Stanford vs UMich

[LadyBulldog]

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I said i wouldn't do this....but i really need help!

Stanford or UMich???


oh, i'm from the east coast, used to live in ann arbor, pretty specific research interests, esp in international health.....

and no merit money from UMich and Stanford is all need-based

 

[Saluki]

I said i wouldn't do this....but i really need help!

Stanford or UMich???

They're both excellent schools, so you can't go wrong... If it were me making the decision I'd choose Stanford because the class size is so much smaller.... But, you may like the bigger class at UMich...I say wait for the financial aid and make your decision based on that...

 

[JDWflash44]

Well, you can't beat the weather in CA and P/F all four years would be very little stress. I dont know too much about UMich, but I'd say Stanford.

Jim

 

[DeadorAlive]

I adored both schools, and I would say stanford. Weather is a factor, but so is the opportunity to live somewhere new. You live on the east coast and have done Ann Arbor - I'm inclined to go try something different, knowing that in 4 years, you will have experienced 3 regions of the country when deciding where you want to be for residency.

When I was doing this very (now-irrelevant) thought experiment the downside for Stanford was the lack of an MPH option on campus (instead joint with Berkeley).

While both are college-towny, Stanford has San Fran so close while Ann Arbor has... detroit.

 

[Saluki]

BTW- Don't you know that Stanford is #8 and UMich is only #9... What more reason to do you need? 😉

 

[ChymeChancellor]

UMich all the way!

 

[Bluntman]

 

[satcool]

I would definitely go to Stanford. Cali's great weather, coupled with 4 years of pass/fail (minimal stress) curriculum, and amazing residency match lists are all wonderful aspects of the Stanford experience. Quality of life during medical school is a very important factor to consider as well. In addition, Stanford also has the HIGHEST USMLE step 1 scores in the Nation (median was 241, mean 237 this past year, http://deansnewsletter.stanford.edu), compared to U-M average of 230 (Which is still awesome). Ann Arbor is a great place, but I think this would be a great opportunity to live in a wonderful place. Finally, If you care at all about U.S News Rankings, Stanford is ranked #7, and U-M is NO LONGER a "top 10" school. To me, Stanford is a no brainer!

 

[jjmack]

I'd go with stanford. New location, all p/f, and smaller class size.

 

[docmode]

Last year this time, my very good friend was making a similiar decision. Her decision was between UCSF, Stanford and scholarship to Michigan. It was a very tough decision. All three are great and she would have been happy at any of them. She also came from Yale. In the end she followed her heart and chose Stanford. It was the best decision of her life. The change from the east coast, the weather and most of all Stanford's way of doing things made it a perfect match. She likes the curriculum and especially the p/f grading. There is no competition with the students and great support from the faculty. San Francisco is so close which is great too. I think you cannot go wrong with either, but the climate and California way is great to experience. With such little free time you might as go for the place that feels the best with all else equal. Go for Stanford, you'll love it.

 

[kupono3]

I said i wouldn't do this....but i really need help!

Stanford or UMich???


oh, i'm from the east coast, used to live in ann arbor, pretty specific research interests, esp in international health.....

and no merit money from UMich and Stanford is all need-based

that's funny, that's exactly the decision I'm trying to make... if it makes you feel any better, I haven't decided yet either, nor will I until I go back to visit both schools... good luck!

what everyone I know keeps telling me is that the nice thing is that there's no wrong choice.

 

[guga282]

I said i wouldn't do this....but i really need help!

Stanford or UMich???


oh, i'm from the east coast, used to live in ann arbor, pretty specific research interests, esp in international health.....

and no merit money from UMich and Stanford is all need-based

How important is international health to you? Stanford's is not that good in IH, while UMich, Harvard, Columbia are among the top programs in the nation. I'd say if that wasn't a factor, go for Stanford.

 

[ChocolateKiss]

The funny thing is, I'd say that Stanford might set you up better for getting a competitive residency or going into academics and might be a less stressful and more pleasant medical school (weather!), but Michigan would give you more disciplined pre-clinical training and superior clinical training.

By the way, shouldn't this thread include a poll?

 

[LadyBulldog]

Thanks so much guys--this really helps!

and uh yeah, smart enough to get into med school, not smart enough to figure out how to include a poll 😛

 

[Mr. Tee]

Stan for sure.

 

[sf1991]

wanna do international health, gotta do umich over stanford!!!!!

