The third Texas "x vs. x" thread...

[sprinkibrio]

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So I've read posts on UTMB vs. UTSA and Tech vs. A&M. How about a UT Houston vs. UT Southwestern post? That happens to be what I'm deciding on... anyone with me or that can help me out? I loved both, but reputation and $$ seem to be calling me to SW lately. Thanks!

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

I didn't interview at UTH, and thus don't feel it really appropriate to comment, but I would probably pick UTSW.

 

[SportsMedMD]

Keep in mind your rank and usmle will be more importnat then the reputation of your medical school when applying for residency. Good luck ranking high in a school where more than half their kids scored 35 and above on the mcat (got that number from another thread).

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Good luck ranking high in a school where more than half their kids scored 35 and above on the mcat (got that number from another thread).

Yeah but things get flip flopped around in med school. Some of those 35ers will stay at the top, some will fall to the middle, and some will fall to the bottom.

I'm interviewing at UTSW ina couple weeks and I got my UTH acceptance. If I somehow get into UTSW, I would also have to think long and hard...

 

[SportsMedMD]

Yeah but things get flip flopped around in med school. Some of those 35ers will stay at the top, some will fall to the middle, and some will fall to the bottom.

I'm interviewing at UTSW ina couple weeks and I got my UTH acceptance. If I somehow get into UTSW, I would also have to think long and hard...

I competely agree, but i think it would be a mistake to think that everything will even out b/c some 35ers will be at the bottom of the class. How much more would you have to study to distiguish yourself academically when the majority of your class is already exceptional acedmeically?

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

I competely agree, but i think it would be a mistake to think that everything will even out b/c some 35ers will be at the bottom of the class. How much more would you have to study to distiguish yourself academically when the majority of your class is already exceptional acedmeically?

Mmm fair enough. I don't know. Actually perhaps because of all the cutthroat press and reports of exceptional students will make other good students want to go to other schools out of a belief that their students are inferior, leaving UTSW with "inferior" students, and so perhaps OP should go there now. Unless the exceptional students know that everyone knows this and then go to UTSW, in which case since the OP knows that they know what we know, should go elsewhere...

 

[SportsMedMD]

Mmm fair enough. I don't know. Actually perhaps because of all the cutthroat press and reports of exceptional students will make other good students want to go to other schools out of a belief that their students are inferior, leaving UTSW with "inferior" students, and so perhaps OP should go there now. Unless the exceptional students know that everyone knows this and then go to UTSW, in which case since the OP knows that they know what we know, should go elsewhere...

LOL u make a good point, but i would say that since half of UTSW's class is 35+, it's a safe bet to say the exceptional students are choosing to cut each others throats at UTSW. If i'm not mistaken, that would be more 35+ students then all of the other TMDSAS schools combined, haha.

 

[AggieJohn]

I had to make this very decision - UTSW vs UT Houston.


At my interviews, I admit I enjoyed UT Houston more. I was put off by the competion of Southwestern, or at least what I perceived to be the competitive atmosphere. After my interviews were done, I knew that these schools were my 1 & 2 and that I would have to decide.

Well, I got accepted to both and so I had to start thinking a little sooner than I thought. My fiancee has family in Dallas, but ignoring that fact, I still had to have other reasons to choose one school over the other.

Some things I considered:

• I've never lived in a big city. Houston = Dallas to me.
• UTSW consistently has higher board scores than UT Houston.
• UTSW has a better reputation in the academic/medical world.
• Parkland (UTSW) and Memorial Hermann (UT-H) are both county hospitals.
• After talking to a friend that goes to Dallas, UTSW now seems much less fierce. The whole grade scaling thing really seems like a non-issue.
• And lastly, from outset, a good amount of students are die hard UTSW fans - they would give anything to get an interview there, and then would give anything to be accepted there. Professors rave about the school. It may seem trivial, and even bad decision making, but I had to think, "If everybody feels so strongly about the school, there must be a reason."

I don't expect to dominate grade-wise in medical school. I feel very pumped and very excited about going to Southwestern. I feel that it will be academically challenging, and that the atmosphere will be one to push me to study harder, and try to do my absolute best. I feel if I could be in the top ~50 %, then I can probably match into whatever I want, assuming everything else falls into place. I don't expect to be of the 'P=MD' mindset.

 

[SportsMedMD]

I had to make this very decision - UTSW vs UT Houston. I feel if I could be in the top ~50 %, then I can probably match into whatever I want, assuming everything else falls into place. I don't expect to be of the 'P=MD' mindset.

