Specialties where I can still have a family and live 9-5

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First off to get in to ophthalmology you will have to work extremely hard to get a good residency. The only ophthalmologists I know who work 9 to 5 are in a group practice as a paid part-time employee. You would definitely not want to be a retina specialist because you would be guaranteed lots of call and lots of long hours.

i don't think this is true for all of ophthalmologists, certainly not for my cousin and his partners who are part of a retina group. the group has 5 doc's now and no one works more than 3 days a week which is usually 2 days clinic, one day surgery. (all full partners, not per diem), the older guys work 2.5 days a week. Opthalmology from my understanding hasn't taken a hit as far as lifestyle, but more compensation in recent years. The hospital doc's are another story...

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However, the poor trauma guys hardly get to operate anymore...all the interesting stuff gets turfed to NSGY or ortho.

Agreed. I've known of a couple people gung-ho about trauma based on ER and then were a little disenchanted when they found out how much post op, ICU type management they'd be doing versus saving people from car crashes or whatever.

However, my picks for lifestyle manageable fields would be Psychiatry, PM&R, Dermatology, certain branches of Neurology, and Radiology (lots of radiologists work long hours because they like the field and like the money, but there are definitely opportunities for part time to variable hours based on practice setting). Also some IM specialties that are more office based: Endocrine, Rheumatology, Heme/Onc. I've heard of anesthesia guy's having good lifestyles, but around here they work very hard (but are paid very well).
 
Trauma surgery isn't nearly as good as it sounds. Unless what sounds good to you is doing lap choles/PEGs all day as your run-of-the-mill general surgeons, then doing the occasional exploratory laparotomy/acute abdomen. All the good traumatic cases that require surgery usually go to ortho.
 
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The current article on the SDN home-page is about trauma, and the surgeon says that he has call every 6 days, and on normal days goes in at around 7am and leaves by the afternoon. Am I wrong in thinking this doesn't seem too bad?

This might be different by region. Seems like the trauma docs where I work are ALWAYS there, often times working 2-3 days straight w/ 24 hour shifts depending on who's working.

One ED doc I know just spent 20 straight days working, although I think that was more by choice (and they do work 8 hour shifts here).
 
An orthodontist I know takes home 450k a year working 4 days a week.

A couple derms I know in private practice work Mon-Thur 10-5 and still take home over 300k.

Radiation Oncology normally works M-F 9-5 with no real emergencies, and I've heard they do pretty well.

PM&R= plenty money and relaxation, so I was told by and attending who used this route to go into sports medicine.

A child psych attending told me his life is cush working about 4 days a week, cuz his practice is in bell air and all those rich hollywood kids have problems that their parents like to throw money at.

Allergery and Immuno work Mon-Fri and I've heard does well with no call and no emergancies. Only thing is you have to go threw internal medicine to get to it.

Those are some of the few off the top of my head that work 40 hours/week or less.

Cards is definately not one of them, they work hard cuz people just don't have heart attacks between 9-5 Mon-Fri.
 
Allergery and Immuno work Mon-Fri and I've heard does well with no call and no emergancies. Only thing is you have to go threw internal medicine to get to it.

I've known a couple of ID's who did allergy/immunology fellowships after several years of ID practice. The lifestyle and number of slots make this subspecialty very competative.
 
This might be different by region. Seems like the trauma docs where I work are ALWAYS there, often times working 2-3 days straight w/ 24 hour shifts depending on who's working.

One ED doc I know just spent 20 straight days working, although I think that was more by choice (and they do work 8 hour shifts here).

A trauma surgeon is not the same thing as an ED physician. Although I do agree - I don't understand why people keep picking ED, as it is not exactly a 9-5 lifestyle.
 
I'm not sure whether or not you misunderstood his post, but by insurance he was referring to medical malpractice insurance, not your personal health insurance. Whatever group/hospital hires you usually covers this, and it costs the same per year regardless of how many hours you're working, so they'd rather purchase it for one person who's going to work 60-80 hours/week than 2 people who are each going to work 30-40 hours/week.
yes, lol, i definitely misunderstood. i thought he meant health ins not malpractice and i was like whats the big deal. Again though, i still stand by my point. Even if you have to cover your own malpractice insurance, for some people, for a few key years in their childrens lives, (or for reasons other than having/raising kids), it might be worthwhile to have to "invest" x amount into malpractice ins in order to still be doing what you love (eg practicing medicine) but also be able to be home a bit more for a short (2-3 yr?) period of time.
 
