The Appropriate Use of Vimentin

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I wish I can get CME by watching your path cartoon videos.
 
I see a lot of consult cases in which vimentin is ordered. I made a short video to help...educate...others about how and when to use vimentin.

http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/7106679/

Dude, holy crap that was hilarious. You just made my day after looking at 6+ prostate inside/ouside consults with saturation Bxs

BTW I know several prominent pathologists that would strongly disagree... but still, A+ on that.

//My name is Dr SBaitso. Tell me about your problems?
 
BTW I know several prominent pathologists that would strongly disagree... but still, A+ on that.

Really? Maybe I don't understand the issue as well as I think I do (I find that is the most likely scenario most of the time!). Could you briefly explain what they use it for and their rationale? Are these soft tissue pathologists or other subspecialties?

But thanks for the feedback. I just put it together after having maybe 5 consult cases, all of which had a vimentin ordered, and I guess I had to get on a soap box for a bit. Glad you guys enjoyed it! Maybe I will try to make another if I think of some other funny/frustrating scenario related to path. Any ideas?
 
I seem to remember having that conversation with one of my attendings a few years ago when I mocked vimentin. I don't remember much other than the conversation including a lot of "ifs", "mights", and "coulds", and concluded that that attending wanted vimentin among their spread of stains on certain kinds of cases. Having to remember all about the various immunostains is not something I miss.
 
My experience with it is predominantly in the realm of spindle cell tumors (as you can tell from the cartoon). Obviously, I am exaggerating the issue for the sake of fun, but I do see it ordered very often. While it certainly does stain most mesenchymal tumors, it also stains many epithelial tumors, especially those that mimic mesenchymal tumors (like the sarcomatoid squamous cell carcinoma, for instance). So it is only "helpful" when you don't really need any help (because you know by morphology whether you have a mesenchymal tumor or not). I am sure there are some uses for it, but on our soft tissue consult service (we actually see thousands of cases annually) it essentially never impacts the diagnosis one way or the other. To me, that speaks to the fact that it is not a very useful stain.

KCShaw, I once saw a consult from a forensic pathologist with an autopsy of a person with a supposed diagnosis (unconfirmed) of rhabdomyosarcoma. They sent us the slides and asked if we thought it looked ok for that and mentioned that immunos were not really in the budget for the ME office (seems like you guys have a reasonable approach to things!).
 
//My name is Dr SBaitso. Tell me about your problems?

Love the Dr. SBaitso reference. Ah, the mid-90's . . . those were the days. Sure, my PC only had 4Mb of RAM, but it was so new and exciting.
 
Really? Maybe I don't understand the issue as well as I think I do (I find that is the most likely scenario most of the time!). Could you briefly explain what they use it for and their rationale? Are these soft tissue pathologists or other subspecialties?

But thanks for the feedback. I just put it together after having maybe 5 consult cases, all of which had a vimentin ordered, and I guess I had to get on a soap box for a bit. Glad you guys enjoyed it! Maybe I will try to make another if I think of some other funny/frustrating scenario related to path. Any ideas?

Uterine vs. cervical endometrioid adenocarcinoma! Not perfect, but hey, it's vimentin.
 
We do a lot of backing-off on tumor diagnoses in FP. Fortunately not that many people completely fail to see a doctor before they die of cancer, and those that do may be among the older age group who don't necessarily have an autopsy performed even if they are a forensic case solely for lack of having their own physician to sign the death certificate (most FP's are willing to assume ASCVD in decedents over a certain age).

If they already have a well established diagnosis I probably wouldn't put a slide through. Those that get a slide I might only go as far as saying it's malignant, epithelial/carcinoma vs mesenchymal, etc. There's usually no benefit for splurging on immuno's which aren't in the budget. If there's a civil case brewing, I save enough tissue so the hired subspecialists can have at it if necessary. Families (and governments paying the bills) usually are satisfied to know whether a decedent had cancer or not, not what type/subtype it was or what molecular abnormality it carried. So, yeah.. we do a fair amount of "consistent with" or descriptive diagnoses, when it does come up. I will, however, occasionally use a special stain (PAS, mucin, oil-red-O, AFB/Z-N, iron/P-B, etc.) for some things, tumor or otherwise, as they're generally much cheaper. But I rather enjoy the primarily non-tumor pathology.
 
Love the Dr. SBaitso reference. Ah, the mid-90's . . . those were the days. Sure, my PC only had 4Mb of RAM, but it was so new and exciting.

I'm glad someone got that....

I had a trusty 386 in HS... Damn it was fast compared to my previous computer- A commodore 128. I think I ran DOS and Windows 3.1. At the time I wasn't sure why anyone needed all those annoying windows that took you ten clicks to get to the same location you could get with one long string of text.
 
Vimentin can be oddly useful in renal tumors (positive in some subtypes). Probably the only time I use it.
 
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