Taking Step 2 vs doing PM&R away rotations earlier

[hashtag]

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Hey guys,

I am an M3 allopathic student with a 210-220 Step 1 score. I was considering taking Step 2 after my third year ends in June in order to get the score out. However, I am unsure how important Step 2 is to PM&R residencies- would my time be better spent setting up earlier and more away rotations and completing my application "ahead" of time? Any advice would be appreciated.

Also, from the looks of it, my Step 2 score, if it is above my Step 1 score, probably would not be much better- maybe a 230 or a little more judging from my test taking (and studying I guess) these past few years.

HT

 

[DrMattOglesby]

The PD from Emory stated at the AAPM&R conference that he prefers to see a step 2 score from applicants. I believe he played it up as more important than Step 1 because it was reflective of clinical knowledge.

 

[wavygravy99]

this is coming from a DO applicant, so it may be a slightly different perspective. i know there is risk involved taking the step 2 if you don't do as well, but if you can get around 230, i think that should be fine

I had a 231/99 on step 1, so I decided not to risk having a bad day and skipped step2ck. complex 1 i was 1 SD above the mean, comlex 2 I took in July beginning of 4th year I got just slightly above avg. a small drop from comlex1. Granted i probably didn't study as hard if I was also taking the usmle step 2

I actually just took my step2 ck last week, and havent gotten my score. in retrospect I should have just taken the usmle step2 along with my comlex2. I ended still got a lot of interview offers and at top programs I really want to go, but I got rejected from U Washington in seattle, and RIC. I was a bit caught off guard by the rejection to be honest, because I thought my step1 was competitive for PM&R. so i think the step 2 do matters to an extent, especially for some of the top programs and the specialty is getting competitive. I did get interview invite from mayo, harvard spaulding, baylor houston, which are often talked about as the top programs. ( i didn't apply to kessler and I did interview at Emory)

So i know it is a risk/reward you have to weigh yourself, and see how much time you actually get for studying. I think you really only nee 3-4 weeks of solid studying. to be honest, the only away rotation that really matters are the early ones ( july, august, september), and you only need to do 2, max 3, which you have to get letter of rec from the program. you have to give the person enough time to write the letter and send it too. away rotation is a nice way to get to know the program, the residents, but doing too many is really not beneficial in grand scheme of thing.

 

[hashtag]

Hey guys,

thanks a lot for the prompt response. I guess there should be enough time to cram in step 2 and move on. I am pretty committed to PM&R from everything I have read, but I do have other specialties like Peds, IM, EM on my radar. Part of the reason why I asked to start is because I am extremely excited to start doing PM&R rotations and wanted to get them started asap lol.

I appreciate the feedback!

HT

 

[DrMattOglesby]

this is coming from a DO applicant, so it may be a slightly different perspective. i know there is risk involved taking the step 2 if you don't do as well, but if you can get around 230, i think that should be fine

I had a 231/99 on step 1, so I decided not to risk having a bad day and skipped step2ck. complex 1 i was 1 SD above the mean, comlex 2 I took in July beginning of 4th year I got just slightly above avg. a small drop from comlex1. Granted i probably didn't study as hard if I was also taking the usmle step 2

I actually just took my step2 ck last week, and havent gotten my score. in retrospect I should have just taken the usmle step2 along with my comlex2. I ended still got a lot of interview offers and at top programs I really want to go, but I got rejected from U Washington in seattle, and RIC. I was a bit caught off guard by the rejection to be honest, because I thought my step1 was competitive for PM&R. so i think the step 2 do matters to an extent, especially for some of the top programs and the specialty is getting competitive. I did get interview invite from mayo, harvard spaulding, baylor houston, which are often talked about as the top programs. ( i didn't apply to kessler and I did interview at Emory)

So i know it is a risk/reward you have to weigh yourself, and see how much time you actually get for studying. I think you really only nee 3-4 weeks of solid studying. to be honest, the only away rotation that really matters are the early ones ( july, august, september), and you only need to do 2, max 3, which you have to get letter of rec from the program. you have to give the person enough time to write the letter and send it too. away rotation is a nice way to get to know the program, the residents, but doing too many is really not beneficial in grand scheme of thing.

Great advice, thanks for sharing! 👍

 

[fozzy40]

Hey guys,

I am an M3 allopathic student with a 210-220 Step 1 score. I was considering taking Step 2 after my third year ends in June in order to get the score out. However, I am unsure how important Step 2 is to PM&R residencies- would my time be better spent setting up earlier and more away rotations and completing my application "ahead" of time? Any advice would be appreciated.