A trauma surgeon is not the same thing as an ED physician. Although I do agree - I don't understand why people keep picking ED, as it is not exactly a 9-5 lifestyle.

sorry, I should have been more clear that I was speaking of two completely different things. The trauma docs work extremely long hours, and the ed docs I know (except the above example), work pretty normal hours.
 
yes, lol, i definitely misunderstood. i thought he meant health ins not malpractice and i was like whats the big deal. Again though, i still stand by my point. Even if you have to cover your own malpractice insurance, for some people, for a few key years in their childrens lives, (or for reasons other than having/raising kids), it might be worthwhile to have to "invest" x amount into malpractice ins in order to still be doing what you love (eg practicing medicine) but also be able to be home a bit more for a short (2-3 yr?) period of time.

I totally agree that there's nothing wrong with this, and actually find myself drawn to the lifestyle specialties, although it's more because I'm miserable if I end up spending 12+ hours in the hospital everyday. I get really cranky if I don't get to sleep 8 hours and workout, and I imagine it will be worse when I actually have a family that I want to see (I know, residency is sure to be a blast). There are some specialties where working part time is just more feasible than others, but I think if you're willing to take the pay cut, you can probably find a job that fits your needs. It may be in private practice, or it may require you deciding to stay in academia but devote more time to research and less time to patient care (which is always an option when it comes to wanting a 9-5 job).
 
radiology is great as well. I met a radiologist..his schedule is 9-5, two weeks on, two weeks off. So he works a total of 6 months a year. He works via email from home. $350k
 
radiology is great as well. I met a radiologist..his schedule is 9-5, two weeks on, two weeks off. So he works a total of 6 months a year. He works via email from home. $350k

I've always wondered, when people speak of radiology is this the oncology field?
 
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I've always wondered, when people speak of radiology is this the oncology field?

As in radiation oncology? No, it's referring to diagnostic radiology (and I guess now stuff like interventional radiology?)
 
Yes, all the comments here are good, but I took the OP to mean, "Which residency will allow me to work 9-5 and have a life?"

Seriously, none of them. Even the residencies with "easy" work hours (derm, path, PM&R) still require substantial amounts of home reading and studying. While you are in residency, you may be able to spend time with your family, but it will be spent on the couch with a book in your lap.

As an attending, your work hours will be dictated by how you structure your practice. You can work 100hrs/wk as a radiologist, or 50hrs/wk as a General Surgeon. It's all about where and how you want to practice, and how much money you feel like you need.
 
radiology is great as well. I met a radiologist..his schedule is 9-5, two weeks on, two weeks off. So he works a total of 6 months a year. He works via email from home. $350k

:thumbup:

He has it made.
 
Yes, all the comments here are good, but I took the OP to mean, "Which residency will allow me to work 9-5 and have a life?"

Aha. Well then I am one of the many who misread it. Not being a resident and all, I guess my "opinion" doesnt matter as much as ybours, but I pretty much think anyone in any allied health profession who has spent time in an academic setting, would be able to tell you, that um "none," is pretty much the answer to that question. Sure some are easier, but ya what you were saying about sitting home with a book even if youre doing an easy ROAD residency, thats what ive seen too and if anyone is going into this thinking, I wanna do derm because they have the best hours during residency, well a) they better keep their mouth shut during an interview when asked what specialties youre interested in and b) they better be prepared to work their ass off in school to get that spot.
 
Aha. Well then I am one of the many who misread it. Not being a resident and all, I guess my "opinion" doesnt matter as much as ybours, but I pretty much think anyone in any allied health profession who has spent time in an academic setting, would be able to tell you, that um "none," is pretty much the answer to that question. Sure some are easier, but ya what you were saying about sitting home with a book even if youre doing an easy ROAD residency, thats what ive seen too and if anyone is going into this thinking, I wanna do derm because they have the best hours during residency, well a) they better keep their mouth shut during an interview when asked what specialties youre interested in and b) they better be prepared to work their ass off in school to get that spot.

