Sports Medicine, PM& R or Family Medicine

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TriMcNasty

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I am just wondering which way is better way to proceed if I want to end up in Sports Medicine? For instance whom do orthos hire to help them in their practice or teams trust to treat their athletes? I looked at some job offerings in Sports Medicine and was unsure who apply to these type of jobs? Thanks a lot and any info would be helpful.

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I am just looking for information and then I would try and make that decision. Are their fellowships/internships for PM R? I have noticed there are for Family Practice doctors. Also I saw that some Emergency Medicine residents went to do a fellowships in sports medicine. So I am just wondering who is the most useful for non operative care in sports medicine? I know there isn't a right answer but there must some opinions on advs and disadvs that i would like to hear.
 
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Med student's perspective here...drusso's question was actually far more relevant than you may think. You can do sports med fellowships from PM&R, IM, EM, FM, and Peds(?). The most common route is from Family Medicine. What drusso was pointing out is that your residency base is what is going to determine the majority of your practice. From reading posts on this thread and talking to docs in the field, the vast majority if their day to day has more to do with their residency training than sports medicine. FM is going to have more of a primary care focus (generalist) while something like EM is going to have more of an emergency/adverse event management focus (specialty).

I talked to an EM sports guy at my school, and hes a full time attending in our ED and does a sports med clinic once a week at UMD - College Park, and also covers the football and basketball games. Of the several PM&R sports guys I've shadowed, I only saw one sports med patient. So what drusso is saying is that you have to decide what you want to do everyday first before you take the plunge into sports med. If you picked FM and did a fellowship in sports med, but you realized halfway through residency PM&R was a better fit for you, doing FM/sports for the next 40 years would likely make you miserable, because youll do mostly general medicine, not sports. Few practitioners decide to make a living off only sports from what I understand.

The majority of fellowships are housed within Family Medicine residencies. Other specialties are "welcome", but politics may or may not dictate differently. Just my $0.02 but I agree with drusso, "Generalist or specialist?"
 
I am just looking for information and then I would try and make that decision. Are their fellowships/internships for PM R? I have noticed there are for Family Practice doctors. Also I saw that some Emergency Medicine residents went to do a fellowships in sports medicine. So I am just wondering who is the most useful for non operative care in sports medicine? I know there isn't a right answer but there must some opinions on advs and disadvs that i would like to hear.

basic vocabulary: internship = first year of residency after medical school. Residency = the years spent training in a primary specialty. Fellowship = done after residency to gain additional training in a specialty.

So in terms of residency:
Family med is 3 years - mostly spent doing outpatient primary care stuff. If you go via family med, you will know your cardiology and pulmonary stuff well. In addition, you will be comfortable with peds and adults.
PM&R is 4 years including one year of intern year in IM, Family Med, Peds, Surg, transitional, etc. PM&R will teach you good MSK/neuro anatomy, physical exam, and diagnostic skills - and most residencies will give you plenty of opportunities doing peripheral joint injections, EMG/NCS, quick scan of initial radiological studies, and some basic rehabilitation of athletes.
ER is 4 years and you will learn your emergency management stuff - suturing, codes, airway management, etc. And also be able to do a quick initial read of radiological studies.
Pediatrics is 3 years - obviously, you will be comfortable treating kids.
Internal medicine is 3 years - you will spend a good amount of time doing inpatient medicine in addition to outpatient time doing primary care stuff. You will be really good at our cardiology and other basic internal medicine stuff.

Fellowship is available to all the above specialties - and are usually 1 year. PM&R is what I know best - so if you go from a PM&R background, you can do a fellowship in musculoskeletal, sports, spine, pain, or combination of the above. In 2006, we were granted the ability to become "board certified" in sports medicine (sit for the sports medicine boards) - either via grandfathering in or doing a fellowship. Currently, there are no ACGME accredited sports medicine fellowships but I'm sure there will be some by the time you are looking for a fellowship.

"On September 19, 2006, the American Board of Medicine Specialties (ABMS) approved the American Board of Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation (ABPMR) application to join with four other ABMS Boards to grant Sports Medicine subspecialty certification. The other ABMS Boards are the American Board of Family Medicine (ABFM), the American Board of Internal Medicine (ABIM), the American Board of Pediatrics (ABPeds), and the American Board of Emergency Medicine (ABEM)."

Many physiatrists (doctors who specialize in PM&R) enter group practices with orthopedic surgeons and generally have a good relationship with them - not only because we provide good non-operative care of their patients but also because we bring income generating procedures such as EMG/NCS, peripheral joint injections, and epidural steroid injections - AND we work well with therapists and athletic trainers.

You can get to sports medicine whatever way you want. Becoming a team physician sounds cool but most team docs I've met have been at academic medical centers because being a team doc doesn't pay well and has huge malpractice risk bc professional athletes are worth millions.

As a pre-med, you should keep your options open and try to get into the best medical school you can for you. Go through your rotations, then decide what you want. Looking at job listings for sports medicine docs seem premature and probably not the best way to figure out what you want to do with your life since even if you are applying to med schools this year - you are still a good 9-10 years away from looking for a job and by then, the market will be different.
 
Med student's perspective here...drusso's question was actually far more relevant than you may think. You can do sports med fellowships from PM&R, IM, EM, FM, and Peds(?). The most common route is from Family Medicine. What drusso was pointing out is that your residency base is what is going to determine the majority of your practice. From reading posts on this thread and talking to docs in the field, the vast majority if their day to day has more to do with their residency training than sports medicine. FM is going to have more of a primary care focus (generalist) while something like EM is going to have more of an emergency/adverse event management focus (specialty).

