Teaching with psyd

[valentinoRossi]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Are there any Psyd holders here that teach at the university level somewhere? My goal is to be in private practice, but i have always enjoyed teaching and would ideally like to be a visiting adjunct professor on the side. It's more for my interest in teaching rather then for making money. I know phd's are highly valued in the academic setting, but honestly this past year i have taken classes with several doctoral level students. I'm sure that a clinical psychologist with a psyd could be able to teach when 28 year old phd candidates are right? I would also say that my favorite teachers have usually been doctoral students. It seems they are usually younger with muchh more energy and passion. But anyways that's irrelevant to the main question at hand.

gracias

 

[Pragma]

Are there any Psyd holders here that teach at the university level somewhere? My goal is to be in private practice, but i have always enjoyed teaching and would ideally like to be a visiting adjunct professor on the side. It's more for my interest in teaching rather then for making money. I know phd's are highly valued in the academic setting, but honestly this past year i have taken classes with several doctoral level students. I'm sure that a clinical psychologist with a psyd could be able to teach when 28 year old phd candidates are right? I would also say that my favorite teachers have usually been doctoral students. It seems they are usually younger with muchh more energy and passion. But anyways that's irrelevant to the main question at hand.

gracias

While most PsyDs I know do not adjuct, I know a couple that do. You likely need to advocate for yourself to do this though, and may need to seek out opportunities on your own. That is in contrast to some PhD programs that include teaching as part of your training. For example, my program had us take a one year "teaching training" course. After that course was finished we could teach to get additional funding. We also were paired with mentors. It was an awesome way to get started and then made it easy to be competitive teaching at other places later. I haven't heard of a PsyD program that does this, although I wouldn't be surprised if it exists someplace.

 

[Pragma]

All of that said, adjuncting is as much about who you know and filling a need. If a dept chair needs to fill a class, they usually will ask people they know first. If you have experience in the area and they need to fill it fast, they may just give you the class.

But in many cases, adjuncting is also competitive and has an application process.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

All of that said, adjuncting is as much about who you know and filling a need. If a dept chair needs to fill a class, they usually will ask people they know first. If you have experience in the area and they need to fill it fast, they may just give you the class.

But in many cases, adjuncting is also competitive and has an application process.

Agree with this and Pragma's previous post. Networking with department chairs and members is very important if you'd like to adjunct, as is having previous teaching experience. Like Pragma's, my program offers a formal "Teaching of Psychology" class for a semester, after which we're required to sign up for a second semester of practicum/supervision during which we complete a variety of more-applied experiences (e.g., observing classes across multiple departments, guest lecturing, presenting articles on different instructional techniques, etc.).

After all that's said and done, we're then allowed to sign on as the instructor for summer/winter intersession and/or year-long courses.

One other piece of advice I'll give--if you really, really want to teach, you can make yourself a more desirable candidate by offering/having experience with courses that most other professors don't want to take on. This can vary from program to program, hence why it's important to network (e.g., in my department, personality was a class that professors often didn't want to teach, but that was very popular with undergrads, so the university liked to offer it and frequently assigned grad students to teach it). Things like psychopathology and abnormal psychology seem to be very popular with professors, while some of the stats, research methods, and ethics classes are generally pawned off on newer faculty who essentially have no choice but to teach them. Although again, this is going to vary widely from school to school, and also between the undergrad and grad levels (e.g., teaching stats or research methods to grad students might be desirable to professors, while teaching those same classes at the undergrad level might be avoided).

 

[wigflip]

my program had us take a one year "teaching training" course.

Ours did too, but there was no content relevant to teaching.

 

[wigflip]

some of the stats [and] research methods...classes are generally pawned off on newer faculty who essentially have no choice but to teach them.