During residency I still say Derm, Rad Onc, and PM&R. I call it the DROP on what Kanya West would call "the good life." I rather be at home with my pugs and GF anyday reading a book then doing overnight call getting paged to give tylenol, or potassuim.

The ROAD doesn't really apply in residency cuz I know rads, opthos, and gas people who work their but offs.
 
I can't help but see this as a sign of a pre-med- completely detached from the world AND its hip hop scene.

But...he's a resident dermatologist...which means he's really only detached from lifestyle woes.
 
I can't help but see this as a sign of a pre-med- completely detached from the world AND its hip hop scene.

I think that knowing the minute details of the hip-hop scene is more indicative of being detached from the world than matching in derm.. :thumbup:
 
Podiatrists generally make less than most MD/DO. In any case, its not a medical specialty.

Whoa. It most certainly is. I would never do it because I hate feet but a good podiatrist is worth his weight in gold. Surely in a society where we refer to naturopaths, homeopaths, acupuncurists, and other circus clowns as doctors we can make room for the medically trained podiatrist.
 
I can't help but see this as a sign of a pre-med- completely detached from the world AND its hip hop scene.
Don't be hatin' LongDong, in case you haven't noticed, he matched DERM, which means he is GOD!!!:bow:
 
Well look, I'm an EM resident and I only work 14 twelve-hour shifts per 28-day block which generally means a schedule like this:

Day 1: off
Day 2: off
Day 3: 9AM-9PM
Day 4: 9AM-9PM
Day 5: off
Day 6: off
Day 7: off
Day 8: 9AM-9PM
Day 9: 9AM-9PM
Day 10: off
Day 11: off
Day 12: 9AM-9PM
Say 13: 9AM-9PM
Day 14: 9AM-9PM
Day 15: off
Day 16: off
Day 17: 9PM-9AM
Day 18: 9PM-9AM
Day 19: off
Day 20: off
Day 21: off
Day 22: 9PM-9AM
Day 23: 9PM-9AM
Day 24: off
Day 25: off
Day 26: 9PM-9AM
Day 27: 9PM-9AM
Day 28: 9PM-9AM
(Repeat)

Add about five hours per week for conference which sometimes falls during a shift (so you get to go to conference instead of working) and which sometimes doesn't (so you have to go to conference on a day off or right after your shift) and you see that this ain't bad.

We also have "backup call" on two days off to cover shifts for people who are sick but getting called in is fairly uncommon and the person who you cover generally owes you a shift later on.

I'll admit that on the three 9AM to 9PM shifts in a row I may not see my kids for three day because we seldom get out exactly at nine and by the time I get home it's usually 10:30 or so.
 
Well look, I'm an EM resident and I only work 14 twelve-hour shifts per 28-day block which generally means a schedule like this:

Day 1: off
Day 2: off
Day 3: 9AM-9PM
Day 4: 9AM-9PM
Day 5: off
Day 6: off
Day 7: off
Day 8: 9AM-9PM
Day 9: 9AM-9PM
Day 10: off
Day 11: off
Day 12: 9AM-9PM
Say 13: 9AM-9PM
Day 14: 9AM-9PM
Day 15: off
Day 16: off
Day 17: 9PM-9AM
Day 18: 9PM-9AM
Day 19: off
Day 20: off
Day 21: off
Day 22: 9PM-9AM
Day 23: 9PM-9AM
Day 24: off
Day 25: off
Day 26: 9PM-9AM
Day 27: 9PM-9AM
Day 28: 9PM-9AM
(Repeat)

Add about five hours per week for conference which sometimes falls during a shift (so you get to go to conference instead of working) and which sometimes doesn't (so you have to go to conference on a day off or right after your shift) and you see that this ain't bad.

We also have "backup call" on two days off to cover shifts for people who are sick but getting called in is fairly uncommon and the person who you cover generally owes you a shift later on.

I'll admit that on the three 9AM to 9PM shifts in a row I may not see my kids for three day because we seldom get out exactly at nine and by the time I get home it's usually 10:30 or so.