I talked to an EM sports guy at my school, and hes a full time attending in our ED and does a sports med clinic once a week at UMD - College Park, and also covers the football and basketball games. Of the several PM&R sports guys I've shadowed, I only saw one sports med patient. So what drusso is saying is that you have to decide what you want to do everyday first before you take the plunge into sports med. If you picked FM and did a fellowship in sports med, but you realized halfway through residency PM&R was a better fit for you, doing FM/sports for the next 40 years would likely make you miserable, because youll do mostly general medicine, not sports. Few practitioners decide to make a living off only sports from what I understand.

The majority of fellowships are housed within Family Medicine residencies. Other specialties are "welcome", but politics may or may not dictate differently. Just my $0.02 but I agree with drusso, "Generalist or specialist?"

That's exactly right.
 
basic vocabulary: internship = first year of residency after medical school. Residency = the years spent training in a primary specialty. Fellowship = done after residency to gain additional training in a specialty.

So in terms of residency:
Family med is 3 years - mostly spent doing outpatient primary care stuff. If you go via family med, you will know your cardiology and pulmonary stuff well. In addition, you will be comfortable with peds and adults.
PM&R is 4 years including one year of intern year in IM, Family Med, Peds, Surg, transitional, etc. PM&R will teach you good MSK/neuro anatomy, physical exam, and diagnostic skills - and most residencies will give you plenty of opportunities doing peripheral joint injections, EMG/NCS, quick scan of initial radiological studies, and some basic rehabilitation of athletes.
ER is 4 years and you will learn your emergency management stuff - suturing, codes, airway management, etc. And also be able to do a quick initial read of radiological studies.
Pediatrics is 3 years - obviously, you will be comfortable treating kids.
Internal medicine is 3 years - you will spend a good amount of time doing inpatient medicine in addition to outpatient time doing primary care stuff. You will be really good at our cardiology and other basic internal medicine stuff.

Fellowship is available to all the above specialties - and are usually 1 year. PM&R is what I know best - so if you go from a PM&R background, you can do a fellowship in musculoskeletal, sports, spine, pain, or combination of the above. In 2006, we were granted the ability to become "board certified" in sports medicine (sit for the sports medicine boards) - either via grandfathering in or doing a fellowship. Currently, there are no ACGME accredited sports medicine fellowships but I'm sure there will be some by the time you are looking for a fellowship.

"On September 19, 2006, the American Board of Medicine Specialties (ABMS) approved the American Board of Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation (ABPMR) application to join with four other ABMS Boards to grant Sports Medicine subspecialty certification. The other ABMS Boards are the American Board of Family Medicine (ABFM), the American Board of Internal Medicine (ABIM), the American Board of Pediatrics (ABPeds), and the American Board of Emergency Medicine (ABEM)."

Many physiatrists (doctors who specialize in PM&R) enter group practices with orthopedic surgeons and generally have a good relationship with them - not only because we provide good non-operative care of their patients but also because we bring income generating procedures such as EMG/NCS, peripheral joint injections, and epidural steroid injections - AND we work well with therapists and athletic trainers.

You can get to sports medicine whatever way you want. Becoming a team physician sounds cool but most team docs I've met have been at academic medical centers because being a team doc doesn't pay well and has huge malpractice risk bc professional athletes are worth millions.

As a pre-med, you should keep your options open and try to get into the best medical school you can for you. Go through your rotations, then decide what you want. Looking at job listings for sports medicine docs seem premature and probably not the best way to figure out what you want to do with your life since even if you are applying to med schools this year - you are still a good 9-10 years away from looking for a job and by then, the market will be different.



thanks for the response. now i have some information that is useful other then a hypothetical question. much appreciated
 
thanks for the response. now i have some information that is useful other then a hypothetical question. much appreciated

I'll remember this next time I decide to take time away from memorizing a 12 page list of spinal blocks, CNS drugs and the like...

Listen up junior, cause I'll only bother with this once. Both drusso and axm were nice in regarding your question. Quite honestly, you could have found the answer to your question with about 20 mins of google and SDN searches. Axm spared you the search, while drusso is asking you a question (which is not even CLOSE to hypothetical, very practical really) that you will actually need to think about regardless of fellowship choice (if you even end up doing one), regardless of whether or not you think its relevant to your purposes.

Did you not read my post as to why he asked that question??? I dont care whether or not you think my opinion is crap, but most who post here are residents and attendings. If any of them actually cares to say something to you, its something worth giving a lot of thought to because not only have they been where you are, they are now where you'll be lucky to end up. If a physician answers your question with a question, take a few and think about it, don't disregard its utility. You'll be in for an unpleasant ride in this field with that kind of attitude.
 
wow, um... what just happened?

lost in translation? msk, i dont believe his reply to you is meant the way you thought it did.
 
I actually did think that there was a hint of attitude in TriMcNasty's posts - but I gave him/her the benefit of the doubt. It's a typical pre-med attitude - and the way he/she was going about trying to make a decision that won't be made for at least 4 years was not the right way to make a decision so I'm hoping my more "concrete" post helped. I figured starting with the real BASICS will help someone like this. Hopefully, it will help some of the other confused pre-meds.
 
I didn't mean any offense. Just the question wasn't helpful when I don't understand its context and was looking for other opinions to formulate one for myself. So before you start name calling and assuming sarcasm just take a deep breath.
 
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