Tcom And Indiana

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Has anyone completed or is currently in the masters programs at Indiana or TCOM. If so what do you think so far?

 

[DrKT2009]

Has anyone completed or is currently in the masters programs at Indiana or TCOM. If so what do you think so far?

I was just curious to see which masters program you are speaking of at Indiana -- there are 3 different ones. I took the Non-Thesis Biology Masters last year if you have any questions 🙂 .

 

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I was just curious to see which masters program you are speaking of at Indiana -- there are 3 different ones. I took the Non-Thesis Biology Masters last year if you have any questions 🙂 .

Sorry I should have been more specific. Here is the link for the program I was thinking of http://www.iupui.edu/~medphys/programs/ms_program.html

This one is set up like Drexel or Bu, Gtown masters programs. Help you raise your GPA mine is 3.2 😱. If you to well you then you get at least an interview at their med school. This one is thesis based though. The research would be done in the second year. If you get into their med school then some of the classes you take durning the mastes will apply to med school to free up sometime to finish the masters. If you have info on the non-thesis based program please let me know what you thought about it. Can it be done in one year? I am looking for a program that will allow me to avoid the glide year. I've been gliding for to many years already lol.

 

[Phil Anthropist]

Sorry I should have been more specific. Here is the link for the program I was thinking of http://www.iupui.edu/~medphys/programs/ms_program.html

This one is set up like Drexel or Bu, Gtown masters programs. Help you raise your GPA mine is 3.2 😱. If you to well you then you get at least an interview at their med school. This one is thesis based though. The research would be done in the second year. If you get into their med school then some of the classes you take durning the mastes will apply to med school to free up sometime to finish the masters. If you have info on the non-thesis based program please let me know what you thought about it. Can it be done in one year? I am looking for a program that will allow me to avoid the glide year. I've been gliding for to many years already lol.

There's a key difference, you can't apply anywhere else realistically. For the Indiana physiology program, you have to apply to the med school while you're in your first year of the program. Well, allow me to clarify.

To be eligible to finish the rest of the medical school courses while in the second year of the physiology masters, you have to apply during the first year of the program AND get accepted to IU med schoo that year. The problem is that if you want to apply to other med schools, they will essentially tell you to "Go finish your masters program first." Many schools do not like it when students try to gain acceptance into a med school when they still have to finish a whole more year of their masters programs.

Also, doing well in the program well be an arduous task. The program essentially requires you to outcompete the med students (kind of like in BU MAMS and G-town SMP). The success rate of the program used to be quite high. For whatever reason, the number accepted into IU med during the 1st year of the program was much lower last year (I was told around 40% compared to an average of 70% or so in previous years). I'm not sure why this is, but I do know that many chose not to apply (because they wanted to continue into the PhD program instead or they didn't think medicine was right for them). Whether or not the med school itself is getting more selective in who it takes out of the physiology masters program, I do not know.

But if you're okay with going to IU and not really having other choices, it might be the program for you. Keep in mind that the program is supposed to be very difficult. I emailed someone who was a former representative of the program (she was in the program) and she said it's harder than anything she's ever done before. Also, there is no acceptance guarantee. So you're taking a risk, but it might be worth taking... In previous years, acceptance seemed more assured with certain gpas. I've been told that now they really look at the whole picture. Some with higher gpas will not be accepted and some with lower gpas will be accepted out of the program.

The nonthesis general biology masters at IUPUI is a one year program. In fact, you have to finish it in one year. But I'm sure DrKT2009 can elaborate on that better than I can. I'm assuming this is the program that DrKT2009 is referring to: http://www.biology.iupui.edu/programs/msprepro.html, http://www.biology.iupui.edu/ms.html and http://www.indiana.edu/~bltindy/science/biology/ms.html

IU also has a MMS program, but it's for disadvantage/minority applicants.

 

[DrKT2009]

There's a key difference, you can't apply anywhere else realistically. For the Indiana physiology program, you have to apply to the med school while you're in your first year of the program. Well actually, let me clarify.

To be eligible to finish the rest of the medical school courses while in the second year of the physiology masters, you have to apply during the first year of the program. Also, doing well in the program well be an arduous task. The program essentially requires you to outcompete the med students (kind of like in BU MAMS and G-town SMP). The success rate of the program used to be quite high. For whatever reason, the number accepted into IU med was much lower last year (I was told around 40%). I'm not sure why this is, but I do know that many chose not to apply (because they wanted to continue into the PhD program instead or they didn't think medicine was right for them).

The problem is that if you want to apply to other med schools, they will essentially tell you to "Go finish your masters program first." Many schools do not like it when students try to gain acceptance into a med school when they still have to finish a whole more year of their masters programs.