UTSW is a great school, but i dont think top 50% match whereever they want.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

Ironically, I'm currently considering UTSA vs. UTSW. I don't have an acceptance to UTSA, but am considering ranking it #1 in the match (with UTSW #2.) I really like the location and the environment of the school. I liked UTSW too, but I am worried about the higher cost of living in Dallas (I need to buy a house.)

Am I crazy for even thinking about choosing UTSA over UTSW?

 

[aggiesarah2007]

Keep in mind your rank and usmle will be more importnat then the reputation of your medical school when applying for residency. Good luck ranking high in a school where more than half their kids scored 35 and above on the mcat (got that number from another thread).

I am sure the other thread gave the most correct info they could, but according to the info given at my UTSW interview, 101 people in the class had a 34+. That's only 43.9% and I know you're thinking gosh that's almost 50%, but its not. The MCAT scores were something I was definitely concerned about, but I realized by GPA really actually makes up for it.

I've only been accepted to UTH but I am strongly considering UTSW. Board scores are a concern I have with Houston also. Though I have heard at most of my interviews that your board scores depend on you and how hard you actually study, there is something to be said for consistency.

And john... 🙂 Memorial Hermann is actually a private, non-profit, hospital 🙂

I think what it all comes down to between UTH and UTSW is where would you rather live, where did you feel like you fit in, and how comfortable are you with HIGHLY competitive applicants at UTSW (I found that they were smart, but also very nice and more than willing to help me). I love UTH but UTSW also won me over because so many of the students asked what they could do to make me feel comfortable and what it would take for me to want to go there. They def do their part to make you feel special, even in a pack of outstanding applicants. 😳

 

[tinyT]

Ironically, I'm currently considering UTSA vs. UTSW. I don't have an acceptance to UTSA, but am considering ranking it #1 in the match (with UTSW #2.) I really like the location and the environment of the school. I liked UTSW too, but I am worried about the higher cost of living in Dallas (I need to buy a house.)

Am I crazy for even thinking about choosing UTSA over UTSW?

if you need a house and/or got a family it is understandable, you have to be able to live and function where you go to school

 

[msdoc]

I had to make this very decision - UTSW vs UT Houston.


At my interviews, I admit I enjoyed UT Houston more. I was put off by the competion of Southwestern, or at least what I perceived to be the competitive atmosphere. After my interviews were done, I knew that these schools were my 1 & 2 and that I would have to decide.

Well, I got accepted to both and so I had to start thinking a little sooner than I thought. My fiancee has family in Dallas, but ignoring that fact, I still had to have other reasons to choose one school over the other.

Some things I considered:

• I've never lived in a big city. Houston = Dallas to me.
• UTSW consistently has higher board scores than UT Houston.
• UTSW has a better reputation in the academic/medical world.
• Parkland (UTSW) and Memorial Hermann (UT-H) are both county hospitals.
• After talking to a friend that goes to Dallas, UTSW now seems much less fierce. The whole grade scaling thing really seems like a non-issue.
• And lastly, from outset, a good amount of students are die hard UTSW fans - they would give anything to get an interview there, and then would give anything to be accepted there. Professors rave about the school. It may seem trivial, and even bad decision making, but I had to think, "If everybody feels so strongly about the school, there must be a reason."

I don't expect to dominate grade-wise in medical school. I feel very pumped and very excited about going to Southwestern. I feel that it will be academically challenging, and that the atmosphere will be one to push me to study harder, and try to do my absolute best. I feel if I could be in the top ~50 %, then I can probably match into whatever I want, assuming everything else falls into place. I don't expect to be of the 'P=MD' mindset.

Just as a quick correction....Memorial Herman is a private hospital and is that primary teaching hospital at UTH. Students also do a lot of rotations at LBJ (which is a county hospital) as well as a few at MD Anderson, Methodist, etc.

 

[Hednej]

Just as a quick correction....Memorial Herman is a private hospital and is that primary teaching hospital at UTH. Students also do a lot of rotations at LBJ (which is a county hospital) as well as a few at MD Anderson, Methodist, etc.

True, Memorial Herman is a private hospital that has seen it's share of ups and downs but overall it's fairly nice.
Alright UTH vs UTSW, let me tell you that it is way way more easier to get to the top of UTH than to the top of UTSW. UTH students are hard core partiers, they don't nearly study as much as UTSW students. And a lot of the top students at UTH do place at some of the best residencies in the country, although not easily. So I think as long as you put in a good amount of work, you should be fine at either school.
If you wanna have fun, go to UTH.
If you're a hardcore academician, UTSW all the way.

