the end of urm classification?

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I found it funny that the girl sued UT over the race issue when she couldn't get in. Sore loser.
 
dmf2682 said:
Any thoughts on how this affects medical school admissions if at all?

http://m.cnn.com/primary/wk_article...:newsml:CNN.com:20120221:scotus-race-policy:1
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There should never have been a urm policy in the first place. And this is coming from a urm.

If you can't make it in on merit, then you don't deserve to be a doctor. The matriculation rates based on gpa/mcat for AA's are absolutely atrocious. I know someone who got into washington univ in st louis med with a 3.8 and a 27mcat. Guess what race he is?
 
Why do we expect college admissions to be blinded to race when nothing else in life is?
 
MedPR said:
There should never have been a urm policy in the first place. And this is coming from a urm.

If you can't make it in on merit, then you don't deserve to be a doctor. The matriculation rates based on gpa/mcat for AA's are absolutely atrocious. I know someone who got into washington univ in st louis med with a 3.8 and a 27mcat. Guess what race he is?
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Do you mean 2.8? A 3.8 and 27 isn't THAT bad.....even with the lower MCAT.
 
MedPR said:
There should never have been a urm policy in the first place. And this is coming from a urm.

If you can't make it in on merit, then you don't deserve to be a doctor. The matriculation rates based on gpa/mcat for AA's are absolutely atrocious. I know someone who got into washington univ in st louis med with a 3.8 and a 27mcat. Guess what race he is?
Click to expand...

In an ideal world, yes. In this world, no.
 
MedPR said:
There should never have been a urm policy in the first place. And this is coming from a urm.

If you can't make it in on merit, then you don't deserve to be a doctor. The matriculation rates based on gpa/mcat for AA's are absolutely atrocious. I know someone who got into washington univ in st louis med with a 3.8 and a 27mcat. Guess what race he is?
Click to expand...

Let's ignore the numerous individuals from every race that get in with low stats every year? The percentage of them is clearly higher among AA's, but let's not pretend that they're receiving some special privilege denied to other groups. Medical schools have shown that, up to a certain point, they are perfectly willing to accept students with "low" MCATs provided they bring something else to the table.
 
zwitterion34 said:
Have you ever faced this discrimination before? The story that comes to my mind distinctively is the story of Jian Li. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jian_Li
This person had a perfect 2400 on his SAT. Sore loser right?
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Yes, he is a sore loser. Didn't win with the current game's rules, then tries to change the rules. Still don't see how my comment was offensive.
 
Also since we are talking about admissions to undergraduate. This was a study done from three universities. For the SAT score: (From Wikipedia)

  • Blacks: +230
  • Hispanics: +185
  • Asians: –50
  • Recruited athletes: +200
  • Legacies (children of alumni): +160[34]
You add or subtract this value from your SAT score to get the newly adjusted SAT score based on your race... So for instance, (from a 1600 scale) a Black person just needs to score 1320 on his SAT to achieve a score of 1550. An Asian person needs a score of 1600 to obtain the same adjusted score of 1550. I think I see a problem.
 
SchroedingrsCat said:
Easy solution: discriminate based on parent income instead of race.
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Not an easy solution. Though race and SES are highly correlated, there are educational, income, and health disparities unique to race the span socioeconomic strata.

Though I agree, SES needs to get more attention than it has in the past, this should not be to the exclusion of other problems that are already well observed.
 
sliceofbread136 said:
Yes, he is a sore loser. Didn't win with the current game's rules, then tries to change the rules. Still don't see how my comment was offensive.
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So you are advocating keeping silent even when clearly they have been wronged. This kind of mentality will never solve any problems. Complacency leads to no action.

You simply label the victim as a sore loser. I don't think that is fair for you to pass judgement in this manner. 😎
 
sliceofbread136 said:
Yes, he is a sore loser. Didn't win with the current game's rules, then tries to change the rules.
Click to expand...

Not sure if you're trolling, but this is how our legal system works. In order to bring suit against a party, you have to demonstrate that you were personally damaged by whatever policy is in question.
 
I don't believe race should play any part of the admissions decision. Giving minority groups an advantage actually puts those groups at a disadvantage in the long run IMO. Race should just be left out of the equation entirely.
 
I think we should all be forced to inter-racially reproduce until a hybrid mixed race clan of Asites Blexicans is produced.
 
I never hear anyone complain about unqualified rich kids whose parents have connections or are Alumni. Hmmm I wonder why?
 
MedPR said:
There should never have been a urm policy in the first place. And this is coming from a urm.

If you can't make it in on merit, then you don't deserve to be a doctor. The matriculation rates based on gpa/mcat for AA's are absolutely atrocious. I know someone who got into washington univ in st louis med with a 3.8 and a 27mcat. Guess what race he is?
Click to expand...

Amen.
 
trackstr22 said:
I never hear anyone complain about unqualified rich kids whose parents have connections or are Alumni. Hmmm I wonder why?
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b/c it is less prevalent though I can provide you anecdotal evidence if you would like to start that thread.
 
trackstr22 said:
I never hear anyone complain about unqualified rich kids whose parents have connections or are Alumni. Hmmm I wonder why?
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You've never heard anyone complaining about that? I have. And I agree, it's just as wrong and unfair.
 