But if you're okay with going to IU and not really having other choices, it might be the program for you. Keep in mind that the program is supposed to be very difficult. I emailed someone who was a former representative of the program (she was in the program) and she said it's harder than anything she's ever done before. Also, there is no acceptance guarantee.

The nonthesis general biology masters at IUPUI is a one year program. In fact, you have to finish it in one year. But I'm sure DrKT2009 can elaborate on that better than I can.

I have a friend in the physiology program, so I kind of know why they accepted only 40% into the med school last year (he got into IU for this past fall). For some reason, last year they had more very qualified applicants for last year's class, and they ended up accepting more people than they had in the past. Then a lot of the students didn't do as well as was expected, so they ended up only accepting a few people. They didn't have nearly as high of a GPA as the classes before them; therefore, they didn't accept as many. It definitely isn't a definite 'in' into medical school. You can still apply to other medical schools in your first year, but I would think to get into that program, you would definitely have to have IU as your first choice.

 

[Phil Anthropist]

Interesting DrKT2009, thanks for the insight. I was seriously considering this program but now I'm having some second thoughts (Indiana would not be my top choice). Also, if I did a program like that I would want more of a guarantee). I may still apply though. Can you tell us anything about your experience with the one-year preprofessional masters? I PMd someone else who did the program and he liked it in many respects, but perhaps you might have a different take on it. Specifically, how successful is the preprofessional one year masters program for med acceptances (and are these more allopathic or osteopathic)?

Edit: that success rate info is on the page I linked above! 😳 But I'd still be interested in your thoughts on the program 😀

 

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I have a friend in the physiology program, so I kind of know why they accepted only 40% into the med school last year (he got into IU for this past fall). For some reason, last year they had more very qualified applicants for last year's class, and they ended up accepting more people than they had in the past. Then a lot of the students didn't do as well as was expected, so they ended up only accepting a few people. They didn't have nearly as high of a GPA as the classes before them; therefore, they didn't accept as many. It definitely isn't a definite 'in' into medical school. You can still apply to other medical schools in your first year, but I would think to get into that program, you would definitely have to have IU as your first choice.

Thanks to both DRKT2009 and to Phil Information and exchange like this is what make this board great. I know that each persons needs are different geographically Allo vs Osteo ect but getting anicdotal evidence of the various programs sure helps me make an informed decision. Karma to both of you!! So far this has been a talk about the Indiana program which is great but if anyone has first or even second hand info on the TCOM program I would love to hear it.

 

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There's a key difference, you can't apply anywhere else realistically. For the Indiana physiology program, you have to apply to the med school while you're in your first year of the program. Well, allow me to clarify.

To be eligible to finish the rest of the medical school courses while in the second year of the physiology masters, you have to apply during the first year of the program AND get accepted to IU med schoo that year. The problem is that if you want to apply to other med schools, they will essentially tell you to "Go finish your masters program first." Many schools do not like it when students try to gain acceptance into a med school when they still have to finish a whole more year of their masters programs.

Also, doing well in the program well be an arduous task. The program essentially requires you to outcompete the med students (kind of like in BU MAMS and G-town SMP). The success rate of the program used to be quite high. For whatever reason, the number accepted into IU med during the 1st year of the program was much lower last year (I was told around 40% compared to an average of 70% or so in previous years). I'm not sure why this is, but I do know that many chose not to apply (because they wanted to continue into the PhD program instead or they didn't think medicine was right for them). Whether or not the med school itself is getting more selective in who it takes out of the physiology masters program, I do not know.

But if you're okay with going to IU and not really having other choices, it might be the program for you. Keep in mind that the program is supposed to be very difficult. I emailed someone who was a former representative of the program (she was in the program) and she said it's harder than anything she's ever done before. Also, there is no acceptance guarantee. So you're taking a risk, but it might be worth taking... In previous years, acceptance seemed more assured with certain gpas. I've been told that now they really look at the whole picture. Some with higher gpas will not be accepted and some with lower gpas will be accepted out of the program.

The nonthesis general biology masters at IUPUI is a one year program. In fact, you have to finish it in one year. But I'm sure DrKT2009 can elaborate on that better than I can. I'm assuming this is the program that DrKT2009 is referring to: http://www.biology.iupui.edu/programs/msprepro.html, http://www.biology.iupui.edu/ms.html and http://www.indiana.edu/~bltindy/science/biology/ms.html

IU also has a MMS program, but it's for disadvantage/minority applicants.