 

[Boris Badenov]

UTSW >> UTH.

It's not even close. This decision should not be hard.

Chickening out because of perceived competition is probably the worst way to go about making this decision. As a fourth-year med student who now knows how things work better than most, I can tell you that pedigree means A LOT when it comes to matching into residency programs. Program directors think very highly of students who come from UTSW.

A slight difference in grades between candidates from two different schools will mean almost nothing, particularly when you consider that USMLE scores are standardized measures with which to compare academic achievement. Going to the stronger school can only help you there.

Keep in mind your rank and usmle will be more importnat then the reputation of your medical school when applying for residency. Good luck ranking high in a school where more than half their kids scored 35 and above on the mcat (got that number from another thread).

This kind of thinking is so flawed, I can't even begin to dissect it. This competition thing will have very little impact on your academic performance during your preclinical years (which are largely irrelevant when comparing candidates from different schools, thanks to step 1) and no impact on your clinical performance. In all likelihood, it's not going to mean the difference between AOA and not-AOA. Being a product of UTSW, on the other hand, will have a huge impact on where you end up.

If I were the OP, I'd take the obvious choice and run with it.

 

[SportsMedMD]

UTSW >> UTH.

This kind of thinking is so flawed, I can't even begin to dissect it. This competition thing will have very little impact on your academic performance during your preclinical years (which are largely irrelevant when comparing candidates from different schools, thanks to step 1) and no impact on your clinical performance. In all likelihood, it's not going to mean the difference between AOA and not-AOA. Being a product of UTSW, on the other hand, will have a huge impact on where you end up.

If I were the OP, I'd take the obvious choice and run with it.

It will however affect your ranking which affects where you place in residency even if your performance hypothetically isnt impacted. And from what i've been told ranking does matter where you place in residencies. Also, it's not about the act of competing, rather the people you are competeting with. I've heard from numerous students at southwestern that they most likely could rank very highly at other texas schools, but are just averagely ranked at SW although they do seem content with the position they are in. It's jsut something to factor in. Not everybody wants or should push themselves to their limits just for the "noble" pursuit of learning when there are other good, viable options available.

 

[djfir0]

ok, its my honest opinion that houston receives far too much hype for no reason. lets look at the facts, their board scores suck, their class schedule sucks if anything its on level with every other school other than baylor and southwestern. only thing that makes is desirable is the 1. the TMC, adn 2. the city. well for 1. you won't use it much your first year and you may elect to do all your rotations at the tmc from any school you go to anyways. 2. the city is great, but its loud crowded and expensive to live in...

with all that said NO BRAINER.. swestern all the way, you are going to one of the best schools in the nation.

with all that said i would never go to southwestern because i don't like competition to get in they way of friends etc... but that is just me and im illogical. go with southwestern over houston any day of the week.

edit: if i were you i wouldn't listen to much that is said in these forums.. cause in the end you will be the one spending four years at the choice you make

 

[potato51]

Folks, look at the actual school stats when you claim what the median MCAT at UTSW is. Look at the numbers they gave you in the interviewee packets. It's certainly not a 35.

Also, I'm getting the feeling people think hardcore studying and partying, especially at UTSW, are mutually exclusive when that's so not the case lol. We've been having class events during exam weeks for god's sakes.

In any case, pick the school you feel more comfortable with. Also don't give much thought to competition - I doubt many here would turn down a Harvard because they think they'd fare better rankwise at Podunk State School. And as a former research mentor for students of both Houston med schools, I can tell you there'll be gunnerism/competition anywhere you go.

good luck with your decisions~~

 

[Boris Badenov]

It will however affect your ranking which affects where you place in residency even if your performance hypothetically isnt impacted. And from what i've been told ranking does matter where you place in residencies.

Program directors aren't ******ed. They know the difference between medical schools. Take a gander at UTSW's and UTH's match lists if you don't believe me. You might not like to hear it, but where you come from matters a lot in the medical field; just ask any FMG.

We might as well start advising people to go to UC Davis over UCSF, UMass over Harvard, or DO school over MD school, so they can optimize that all-important "class rank" that nobody looks at when comparing applicants from different schools who all took the same USMLE. No offense, but some of the worst career advice ever has been dished out in this thread.

 

[HOLDENc]

I am having trouble determining Boris' stance on the issue.

 

[Texas Jayhawk]

Ironically, I'm currently considering UTSA vs. UTSW. I don't have an acceptance to UTSA, but am considering ranking it #1 in the match (with UTSW #2.) I really like the location and the environment of the school. I liked UTSW too, but I am worried about the higher cost of living in Dallas (I need to buy a house.)