But keep in mind that these classes are disliked for a reason: they are requisites for majors, so UGs can't drop as easily when they are struggling. They are high anxiety classes for some UGs, so they can be a lot of extra work for the instructor (numerous emails, student meetings) if you don't have TAs to fob the scutwork off onto.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

But keep in mind that these classes are disliked for a reason: they are requisites for majors, so UGs can't drop as easily when they are struggling. They are high anxiety classes for some UGs, so they can be a lot of extra work for the instructor (numerous emails, student meetings) if you don't have TAs to fob the scutwork off onto.

Oh, I definitely wasn't meaning to imply that there weren't reasons these classes were less-preferred by faculty. Just that if you really, really want to teach, one of the ways you can improve your marketability is to offer to teach and/or have previous experience with some of these courses.

But yes, the research methods classes at the undergrad level in particular can be rough on the instructor. This is definitely one reason why gaining experience with such classes as a grad student, perhaps via both TAing and teaching while still supported by your training program, could be a great idea.

 

[Pragma]

Oh, I definitely wasn't meaning to imply that there weren't reasons these classes were less-preferred by faculty. Just that if you really, really want to teach, one of the ways you can improve your marketability is to offer to teach and/or have previous experience with some of these courses.

But yes, the research methods classes at the undergrad level in particular can be rough on the instructor. This is definitely one reason why gaining experience with such classes as a grad student, perhaps via both TAing and teaching while still supported by your training program, could be a great idea.

I thought teaching the advanced portion of research methods was fun. It was the introductory research methods course that made a small part of me die inside. Alcohol helps (after, not during class)

 

[wigflip]

Are there any Psyd holders here that teach at the university level somewhere? My goal is to be in private practice, but i have always enjoyed teaching

what and where have you taught before?

and would ideally like to be a visiting adjunct professor on the side. It's more for my interest in teaching rather then for making money.

Well that's good, because most adjuncts get paid s**t. You can check out some "salaries" on Adjunct Nation.

I know phd's are highly valued in the academic setting, but honestly this past year i have taken classes with several doctoral level students. I'm sure that a clinical psychologist with a psyd could be able to teach when 28 year old phd candidates are right?

Depends. Grad students' teaching duties are often tied to their grad programs (think funding). Your an UG, right, not an MA student? If this is true, then it's not like the grad student teachers you had interviewed against competitors with PsyDs--they were probably allocated those classes by their/your department.

This (adjuncting) is a highly political topic for people hoping to teach or secure tenure track positions. There is a huge shift towards using non-tenure-track labor to teach (I've read estimates that 75% of teaching is now done by adjuncts, grad students, and VAPs). Adjuncts can be treated like crap by both full time faculty and staff.

I would also say that my favorite teachers have usually been doctoral students. It seems they are usually younger with muchh more energy and passion.

That might be true. It also might be that as young professionals hoping to build an attractive package for hiring on a competitive academic job market (think teaching evals), they have to pander to student perceptions in a way that tenured profs do not.

 

[wigflip]

Oh, I definitely wasn't meaning to imply that there weren't reasons these classes were less-preferred by faculty. Just that if you really, really want to teach, one of the ways you can improve your marketability is to offer to teach and/or have previous experience with some of these courses.

But yes, the research methods classes at the undergrad level in particular can be rough on the instructor. This is definitely one reason why gaining experience with such classes as a grad student, perhaps via both TAing and teaching while still supported by your training program, could be a great idea.

I didn't mean to imply that (see bold). Agree completely.

I think sometimes the folks (may or may not be true of OP) who state "adjuncting" as a goal really don't know what they're in for (ratio of hassles, humiliation, hard work to poor remuneration) and have a poor understanding of the economic realities and politics of higher education. Which is cool; you don't know what you don't know. Except there are so many highly qualified, out of work academics screaming about this stuff from the rooftops.

 

[Pragma]

This (adjuncting) is a highly political topic for people hoping to teach or secure tenure track positions. There is a huge shift towards using non-tenure-track labor to teach (I've read estimates that 75% of teaching is now done by adjuncts, grad students, and VAPs). Adjuncts can be treated like crap by both full time faculty and staff.

