Studying for Step 3 in M4?

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metroidlonder said:
Bored af and forgetting everything I learned for Step 2. What do y'all think about getting step 3 uworld rn and just doing a block or two a day
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Most will say no, but I'm the student that probably needs it, even for enrichment sake. My only gripe is that most residency has an education stipend and I don't want to pay for something I'd get free later.
 
popopopop said:
Most will say no, but I'm the student that probably needs it, even for enrichment sake. My only gripe is that most residency has an education stipend and I don't want to pay for something I'd get free later.
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Same. I just don't want to shell out the $600 but I really need to keep learning medicine lmao
 
Intern here and i havent even touched anything related to step 3 lol

If you have a burning desire...the step 3 anki deck is huge
 
ciestar said:
Intern here and i havent even touched anything related to step 3 lol

If you have a burning desire...the step 3 anki deck is huge
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I don't like anki... The only way I've ever been able to learn is through the explanations in Uworld
 
metroidlonder said:
Bored af and forgetting everything I learned for Step 2. What do y'all think about getting step 3 uworld rn and just doing a block or two a day
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forums.studentdoctor.net

Step III before residency?

Hi, Just wondering--if you have time before residency starts, would you recommend getting Step III out of the way? Do scores matter for fellowship?
forums.studentdoctor.net forums.studentdoctor.net

I am a big fan of taking it ASAP, before the real world issues jumble up your book knowledge.

IE pt should be on med A (test answer) but since insurance doesn’t cover it we will give med B (real world answer)

Plus you will NEED that easy rotation in intern year to relax a bit. No use wasting it on test prep if you had opportunity to take it ahead of time.
 
There HAS to be a better way to spend your time. Even if you're bored our of your mind, find yourself a research project or do something that will have more long-lasting benefits than studying a year in advance for a test where all you need to do is pass (and the vast majority do).
 
First, I’d probably just have fun, exercise and enjoy life. If you absolutely, positively have to do some sort of studying, you’d probably be better off studying for boards of whatever specialty you plan to match into than step 3. Step 3 is zzzz. Boards not always and you’d look smarter if you’re gonna do an away. I know you guys have less aways due to covid and all but all the more reason to look baller. Just my thoughts as someone years down the road.
 
Tenk said:
First, I’d probably just have fun, exercise and enjoy life. If you absolutely, positively have to do some sort of studying, you’d probably be better off studying for boards of whatever specialty you plan to match into than step 3. Step 3 is zzzz. Boards not always and you’d look smarter if you’re gonna do an away. I know you guys have less aways due to covid and all but all the more reason to look baller. Just my thoughts as someone years down the road.
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Already plan on doing the first 3 things, but we have no aways at all bc of covid. Plus I'm already done with my sub-I and I'm just on electives so I really am bored af lol. There's only so much fun you can have in a lockdown
 
metroidlonder said:
Already plan on doing the first 3 things, but we have no aways at all bc of covid. Plus I'm already done with my sub-I and I'm just on electives so I really am bored af lol. There's only so much fun you can have in a lockdown
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So I guess I would emphasize that there is literally no marginal advantage between 260 vs 230 vs 210 for step 3–all that matters is you pass. So again, if you’re bored, find something that will be beneficial to you when you actually start residency, such as research, or read for your specialty, etc. While step 1 studying was very “high yield,” step 3 is the polar opposite.
 
we all need hobbies, I guess

I took it in third year of residency after blitzing through a board prep book and a q bank

Probably would have been less stressful if I took it earlier, when I still remembered what children and gynecology were
 
johnpablo85 said:
Yeah that one that ciestar posted lol, I did Zanki for step1 and Dorian for step2, so I was looking for something similarly comprehensive
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Can you give me a quick rundown on how this works. I downloaded ANKI for windows, downloaded the .apck, and now have the deck. I see about 8000ish cards in one folder. I expand the folder and I see a bunch of sections (Cardiology, Derm, etc.) and they all say Due: 0, New: 20. What do I do to start studying. I want to do it systematically and not like randomly because that's how I burn out in the first place.
 