Sorry to semi-hijack this thread, but since Panda decided to weigh in, I've got what I believe to be a representative question for him: What's the real deal with shift work in EM? Some folks say messing with your circadian rhythms that much wreaks harrowing damage on your circulatory system and hormone levels, not to mention makes you irritable and distant around other people (subjective, I suppose).
 
I can't help but see this as a sign of a pre-med- completely detached from the world AND its hip hop scene.
Hey I'm in tune with the world I watch MTV and real world. I just can't spell, Engrish is my second language.

But...he's a resident dermatologist...which means he's really only detached from lifestyle woes.
Word up yo. See I'm in tune cuz I'm down wit da hip hop slang.

Don't be hatin' LongDong, in case you haven't noticed, he matched DERM, which means he is GOD!!!:bow:
You guys are just to funny.:lol:
 
Sorry to semi-hijack this thread, but since Panda decided to weigh in, I've got what I believe to be a representative question for him: What's the real deal with shift work in EM? Some folks say messing with your circadian rhythms that much wreaks harrowing damage on your circulatory system and hormone levels, not to mention makes you irritable and distant around other people (subjective, I suppose).

Half of my shifts are "days" and half are nights. As long as you are consistently on days or nights and discipline yourself to sleep I don't think you will have any problems. I haven't, anyway. But if you get home at 10 AM and decide to live a normal life before your next shift at 9PM you are going to get tired fast.

The only hard part are transition days. I'm switching to nights tonight and will be working when my brain tells me I should be sleeping.


I get about seven hours or more of sleep a day.
 
Aha. Well then I am one of the many who misread it. Not being a resident and all, I guess my "opinion" doesnt matter as much as ybours, but I pretty much think anyone in any allied health profession who has spent time in an academic setting, would be able to tell you, that um "none," is pretty much the answer to that question. Sure some are easier, but ya what you were saying about sitting home with a book even if youre doing an easy ROAD residency, thats what ive seen too and if anyone is going into this thinking, I wanna do derm because they have the best hours during residency, well a) they better keep their mouth shut during an interview when asked what specialties youre interested in and b) they better be prepared to work their *** off in school to get that spot.

I know its impossible to work 9-5 during residency:rolleyes:


I meant when youre practicing after its done.:cool:
 
Half of my shifts are "days" and half are nights. As long as you are consistently on days or nights and discipline yourself to sleep I don't think you will have any problems. I haven't, anyway. But if you get home at 10 AM and decide to live a normal life before your next shift at 9PM you are going to get tired fast.

The only hard part are transition days. I'm switching to nights tonight and will be working when my brain tells me I should be sleeping.


I get about seven hours or more of sleep a day.

What other schedules can you have besides 12hr shifts and days off? Can ya fit in 9-5pm everyday?
 
A question for you guys and gals interested in Derm, is there any real interest to work with skin, or is it mostly a lifestyle choice?
 
pathology. talk to intelligent people all day. give the diagnosis. be the leader in the lab. work 10 hours a day for 4 days a week. the doctor i am shadowing seems like she really loves her job.
 
My cousin is a psychiatrist and she works 9:30 to 3:30 5 days a week (never on the weekends). I have been shadowing her for a long time and we have yet to stay past 3:30 PM. In fact, on days that she teaches she gets in later than 9:30 and still leaves at 3:30.

Is that the norm for all psychiatrists?

Also, how much do rheumatologists generally make? I won't lie. My fiancee wants to have a family and I want to be a part of my kids' lives so while I can't picture myself happy in any career besides medicine, I do want to enjoy lots of family time and still make enough to live a decent lifestyle. Expensive cars, ritzy vacations, etc. aren't important. Just enough that I know I can raise my children and put them through college and still spend time with them and be a part of their lives.
 
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Radiation Oncology normally works M-F 9-5 with no real emergencies, and I've heard they do pretty well.

True. Lifestyle is a huge draw to this field. Rad oncs can actually do extremely well especially in private practice.
 
Is that the norm for all psychiatrists?

No, however, psych is one of the lighter fields, but it depends on the person's practice (inpatient & outpatient, outpatient only, inpatient only, the type of hospital, etc).