Oh totally true. But adjuncting remains a decent option for people who have a different primary job. It's actually naturally suited for clinical folks to come teach clinical psychology classes, given their "real-world" experience. I know several clinicians who moonlight as an adjunct to pay for daycare, etc. I lived that lifestyle myself while I was on postdoc and teaching was great.

But among full time academics, the way adjuncts are treated is straight up class warfare.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

But among full time academics, the way adjuncts are treated is straight up class warfare.

+1. With the increased competition for even fewer TT positions (bc of a shift to a higher % of instructor/adjunct positions), there can definitely be some larger divides within the faculty. Depending on how strong of an itch you have to teach, there are also alt options like teaching in community college or guest lecturing for teaching/research colleagues.

There are also clinical positions that allow for teaching a class per semester, team teach a seminar course, and/or be a regular seminar presenter for a training program (more common in a hospital setting and/or allied health school.) Doing didactic or seminar series are both a bit different dynamic than teaching a class, but I now prefer them bc I can teach in my areas of interest and the time commitment is much less.

 

[wigflip]

There are also clinical positions that allow for teaching a class per semester, team teach a seminar course, and/or be a regular seminar presenter for a training program (more common in a hospital setting and/or allied health school.) Doing didactic or seminar series are both a bit different dynamic than teaching a class, but I now prefer them bc I can teach in my areas of interest and the time commitment is much less.

How are your "students" in these setting, T4C? Are they eager and professional? Even some of the tenured profs at my school talk and text during others' presentations--for someone who used to be pretty idealistic about teaching, it's pretty depressing.

 

[cara susanna]

I think it depends on where you adjunct. I adjunct at a CC and I'm treated very well. But I have heard horror stories about other places.

Adjuncting isn't my career goal, but I've accepted that I may have to do it for a living (or lack thereof, given the money you get for it). If I do have to adjunct, I'd like it to be at a CC where I think there's less of a divide.

Anyway, PsyDs can get hired, but I think in the competitive world of academic hiring it would be easy to use against you. When you have similar qualifications to a PhD, I think the PhD would probably be preferred. Maybe I'm wrong, though.

 

[Pragma]

How are your "students" in these setting, T4C? Are they eager and professional? Even some of the tenured profs at my school talk and text during others' presentations--for someone who used to be pretty idealistic about teaching, it's pretty depressing.

wigflip, based on this and other posts, it sounds like your institution is somewhere in between the 2nd and 3rd circles of hell in terms of faculty behavior. I must say that I have never seen this type of behavior among faculty members at any institution I have been affiliated with - particularly towards peers.

I am not saying that I don't believe you at all, but what's up with your school? I mean, I've seen some crappy faculty, but typically they have enough hubris to at least give the illusion that they care.

 

[PsyDLICSW]

While most PsyDs I know do not adjuct, I know a couple that do. You likely need to advocate for yourself to do this though, and may need to seek out opportunities on your own. That is in contrast to some PhD programs that include teaching as part of your training. For example, my program had us take a one year "teaching training" course. After that course was finished we could teach to get additional funding. We also were paired with mentors. It was an awesome way to get started and then made it easy to be competitive teaching at other places later. I haven't heard of a PsyD program that does this, although I wouldn't be surprised if it exists someplace.

My PsyD program (university based) has a teaching component. We take a teaching in psychology course in our first year and teach intro psychology second year until fourth year. I have taught four sections of intro (one each semester after year one) and one section assisting in teaching a graduate level course. IMO, I think that it is possible for PsyDs to teach (we have two professors with PsyDs) but I think PhDs are favored, at least at bigger schools, Perhaps it is more a possibility to teach at a small, liberal arts college, or small state school that focuses more on teaching than research.

