So. Cal for a DO?

[mfrederi]

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I have been looking at the LA area ED residencies lately, as my wife is a Californian and all her family still lives there. She and I would like to go to a program in that area. However, I have been told by some people that I probably shouldn't even bother because they don't have any love for DOs. A quick survey on EMRA of the programs confirms that Loma Linda, the UCLAs, and USC have not accepted a DO in the last 5 yrs. Considering that I am very reticent to go to King Drew because of all the ups and downs with the program recently, nor do I want to spend an extra year at Arrowhead, is there any option for me? I have talked to the PD at In and Out, but it is so prestigous I am not sure a DO could even get an interview there. I was going to rotate at LLU, but I don't want to waste my time. I am a competitive applicant, though not stellar (top 20% of my class, 240's USMLE, great score on COMLEX (but nobody cares about this one) and I speak Spanish (a plus in Cali me thinks). I figure sometime somebody has to be the first DO to get into one of these places, but I am not sure my profile is good enough to kick down that door. So please tell me, do I have any options or should I not waste my time (and $) with a southern California rotation.

 

[11-44]

Just apply, then make contingency plans just like allopathic students do.

 

[mfrederi]

Just apply, then make contingency plans just like allopathic students do.

I appreciate the advice, and I am planning on applying regardless of whether or not I think I will get in. However, my concern is more in regards to putting extra effort (i.e. audition rotation, second look, etc) into one of these California rotations if inevitably they will be slamming the door in my face at some point.

 

[GeneralVeers]

I appreciate the advice, and I am planning on applying regardless of whether or not I think I will get in. However, my concern is more in regards to putting extra effort (i.e. audition rotation, second look, etc) into one of these California rotations if inevitably they will be slamming the door in my face at some point.

King/Drew will probably have scramble spots, so if you really need to come to California it's an option.

The situation is not as unstable as the media has made it out to be.

 

[11-44]

If you interview, pick one that appeals to you and do a 'second look.' It may not definitively help much other than you may show enhanced interest to a PD.

While many say such a trip is unnecessary and won't help much, if planned correctly around late Jan. or early Feb, it certainly won't hurt you. In this regard, you kill 2 birds with one stone.

You many enhance a So Cal slot for yourself and you will make an effort to include your wife's wishes in your match. Ask yourself if that is worth the $200-300.

 

[mfrederi]

If you interview, pick one that appeals to you and do a 'second look.' It may not definitively help much other than you may show enhanced interest to a PD.

While many say such a trip is unnecessary and won't help much, if planned correctly around late Jan. or early Feb, it certainly won't hurt you. In this regard, you kill 2 birds with one stone.

You many enhance a So Cal slot for yourself and you will make an effort to include your wife's wishes in your match. Ask yourself if that is worth the $200-300.

yes- point taken
I would still like to know a DOs chances are as dismal as they seem.

 

[11-44]

yes- point taken
I would still like to know a DOs chances are as dismal as they seem.

It is doltish to continue pursuing this question. Looks like you have formed your own opinion. Trust your own defeatist attitude.

Unless you can get inside the head of a SoCal PD, then I doubt there's anything I can tell you. If you were an MD student I would tell you the same thing.

By the way, what the hell's wrong with your own initiative? If you know its an uphill battle and you cannot assess your chances with your own faculties, there's nothing to be said.

You are a DO outside of California who is not a former resident of California who did not attend medical school in California. Search the previous forums. Many 'stellar' allopathic former California-residents have had a difficult time obtaining interviews back home.

On a side note- whats the hangup with Arrowhead? If are looking at the 'UCLA's' then you know that Oliveview is a 2-4 as well.

I give up.

 

[EctopicFetus]

USC has taken DOs in the past..

 

[mfrederi]

EF- thank you, I must have missed that on EMRA.

In regards to the other response, it is very hard to use your own "faculties" to acqure information that only residents with intimate knowledge of a program can provide to you. For example, it would be good to know that X program has an unwritten policy against interviewing DOs, or against accepting out of state applicants, or will only consider out of staters that rotated with them, or have a connection. And I keep asking the same question because "apply and have contingency plans" is completely unrelated to whether or not a DO can break in to some of these residencies. I am fully aware that you must apply to residencies, and that if don't get in you need a contingency plan. Yes, I know Oliveview is 4 yrs. I only checked to see if they had taken DOs in the past to further asses the climate in the area.