Phil Anthorpist

Thanks for the link! I was just reading information on IU's Thesis program which even pays a 15k stipened for teaching assistants. I know most programs don't have unlimited postitions like this but most of them are not open to masters students. 15k plus no tuition sure beats the cost of G-town, BU, Finch ect at 30k plus living expences!! As far as how hard the programs are it is to be expected! If med school was easy everyone would do it. I don't know anyone who has gotten into med school with out hard work. I see these programs as doing the 1st year of med school in two years. It costs more but thats the price I pay for a low undergrad gpa.

 

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Phil Anthropist

Sorry I killed your name!!

 

[Phil Anthropist]

First, some clarifications on the special masters in cellular/integrative physiology program

Here is the link for the program I was thinking of http://www.iupui.edu/~medphys/programs/ms_program.html

This one is set up like Drexel or Bu, Gtown masters programs. Help you raise your GPA mine is 3.2 😱

Be careful with this-- the Drexel IMS, BU MA Med Sci and G-town masters programs (or any other masters program for that matter) will not raise your undergrad gpa on the AMCAS application. Graduate courses do not get factored into your undergrad gpa. So if you're trying to increase your undergrad gpa, undergraduate postbaccalaureate programs are the way to do this. But if you're trying to prove you can handle a tough graduate-level courseload, then going for masters programs is a reasonable route. An excellent graduate performance can make up for your 3.2, but it won't change your undergrad 3.2.

If you to well you then you get at least an interview at their med school. This one is thesis based though. The research would be done in the second year.

You are correct in saying that you must do research in this program (this is also true for Boston U MA Med Sci). However, the program does not require a thesis. This may be a little bit of semantics, but you don't actually do a thesis. You are required to do a research project--either library-based or lab-based and you're required to present it, but you don't defend or present an actual thesis. Nevertheless, the research component in this program is much more than in other special masters programs.

If you get into their med school then some of the classes you take durning the mastes will apply to med school to free up sometime to finish the masters.

I am looking for a program that will allow me to avoid the glide year. I've been gliding for to many years already lol.

Here's the thing. If you get accepted into IU med during your first year in the program, then you are allowed to complete the rest of the first year med school courses during your 2nd year of the program. Therefore (this is assuming you get accepted to IU during that first year, which you can't know for sure), by the time you've finished the program you can enroll in IU med school as a 2nd year med student.

Phil Anthropist
Sorry I killed your name!!

"Phil" will suffice! 😀

I was just reading information on IU's Thesis program which even pays a 15k stipened for teaching assistants. I know most programs don't have unlimited postitions like this but most of them are not open to masters students. 15k plus no tuition sure beats the cost of G-town, BU, Finch ect at 30k plus living expences!! As far as how hard the programs are it is to be expected! If med school was easy everyone would do it. I don't know anyone who has gotten into med school with out hard work. I see these programs as doing the 1st year of med school in two years. It costs more but thats the price I pay for a low undergrad gpa.

Regarding the IU MS in Biology-thesis program.

Please keep in mind that this is not related to the Indiana special masters I just talked about earlier. One of the key differences is that the courseload is much different. This is a traditional masters program. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it's not the same as a special masters. As far as I know (I could be wrong), you can't take medical classes if you're in the MS in Biology thesis program. One thing you should ask them about the tuition remission and stipend: Does it apply to both the first and second years of the MS Biology thesis program, or just the second year? The reason I'm not sure is because the website discusses teaching assistantships. Sometimes teaching assistantships are not performed in the first year. However, there are many masters programs that DO have teaching assistantships in the first year as well as tuition remission for all years in the program. I just think you should check with them to be sure. If this is the case, and you're looking to save money, a traditional masters program like IU's is a good idea. There's actually a lot of traditional 2-year masters that are tuition-free. Some of these programs are pretty competitive though, but I do know that there's a lot out there. The one big disadvantage is that you won't be starting as a first year med student until you've finished the program. In contrast, some of the better known special masters might allow you to avoid the glide year and after two years you might be starting as a 2nd year med student.

Again, I was seriously considering applying to some of the IU programs (and I still might). These are just some things to keep in mind.

As far as how hard the programs are it is to be expected! If med school was easy everyone would do it. I don't know anyone who has gotten into med school with out hard work. I see these programs as doing the 1st year of med school in two years. It costs more but thats the price I pay for a low undergrad gpa.