 

[wigflip]

wigflip, based on this and other posts, it sounds like your institution is somewhere in between the 2nd and 3rd circles of hell in terms of faculty behavior. I must say that I have never seen this type of behavior among faculty members at any institution I have been affiliated with - particularly towards peers.

I am not saying that I don't believe you at all, but what's up with your school? I mean, I've seen some crappy faculty, but typically they have enough hubris to at least give the illusion that they care.

I don't know what to say beyond this: the bad behavior I've observed isn't just in my department, and I'm holding back the really good stories. I'm not at an Ivy, but we're a competitively ranked R1. I have some pretty ridiculous stories from UG too.

I don't know what anyone's motivation for fibbing about such a thing would be. It's not like you're going to come to sdn to get sympathy.

 

[wigflip]

I think that it is possible for PsyDs to teach (we have two professors with PsyDs) but I think PhDs are favored, at least at bigger schools, Perhaps it is more a possibility to teach at a small, liberal arts college, or small state school that focuses more on teaching than research.

I think if the OP is really interested, the thing to do is simply put in the time and google it. Find the types of institutions s/he would be interested in teaching at, and see what the credentials of full time and part time faculty are. Not to mention where they got the PsyD from.

 

[Pragma]

I don't know what to say beyond this: the bad behavior I've observed isn't just in my department, and I'm holding back the really good stories. I'm not at an Ivy, but we're a competitively ranked R1. I have some pretty ridiculous stories from UG too.

I don't know what anyone's motivation for fibbing about such a thing would be. It's not like you're going to come to sdn to get sympathy.

Well you have my sympathy. I have a strict "no texting" policy in class (except now there is fun polling stuff you can let them text with). I can't imagine a faculty member doing that at a talk, and they'd get the stank eye big time for doing it.

 

[Doctor Eliza]

Hmmm…since this is VR’s thread I am tempted to say it is all gumdrops and lollipops to be an adjunct with a Psy.D. But I suspect others may have questions about this too, so I’ll put my $.02 in…

Most of my psychology friend-colleagues are Ph.D.’s and not Psy.D’s, however, a close friend of mine is a Psy.D. who has done some regular adjunct work. He has definitely put time into networking. I knew of a few times met with frustration due to his degree. For example, he passed an adjunct job possibility onto me (for an online program) because they specified that they only would accept a Ph.D. for the position. However, that is more the exception than the rule.

That said, I loved teaching in grad school and was pretty successful at it. I had always intended to return to it at some point through adjunct work. That was until I actually looked into the logistics of doing that. As mentioned earlier, the payment for such positions is quite poor relative to the amount of time you will spend prepping your class. As I have previously mentioned, the private practice I am in gives me a pretty poor split, but it was pretty clear from a financial POV I would be better off taking on a few extra clients instead of teaching a class. In some ways, it is probably better to think of adjunct teaching as a hobby rather than a source of employment!

Even if you can put that aside, almost all of the adjunct positions around here want you to teach evening classes (they save the daytime hours for FT faculty). This is a problem when you primarily work in PP because those are the same hours that people are able/willing to see you. This is an especially significant issue if a chunk of your practice is kids because parents are typically not willing to pull their kids from school to see you unless they are in crisis. This has been my primary sticking point. I do think I will return to it someday though because I miss it.

Best,
Dr. E

 

[Pragma]

Hmmm…since this is VR’s thread I am tempted to say it is all gumdrops and lollipops to be an adjunct with a Psy.D. But I suspect others may have questions about this too, so I’ll put my $.02 in…

Most of my psychology friend-colleagues are Ph.D.’s and not Psy.D’s, however, a close friend of mine is a Psy.D. who has done some regular adjunct work. He has definitely put time into networking. I knew of a few times met with frustration due to his degree. For example, he passed an adjunct job possibility onto me (for an online program) because they specified that they only would accept a Ph.D. for the position. However, that is more the exception than the rule.

