Switching programs

[mwest]

I just started looking into transferring to another program closer to family and have gotten in touch with a few programs. However all but 1 program wanted to first get in touch with my program director before proceeding.
I have not even discussed this matter to my program yet, and I don't know if I should let them know before having an offer at hand. What if I don't get accepted by the other program for whatever reason? How have others done this?

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[Curious Biff]

Generally speaking, program directors do not want unhappy residents in their program whatever the reason for that unhappiness may be. I would approach your current PD and discuss with him/her whether or not it would be a good time to step out of your current program at the end of the academic year. This way, you'll have your answer about how it will be received. If you are in a pretty competitive program now, it won't be a problem filling your shoes.

The other programs want to contact your current program to make sure that the reasons for the transfer aren't performance or behavioral related. That's all. If they like you and are entertaining considering accepting you, then you should be okay so long as you're not running from anything.

This is primarily a professional issue to them. No one takes it personally, despite your fears. It's business. Think of it that way, and act that way when you have the discussion with your current PD. FWIW, this kinda thing happens all the time.

Biff

 

[mwest]

That sounds good but I am only interested in moving to a certain program in a certain location which makes it very complicated. I am not willing to move/transfer out just anywhere. So if this program can't give me an offer or assurance, I m finding it very difficult telling my current program. If the transfer does not work out, would they still renew my contract knowing that I tried to transfer out??? Where would that leave me?
No doubt I have had problems due to marital distance and things I don't like about this current program but I am not that miserable enough to quit residency altogether (esp after completing the hardest part-PGY1). This is different from what happens in the 'real-world' where people first get offers then announce their resignation. I don't think its very resident-friendly

 

[Jersey]

This is different from what happens in the 'real-world' where people first get offers then announce their resignation.

Believe me, chances are that in the real world, you're going to get checked out for any position with a lot of responsibility, too before they give you an offer.

 

[deleted87716]

If the transfer does not work out, would they still renew my contract knowing that I tried to transfer out??? Where would that leave me?

Sneaking around behind your PD's back isn't very professional, and likely won't be looked at favorably. Regardless of what happens, you'll be better off if you let him/her know what you're planning.

This is the "real world." Get used to it.

 

[thedrjojo]

(esp after completing the hardest part-PGY1).

Unfortunately, you will likely learn that while PGY1 is the crappiest and most BS year, and you are treated the worst, almost every resident/attending I have spoken with says that it just gets harder... gone are the SCUT work, the mindless tasks, and on comes responsibility and decision making, 24-7 home call, presenting M&M, stats, or whatever it is your specialty does, the longer, harder, more complex cases, etc... like the previous poster said, welcome to the real world.

 

[mwest]

Sneaking around behind your PD's back isn't very professional, and likely won't be looked at favorably. Regardless of what happens, you'll be better off if you let him/her know what you're planning.

This is the "real world." Get used to it.

Kindly watch what you are saying. Clearly you don't understand anything from a resident's perspective. Nobody is sneaking around here, at some point we start at researching options before making a decision & thats where I am at. Do you blurt out every thought or idea as it occurs to you before analyzing ?
Anyways I have a short time frame before I make this decision & tell my program in a matter of days and wanted to hear from people who have dealt with this. Not chastising from people who do not even get what I am saying.

 

[smq123]

Kindly watch what you are saying. Clearly you don't understand anything from a resident's perspective. Nobody is sneaking around here, at some point we start at researching options before making a decision & thats where I am at. Do you blurt out every thought or idea as it occurs to you before analyzing ?

Anyways I have a short time frame before I make this decision & tell my program in a matter of days and wanted to hear from people who have dealt with this. Not chastising from people who do not even get what I am saying.

To be fair, Blue Dog IS an FM attending....I'm sure he's seen your situation from both sides. And I'm willing to bet that he does have SOME understanding of the situation from a "resident's perspective."

His point is, even if you are just "researching options," you should still talk about it with an attending. It doesn't have to be your program director, but someone in the faculty should understand what you are contemplating about.

One of my fellow interns was contemplating switching specialties. Even though he ultimately did not, he let the PD know well in advance. Honesty and open communication is always appreciated, even if nothing (ultimately) comes from it.

If a spot in another program in your desired location opens up, and you come to your PD and say "This spot is open; I've already talked to their PD and he will accept me," your current PD will (rightfully) feel betrayed. You're leaving the program with a bad impression of you.

Plus, if you're scoping out another program, it is very likely that the PD at that program will want to know, first of all, if your current PD has given you his blessing to leave. If you say "No, he doesn't know," you will very likely not be given a spot at another program. You come across as shifty and dishonest.

Finally, you never know. Your current PD may be very understanding and may be willing to help you locate to a different program.

 

[deleted87716]

Kindly watch what you are saying. Clearly you don't understand anything from a resident's perspective. Nobody is sneaking around here, at some point we start at researching options before making a decision & thats where I am at. Do you blurt out every thought or idea as it occurs to you before analyzing ?
Anyways I have a short time frame before I make this decision & tell my program in a matter of days and wanted to hear from people who have dealt with this. Not chastising from people who do not even get what I am saying.