Am I crazy for even thinking about choosing UTSA over UTSW?

I'm also deciding over whether or not to choose UTSA first. I'm originally from Dallas, and after looking at San Antonio, I definitely liked the housing options better. I think SW is a much better "name" school, but UTSA is on the rise and has always had a great reputation for producing excellent clinicians. After talking to physicins (including UTSW and Baylor alumni) who are involved in private practice and academic medicine, the feeling that I get is that UTSA is has greater respect than UTH, UTMB, or TT and A&M. UTSW is still ahead, and it's a great school, so it's a hard decision. I think when you pick UTSA, much of your decision is based on San Antonio, itself.

 

[sprinkibrio]

Wow, I'm glad I've got so many responses! I'll have to admit, a lot of the pull for me towards Houston has come from the facilities, TMC, and Rice Village area. The students were also refreshing after my four years at an uber competitive undergrad. But then again, so were the students at UTSW... From what I saw, they are less intimidating than I thought (not all have Ivy pedigrees thank god). The only thing holding be back from UTSW, like a lot of you had guessed, is getting to the top of my class.

To clarify how I see competing against 35Q classmates:
At a lot of our undergrads, classes were curved. A 94 could be a C if half of the class scored above you. We felt like we had less control over our grades, and for me, personally that lead to frustrated studying because I felt it would be ineffective. Now, at Southwestern, a 94 is an A no matter what the rest of the class does. Although we have more control over our grades, we have less control over our rank. Everyone could be getting a 94. But does that really happen at a school like Southwestern? How impossibly hard is it to be in the top third? Now, I'm not a stranger to working hard... and after four years of busting my butt to get to med school I'm not about to stop. But does anyone who goes there feel like sometimes all the studying in the world still won't get you to the top of the class due to your really smart classmates? Cause that would suck...

to jota: Have you looked in the Oak Lawn area? It's close by, and from what I've seen very nice 1br condos are around 100000. I'm guessing you're looking for bigger though. I remember at the interview, they put up a map pinpointing where students live, and a bunch seem to live in the suburbs without a problem. From what I've heard Addison is a fun, young suburb and one of the closest to the city, but it might not be cheap.

to jayhawk: I totally agree with you that certain physicians seem to think UTSA ranks above most other schools, although I've seen many people on SDN who are pushing UTMB over it b/c of board scores...?

I'm still leaning significantly towards UTSW, but I'd love to hear what more people think. I think it's a great option to rotate through the TMC 4th yr.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

But wait, it gets (a little) worse.

Biochemistry at UTSW is truly curved, so if you got a 94, but everybody else scored > 94, that 94 could THEORETICALLY end up being a C or something. I'll let any current UTSW students who might be eavesdropping on this thread comment on the actual numbers/cutoffs.

As far as I understand, however, only Biochemistry is graded that way. The rest of the courses are as you describe. If everybody scores > 90, everybody gets an A.

I hate to break it to you: if you were "riding the curve" to get your As in undergrad, I would wager that you will have a tough time making the top x% (you used x=33.3) in ANY medical school since the competition is far more fierce ANYWHERE. At any medical school, take the bottom ~90% of your UG Bio. classes, throw them out, and what's left is who you will be competing with. That's the sobering truth, so I agree that those who think that they can coast into a high class rank by attending a lower-ranked school are sadly mistaken.

Also, some of the things that Boris_Badenoff is saying are things that I have long suspected. Namely, your grades in preclinical work aren't the end-all-be-all of determining your rank. Remember that you have 2 years of rotations, clinical evaluations, etc. I really appreciate the MS4 perspective that he is giving, and I'm now, once again, thinking that the benefits of attending a higher-ranked medical school outweigh the cost savings that I could possibly realize from living in San Antonio. If you ask me tomorrow, however, the answer may be different 😛

I also agree with the poster that said that they couldn't see what people saw in UTH. Quite frankly, I always saw it as "that other" school in the TMC, without much of a personality of its own. Then again, I might also be subconsciously bitter because I was never invited for an interview there.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

to jota: Have you looked in the Oak Lawn area? It's close by, and from what I've seen very nice 1br condos are around 100000. I'm guessing you're looking for bigger though. I remember at the interview, they put up a map pinpointing where students live, and a bunch seem to live in the suburbs without a problem. From what I've heard Addison is a fun, young suburb and one of the closest to the city, but it might not be cheap.