That said, I loved teaching in grad school and was pretty successful at it. I had always intended to return to it at some point through adjunct work. That was until I actually looked into the logistics of doing that. As mentioned earlier, the payment for such positions is quite poor relative to the amount of time you will spend prepping your class. As I have previously mentioned, the private practice I am in gives me a pretty poor split, but it was pretty clear from a financial POV I would be better off taking on a few extra clients instead of teaching a class. In some ways, it is probably better to think of adjunct teaching as a hobby rather than a source of employment!

Even if you can put that aside, almost all of the adjunct positions around here want you to teach evening classes (they save the daytime hours for FT faculty). This is a problem when you primarily work in PP because those are the same hours that people are able/willing to see you. This is an especially significant issue if a chunk of your practice is kids because parents are typically not willing to pull their kids from school to see you unless they are in crisis. This has been my primary sticking point. I do think I will return to it someday though because I miss it.

Best,
Dr. E

Yeah the pay varies by institution. When I was adjuncting, I was paid between $3,000 and $4,500 per course. Which I hear is decent compared to some places. But it is peanuts compared to tenure-track, even on a per-course basis.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

How are your "students" in these setting, T4C? Are they eager and professional? Even some of the tenured profs at my school talk and text during others' presentations--for someone who used to be pretty idealistic about teaching, it's pretty depressing.

I did the typical grad student TA stuff during my schooling, and while I enjoyed my time in the classroom, I'd much rather do more seminar/didactic focused work. Being in academic medicine lets me still do a bit of lecturing/presenting, but without the hassle of doing a 15wk lesson plan. Generally, the people attending a talk are interested in learning (and/or getting a CME…and/or it is required of their program ). The trick is snagging a faculty appointment to a medical school/university, as the red tape is much more if you don't already have an affiliation. The $-side of things will depend on if you are truly an outside person or if you have a carve out to teach/participate in one or more training programs; I have always been in the latter group. It isn't a traditional teaching gig, but it eliminates all of the, "I need to re-schedule my exam because their mother's boyfriend's cat is sick" issues.

I think it depends on where you adjunct. I adjunct at a CC and I'm treated very well. But I have heard horror stories about other places.

This is consistent with what I have seen. Most people I know who go this route do it to break up their clinically-intensive work week.

 

[Doctor Eliza]

Yeah the pay varies by institution. When I was adjuncting, I was paid between $3,000 and $4,500 per course. Which I hear is decent compared to some places. But it is peanuts compared to tenure-track, even on a per-course basis.

I wonder if compensation for adjuncts in my city is particularly low due to having a major university. Seems like there are many PhD's around here for all disciplines.

In general, I wonder about how the presence of permanent and temporary instructor positions influences the number of available adjunct opportunities. I have had a few (non-psych) friends that have taken such positions when unable to get TT positions. They don't seem to pay much more than adjunct work, so it would think a university might hire 2 instructors rather than 8 adjuncts. Maybe not. Just wondering aloud.

Best,
Dr. E

 

[sydb1367]

I'm (any day now) a PsyD who adjuncts at a university. so yes it can be done. I'd echo the others' statements regarding networking and getting experience (of course in what job/career/profession is that not important). I guess I am alone in thinking the pay is actually decent (at least at this point in my career). Sure, given the amount of time it takes to create a course, if you only teach it once it's not great, but I reckon I'm making about $45-50 an hour.

 

[valentinoRossi]

Hmmm…since this is VR's thread I am tempted to say it is all gumdrops and lollipops to be an adjunct with a Psy.D. But I suspect others may have questions about this too, so I'll put my $.02 in…


Best,
Dr. E

haha, thanks 🙂

 

[valentinoRossi]

I'm (any day now) a PsyD who adjuncts at a university. so yes it can be done. I'd echo the others' statements regarding networking and getting experience (of course in what job/career/profession is that not important). I guess I am alone in thinking the pay is actually decent (at least at this point in my career). Sure, given the amount of time it takes to create a course, if you only teach it once it's not great, but I reckon I'm making about $45-50 an hour.

intriguing...im curious to know, how much do you think you will make from teaching a single course? Is it enjoyable?

