Surg path fellowships

[deschutes]

Jumping ahead... (I get a little weary of interview talk!)

My understanding is that surg path can be done as a 4th-year fellowship in an AP/CP track, but would not count towards earning subspecialty ABP certification - is this right, or is this program-dependent? Also, is it usually done at the home (i.e. residency) institution?

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[yaah]

Jumping ahead... (I get a little weary of interview talk!)

My understanding is that surg path can be done as a 4th-year fellowship in an AP/CP track, but would not count towards earning subspecialty ABP certification - is this right, or is this program-dependent? Also, is it usually done at the home (i.e. residency) institution?

The more senior residents are still on the 5 year requirement, and so things have yet to change a lot. A lot of current residents are doing their 5th year as a fellowship at the home institution. Many, however, go somewhere else for the 5th year. When the fourth year residents start to be the ones who are only required to do 4 years I am not sure how things will change, but since the 5th year will now be an option, many may look for jobs at that point.

Ap/CP combined is 4 years, and the 4th year is not a fellowship. It is still required rotations and some electives. You often will do electives in which you act like a fellow, but not for the whole year.

I am not sure about your subspecialty certification question.

 

[stormjen]

The University of Minnesota told me that they allow the fourth year to be used for a fellowship. I don't know about certification.

 

[yaah]

The University of Minnesota told me that they allow the fourth year to be used for a fellowship. I don't know about certification.

Well shut my mouth. Perhaps they use some of the required surg path rotations as part of this fellowship. However, since there are 36 months of required rotations in an AP/CP elective, doing a fellowship in your 4th year would mean you have minimal elective time during the rest of your training.

 

[RyMcQ]

The rule from the board is that any boarded fellowship will not be allowed as part of the AP/CP years. This was more of a credentialing year issue before, but it will apparently continue to be an issue for 4-year residencies. Anyway, Dr. Hartman of the American Board of Pathology stated unequivocally at Residents' Forum a couple of years back that there will be no "double dipping". Residents will continue to be able to do a surgical pathology fellowship because there is no board certification for it. You will not be able to do a hemepath or cytopath fellowship for the 4th year, at least not one that will make you eligible for subspecialty boards.

 

[deschutes]

What is the general motivation behind doing a 4th-year surg path fellowship vs. a whole year of electives (which I am guessing would possibly incorporate surg path)?

 

[stormjen]

Yes, to clarify, U of MN told me you could do a surg path fellowship in the fourth year, not any fellowship.

 

[GreatPumpkin]

Surg path is not a boarded fellowship. So that is why you may be able to do it as a 4th year. That is why I can do it as my 5th year (last of 5 year folks).

 

[deschutes]

Surg path is not a boarded fellowship. So that is why you may be able to do it as a 4th year. That is why I can do it as my 5th year (last of 5 year folks).

I am inferring that probably means that it can't be done "away", since the funding would have to come from the residency institution.

 

[Doctor B.]

I think it can be done away just like any other fellowship.

 

[Mrbojangles]

So which fellowships in pathology are boarded? And boarded meaning that there is a test at the end of training?

And what does it exactly mean if a fellowship is not ACGME accredited? Does the ACGME basicly clear programs for fellowship training based on case load numbers? Does it matter if you chose to do a fellowship that is or is not ACGME accredited and does it affect job marketability?

Thanks in advance!

 

[pathdawg]

So which fellowships in pathology are boarded? And boarded meaning that there is a test at the end of training?

And what does it exactly mean if a fellowship is not ACGME accredited? Does the ACGME basicly clear programs for fellowship training based on case load numbers? Does it matter if you chose to do a fellowship that is or is not ACGME accredited and does it affect job marketability?

Thanks in advance!

So-called "boarded" fellowships are those subspecialties in which one is eligible to be board certified after completion. For example, after completing a fellowship in cytopath, hemepath, dermpath, transfusion med, or any other such training, you can sit for that subspecialty board certification exam. No such examination is offered for surgical pathology fellowships (probably because a surgpath board exam would pretty much be exactly like the AP boards).
A surgical pathology fellowship is a good idea because the extra experience would be beneficial before becoming an attending pathologist. However, one cannot be board certified in surgical pathology.
The debate for many (now that there will not be a 5th year requirement) will be whether to do a surgpath fellowship or one (like cytopath or heme) in which you can be board certified. Of course, one can do both (or neither).

 

[Mrbojangles]

So-called "boarded" fellowships are those subspecialties in which one is eligible to be board certified after completion. For example, after completing a fellowship in cytopath, hemepath, dermpath, transfusion med, or any other such training, you can sit for that subspecialty board certification exam. No such examination is offered for surgical pathology fellowships (probably because a surgpath board exam would pretty much be exactly like the AP boards).
A surgical pathology fellowship is a good idea because the extra experience would be beneficial before becoming an attending pathologist. However, one cannot be board certified in surgical pathology.
The debate for many (now that there will not be a 5th year requirement) will be whether to do a surgpath fellowship or one (like cytopath or heme) in which you can be board certified. Of course, one can do both (or neither).

Hey pathdawg,
Thanks for the reply. For a fellowship program, is being accredited by the ACGME the same as being boarded? If not what kind of status does ACGME accreditation give for a fellowship program? Is a non ACGME accredited fellowship seen as a non formal post-residency "additional training"? I'm kind of confused becayse at one of my interviews one of the attendings said that their program has not received accreditation for their surg path fellowship because they haven't tackled the paperwork yet? Thanks.