I like how almost every premed has a well thought out solution to the worlds problems -_-

Edit: may as well add my thoughts on the topic... @op I think this is a great thing and I can't wait to see it implemented.
 
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Narmerguy said:
Not an easy solution. Though race and SES are highly correlated, there are educational, income, and health disparities unique to race the span socioeconomic strata.

Though I agree, SES needs to get more attention than it has in the past, this should not be to the exclusion of other problems that are already well observed.
Click to expand...

Unless that is just a reiteration of race and SES being correlated, I'm not sure what you would be referring to.
 
trackstr22 said:
I never hear anyone complain about unqualified rich kids whose parents have connections or are Alumni. Hmmm I wonder why?
Click to expand...

Tbh, people do complain about that, too. It's a totally different issue though. Similar to affirmative action, it undermines meritocracy. On the other hand, it allows universities to offer larger scholarships to poorer students (and affirmative action students), due to greater contributions from alums.
 
theseeker4 said:
LOL, do a search. If you haven't heard any complaints about it, you haven't been paying attention!
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Yeah. Honestly, I hear people complain about this all the time. Fortunately, I love listening to complaints (Music to my ears, they are), and I generally like to butter up my complainers a little so they say something nice and juicy for me to remember forever.

Beware.
 
Spot.png
 
Sephiroth said:
Unless that is just a reiteration of race and SES being correlated, I'm not sure what you would be referring to.
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Sure I'll gladly be more specific.

Blacks with similar levels of education have lower levels of income, even if we bracket them into groups (the poverty, poor, lower middle class, upper middle class, affluent). In each group, we see the disparity persist. You can think of it as similar to gender income disparities.
 
tantacles said:
yeah. Honestly, i hear people complain about this all the time. Fortunately, i love listening to complaints (music to my ears, they are), and i generally like to butter up my complainers a little so they say something nice and juicy for me to remember forever.

Beware.
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lol.
 
Why isn't AA practiced in professional sports (NBA, NFL, NHL)? We need more Asians. 😉
 
That article basically describes me... same city, same issue. I didn't sue though... thought that would be a little extreme.
UT's system has to change. My friend, who was ~top 15%, 2300+ SAT score didn't get in. It's just ridiculous. He applied to Liberal Arts, btw. The top 10/8 % rule, and affirmative action have to stop.
 
ranson said:
Why isn't AA practiced in professional sports (NBA, NFL, NHL)? We need more Asians. 😉
Click to expand...

This would only be logical. Someone previously mentioned the point of diminishing return in the GPA/MCAT in relation to how successful you will be as a physician.

This logic can be further applied to the diminishing return of selecting the best athletes. I mean running a 40 yard dash in 4.8 seconds is pretty fast for an Asian. Even though Reggie Bush ran it in 4.33 seconds. That is only half a second apart.
 
zwitterion34 said:
So you are advocating keeping silent even when clearly they have been wronged. This kind of mentality will never solve any problems. Complacency leads to no action.

You simply label the victim as a sore loser. I don't think that is fair for you to pass judgement in this manner. 😎
Click to expand...

He wasn't wronged. It is clearly know that Asians have higher standards due to their over-representation in higher education. Those were the rules in place when he applied. He knew the standards were higher, so he went above and beyond. Unfortunately, it still wasn't good enough and he lost. Only then does he complain about the rules. In my opinion, that is a sore loser.

And I don't think the system is as flawed as everyone seems to think, and it will be in place until a better solution is found (which I doubt will be any time soon).
 
sliceofbread136 said:
He wasn't wronged. It is clearly know that Asians have higher standards due to their over-representation in higher education. Those were the rules in place when he applied. He knew the standards were higher, so he went above and beyond. Unfortunately, it still wasn't good enough and he lost. Only then does he complain about the rules. In my opinion, that is a sore loser.

And I don't think the system is as flawed as everyone seems to think, and it will be in place until a better solution is found (which I doubt will be any time soon).
Click to expand...

Oh wise one, I cannot argue with you anymore. You are absolutely correct and I hereby will adopt your perspective.
 
sliceofbread136 said:
He wasn't wronged. It is clearly know that Asians have higher standards due to their over-representation in higher education. Those were the rules in place when he applied. He knew the standards were higher, so he went above and beyond. Unfortunately, it still wasn't good enough and he lost. Only then does he complain about the rules. In my opinion, that is a sore loser.

And I don't think the system is as flawed as everyone seems to think, and it will be in place until a better solution is found (which I doubt will be any time soon).
Click to expand...

What? He was wronged. That's the whole point. The fact that asians are held to a higher standard is a flaw in the system. I do not understand your logic. "I don't think the system is as flawed as everyone seems to think", please explain the pros of the system.

Just imagine we're playing soccer. Whoever scores wins. Both teams have the same players. One of the teams' net is 100 ft large, while the other teams' is 2 ft large. Of course, the team who's scoring against the team with the 100 ft net wins. Yes they win, according to the "rules". But any sane person would agree that the winning team had an UNFAIR advantage. Thus, the sport's rule should be revised to where the size of the net is equal for both teams.
 
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