Studying medicine abroad? What's your opinion on it (specifically Europe)?

[Yazo]

I've been seeing an increased trend of people leaving their home countries (i.e. US or CA) to study in Europe/Caribbean. I actually think it's a good alternative, especially if you're from there yourself (like me).

Pros:

• Cheaper schooling (average is like $10k / year at good universities)
• You get your MD title after 6 years of schooling
• A lot of English programs over in Europe
• If you somehow attain citizenship, you'll be able to work there for the same money

Cons:

• If you're trying to come back to US/CA, they're tightening down the available residencies (or so I've heard)
• You're away for 6 years (which I don't know if it'd bother anyone)

Give some of your opinions.

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[Medstart108]

Depends on where you are studying but it'll be a lot harder to come back. Anyone who goes abroad probably gets an automatic -20 on the USMLE Step 1 just by going abroad. Its like making yourself an ORM voluntarily, why would you do that? On top of that for the Caribbean schools, the top residency programs won't accept them no matter how well they do.

Programs in Eastern and Southern Europe pay nothing near what American physicians earn, so if you did get citizenship and decided to practice there, it wouldn't pay very well, you'll also likely be using inferior equipment and have trouble getting research funding.

 

[tiedyeddog]

It is a terrible alternative if you actually want to practice in the US. Horrible idea.

 

[drcrispmd]

You need to think very hard about this. Of you are wanting to practice in the US you need to try to go to school in the US. Schools abroad are not always cheaper and some are more expensive.

Going abroad does not mean auto -20 on USMLE. Most have better scores than USMD students (partly because they have been told from day 1 they have to have 240+ to get residency).

You first need to get through high school and get into a good undergrad.

 

[mimelim]

Depends on where you are studying but it'll be a lot harder to come back. Anyone who goes abroad probably gets an automatic -20 on the USMLE Step 1 just by going abroad. Its like making yourself an ORM voluntarily, why would you do that? On top of that for the Caribbean schools, the top residency programs won't accept them no matter how well they do.

Programs in Eastern and Southern Europe pay nothing near what American physicians earn, so if you did get citizenship and decided to practice there, it wouldn't pay very well, you'll also likely be using inferior equipment and have trouble getting research funding.

No. Just no.

#1 If you get a 240 on your Step 1, you got a 240 on your Step 1. It doesn't matter what school you go to. It is your score.
#2 The biggest issue with Caribbean students is that they aren't very good. There is generally a reason they didn't get into a USMD program. Layer on 'meh' education (or piss poor education depending where you go) and you don't have a good product. Every once in a while, someone makes it through and into a pretty decent residency. Why? Because they are in the mold of a good USMD, not the average Caribbean grad.

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@Yazo the students that come from other countries and end up in residencies are the best of the best. They are the best students and we attempt to select out the best at functioning in the hospital as well. It isn't some magical route that circumvents getting an MD here. It will not make life easier and in many instances make it more difficult.

 

[puppylatte]

It's not the same amount of money.

Consultants in England and Ireland make around 150,000 (GBP or Euros, respectively). But before you run to google to convert the currency into USD, realize that it takes 6 years to become a consultant in England and around 9 years in Ireland (for things like Paeds and GP). Also, the tax rate in Ireland is like 50%. Your take home pay as an intern in Ireland would be about 2300 Euros a month (this is including overtime). As a consultant, it would be around 6000. They are taxed like crazy. In addition, they have a lot of African doctors that do things like read X-Rays upside down[1]. These incompetent doctors get hired because there is a massive shortage due to all the Irish grads moving to Australia for a better life and higher pay.

[1] http://www.independent.ie/irish-new...d-xray-upsidedown-inquiry-hears-29575831.html

 

[Yazo]

Thanks for the input, guys.
I really do appreciate it, helping me make this HS -> Uni transition.

 

[Medstart108]

No. Just no.

#1 If you get a 240 on your Step 1, you got a 240 on your Step 1. It doesn't matter what school you go to. It is your score.
#2 The biggest issue with Caribbean students is that they aren't very good. There is generally a reason they didn't get into a USMD program. Layer on 'meh' education (or piss poor education depending where you go) and you don't have a good product. Every once in a while, someone makes it through and into a pretty decent residency. Why? Because they are in the mold of a good USMD, not the average Caribbean grad.

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@Yazo the students that come from other countries and end up in residencies are the best of the best. They are the best students and we attempt to select out the best at functioning in the hospital as well. It isn't some magical route that circumvents getting an MD here. It will not make life easier and in many instances make it more difficult.

You get 240 on your Step 1 but don't think that a US IMGs from a Polish school with a 240 will be treated like a US MD grad with a 240. Most likely, you would need a higher Step 1 score like 20 points higher to be considered in the same light, to overcome the concerns about the medical education there. I don't mean they literally take 20 points off your Step 1 because you are an IMG, I mean they figuratively want more from a IMG over a US MD grad and I used Step 1 as an example.

 

[mimelim]

As someone that reads residency applications in an extremely competitive field at a competitive program in a major city, that is not true. A 240 is a 240. The issue isn't the medical education elsewhere. Our job is to train you. Whatever you got out of med school is a bonus. The issue is everything else. Visas, language, culture, common sense etc. That is what makes being an IMG harder.

 

[DermViser]

As someone that reads residency applications in an extremely competitive field at a competitive program in a major city, that is not true. A 240 is a 240. The issue isn't the medical education elsewhere. Our job is to train you. Whatever you got out of med school is a bonus. The issue is everything else. Visas, language, culture, common sense etc. That is what makes being an IMG harder.

I would think the quality of the medical education received abroad is in fact an issue.