Don't ask for advice if you don't want it.

 

[bluealiendoctor]

Unfortunately, you will likely learn that while PGY1 is the crappiest and most BS year, and you are treated the worst, almost every resident/attending I have spoken with says that it just gets harder... gone are the SCUT work, the mindless tasks, and on comes responsibility and decision making, 24-7 home call, presenting M&M, stats, or whatever it is your specialty does, the longer, harder, more complex cases, etc... like the previous poster said, welcome to the real world.

Yeah, always blow-hards who like to say it gets harder. You think residency is hard? Wait until you're an attending! Oh yeah? Wait until you're retired and having to get by without a steady income? Oh yeah? Wait until you're too old to take a dump by yourself and having to push a walker around! Oh yeah, wait until your'e dead. Sheesh. Whatever.

 

[deleted87716]

Yeah, always blow-hards who like to say it gets harder. You think residency is hard? Wait until you're an attending! Oh yeah? Wait until you're retired and having to get by without a steady income? Oh yeah? Wait until you're too old to take a dump by yourself and having to push a walker around! Oh yeah, wait until your'e dead. Sheesh. Whatever.

No, it gets easier...assuming, of course, that you learned anything.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

As a PD, I'm willing to talk to a prospective resident transfer on the phone, and let them know if there is an open spot and whether a transfer will be possible, and talk about the program in general. I won't look at your application until you've given me permission to talk to your PD, which gives you a chance to talk to them first.

So, I think it's perfectly reasonable to call the small number of programs you're interested in transferring to and see if they have an open spot. If not, then your PD doesn't need to know.

My 2 cents.

 

[Ali Purinol]

Yeah, always blow-hards who like to say it gets harder. You think residency is hard? Wait until you're an attending! Oh yeah? Wait until you're retired and having to get by without a steady income? Oh yeah? Wait until you're too old to take a dump by yourself and having to push a walker around! Oh yeah, wait until your'e dead. Sheesh. Whatever.

HAHA!! This was funny!

Sure, it's a little off topic, but bluealiendoctor couldn't have said it better!

Those who love to preface/postface their comments with "Just wait, you'll see" are uncomfortably annoying.

For me, first it was "just wait, enjoy your 'last summer' before college!", then it was "just wait, enjoy your 'last summer' before med school!", then "just wait, enjoy your 'last summer' before second year", then "just wait, enjoy your fourth year before intern year", etc. etc. All of the above could have ended with "It only gets harder!"

Although some are well intended, sometimes I interpret this mindless jibberjabber as "i feel inferior, but since i'm ahead of you in training (even if by only one or more years), I think i'm more experienced and thus superior, so listen to me and ENJOY it!"

I can't wait to start working! From my perspective, YOU, the "superiors", are the ones getting paid ~$45,000 (or more if already in practice) and have likely already started paying back loans! I, on the other hand, am still accruing massive debt due to tuition for a fourth year (that all of us could honestly due without), and interest on huge principle. Boy, and I'm the one who should enjoy it!

So next time a current intern/resident wants to start barking about how lucky we "med students" are... uh, keep it to yourself, please!

 

[mwest]

As a PD, I'm willing to talk to a prospective resident transfer on the phone, and let them know if there is an open spot and whether a transfer will be possible, and talk about the program in general. I won't look at your application until you've given me permission to talk to your PD, which gives you a chance to talk to them first.

So, I think it's perfectly reasonable to call the small number of programs you're interested in transferring to and see if they have an open spot. If not, then your PD doesn't need to know.

My 2 cents.

Thank you so much for giving your feedback. BTW I had a heart-to-heart with my program director last week and all is well for now. Rest we'll see...

 

[mwest]

HAHA!! This was funny!

Sure, it's a little off topic, but bluealiendoctor couldn't have said it better!

Those who love to preface/postface their comments with "Just wait, you'll see" are uncomfortably annoying.

For me, first it was "just wait, enjoy your 'last summer' before college!", then it was "just wait, enjoy your 'last summer' before med school!", then "just wait, enjoy your 'last summer' before second year", then "just wait, enjoy your fourth year before intern year", etc. etc. All of the above could have ended with "It only gets harder!"

Although some are well intended, sometimes I interpret this mindless jibberjabber as "i feel inferior, but since i'm ahead of you in training (even if by only one or more years), I think i'm more experienced and thus superior, so listen to me and ENJOY it!"

I can't wait to start working! From my perspective, YOU, the "superiors", are the ones getting paid ~$45,000 (or more if already in practice) and have likely already started paying back loans! I, on the other hand, am still accruing massive debt due to tuition for a fourth year (that all of us could honestly due without), and interest on huge principle. Boy, and I'm the one who should enjoy it!

So next time a current intern/resident wants to start barking about how lucky we "med students" are... uh, keep it to yourself, please!

I know. It doesn't even have anything to do with my original post