 

[valentinoRossi]

I think if the OP is really interested, the thing to do is simply put in the time and google it. Find the types of institutions s/he would be interested in teaching at, and see what the credentials of full time and part time faculty are. Not to mention where they got the PsyD from.

yeah i actually did try googling psyd and teaching...didn't get anything really. Honestly speaking...its hard finding anything on psyd lifestyle outside of these forums. Sure I can read school websites, but I prefer reading opinions from people who are experienced and know their **** (aka you guys)

 

[sydb1367]

intriguing...im curious to know, how much do you think you will make from teaching a single course? Is it enjoyable?

sorry I wasn't clear. It's pretty universal that you get paid a flat rate per course. When I divide the flat rate I get paid by how many hours I spend on the class (teaching, prepping, grading, etc.) it comes out to the figure above.

is it enjoyable? hrmmm, good question. It's a steep as hell learning curve and quite a bit of disillusionment at the start, but, yeah, it's fun. just don't teach 9am on a monday.

 

[cara susanna]

I got like $500/month for teaching one course (for one semester) and supposedly will be earning $1000/month for teaching two courses this fall (again, for one semester).

 

[AcronymAllergy]

The typical rate at my university was the same as Pragma's (i.e., $3-4k/course). I believe the same amount was paid whether it was a full semester or an intersession (e.g., mid-Dec to early Jan, early June to mid-July), which could be nice--$3k for a month or so of work, although you'd generally be teaching for 2-3 hours per day, every day.

 

[wigflip]

yeah i actually did try googling psyd and teaching...didn't get anything really. Honestly speaking...its hard finding anything on psyd lifestyle outside of these forums. Sure I can read school websites, but I prefer reading opinions from people who are experienced and know their **** (aka you guys)

Really? I just spent about 7 minutes googling and came up with a lot. I picked these programs randomly:

Widener: PsyDs on faculty:
http://www.widener.edu/academics/schools/shsp/psyd/faculty/default.aspx

Rutgers: core faculty appear to be all PhDs, but a couple of these clinical faculty appear to be Rutgers alums (presumably PsyDs--they're a little opaque with the credentials of the clinical faculty, but maybe that's because I only glanced):
http://gsappweb.rutgers.edu/facstaff/faculty/facultyclinical.php

PGSP: I didn't see any PsyDs:
http://www.paloaltou.edu/pgsp-stanford-psyd-consortium/faculty

Pepperdine: PsyDs as faculty:
http://gsep.pepperdine.edu/welcome/...tm?division=Psychology+Division&selection=all

You can assume that PsyDs are probably going to be more likely to teach in PsyD programs--start there. Then figure out what the credentials (# of pubs, pedigree, etc.) of the successful candidates are (i.e. the PsyD faculty beat out others for those positions--you gain some insight into why that is by reading their CVs, etc).

 

[wigflip]

I'm (any day now) a PsyD who adjuncts at a university. so yes it can be done. I'd echo the others' statements regarding networking and getting experience (of course in what job/career/profession is that not important). I guess I am alone in thinking the pay is actually decent (at least at this point in my career). Sure, given the amount of time it takes to create a course, if you only teach it once it's not great, but I reckon I'm making about $45-50 an hour.

Hey, congrats, sydb1367!! Best of luck. 👍

 

[PsyDr]

i hold a faculty position at a well respected university. It is 100% related to research.

Periodically I guest lecture in all sorts of departments.

I think last time someone asked me to teach a course, it was not worth my time to take it.

 

[sydb1367]

Hey, congrats, sydb1367!! Best of luck. 👍

thanks wigflip 😀

 

[valentinoRossi]

what about teaching in others countries, perhaps in Europe? Is the psyd well recognized outside of America?