 

[LadyBulldog]

wanna do international health, gotta do umich over stanford!!!!!

really? why's that--i didn't realize umich was so much stronger...what kind of differences would there be?

 

[happydays]

I would definitely go to Stanford. Cali's great weather, coupled with 4 years of pass/fail (minimal stress) curriculum, and amazing residency match lists are all wonderful aspects of the Stanford experience. Quality of life during medical school is a very important factor to consider as well. In addition, Stanford also has the HIGHEST USMLE step 1 scores in the Nation (median was 241, mean 237 this past year, http://deansnewsletter.stanford.edu), compared to U-M average of 230 (Which is still awesome). Ann Arbor is a great place, but I think this would be a great opportunity to live in a wonderful place. Finally, If you care at all about U.S News Rankings, Stanford is ranked #7, and U-M is NO LONGER a "top 10" school. To me, Stanford is a no brainer!

Yup, everyone should just drop their UMich acceptances right now.

 

[Modanq]

Yup, everyone should just drop their UMich acceptances right now.

If you look at Dean Licter's responce, I think the fact that the Dean of the Health System is addressing the falling numbers indicates a ranking complex. Regradless of what it entails, I think it shows you that Michigan is semi worried about thier rankings, or instead it is significant to address. (I don't know what happened at Columbia) Moreover, I remember at one time Umich being ranked 7. Take that for what its worth. I think that Michigan is a little heavy on the numbers versus other schools. I remember them always touting the third in residency match or board scores bit throughout the application process. But, on the flip I love the school, and would love to go there. Hail to Michigan!

 

[UMP]

umich sucks don't go there... school is awful, weather is abysmal, the town is full of dirty hippies, they are out of the top ten !!!


(gotta start taking out the competition to my top choice early, you never know if prospective applicants might read this 😉 )

 

[DNM503]

really? why's that--i didn't realize umich was so much stronger...what kind of differences would there be?

I'd like to know this too. Also--if you go to Stanford for med school and plan on returning to the northeast for residency, is it more difficult than matching in the west?

Stanford isn't quite an "option" for me yet--but I should hear a decision soon and if I get in, I currently am 99% sure I would go. I'm also very interested in international health, though. I was under the impression that the Medical Scholars program allowed you to do international research if you so desire. That's what the curriculum guy told me. Also, you can design your own scholarly concentration in international health or international health combined with something else if you are clever.

 

[Centinel]

Also--if you go to Stanford for med school and plan on returning to the northeast for residency, is it more difficult than matching in the west?

My understanding is that it's not a problem, specifically because Stanford is Stanford. You see most residency matches ending up in CA, but that's classical selection bias. I'm a blind man trying to lead you around, but it's the intuitive answer.

I'm from the West Coast, heading to med school in the Northeast, and heading back to the West for residency. When I've spoken with MDs about this (maybe not the most knowledgeable bunch, but they've at least done this) they tell me that as long as the program is highly ranked, matching anywhere should not be too problematic.

Of course, 'home court love' can be beneficial to those who go to med school very close to where they want to match for residency, but that's anecdotal, and I don't think there has been empirical analysis of that.

 

[docmode]

I highly recommend second look weekend for both if you can. That is the best way to see what feels best. If they are both the same weekend, go to Stanford's since you are more familiar with Ann Arbor.

 

[lastrun82]

two things...stanford's supposed lack of stress comes from the pass/fail deal, but on step 1 you'll be competing against people who have been busting their tails for grades or honors

so you have to ask yourself whether you're mature enough to go the extra mile when you study over the first 2 years, instead of just going for the pass, cause that would haunt you on the boards (before the naysayers shoot this down, i've seen this with my own eyes...i'm not just hypothesizing)

secondly, 75% of stanford med students do a 5th year of research...w/o this, there would be no way to stand out when applying to residencies

 

[Labslave]

two things...stanford's supposed lack of stress comes from the pass/fail deal, but on step 1 you'll be competing against people who have been busting their tails for grades or honors

so you have to ask yourself whether you're mature enough to go the extra mile when you study over the first 2 years, instead of just going for the pass, cause that would haunt you on the boards (before the naysayers shoot this down, i've seen this with my own eyes...i'm not just hypothesizing)

secondly, 75% of stanford med students do a 5th year of research...w/o this, there would be no way to stand out when applying to residencies

UMich has P/F grading for the first two years, as well. Hence, according to your thinking, she'd have to "go the extra mile" at UMich as well in order to compete against people you have been competing with their classmates on a regular basis.