I just click on the system I want to start studying for example Cardiology and do it daily until I finish then move on to Pulmonology for example.
 
johnpablo85 said:
I just click on the system I want to start studying for example Cardiology and do it daily until I finish then move on to Pulmonology for example.
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Is there any way to split it up so you can just do a generalized review. I have UWorld set to Random, Timed tests and don't want to take a systems approach.
 
Seems like you're going back on your initial decision of wanting to do it systematically lol. I'm actually not sure how to do it that way.
 
Rekt said:
Study and take it day one that you're eligible. Your future resident self with thank you
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Can confirm. Should of done. 100% regret
 
Are we really doing 8000 cards for step/level 3?
010F8205-7BF4-4943-8000-1195638BD8DC.jpeg
 
Step 3 is a complete joke and isn't worth putting much effort into. Yes, you should probably do a bit depending on the field that you go into, but this is nothing like step 1/2 in terms of either difficulty or effort required. I worked my way through about half of the USMLE Qbank over the course of a couple of months and scored something in the 80th percentile, and that was all the studying that I did.

Exactly 0 people are going to care about your performance on step 3. Your licensing board and residency are only going to care that you passed the thing, and that's it.
 
BacktotheBasics said:
Can you give me a quick rundown on how this works. I downloaded ANKI for windows, downloaded the .apck, and now have the deck. I see about 8000ish cards in one folder. I expand the folder and I see a bunch of sections (Cardiology, Derm, etc.) and they all say Due: 0, New: 20. What do I do to start studying. I want to do it systematically and not like randomly because that's how I burn out in the first place.
Click to expand...
You would benefit from watching this video: .
This explains how the software works and how to manipulate the intervals. At the very least, understand it. Definitely worth the watch.
 
NickNaylor said:
Step 3 is a complete joke and isn't worth putting much effort into. Yes, you should probably do a bit depending on the field that you go into, but this is nothing like step 1/2 in terms of either difficulty or effort required. I worked my way through about half of the USMLE Qbank over the course of a couple of months and scored something in the 80th percentile, and that was all the studying that I did.

Exactly 0 people are going to care about your performance on step 3. Your licensing board and residency are only going to care that you passed the thing, and that's it.
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Don't some IM fellowships care about it? I'm all for winging it but I'm IM bound with fellowship goals and I don't wanna take the chance
 
Prehealth1011 said:
Don't some IM fellowships care about it? I'm all for winging it but I'm IM bound with fellowship goals and I don't wanna take the chance
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I'm not sure why any of them would care when program quality + research + connections matter far more. Failing = bad though.
 
Lawpy said:
I'm not sure why any of them would care when program quality + research + connections matter far more. Failing = bad though.
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Maybe you're right. I just don't wanna take any chances. This is from a PD who posted here
1609259507960.png
 
metroidlonder said:
Bored af and forgetting everything I learned for Step 2. What do y'all think about getting step 3 uworld rn and just doing a block or two a day
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Single how does the saying go? 2 months for Step 1, 2 weeks for step two, and number two pencil for step 3.

Meaning you don't need to be studying now for step 3
 
Goro said:
Single how does the saying go? 2 months for Step 1, 2 weeks for step two, and number two pencil for step 3.

Meaning you don't need to be studying now for step 3
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This could not be more wrong. Dedicated for Step 2 should also be at least 4-5 weeks, potentially 2 months. Doing 4000 uworld questions is no joke, and honestly Step 2 can be considered a harder exam than Step 1 in many regards
 
Also agree that STEP 2 requires more dedicated time now. UWORLD added ~2000 questions in last 2 years and every single one of them is mandatory in my opinion. By 2023, we might see 5000 UWORLD questions for STEP 2
 
Ho0v-man said:
Calling it now. Step 2 is p/f in <5 years. Why anyone actually believed that this was a better idea is beyond me. Now we’ll just have M2 level stress with an M3 schedule.
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Did Step 2 become difficult because of Step 1 P/F? Or was it a recent change that happened in past couple of years or so?
 
