Please don't take this personally PW. I post this because I'd like to stimulate discussion on this issue, because I think it deserves more discussion. Your post reflects to me the mainstream MD/PhD thinking, and as such serves as a good jumping post.
PostalWookie said:
Personally, I'd never go to an MD/PhD surgeon who did any serious research. Surgery requires constant practice, and for most conditions, the outcome really depends on the experience of the surgeon, so I think it's pretty much impossible to do both things well.
I've heard the same said for any kind of doctor, including medicine. How is an internal medicine doc supposed to keep up on his skills and the latest advances if he only does it a month or such a year? I'd never want to be the patient of that doctor!
I hear the surgery research MD/PhD wannabes advocating for something like a day or two a week of surgery and the rest research. This fits into the MD/PhD dream propogated by most PDs of 80%-90% research, 10%-20% clinical. But, somehow according to your post it's okay when some fields of medicine do it, but not others. Maybe it's just that oncology or rheumatology aren't as complicated as surgery? In reality, what program directors are talking about you doing is super-specializing yourself in any field so you can only do it 10-20% of your time. I don't see why you can't do that in surgery, and some people do. The question is why only a proportion of people in a given specialty actually end up doing research. That's a more complicated question, and you can't just write it off as "Well surgeons just can't do research because they have to keep up their skills".
I'm heading into Radiology, and even here at one of the most academic places there is, I'm consistantly told no future employer is ever going to give me 90% protected research time, and even the 80/20 split would be very unlikely (impossible in some minds). It would depend on me taking a gigantic pay cut over my academic clinical colleagues and becoming successful in basic science very quickly. Why is this? Supposedly they wouldn't trust me to read neuro MR/CT if I didn't do it at least 50% of the time. I call BS. Radiology just supports the hospital with all the money it generates so Radiology attendings have to do plenty of clinical work. Where I'm at, at least 50% clinical is what I've seen unless you are big name and take on administrative duties as well. I bring all this up because I don't think this whole issue is as simple as "Well some specialties are good for research and others aren't."
The vast majority of IM, peds, pathology, neurology, and psychiatry docs can't bring in nearly the clinical revenue radiology and surgery docs would bring in (just as limitations of their subspecialties), so it doesn't hurt the departmental bottom line (as badly) for one of their docs to do research. Not to mention that you're not going to take a big salary cut personally, because most of the "research" specialties don't pay will to begin with.
I'm beginning to think that these sorts of financial decisions drive most of what's really going on around here. Think about it for yourself. When you're 40 and have a couple kids, are you going to turn down $250k/year to go make $100k/year? But what if your only option is to make $100k/year, are you more likely to pick research then? I always hear "I could go make more money if I really wanted to". Yeah, a huge switch from academics to private practice. Many of these specialties in the exact same place your salary is going to change drastically based on what you do with your time. Are you willing to work 80 hours a week instead of 50 to keep going with research? If you're a Radiologist how can you not just leave the department if your grants don't get funded, and have your salary and vacation time tripled (this happened recently here)? When you're program director and they're looking on you to support the hospital which is barely in the black, are you going to hire MDs to do research in a time of very uncertain grant funding? What if your department is a big money loser anyway? Does it still matter then?
I think our program director was pretty disappointed when he found out 3 MD/PhDs matched into surgery this year.
Why? Was he disappointed at some people I talked to going into more traditional MD/PhD fields who had no desire to continue doing research? I think it would be pretty narrow minded to write off anyone who doesn't go into certain specialties as not going to continue research. Most MD/PhDs will NOT go on to do mostly basic science research. Instead, they will continue to do a broad spectrum of clinical, translational, and basic research with clinical practice. Are they disappointed at all of them? Surgeons never go on to do clinical, translational, or basic research? I can give you examples of all 3. I'm not even sure that the assumptions about who does research by specialty chosen for residency are true anymore. I'd like to see data breaking down the fates of MD/PhD graduates by specialty, and NOT JUST whether they're in an academic department which tells you pretty much nothing about what they do in life.
One of the biggest name basic science researchers here, an MD/PhD who is very well regarded by the program, recently told me in private that if he was to do it all over again he'd still do 100% basic science research, but he'd go into a field that wasn't oversaturated with researchers like his IM subspecialty. He suggested maybe Urology or Dermatology, because he could have a bigger impact there. Maybe those three students were listening to him...