SUNY Upstate Warning

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Justiceforall2013

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Avoid this school at all costs especially if you are a minority. There is no support for the students. The schools motto is "students first", what is should really be is "money first". Their former president (David Smith) had to resign for illegally padding his pay. This school lies about their attrition rates and they are constantly dismissing students even in their 3rd and 4th yrs. They do not care about the loans you have accrued. If you have a choice between this school vs going somewhere else, do your self a favor and do not go to SUNY Upstate. You will regret it!
 
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Troll-dolls-640x480.jpg
 
Oo Cipher oO said:
What challenges do minorities face at SUNY that others would not? Why were they dismissing students? More information is needed in order to be a better warning because right now you just sound bitter about something.
Click to expand...

No one is bitter here just passing on the Information. Also there is a huge article coming out sometime next week about SUNY Upstate. It will explain things in more depth. 🙂
 
@Justiceforall2013 , none of this is new information, which is why you are coming off overly dramatic. Way to blow the whistle champ. Also, it is in extremely poor taste to publicly disparage your own institution.

NontradCA said:
Why even make the thread if you're not going to elaborate?
Click to expand...
🤣🤣🤣😆😆😆
 
Dern yankees can't do nothin' right.

I'm assuming you go there. Kind of unprofessional to bash your school like that. "That" meaning in such a dramatic many !!!! kind of way.

EDIT: lol. OP took out the exclamation marks.
EDIT: OP put an exclamation mark back in. Lol. People can see when you edit, OP.
 
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Justiceforall2013 said:
Avoid this school at all costs especially if you are a minority. There is no support for the students. The schools motto is "students first", what is should really be is "money first". Their former president (David Smith) had to resign for illegally padding his pay. This school lies about their attrition rates and they are constantly dismissing students even in their 3rd and 4th yrs. They do not care about the loans you have accrued. If you have a choice between this school vs going somewhere else, do your self a favor and do not go to SUNY Upstate. You will regret it!
Click to expand...

SUNY Upstate is in Syracuse. For most of us, that means if we have a choice, we're going elsewhere anyway.

I was invited to interview here, but withdrew my application (at all schools with MMI interviews) after receiving an acceptance elsewhere.
 
wiloghby said:
SUNY Upstate is in Syracuse. For most of us, that means if we have a choice, we're going elsewhere anyway.

I was invited to interview here, but withdrew my application (at all schools with MMI interviews) after receiving an acceptance elsewhere.
Click to expand...

I didn't get in here, but I interviewed a few months ago, and I was thoroughly impressed by the school. The dorms are unbelievably gorgeous (think luxe apartment style, private kitchens, etc), huge windows, gym and laundry on-site. Much different than the jail-like living conditions you will find at most schools. The students and faculty were all really cool and friendly. I went in not expecting much (I mean come on, Syracuse?) but I left with the feeling like this school is a great place.
 
J Senpai said:
Dern yankees can't do nothin' right.

I'm assuming you go there. Kind of unprofessional to bash your school like that. "That" meaning in such a dramatic many !!!! kind of way.

EDIT: lol. OP took out the exclamation marks.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure that it is fair to conclude that without more details. The OP may have legitimate reasons for feeling that way. I don't think bashing your school in and of itself, if it is accurate criticism, is unprofessional.
 
I genuinely appreciate having the opinion expressed. Many pre meds will jump through whatever mental hoops necessary to maintain their rose colored glasses regarding medical school administrations and the like.
 
Upstate had a cheating scandal within the last several years that placed it on probation by the LCME. That was a pretty big deal in NY.
 
knv2u said:
I'm not sure that it is fair to conclude that without more details. The OP may have legitimate reasons for feeling that way. I don't think bashing your school in and of itself, if it is accurate criticism, is unprofessional.
Click to expand...
They way he had criticized it, before adjusting his post, was, as I said, dramatic and exclamatory. Criticism is very important, but going about it in a way that most would interpret as bashing would be professionally irresponsible.
 