Lawpy said:
Did Step 2 become difficult because of Step 1 P/F? Or was it a recent change that happened in past couple of years or so?
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It's hard to say. To us recent test takers, we obviously had more UWORLD/"what is the most common cause" to cover but who knows how difficult it was before

I know in November they decided to add more non-science nonsense (legal, ethics, patient safety i.e. things you can't study). I made sure to take it earlier to avoid that nightmare
 
metroidlonder said:
This could not be more wrong. Dedicated for Step 2 should also be at least 4-5 weeks, potentially 2 months. Doing 4000 uworld questions is no joke, and honestly Step 2 can be considered a harder exam than Step 1 in many regards
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Hey, I'm not making the news just reporting it.
 
Lawpy said:
Did Step 2 become difficult because of Step 1 P/F? Or was it a recent change that happened in past couple of years or so?
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N=a few

but it seems like everyone on here and IRL I’ve talked to did not get the classically easy exam if they took it after June. My friends who managed to take it earlier said it was a walk in the park.

But even if it didn’t get harder, it doesn’t matter. The whole issue is that people couldn’t get into competitive specialties because they weren’t able to compete with people with higher step scores. Moving things to step 2 doesn’t make a 50th percentile scorer equal to a 75th percentile scorer. I think part of what’s made the exam lower stress in the first place is that you already knew what you were going into when you took it because step 1 (right or wrong) had kind of sorted you into where you could go. All you had to do was score a similar percentile to step 1, which most people do anyway.
 
metroidlonder said:
This could not be more wrong. Dedicated for Step 2 should also be at least 4-5 weeks, potentially 2 months. Doing 4000 uworld questions is no joke, and honestly Step 2 can be considered a harder exam than Step 1 in many regards
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I agree. I took 6 weeks for Step 2. The first 2 weeks were light studying and the next 4 weeks were heavy studying.
 
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metroidlonder said:
Pleas don't report fake news like this in the future lmao. I know a couple of people who failed Step 2 CK because they genuinely believed it would be easy. It's not.
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I see the World has moved on. I'm just telling you what residents and attendings have reported on SDN in the past. Obviously, you should be studying, not bored.
 
Lawpy said:
Seems to suggest they screen out for Step 3 failures?

@Doctor Bob could you clarify? Or are Step 3 scores actually weighted higher than Steps 1/2?
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Keep in mind this is an n of 1; each institution and training program will have their own way of evaluating applicants.

In the first stage of fellowship application review, I'm sifting through hundreds of applications and trying to come up with a way of narrowing down the list to a more manageable number (to determine who to invite for interviews). One way I do that is with a formula that assigns points to all of the items on the ERAS application (board scores, publications, presentations, etc), and reduces the application to a number that I can then stratify. I'm still going to look through all of the applications but I do it in order from highest points to lowest points. I don't just interview the top 60 people by points, sometimes someone lower down has something in their PS that makes me interested in meeting them; sometimes someone in the top 60 has other red flags that make me put their application to the side.

Within that formula are conversion factors for each of the board exams and I weight step 3 more heavily than steps 2 or 1. But I'm looking at fellowship applicants; these people have been in clinical practice now for a minimum of 3 years... their performance on step 1 is pretty irrelevant to me other than that they passed it. Step 2 is less important than 3 but more than 1 so its conversion factor is in the middle.

With that said, even though step 1 is pretty much irrelevant to me I do still screen out people if they've failed a step exam. Certainly a step 3 failure is an immediate screen-out on my part. I might consider someone with a step 1 failure if the other exams are all much better and there's evidence of academic growth in the remainder of the application.
 
Importance of Step 3 score certainly seems higher for IM fellowships. I found the following info from Albany Medical College's GI fellowship website (Albany Medical College: Gastroenterology) -
  • USMLE I, II, III (minimum of 220 on your first attempt)

Fortunately, I am going into radiology where fellowships are not competitive and care about other factors (research, LoRs) more than Step 3.
 
Me and couple of my buddies applying to IM already started light step 3 studying while we have some free time last few months of M4. No one wants to take a chance on these things. It sounds like a gross idea but what can we do really
 
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