 

[corpsmanUP]

With the very few rare exceptions like Vandy, Carolinas, and maybe UNM, I think most any residency in EM is open to DO's if you play the game perfectly. For a California program, you will need a "personalized" PS. Make it show your interests in Cali and why.....embellish if need be! Just be sure to be able to back up anything your PS talks about.

Start getting in with the PD now. Travel there to visit and stop by unannounced and meet the PC. See if anyone of importance is around. Just tell them you are an MS3 from Texas and are in the area for a family visit. Then pretend to be incredibly impressed even if they stink!! Then schedule an audition rotation and really impress them. Do a second look, and stay in touch with the PD. If you have the right level of confidence and people skills, you will have no problem. But all this is assuming you can pull off a task this detailed, or a better question is would you be willing to do all this for an average program only? If location is prime importance, you really better look at Arrowhead as well.

Not to worry you, but I applied to several Cali programs and got the complete shaft from all of them. And you know my stats are not meager MFred. I did not try very hard though to get in there...just thought of Cali as another place to train....had no real desire to go there.

Look me up next year and see if I can't talk you into coming up and doing a visiting rotation in the midwest....🙂

 

[EctopicFetus]

The programs in Cali seem to really care if you rotated there. I was lucky to get some interviews out there without ever rotating there. I will say that one of the things that helped me a lot was a couple of "excellent" LORS (or so I was told). At USC and Harbor they basically flat out said that they interviewed me because I did great at Cook County and they are both county places. I cant speak too much on the DO issue since I am not one but rotating there can ONLY help. When I was @ USC they were interviewing 1-2 FMGs who had rotated there, so IMO if they will interview them I cant imagine why they wouldnt interview a DO. (Not trying to start a DO vs Carib thing just saying).

Sorry about the error.. before..

 

[mfrederi]

corpsman, thanks great idea to visit this year. Man, you really know how to play "the game." Where are you hoping to be in the midwest (Indy?)? From knowing your priorities, I am sure you will end up at a very family friendly with a benign schedule and atmosphere- i.e. worth looking into.
EF- that helps me alot to know they interviewed some FMGs. Very encouraging

 

[corpsmanUP]

Midwest with almost near certainty, or Texas. Indy is my long shot, followed closely by Mayo as another long shot. Iowa is my 3rd and realistic, but it only has 6 spots and they tie several of them up with their own grads usually leaving a couple for out of staters. My 4th choice is Case with big MikeCWRU! I think if I were to analyze the situation statistically speaking I would bet on either Iowa or Case. I would be completely happy with any place on my rank list. Getting Indy might even get me to stop cursing and do occassional mission work 😉

 

[PalCareGrl]

I would try to rotate somewhere where you think you might have a shot. Neither my SO (who applied EM this year - I applied IM) were able to rotate at any of the UC programs due to schedule conflicts (Three week schedule - our school requires 2 or 4 wks). We are trying to get to LA from Florida (I'm from CT, he's from LA - went to UCLA undergrad)... it's been a challenge, and we're limited by where he ends up, but I got surprising interviews for IM - so you NEVER KNOW. I was the first DO to be interviewed at Olive View, and the program director told me that I was definitely competitive (whether I match there or not is a different story), and that they were trying to "diversify" their program.... so you never know which way trends will go for ANY specialty in any given year.

Anyway, I'll shut up. 😀 My point is - don't give up before you start! USC is DO friendly for EM (even though its 2-4). If you want to get back to LA your best shot may be Arrowhead - especially if you rotate there - the DO programs are more likely to take you if they like you when you rotate there... Best of luck!

 

[ElZorro]

Trying to diversify.... hummm, maybe DOs can get affirmative action

 

[MasterintuBater]

A D.O. from my school matched to USC this last year with tradiational year at arrowhead or somewhere else I think. His SDN name is FlemishGiant. He smells funny most of the time.