ain't just community health, the general hospital systems around here aren't really hiring psychologists for general therapy roles anymore. Jobs aren't plentiful in some of those settings unless youlrequires more advanced training.

Fixed that your you (at least in the immediate area). The only places outside of VA hiring a significant number of psychologists are AMCs in the area. Regional hospital systems are not hiring us by me. It is all private practice jobs. I do see the occasional health psych posting and about 3 neuopsych/rehab jobs at the larger hospital centers. There are a few of larger pediatric hospitals hiring. However, the closest offers relatively poor salaries as it is mostly there for early career folks to cut their teeth.

 

[WisNeuro]

Fixed that your you (at least in the immediate area). The only places outside of VA hiring a significant number of psychologists are AMCs in the area. Regional hospital systems are not hiring us by me. It is all private practice jobs. I do see the occasional health psych posting and about 3 neuopsych/rehab jobs at the larger hospital centers. There are a few of larger pediatric hospitals places hiring. However, the closest offers relatively poor salaries as it is mostly there for early career folks to cut their teeth.

I will say. AMCs are still hiring, but they're also hiring people who have backgrounds and interest in research. And, those are pretty competitive, so most psychologists, especially these days, are not going to be in the running for those positions.

 

[R. Matey]

I just cannot imagine having to compete anywhere in the near future with MA-level psych people for AMC jobs… hopefully it doesn’t become a thing. (But the way the economy is heading, who’s to say AMCs won’t become cheap and start heading in that direction!) 🤡

FWIW, the sky isn't falling everywhere. Hospital systems that compete directly with AMCs will still hire psychologists, especially in health, neuro, and peds.

 

[Sanman]

Absolutely *zero plans* of going into CMH… 😅.

I think we have to be cautious about the assumption that grads from these programs would be applying to “extremely different” jobs vs. PhD-level folks.

I just cannot imagine having to compete anywhere in the near future with MA-level psych people for AMC jobs… hopefully it doesn’t become a thing. (But the way the economy is heading, who’s to say AMCs won’t become cheap and start heading in that direction!) 🤡

I am not saying whether you will or will not be competing with them. However, if you are then that is not just on them. You come from a clinical science PhD program. Your trajectory should be more toward a faculty or teaching position with at least some research.

There a many hospital jobs for midlevels including at AMCs. However, you are not usually teaching or doing research. If you are opting for an all clinical job, that is more about the market for clinical science PhD jobs than it is for masters level folks. There are folks here that made that turn. As someone much more clinically focused, I compete with midlevels more closely. That said, most of those jobs are also not very good jobs. That is not a masters level problem, but a jobs problem. A SW, LPC, or MFT could have taken the job all the same.