QuinnTheEskimo said:
I didn't get in here, but I interviewed a few months ago, and I was thoroughly impressed by the school. The dorms are unbelievably gorgeous (think luxe apartment style, private kitchens, etc), huge windows, gym and laundry on-site. Much different than the jail-like living conditions you will find at most schools. The students and faculty were all really cool and friendly. I went in not expecting much (I mean come on, Syracuse?) but I left with the feeling like this school is a great place.
Click to expand...

This is true, I have heard the dorms are very new (I believe they were added under the the last president). I really have nothing against the school as a place of learning or the facilities... but I don't think I'd survive 4 years in Syracuse.
 
Justiceforall2013 said:
Avoid this school at all costs especially if you are a minority. There is no support for the students. The schools motto is "students first", what is should really be is "money first". Their former president (David Smith) had to resign for illegally padding his pay. This school lies about their attrition rates and they are constantly dismissing students even in their 3rd and 4th yrs. They do not care about the loans you have accrued. If you have a choice between this school vs going somewhere else, do your self a favor and do not go to SUNY Upstate. You will regret it!
Click to expand...

Ok yeah, now tell us how you really feel!
 
Justiceforall2013 said:
Avoid this school at all costs especially if you are a minority. There is no support for the students. The schools motto is "students first", what is should really be is "money first". Their former president (David Smith) had to resign for illegally padding his pay. This school lies about their attrition rates and they are constantly dismissing students even in their 3rd and 4th yrs. They do not care about the loans you have accrued. If you have a choice between this school vs going somewhere else, do your self a favor and do not go to SUNY Upstate. You will regret it!
Click to expand...

You'll understand if I have a mild suspicion that you're not a medical student at Upstate but actually a wait listed candidate there?
 
Justiceforall2013 said:
Avoid this school at all costs especially if you are a minority. There is no support for the students. The schools motto is "students first", what is should really be is "money first". Their former president (David Smith) had to resign for illegally padding his pay. This school lies about their attrition rates and they are constantly dismissing students even in their 3rd and 4th yrs. They do not care about the loans you have accrued. If you have a choice between this school vs going somewhere else, do your self a favor and do not go to SUNY Upstate. You will regret it!
Click to expand...


You look absolutely ridiculously when being overly sensational like a tabloid. If you have problems/complaints with your institution, bring it up in a more professional manner.

Also if you don't want to elaborate, then don't make a thread about this.
 
QuinnTheEskimo said:
I didn't get in here, but I interviewed a few months ago, and I was thoroughly impressed by the school. The dorms are unbelievably gorgeous (think luxe apartment style, private kitchens, etc), huge windows, gym and laundry on-site. Much different than the jail-like living conditions you will find at most schools. The students and faculty were all really cool and friendly. I went in not expecting much (I mean come on, Syracuse?) but I left with the feeling like this school is a great place.
Click to expand...

SUNY Upstate was my first acceptance this cycle. Although I won't be attending Upstate due to it being far from home, having interviewed there and spending a night with a student host, I left with a similar feeling to you: impressed.

The new Geneva tower dorms are amazing, the school seems to be well-maintained, and the administration seems to be relatively receptive (they are implementing new curriculum changes constantly).

The OP's defamation without hard evidence is quite uncalled for. Post when you have proof.
 
Yeah, Syracuse is crappy because of the snow and gray winter skies. I'm an undergrad in the city at the moment. But as a resident of Syracuse, I would think that I would've heard news that big already. So yeah, where is that big article, OP? I'm still going to be applying there as my ideal choice, so your defamation is futile.
 
LuciusVorenus said:
700k for a 6 bedroom/6000 sqft/~1 acre lot house?? Makes me realize how expensive is is here :/
Click to expand...

That actually sounds cheap to me for a house that size. Then again, COL is a little high where I live currently.
 
MedWonk said:
That actually sounds cheap to me for a house that size. Then again, COL is a little high where I live currently.
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I think that's what he was trying to point out. The house market in Syracuse is in fact very cheap.
 
MedWonk said:
That actually sounds cheap to me for a house that size. Then again, COL is a little high where I live currently.
Click to expand...

No that's what I mean! Where I live that'd probably go for a couple million.
 