You've got the right attitude! 👍

Phil 😀

 

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Phil

Again, thanks for your input!!! More karma to you. May I ask what programs you are looking at? I have a folder full of fifteen plus programs. They all look like they will help prove that I can handle the work load (which is my goal), but some cost so much (finch) so I am wondering what other options I have. There are many pathways to getting into med school. Post bach ect but I feel that a masters is best for me for many reasons. Number one is it's a Masters. If I do have a glide year then at least I have another degree to show for my efforts which may help in the job market. Second I feel my undergrad grads dont reflect my ability whatsoever. I worked full time 40 hours plus during undergrad and my first two years of college were horrible so I had to get alot of A's to make up for past mistakes. I have a 3.8 in my major. Last I dont want to take any of those classes again. I would rather add to my knowledge base then rehash gen chem.

 

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Phil

I also understand that retaking classes helps only to a point (for allo). If I retake cell bio to bring my B- to an A then Allo schools are only going to average the two grades which does'nt help much. For osteo it helps since they use the best as far as I understand. So going from a B- 2.7 to an averaged B, 3.3 isn't much of a jump in my book. Just my 0.2 cents

 

[Phil Anthropist]

Sorry, I wasn't clear. You're referring to the type of postbac undergrad programs that involve the prereqs. There are also undergrad enrichment postbac programs and informal nondegree postbacs that allow you to take upper division science courses to raise your undergrad numbers.

For the AMCAS allo application, there isn't much of a point to retaking classes. Also, it isn't very statistically effective to retake if you're trying to increase your gpa (especially if you have a lot of credit hours). If you have a C in Bio I and you retake and get an A, both still show up. The C stays anyway, so I'd rather just take an upper division bio course like physiology, anatomy, etc. and get an A in that. Even in this case your science gpa will move slowly, but at least you show that you can succeed in a more advanced course. I think it's pointless to retake a prereq unless you got less than a C (because some med schools require that no prereqs are below a C).

For osteo, only your most recent grade is calculated in your gpa--regardless if your retake grade is higher or lower than your previous grade. For pre-osteopathic postbacs, retaking can be very effective for increasing gpa. But even if I was solely osteo-bound, retaking all the prereqs would suck.

May I ask what programs you are looking at? I have a folder full of fifteen plus programs. They all look like they will help prove that I can handle the work load (which is my goal), but some cost so much (finch) so I am wondering what other options I have.

I've got a list of well over 40--it's pretty ridiculous. Don't worry, I'll probably only apply to about 10. 😀 I'm looking at some special masters programs (at allopathic and osteopathic schools), a couple of the well known certificate programs, and some traditional 2-year biomedical Master of Science programs on medical campuses. I'm leaning toward the traditional masters. There's actually many of these--they're very inexpensive relative to the special masters programs, they can help me prove my academic capabilities, and they give me the added benefit of meaningful biomedical research (I want to get biomedical research experience). The Boston U masters, the VCU program (if you stay an extra year), and the Drexel IMS program (if you stay an extra year) have some of these research opportunities, but programs like G-town, Finch and Loyola MAMS, do not. I think the traditional biomedical masters degree will have more use for me in the long run than the non-research, non-lab, non-thesis special masters programs--especially if I decide to do some biomedical or clinically relevant research. The special masters that are essentially masters-in-I-want-to-go-to-med school aren't very useful degrees. They're good at what the do--proving you can handle rigorous medically oriented curriculums and getting you accepted into professional schools. But aside from those purposes, I don't think they provide many other benefits.

There are many pathways to getting into med school. Post bach ect but I feel that a masters is best for me for many reasons. Number one is it's a Masters. If I do have a glide year then at least I have another degree to show for my efforts which may help in the job market. Second I feel my undergrad grads dont reflect my ability whatsoever. I worked full time 40 hours plus during undergrad and my first two years of college were horrible so I had to get alot of A's to make up for past mistakes. I have a 3.8 in my major. Last I dont want to take any of those classes again. I would rather add to my knowledge base then rehash gen chem.

I agree that a masters is right for you from your info. I just wanted to point out that little undergrad gpa consideration because some people go into graduate level postbac programs with the intent to raise their undergrad cumulative/science gpa, and it doesn't work that way. But again I agree with you, sounds like the masters is the way to go in your case. 👍

 

[DrKT2009]

Interesting DrKT2009, thanks for the insight. I was seriously considering this program but now I'm having some second thoughts (Indiana would not be my top choice). Also, if I did a program like that I would want more of a guarantee). I may still apply though. Can you tell us anything about your experience with the one-year preprofessional masters? I PMd someone else who did the program and he liked it in many respects, but perhaps you might have a different take on it. Specifically, how successful is the preprofessional one year masters program for med acceptances (and are these more allopathic or osteopathic)?

