surgery lifestyle

[ucsfer]

Hi,
I'm sure this might have been posted elsewhere, but really couldn't find it.. i'm really interested in surgery, but don't know if I can maintain the lifestyle required during the two-month rotation I just went through for my entire career. However, I don't know what the lifestyle is really like for attendings - both in academia and community hospitals (ala Kaiser). How many hours do they work/week? How often are they on call?
Also, what is a surgical career in a community hospital like? Can they/do they do research?
thanks a lot!

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[ucsfer]

btw, i was speaking specifically of general surgery in the above post.

 

[Leukocyte]

As far as I know, GS is NOT one of those "life style" specialties.

I usually compare GS to IM (both very demanding, and both share similar patient populations)-

IM is the general MEDICAL management of patients.

GS is the general SURGICAL management of patients.

 

[DoctorDoom]

You can tailor your workload according to your desire for income, ambition and other factors. Attending lifestyles in general surgery can vary quite a bit based on size of practice, location, and degree of specialization/preponderance of surgical diagnoses and disease types. You can do some clinical research in community settings. Plenty of options available, and it won't necessarily be as demanding as residency. But it's no walk in the park.

 

[ucsfer]

So .. does no walk in the park mean 60 hrs a week? 70? 80?
Also, how bad is ones lifestyle during fellowship? If it's the same as surgery, it seems terrible to have such a life for 9 straight years (7 for the residency and 2 for fellowship)!

 

[HiddenTruth]

So .. does no walk in the park mean 60 hrs a week? 70? 80?
Also, how bad is ones lifestyle during fellowship? If it's the same as surgery, it seems terrible to have such a life for 9 straight years (7 for the residency and 2 for fellowship)!

well 7 yrs gen surg res. is only at the big academic institutes--most are 5 i believe. please advise if i am wrong. Thanks

 

[DoctorDoom]

So .. does no walk in the park mean 60 hrs a week? 70? 80?
Also, how bad is ones lifestyle during fellowship? If it's the same as surgery, it seems terrible to have such a life for 9 straight years (7 for the residency and 2 for fellowship)!

Like I said it really depends, but 60 is about right. Much more of your time will be spent in office or clinic type settings than during residency. You won't have much ICU exposure as an attending if you don't desire it.

Fellowship may be worse than residency, especially nowadays in surgery. When I first went through residency the hours were longer but even then fellows dealt with higher acuity and higher patient volumes. You deal with less scut though, sometimes.

Ultimately lifestle issues will not be answered by anyone but yourself.

The 7 year general surgery residencies include 2 years of research. Those are pretty rare. Most Gs residencies are indeed 5 years.

 

[apma77]

the words lifestyle and gen surg dont usually go hand in hand
most gen surgeons these days are VERY bitter bout their high malpractice and comparible low salaries.
after 5-7 yrs of training and working 110+ hrs/week who wants to make 150k?

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

maybe I'm ill informed here, but I doubt there are surgeons making 150k a year, especially not one that works 110 hours a week.

 

[Fab5Hill33]

I would agree the the above post... there is no surgeon out there working 110 hours and making 150K. Thats just ridiculous.

 

[Bovie9]

yeah, I heard most general surgeons make about 250, and the hours tend to run in the 50-60 range. I also heard that we will see a huge void in the number of general surgeons in the very near future... most GS are set to retire in the next 5-10 years, and the vast majority of graduating residents enter fellowships. This should markedly reduce the "supply" and increase the "demand," and we all know what that means!

 

[ucsfer]

This may be wrong, but I thought that gen surgery as is has almost disappeared as nobody really does everything (hernias, vascular, trauma etc) anymore - everyone is subspecialized. So I'm not sure I get how the fact that residents all do fellowships matters ..

Also I've heard that the amount charged for each procedure in gen surg has bottomed out and that history in other specialties hasn't shown that when that happens the amount insurances, medicare etc pay doesn't go up no matter what happens with supply/demand .. what do you guys think?

 

[ucsfer]

bump

 

[shag]

Also I've heard that the amount charged for each procedure in gen surg has bottomed out and that history in other specialties hasn't shown that when that happens the amount insurances, medicare etc pay doesn't go up no matter what happens with supply/demand .. what do you guys think?

Welcome to the world of pseudo-socialized medicine

 

[runnermoore]

There was an article in JAMA last summer or fall that had statistics on work hours and salary. The average general surgeon worked 60 hours and took home $265K.