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2011/10/upstates_medical_school_may_be.html

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2013/06/national_accreditation_group_t.html

Good morning everyone. Please take it easy on the OP. This school was a very bad place and was an embarrassment to medicine. There was a huge scandal in 2012 and the LCME placed them squarely on probation. I say "was" because they did a lot of restructuring and changing and revamped the education paradigm, so I know this are a lot better. But they were just taken off in the summer of 2013, after I submitted my AMCAS so I didn't apply.

I doubt everything is perfect only a year after.
 
Again, I cannot comment on anything happening right now at the institution. Making claims about any school that are not substantiated by evidence is misleading and doesn't really help anything. But, as I stated before, the school just came off of LCME probation about 6-7 months ago due to the following reasons from the LCME.
  • Objectives of the medical school are not consistently used to guide curriculum.
  • School’s objectives are not consistently stated in outcomes-based terms that allow assessment of student progress.
  • Some clinical courses in medical specialties do not consistently apply the same criteria to all students.
  • No process to ensure the school’s objectives are made known to students, residents and faculty.
  • Comparable education experiences and assessment across all instruction sites do not exist in some courses.
  • Students in some courses do not get final grades on a timely basis.
  • No system to ensure formal feedback to students in some courses.
  • No effective authority for the overall design, management and evaluation of a coherent and coordinated curriculum.
  • Dean does not have authority to modify curriculum.
  • No faculty committee effectively monitoring course content to ensure educational objectives are met.
  • Different clinical requirements at regional campuses and inadequate oversight of the rural training program.
  • Different numbers of credit hours required for graduation at the Syracuse and Binghamton campuses.
  • Little evidence student feedback is used to improve the educational program.
  • School has a lower than national average student awareness of mistreatment policies and an above average percentage of students reporting mistreatment.
  • More than 100 fourth-year students shared answers on online quizzes or were aware of such activity.
 
Espadaleader said:
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2011/10/upstates_medical_school_may_be.html

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2013/06/national_accreditation_group_t.html

Good morning everyone. Please take it easy on the OP. This school was a very bad place and was an embarrassment to medicine. There was a huge scandal in 2012 and the LCME placed them squarely on probation. I say "was" because they did a lot of restructuring and changing and revamped the education paradigm, so I know this are a lot better. But they were just taken off in the summer of 2013, after I submitted my AMCAS so I didn't apply.

I doubt everything is perfect only a year after.
Click to expand...

Espadaleader said:
Again, I cannot comment on anything happening right now at the institution. Making claims about any school that are not substantiated by evidence is misleading and doesn't really help anything. But, as I stated before, the school just came off of LCME probation about 6-7 months ago due to the following reasons from the LCME.
  • Objectives of the medical school are not consistently used to guide curriculum.
  • School’s objectives are not consistently stated in outcomes-based terms that allow assessment of student progress.
  • Some clinical courses in medical specialties do not consistently apply the same criteria to all students.
  • No process to ensure the school’s objectives are made known to students, residents and faculty.
  • Comparable education experiences and assessment across all instruction sites do not exist in some courses.
  • Students in some courses do not get final grades on a timely basis.
  • No system to ensure formal feedback to students in some courses.
  • No effective authority for the overall design, management and evaluation of a coherent and coordinated curriculum.
  • Dean does not have authority to modify curriculum.
  • No faculty committee effectively monitoring course content to ensure educational objectives are met.
  • Different clinical requirements at regional campuses and inadequate oversight of the rural training program.
  • Different numbers of credit hours required for graduation at the Syracuse and Binghamton campuses.
  • Little evidence student feedback is used to improve the educational program.
  • School has a lower than national average student awareness of mistreatment policies and an above average percentage of students reporting mistreatment.
  • More than 100 fourth-year students shared answers on online quizzes or were aware of such activity.
Click to expand...
A very bad place and an embarrassment to medicine? Upstate has had a higher match rate than the national average almost every year for a decade despite having entering classes with stats below average. They have consistently shown that they produce high quality medical students despite not starting with the strongest groups.

The reasons they were placed on probation were mostly bureaucratic things that had not yet affected the quality of the education to any significant degree. They had the potential to become bigger problems that would have made a difference for the students, but the probation prevented this from happening.
 
Well, I'm hopeful that whatever problems they have will be resolved by the time a apply after my gap year (around 2017). 👍 Especially if what V5RED says is true. I'm not worried about it. I've really only heard good things about the school.
 