Edit: that success rate info is on the page I linked above! 😳 But I'd still be interested in your thoughts on the program 😀

I liked the program. I thought it was very helpful. There was only one kind of weird teacher that I had. I don't even think the stats on that page are correct on how many people got into what programs. I knew more than 5 people that got into D.O. school (that is what they preferred), and I think that site just says 1. I can't remember on the number of the people that got into M.D. school. I knew 10 people or so that got into M.D. school, but a lot of the other students were trying to get into dental school. I really can't comment on the percentage of people wanting to get into med school against the percentage of people that got in. I am sorry that I am not much help. It was a pretty good program though. It definitely helps in medical school (I have two friends that mentioned that they were at an extreme advantage with other medical students that did not take this masters program). Good luck. Feel free to ask any additional questions.

 

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Phil

I appreciate your advice. Sounds like you are like me researching everything to make the best choice. I can't believe you found 40 ++ programs thats awesome. I have not really considered the two year programs at this point. I do agree with you that a traditional masters program may have more use then the special masters programs. I am leaning towards the TCOM postpost bach certificate program. My wife wants to get back to Texas so this maybe away to do it. If I don't get in the first year then you can finish the masters in clincial research and then reapply to all of the Texas medical schools the following year the cost of the program is less then lunch and dinner at Finch, G-town or BU. Also the cost of med school in Texas is so cheap. My biggest problem is the MCAT at this point. My school doesn't offer the physics classes I need to be ready for the April MCAT. So I would be taking the April MCAT without the second semester of physics, OUCH!

 

[Phil Anthropist]

I surfed the web today and I realized that the Indiana physiology special masters (not the one-year nonthesis bio masters, the two year physio masters) has been cancelled. 🙁 I was seriously considering it--the program sounded excellent. Oh well.

http://www.iupui.edu/~medphys/programs/ms_program.html
http://www.iupui.edu/~medphys/programs/grad.html

 

[DrKT2009]

I surfed the web today and I realized that the Indiana physiology special masters (not the one-year nonthesis bio masters, the two year physio masters) has been cancelled. 🙁 I was seriously considering it--the program sounded excellent. Oh well.

http://www.iupui.edu/~medphys/programs/ms_program.html
http://www.iupui.edu/~medphys/programs/grad.html

That is really odd. I have a friend in that program too... I think I will try to call him and see what he says. If I find out anything, I'll let you know. It may just be cancelled for this year. I will try to find out.

 

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Phil I saw the same thing today I have the link in favorites and as of 12/13/2004 it is done. I wonder what gives? I also was going to apply for fall 2005. For the life of me I do not understand why they would shut it down like that. DrKT 2009. Please let us know what your friend says.

On another note does anyone out their have any first hand knowledge about the post bach certificate program at TCOM? If so tell me everything or PM me. I like the program and my wife wants to live in Texas long term. The course load isnt as intense as the some programs but worst case you can finish with a masters in clinical research which is an up an coming field on its own. I am hoping it will give me an in for Texas medical schools.

 

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Here is the link to the TCOM programs.

http://www.hsc.unt.edu/education/gsbs/disciplines.cfm

 

[HussainGQ]

The program at Indiana U has been discussed thoroughly here, what about the program offered by TCOM?

 

[DrKT2009]

Phil I saw the same thing today I have the link in favorites and as of 12/13/2004 it is done. I wonder what gives? I also was going to apply for fall 2005. For the life of me I do not understand why they would shut it down like that. DrKT 2009. Please let us know what your friend says.

On another note does anyone out their have any first hand knowledge about the post bach certificate program at TCOM? If so tell me everything or PM me. I like the program and my wife wants to live in Texas long term. The course load isnt as intense as the some programs but worst case you can finish with a masters in clinical research which is an up an coming field on its own. I am hoping it will give me an in for Texas medical schools.

I haven't been able to get ahold of my friend yet. I just contacted my friend which is at the IU school of medicine. He didn't know about it yet either. He did tell me that they were pretty upset last year with the students not doing well in the program. They were beginning to think that the students which got into the program thought they were a shoe-in; therefore, they think the students didn't really care as long as they 'got in'. He said the year before, 15 of 17 students got in while only 5 of approximately 25 got in last year (of course, the rest of the students didn't do well for whatever reason). It is a hard program, and they weren't going to lower the standards of the program because some students weren't working hard (of course, the students from all of the previous years had done very well). He also said, that they students that ended up not getting into medical school, ended up quiting the program all together. He said it was even a possiblity that they cancelled the remaining masters program for the students that just stated this fall. I am still trying to get ahold of my friend, but he is hard to get ahold of sometimes. He said they didn't like the rep they were getting for less than 5 people getting into medical school. I will update you as soon as I know anything else. Have a great day