Surgery sub-i; CT vs PRS?

[brulaz]

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US MS3 gal here, applying Gen Surg in 2017. I have a question regarding surgery sub-i selection. I already have 3 other sub-is scheduled this summer (SICU, MIS, General).
-Since my schedule allows me to, would you recommend a 4th surg rotation? Trying to overcome a low Step 1 and bad 3rd year grades with (hopefully) multiple Honors in advanced Surg rotations (and high Step 2), all before ERAS opens.
-If so, would you recommend CT or PRS? Both sound equally interesting and fun to me.

Both fields now have their own integrated residencies so not sure how relevant it will be for my application (assuming that I am able to Honor either one). Also, I don't want programs to think that I am dual applying (which I am obviously not because 1) I want to do GS; 2) I can't with my grades anyway).

Thanks

 

[ThoracicGuy]

US MS3 gal here, applying Gen Surg in 2017. I have a question regarding surgery sub-i selection. I already have 3 other sub-is scheduled this summer (SICU, MIS, General).
-Since my schedule allows me to, would you recommend a 4th surg rotation? Trying to overcome a low Step 1 and bad 3rd year grades with (hopefully) multiple Honors in advanced Surg rotations (and high Step 2), all before ERAS opens.
-If so, would you recommend CT or PRS? Both sound equally interesting and fun to me.

Both fields now have their own integrated residencies so not sure how relevant it will be for my application (assuming that I am able to Honor either one). Also, I don't want programs to think that I am dual applying (which I am obviously not because 1) I want to do GS; 2) I can't with my grades anyway).

Thanks

If you are looking to apply to general surgery residencies, I'd stick with an area of general surgery instead of CT or PRS. Consider Colorectal, Hepatobiliary, Trauma, or Endocrine depending on what you have available.

 

[Ceusina]

Just making sure I understand your timeline - you have 3 surgery Sub-Is already scheduled for this summer (SICU, minimally invasive surgery, and gen surg). June, July, August?

When do you plan to take Step 2? Although Step 2 is typically easier to do better on that Step 1, it still takes a decent amount of dedicated prep work/study time. My Step 1 score was only average (not SDN average - real life average) and I studied for a solid 3 weeks (for Step 2). It paid off and my score (percentile wise) improved quite a bit. If you want your Step 2 score available when you apply, I'd recommend taking it early summer (June through mid July).

Depending on the flexibility of your 4th year schedule, I'd do something like this:
-June = Step 2 studying (take Step 2 three weeks into the month, then enjoy a week off to work on ERAS stuff and relax - you're going to appreciate that week when you're working at your max potential for 80+ hours a week during your Sub-Is)
-July = Surgery Sub-I #1
-August = Surgery Sub-I #2
-September = Surgery Sub-I #3
-October = Surgery Sub-I #4 (last Sub-I, as Nov/Dec will busy with interviews)

The purpose of your first two Sub-Is is to get LORs and face time with programs you're potentially interested in matching at. Get your letters in July/August. Make sure the Sub-Is you have scheduled those months are with people you want writing your letters (program directors/chairmen/senior faculty). Honestly, I'd just do two gen surg rotations during those months at different hospitals, or if you want to stay at the same place, do one gen surg rotation and another rotation that has A LOT of contact with the gen surg services/attendings (at my hospital, the SICU is run by the cardiothoracic surgery folk and the intesivists - the gen surg attendings (including surg onc/hepatobiliary, colorectal, endocrine, trauma) spend almost zero time there (their big belly surgery patients go to our trauma ICU) and gen surg residents spend little time there too - so not a great Sub-I for someone interested in the general surgery residency - possibly my program specific). Just make you're rotating with the RIGHT people during your rotations - just because it's a surgical rotation does NOT mean it'll benefit you in the application game.

The purpose of subsequent Sub-Is is to get some face time with programs you're interested in (the time to get LORs will have passed). Again, I recommend only doing rotations with the general surgery folk. As someone with a less than stellar application (not judging - mine was too and I successfully matched) you want programs to get to know you - and know that there's more to you than what they see on paper.

I'd scratch the CT and PRS rotations. I'd consider doing them during electives later in the year (once interview season is over) if you REALLY want some exposure to those fields. But honestly, after several months of Sub-Is/application and interview season/stress of the Match, you might want some cush rotations to finish out the year - just a suggestion...

Good luck!

 

[CTFellowMD]

I'd scratch the CT and PRS rotations. I'd consider doing them during electives later in the year (once interview season is over) if you REALLY want some exposure to those fields. But honestly, after several months of Sub-Is/application and interview season/stress of the Match, you might want some cush rotations to finish out the year - just a suggestion...

I agree with all of the above. Take some time off in July to get through Step 2 and unwind a little from 3rd year. 3 months of surgical Sub-I's will be more than enough. Don't waste your time doing an additional Sub-I in PRS or CT unless you have a legitimate interest in it . I would recommend using your fourth year to do some rotations where you'll gain knowledge that you won't have the opportunity to obtain later on. Cardiology consult, radiology, ER... all are very useful for general surgery residency (and also normally don't have the worst schedule for a 4th year med student...)

 

[dynx]

I agree with all of the above. Take some time off in July to get through Step 2 and unwind a little from 3rd year. 3 months of surgical Sub-I's will be more than enough. Don't waste your time doing an additional Sub-I in PRS or CT unless you have a legitimate interest in it . I would recommend using your fourth year to do some rotations where you'll gain knowledge that you won't have the opportunity to obtain later on. Cardiology consult, radiology, ER... all are very useful for general surgery residency (and also normally don't have the worst schedule for a 4th year med student...)

Agree, rotate in the ER. Great schedule, especially when you dont show up on time. 4th year after match is your time, take advantage. rads was good schedule and comes in very useful in the future no matter what you do.
ER was great. My final evaluation said something like "Showed up late every day, one time mumbled something about car trouble and traffic" Low pass. See how annoying lazy people who dont put any effort into any thing is jerk faces? If only I'd known then how the ER abuses surgical residents I'd have tried to make the experience of my rotation even more annoying for them. So do this, learn from my mistakes, be the biggest pain in the ass student in the ER that you can be before the tables are turned during your residency.

 

[witzelsucht]

Agree, rotate in the ER. Great schedule, especially when you dont show up on time. 4th year after match is your time, take advantage. rads was good schedule and comes in very useful in the future no matter what you do.
ER was great. My final evaluation said something like "Showed up late every day, one time mumbled something about car trouble and traffic" Low pass. See how annoying lazy people who dont put any effort into any thing is jerk faces? If only I'd known then how the ER abuses surgical residents I'd have tried to make the experience of my rotation even more annoying for them. So do this, learn from my mistakes, be the biggest pain in the ass student in the ER that you can be before the tables are turned during your residency.

rofl. i suppose you would prefer it when ERs had a 'surgery side' and 'medicine side' and surgeon residents were resopnsible for fully 50% of everyone who walked in the door?

 

[dynx]

rofl. i suppose you would prefer it when ERs had a 'surgery side' and 'medicine side' and surgeon residents were resopnsible for fully 50% of everyone who walked in the door?

Wow you mean they used to be nice enough to group all the patients that had no work up or diagnosis together on one side of the ER? That would be awsome, could we go back to that? Probably got rid of that system cause it made it to obvious that the clerk at the front desk could essentially do the ER physicians job and just triage to surgery straight away when assigning bed placement.