I think everyone needs to realize that even if a school impelements a strictly P/F grading system, THEY STILL KEEP TRACK OF YOUR PERFORMANCE. You may not be evaluated according to a numbered ranking system, but they will know whether your beasting out or barely eeking by. Don't be so naive as to think that when applying for residencies the residency directors won't know about such things...they most certainly will.

At Michigan, they give 'code words' for those in the top 25%, middle 50%, and bottom 25% such as "impressive" or "respectable" or "less than desireable" when they write a summary of your pre-clinical performance when you're applying to residencies. Although I'm not absolutely certain this is the case at Stanford, they have to give some sort of indication of your performance relative to others in their school.

To the OP: Follow the advice of one of the posts above and attend the second look weekends for each of the schools. Only you will be able to decide where you'll be happier and which school will best assist you in reaching your career goals. Best of luck and congratulations on having such a desirable decision to make!

 

[Marie_]

rankings, and weather aside (because who really cares about those 😉 ) I fell in love with Michigan when I went there. The students seem awesome, and because I have a friend who goes there I know they are a tight knit group who really supports each other. Also, Ann Arbor is such a great area with the ethnic cuisine of a big city and the friendly charm of a small town. On the UM downside you pretty much need a car there, they do not plow very well, and the weekly tests could get tiring. I'm sure you've already spent a ton of money, so splurge a little more on the second looks and meet your prospective classmates. That will make all the difference.

By the way I know nothing about Stanford so some of this may be true for them as well.

 

[sen]

I think everyone needs to realize that even if a school impelements a strictly P/F grading system, THEY STILL KEEP TRACK OF YOUR PERFORMANCE. You may not be evaluated according to a numbered ranking system, but they will know whether your beasting out or barely eeking by. Don't be so naive as to think that when applying for residencies the residency directors won't know about such things...they most certainly will.

At Michigan, they give 'code words' for those in the top 25%, middle 50%, and bottom 25% such as "impressive" or "respectable" or "less than desireable" when they write a summary of your pre-clinical performance when you're applying to residencies. Although I'm not absolutely certain this is the case at Stanford, they have to give some sort of indication of your performance relative to others in their school.

Wow...I had no idea about this. Thanks so much Labslave!

Does anyone know if this also applies at Stanford or Yale? That would make the P/F there much less attractive...

 

[qr321]

Wow...I had no idea about this. Thanks so much Labslave!

Does anyone know if this also applies at Stanford or Yale? That would make the P/F there much less attractive...

Stanford is P/F, with no rankings and no AOA. It is a "true" P/F.

 

[LadyBulldog]

thanks again guys...unfortunately, i can't make the UMich second look weekend and they just complicated things with a 10,000 merit scholarship. Stanford seems like a dream school, but is it worth 40 thou?

 

[DNM503]

thanks again guys...unfortunately, i can't make the UMich second look weekend and they just complicated things with a 10,000 merit scholarship. Stanford seems like a dream school, but is it worth 40 thou?

I wouldn't count it out so fast...10,000 isn't that much...and I hear Stanford's financial aid is AMAZING...so they may give you that 10,000 at Stanford in grants anyway.

 

[fatmagi]

I wouldn't count it out so fast...10,000 isn't that much...and I hear Stanford's financial aid is AMAZING...so they may give you that 10,000 at Stanford in grants anyway.

Stanford's financial aid is very generous. There are also TA and RA positions that are compensated extremely well. Plus they have 1-4 med scholar's travel/research quarters (one quarter alone is worth $12,000 in aid).

That being said, choose your school based on location. Being close to family and friends may be important to you. The reputation, research, and student body at both schools are excellent. You will have numerous options whichever school you choose. Several of my friends chose to go to top schools in less desirable (to them) locations because of reputation or career choices and regretted their decision to go with reputation over location.

I can only speak for Stanford, but I loved living in the Bay Area... biking, swimming, skiing, surfing, hiking, a wonderful mix of culture and art - all easily accessible. If you've haven't lived in California before, I'd definitely recommend it. My friends who went to Stanford Med, truly enjoyed their time. The % of happy students at Stanford across departments and schools is quite high which makes for a great living and learning environment.