Also, from the looks of it, my Step 2 score, if it is above my Step 1 score, probably would not be much better- maybe a 230 or a little more judging from my test taking (and studying I guess) these past few years.

HT

Having screened students and been through the process, I don't think that step 2 is a limiting factor to getting an interview. I received probably 90% of my PM&R interviews before my step 2 scores were reported. I can't speak to the importance of step 2 though to prelim years. I wouldn't rush taking it at the risk of not being prepared.

 

[TeaKae]

Here's a different perspective, just for balance.
211 on my step 1. I was not confident that would make me a competitive applicant, so i took step 2ck pretty early--aug-- and did not take any dedicated time off to study for it (although I was on a EM rotation when I did, so had some days off that month). ended up getting a 251, and i think that's what landed me some top invites I may not have gotten otherwise. it was definitely a little risky, as I chose to auto-release the score to ERAS so programs would see it as early as possible, but big rewards are worth big risks, you only live once...anywho...
Also, I did not do any away rotations in PMR. Did a 3rd year rotation in it, from which I got a letter, my 4th year rotations are at my home program as well (one which is still coming up, after the match is all said and done. not the best strategic move, but it's the way my schedule worked out). it's a solid PMR department and money is an issue, so I chose to forego the auditions. while at least 1 letter from within the specialty is important, i don't necessarily think all of the letters need to be rehab specific. you want to be good all-around to excel in this field!

sorry for the long post, just wanted to offer a different view. btw, I'm an MD applicant, not DO. and i'm not sure I'm in a great position to give advice, as I haven't matched yet, and I'm still afraid i won't!

 

[Lanvin]

I took step 2ck immediately after 3rd year (giving myself 1 week "vacation" to study before starting ICU). I had 7 weeks of electives (3 at home, 4 away) in PM&R starting early-mid August. PM&R LoR #1 was in ERAS by early Sept. PM&R LoR#2 was in ERAS by mid-late Oct. I got plenty of interviews and matched well.

Make sure you are ready for step 2ck and try to get at least 1 PM&R LoR in ERAS by early Sept. I received compliments on the interview trail for taking step 2ck early (and scoring well on it).

 

[Eilat87]

I think you really only nee 3-4 weeks of solid studying. to be honest, the only away rotation that really matters are the early ones ( july, august, september), and you only need to do 2, max 3, which you have to get letter of rec from the program.

So is the magic number, 2 or 3?

And if I do 3.. would it be something like 1 in general PM&R and 2 others in the subspecialties?

An AI (sub-i) in PM&R would be good too right? To show you can handle things. I know some places offer that.

 

[Tromner]

So is the magic number, 2 or 3?

And if I do 3.. would it be something like 1 in general PM&R and 2 others in the subspecialties?

An AI (sub-i) in PM&R would be good too right? To show you can handle things. I know some places offer that.

I did 1.5 months of sub specialty, 2 month of general in-patient and 0.5 months of out-patient.

I would recommend everyone doing 1 month of general inpatient but 2 months felt like a lot. Also out-patient can be boring for a medical student since some places it's lots of shadowing.
In reterospect I would no do more than 3 months of PMR as a med student.

 

[RangerBob]

So is the magic number, 2 or 3?

And if I do 3.. would it be something like 1 in general PM&R and 2 others in the subspecialties?

An AI (sub-i) in PM&R would be good too right? To show you can handle things. I know some places offer that.

I'd recommend 2-3 PM&R rotations total, including any visiting rotations & subspecialty rotations (possibly excluding pain/sports, since you can do them through anesthesia and FM or ortho).

I did three PM&R rotations myself--one at my home institution and two at institutions I was interested in. Both of those institutions only offered a general PM&R rotation (mix of inpt, consults, outpt, though I could spend more time in a specific area if I wanted) which I felt was better because it let me "interview" the program better. Remember--at an AI you both interview one another. You may decide you don't actually like the program, which happened to me for one of my rotations.

Of course, if your goal is to get a LOR, then you may want to spend more time with a specific physician. And, if you're absolutely certain you want to go into, say, sports, then you'll probably want to either do a sports rotation (if it's offered), or just spend more time in sports clinic on a general PM&R rotation. I think most places are pretty flexible.

Just make sure to apply for those AI's early! It makes a big difference.

 

[MedBronc23]

I can only talk for myself and my program. You'd likely get an interview here with your current scores, but you would have to have a rotation in PM&R. We highly value those who rotate with us for away rotations and I know this first hand after matching to my #1 program and doing away rotation.

However, my program has to see step 2 ck score and CS pass to rank you.

My advice is make sure you have overall good package with scores LOR and away or home rotations.