I did inpatient psych at a community hospital. The attending would come in usually at 9, and most days we were done at 5-6... usually closer to 6. There was an occasionaly day that we got done at 12. (Overall, I worked more hours on psych than I did on OB/gyn. All of my other friends tend to have nicer hours than I on psych. It was a miserable month.)
 
Emergency Medicine (ER) and Hospitalist work mostly shift work at hospitals, but I don't know if its 9-5, I am sure its a rotation. Anesthesiology and Radiology are really nice. Most groups allow for up to 10wks of vacation/year along with 1:6 call rotation. Most of the Anesthesiologist I work with put in about 40-50 hours a week and some of it is call, so they are not in the hospital all the time. Radiologist have the best call. They only have to wake up in the middle of the night and read film that has come over their private hospital network on their computer. Dermatology is good too. I am sure many docs can count on one hand how many times they have been called out in the middle of the night. Same for Pathology
 
What other schedules can you have besides 12hr shifts and days off? Can ya fit in 9-5pm everyday?

I'm sure Panda should weigh in to, but since I've been to about every talk about EM there's been since school started, I'll tell you what I've been told.

EM is pretty much always shift work - whether you're academic or community EM. And they are usually either 8, 10 or 12 hour shifts (with 10 being the most common nowadays), depending on the hospital you're at. Also, its more common to work nights because those are the busiest times so more docs are needed then. [all this is from talks I've been to from EM docs in our hospital]

So no, my understanding is if you're looking for something 9-5 then EM is NOT for you. But keep in mind, that Panda is still a resident - when he's an attending he'll work less. It still depends on the hospital but I know our attendings only work eight to ten, 12-hour shifts per month. Which really isn't bad.

(Please correct me if I'm wrong Panda)
 
I would advise against Anesthesiology. I know one who said she works when the surgeon wants to operate and the one she works with the most likes to schedule most of them in the evening.
 
My orthopaedic surgeon works for a private practice and he has total control over his OR days and clinic days.

The orthopaedic surgeon I shadowed works at a hospital, has to take trauma call, and works crazy hours and never sees her kids.
 
How much do military doctors have to work, does anyone know?
 
How much do military doctors have to work, does anyone know?

Isn't there a whole forum for military medicine on here?

From what I have heard, you work fairly normal hours, but it is quite common to get deployed overseas for months at a time.
 
I know I have a passion for medicine but Im concerned about the toll that being a doctor will have on my family. I know residencies take a long time but what are the best to choose so that I can spend a reasonable amount of time with my family, aka eating dinner at home and not having to work 7 days a week?

Thanks for your comments!

Go neurosurgery Ian. Your family will love you for it!
 
How much do military doctors have to work, does anyone know?

Military doctors work week is closer to 40-50 hours. However, the problem with this is that higher skill jobs like neurosurgery stand the risk of diminishing skills. Also, underutilization is another major problem. The pay for military docs is very low, depending on the needs of your branch and your bonus. Expect your pay to fall betwen 80-100K. The problem here is that docs tend to moonlight to make a little extra dough and end up working 80-100 hour weeks anyways to maintain their skills and make-up on some salary cuts you get for working for Uncle Sam!
 
I would advise against Anesthesiology. I know one who said she works when the surgeon wants to operate and the one she works with the most likes to schedule most of them in the evening.

I agree with you here. The problem with ancillary docs, like gas docs, is that you run the risk of working when the the surgeons wants to work. If your surgeon wants to make 500K plus a year, you may be forced to work some mad hours. However, a fellow in pain mangement will give you more flexibility of you schedule and the pay is actually better than a gas doc. On the other perspective, gas docs have a better chance of finding shift work than any other specialty, with the exception to EM. Shift work, no matter what times, are always better on families because you can have a somewhat predictable schedule and plan family events around it. ALso, shift work generally means no pager watch. Big Plus!!!
 
I would advise against Anesthesiology. I know one who said she works when the surgeon wants to operate and the one she works with the most likes to schedule most of them in the evening.

That's really institution specific. I've indeed heard of the places where the anesthesiologists are the wipping boys when it comes to schedule, but that's not always the rule. Some places it's far more balanced and I've even heard of some where the anesthesiologists have the upper hand.

But it is a legitimate concern because you're never guaranteed complete autonomy.
 
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