Specialty Programs

[DocDrtySanchez]

Is anyone familiar with the level of dental school performance and/or Part I board performance needed to be competitive for specialty programs, particulary OMFS and Orthodontics? I am currently considering pursuing externships in these areas. However, I'd like to know realistically what my chances would be if I were to apply to one of these programs. Any relevant info would be greatly appreciated.

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[Dr. Pedo]

Simple parameters for OMFS, ORTHO:

Top 10% (most of time at least top 5 in class)
90+ on part I
Involved research

Obviously there are exceptions and more requirements but realistically you need to be at the top of your game.

Good luck,
RRB

 

[JML1DDS]

The shorter the residency/the more compensation after graduation = the more competitive. OMFS is not quite as popular as it was before. OMFS is 4 - 6 yrs some places 7 yrs. The compensation for most OMFS is about the same as Pedo, Ortho, etc. Ortho. makes good money and usually is only 27 mos. Pedo. is the same usually 24 to 27 mos and makes Good money. Ortho. and Endo. are the two most competitive residencies to get into. There are always exceptions, but in general you need to be top 10% and NBDE 90 or above. OMFS depends on the program you choose. More and more of the people in the top 10% and 90 or above on NBDE are choosing easier things like Ortho., Pedo., and Endo. So OMFS is getting slightly (SLIGHTLY) less competitive. I know that OMFS gets much training in facial trauma and implants and cosmetic surgery, but most practicing OMFS make the gist of their money taking out wizzies. So you go to 6 or 7 yrs of school, get your MD, and then mainly extract teeth. There are those out there that have managed to build good cosmetic practices or implant practices, but starting up with all the competition most OMFS must make their living off 3rds. So the spots are not filling as well as they did. Also, with more women graduating dental school in the top 10 percent, etc. These women want a family etc. they want to specialize, but not spend 6 yrs in a residency, and some don't have the physical strength to practice OMFS and therefore they are applying to the shorter "easier" residencies. I graduated Pedo. last year. and we interviewed at least 4 number ones in the class with board scores from 90 to 97 for Pedo. Pedo. is probably more competitive than OMFS probably the order goes Endo., Ortho., Pedo., OMFS and then Perio. Most Perio. residencies don't pay a good stipend and therefore don't command the applicants that the other programs draw. Hope this helps this is just my own babble. After considering residencies myself and then doing one and then being involved with interviewing applicants etc. this is what I have picked up.

 

[shore45]

docdrtysanchez - i'm also interested in OMFS and ortho. where are you doing an ortho externship? what does it involve? i haven't been able to find one really. i'm planning on doing an omfs externship next year probably at the school-affiliated hospital.

any suggestions?

 

[DocDrtySanchez]

Thanks for your input JML1DDS...everything you wrote certainly makes sense. While OMFS and Ortho are the only two specialties I can realistically see myself pursuing, I have been leaning towards Ortho simply because of the nature of the work, the lifestyle, and the comparatively shorter and less stressful residency. I've got a solid CV, scores, and GPA...however I'd like to get more clinical experience in the specialty. I did an externship in Ortho last summer, but ended up completely bored out of my mind since I couldn't really do anything. It was great during the first few weeks...but I'm the type of person who gets bored just standing around and watching other people do their thing.
My question is...has anyone had any experience with an Ortho externship in a hospital based program? I observed a private practitioner last summer...I'd like
to get a broader experience prior to committing myself to applying for ortho positions. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
DocDrtySanchez

 

[imdaman]

I was very interested in OMFS initially, but after a brief experience of dental school and being exposed to speicialty fields a little bit, I am leaning more towards ortho now. Like JML1DDS said, I do not feel the compensation you get for long and hard training of OMFS is satisfying. On the other hand, I enjoy the logical practice of orthodontics- Yes I like logic and math

Best wishes for you all.

 

[anu]

hi guys ,wats ur take on perio in boston university ...

 

[ljube_02]

Hey could you tell what these ortho and endo do-other than putting cavities in? How much they work? And how much money they make? And is it easy in forseeable future to get a partnership work in this field?

And compare them to Physicians-Radiologists, in terms of lifestyle?
Thanks

 

[gryffindor]

ltjube_02,

Sure, we'll tell you what ortho and endo does. Ortho is orthodontics (straightening malposed teeth, correcting jaw alignments) and endo is endodontics (root canals of every kind). They don't put in any cavities or make dentures, because as specialists, they are limited to practice only what they specialized in (the stuff I mentioned). After 4 years of dental school, a residency in ortho or endo is 2 to 3 years long.

As far as how many hours they work - from what I've seen, around 40 hours. More if you are just starting your business, less once you are well established. I've seen some orthodontists work 4 day weeks and still earn plenty- at least $200K+. Endo makes lots of money as well - very low overhead, a general estimate would be $1000 for a root canal on a molar (around here). But there isn't too much salary talk around here in dental school, other than the fact that specialists will usually make more than the general dentist.

I don't know too much about radiology other than what I read here on SDN. It sounds like a really competitive medical specialty to get into (need high USMLE scores, top AOA honors, research, etc). That sounds like ortho and endo admissions here in dental school. Programs get around 25 to 40 applicants for every available spot in these specialties. So from the threads I read, it sounds like you can be a radiologist, but still have these crazy hospital hours and be on call, the only consolation being you will make tons of money. Ortho definitely has very little off-hours emergency. If a kid's braces fall off because they bit an apple too hard, it can wait till the office opens on Monday. Wires usually don't snap or break off in the mouth. They may shift around but again, it can wait till Monday. Endo probably has more emergency calls since a tooth can flare up and cause pain at any hour, but I haven't heard of any endodontists at school having to come in at 3 am to start a root canal. Neither specialty is life or death though - people live normal lives with crooked teeth and if a root canal fails for some reason, the tooth can be extracted and the person will still live

There are definitely many jobs and opportunites available for endodontists and orthodontists after they graduate. The hard part is getting through dental school with the right credentials to get into a specialty program.

 

[ljube_02]

Thanks for the reply!

My aunt has bad teeth and she goes to the dentist often to get root canals and other stuff to keep her jaw from falling out(same dentist that i go to for regular checkups and fillings). I wonder if he did any residensy in endodontics? Or it's possible to do root canals anyway?

Also we are in a big city, NYC, and so the insurance is HMO based. My aunt says root canals cost about $300, as opposed to $1000. Does fee-for-service mean that the patient just pays cash? Or the commercial insurance in hmo-free area just pays so much more?
Also this dentist i think works 6 days/wk and last time i was in his office at 6pm (last patient in his office). I think he is about 50yo.