Espadaleader said:
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2011/10/upstates_medical_school_may_be.html

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2013/06/national_accreditation_group_t.html

Good morning everyone. Please take it easy on the OP. This school was a very bad place and was an embarrassment to medicine. There was a huge scandal in 2012 and the LCME placed them squarely on probation. I say "was" because they did a lot of restructuring and changing and revamped the education paradigm, so I know this are a lot better. But they were just taken off in the summer of 2013, after I submitted my AMCAS so I didn't apply.

I doubt everything is perfect only a year after.
Click to expand...


As a New York state resident, I would still attend Upstate over paying 2x as much at most out of state schools or private ones.

Plus, SUNY Upstate is one of the oldest medical schools around. If anything, their slip up with the LCME is only going to make this public institution better.
 
V5RED said:
A very bad place and an embarrassment to medicine? Upstate has had a higher match rate than the national average almost every year for a decade despite having entering classes with stats below average. They have consistently shown that they produce high quality medical students despite not starting with the strongest groups.

The reasons they were placed on probation were mostly bureaucratic things that had not yet affected the quality of the education to any significant degree. They had the potential to become bigger problems that would have made a difference for the students, but the probation prevented this from happening.
Click to expand...

Listen. I am only being objective. The fact that 100 seniors cheated made it clear that these problems were making it to a student level. Granted, these problems have been remedied and SUNY Upstate is probably better than ever before after the restructuring but their is no denying that that what transpired was an embarrassment to medicine and to the school and to the hundreds of extremely bright students that had their reputation tarnished because of events out of their control.

“Our students exceed the national
average in licensure examinations and residency
placements. While the LCME recommendation
is very disappointing, I believe we will continue
to attract highly qualified and motivated students
to our college.” Dean of the school

I have a lot of friends at Upstate and know a lot of fine doctors there. They are awesome. That doesn't mean the school didn't embarrass the SUNY system though. Of course they did, but they are better than ever.
www.upstate.edu/medalumni/alumni_resources/alum_journal/sp12.pdf
 
iceman55 said:
As a New York state resident, I would still attend Upstate over paying 2x as much at most out of state schools or private ones.

Plus, SUNY Upstate is one of the oldest medical schools around. If anything, their slip up with the LCME is only going to make this public institution better.
Click to expand...

I agree.
 
Espadaleader said:
Listen. I am only being objective. The fact that 100 seniors cheated made it clear that these problems were making it to a student level. Granted, these problems have been remedied and SUNY Upstate is probably better than ever before after the restructuring but their is no denying that that what transpired was an embarrassment to medicine and to the school and to the hundreds of extremely bright students that had their reputation tarnished because of events out of their control.
Click to expand...

Groupwork on an online quiz is an embarrassment to medicine and reputations are tarnished? That's a bit of a harsh statement. The point of medical school is to learn. Going through questions is a way to test your knowledge and figure out what you need to study.
 
No. These 14 reasons cited by the LCME are:
  • Objectives of the medical school are not consistently used to guide curriculum.
  • School’s objectives are not consistently stated in outcomes-based terms that allow assessment of student progress.
  • Some clinical courses in medical specialties do not consistently apply the same criteria to all students.
  • No process to ensure the school’s objectives are made known to students, residents and faculty.
  • Comparable education experiences and assessment across all instruction sites do not exist in some courses.
  • Students in some courses do not get final grades on a timely basis.
  • No system to ensure formal feedback to students in some courses.
  • No effective authority for the overall design, management and evaluation of a coherent and coordinated curriculum.
  • Dean does not have authority to modify curriculum.
  • No faculty committee effectively monitoring course content to ensure educational objectives are met.
  • Different clinical requirements at regional campuses and inadequate oversight of the rural training program.
  • Different numbers of credit hours required for graduation at the Syracuse and Binghamton campuses.
  • Little evidence student feedback is used to improve the educational program.
  • School has a lower than national average student awareness of mistreatment policies and an above average percentage of students reporting mistreatment.
What the students did were the result of the administration. The imagine what the students went through in this environment. I don't blame them.
 
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