Nope, I haven't heard of Oak Lawn, but thanks -- I'll add it to my list of places to check out. Yeah, since I have a family, I'm looking for probably at least a 4/2/2. I'm currently looking into Carrolton, Farmer's Branch, and Irving. I'm familiar with Addison and it is filled with restaurants/bars/etc, but I don't think there are too many places to live in Addison proper as it is not geographically very big, and, IIRC (I interviewed for a job at a company in Addison a few years ago) is more of a "commercial" neighborhood, rather than a residential neighborhood. Carrolton and Farmer's Branch border Addison to the Northwest and West, but I forget what parts of Dallas Border it to the East. All of those sections are pretty close to UTSW.

I'm still leaning significantly towards UTSW, but I'd love to hear what more people think. I think it's a great option to rotate through the TMC 4th yr.

Although the TMC might provide you with trivially better clinical exposure, Parkland is no slouch. You will get an EXCELLENT clinical education at Parkland, no doubt.

 

[SportsMedMD]

I dont think anybody thinks you can coast and make it to the top of your class. Obviously you need to bust your ass newhere you go to do well. But when there is such a big mcat differential between SW and the other TMDSAS schools, it's probably a hell of a lot harder at SW.

 

[OddNath]

ok, its my honest opinion that houston receives far too much hype for no reason. lets look at the facts, their board scores suck, their class schedule sucks if anything its on level with every other school other than baylor and southwestern. only thing that makes is desirable is the 1. the TMC, adn 2. the city. well for 1. you won't use it much your first year and you may elect to do all your rotations at the tmc from any school you go to anyways. 2. the city is great, but its loud crowded and expensive to live in...

First off, best of luck to all of you with your decisions.

But more importantly..I'm genuinely entertained by all this hearsay and gossip! Gotta love premeds 🙂 I'll address a little of it from above:
1) Our class schedule sucks? Really? At this point, 1st years only dissect in gross lab 1-2 afternoons/wk during 1st semester. And then the next 3 semesters are mostly 8am-noon, generally with one weekly lab in the afternoon.
2) "you may elect to do all your rotations at the tmc from any school you go to anyways"? Seriously? You can do each and every one of your *required* MS3 rotations wherever you want?
At my school..and I think this is true most places..your required rotations need to be done at your school's own teaching hospitals. During 4th year, though, you can do away rotations at other places. I understand that UTMB has a set up with some hospitals in Austin for MS3, but this is unique.
3) Houston is expensive to live in? Maybe compared to Galveston, but the housing market is pretty reasonable compared to other major cities. I pay $635/month for a spacious, new, 650 sq ft single apt near the med center.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

It's definitely true that Houston is one of the most expensive places to live IN TX. Here are the cost of living indices for all TX cities that contain Medical Schools. These represent what someone must earn in each of the following cities to have the same standard of living as someone earning $100k in College Station (which I thought to have the lowest cost of living of this batch, but I was a little bit off):

Dallas..............107,984
Austin..............107,135
Houston...........105,900
Galveston........100,749
San Antonio.....100,363
College Station.100,000
El Paso.............98,687
Lubbock............97,479
Amarillo.............95,863
Temple..............93,752

IMHO, $635 for a 1 BR apartment is expensive. I rent one of my houses (a 1500 square foot 3/2/2) for $875 here in Austin.

 

[sprinkibrio]

But wait, it gets (a little) worse.

Biochemistry at UTSW is truly curved, so if you got a 94, but everybody else scored > 94, that 94 could THEORETICALLY end up being a C or something. I'll let any current UTSW students who might be eavesdropping on this thread comment on the actual numbers/cutoffs.

As far as I understand, however, only Biochemistry is graded that way. The rest of the courses are as you describe. If everybody scores > 90, everybody gets an A.

I hate to break it to you: if you were "riding the curve" to get your As in undergrad, I would wager that you will have a tough time making the top x% (you used x=33.3) in ANY medical school since the competition is far more fierce ANYWHERE. At any medical school, take the bottom ~90% of your UG Bio. classes, throw them out, and what's left is who you will be competing with. That's the sobering truth, so I agree that those who think that they can coast into a high class rank by attending a lower-ranked school are sadly mistaken.

It sounds like you should be giving the advice on where to live not me 😉 Good luck with the choice!

Believe me, I wasn't riding the curve to get A's, I was fighting it. Did I even get A's? Lol, but that's exactly the reason why I really hope I will not be faced with the dilemma of no matter how hard I work, I'll never be at the top--which I guess you're saying could happen anywhere.

I really would like to hear from someone about the grading at SW. I've heard conflicting things, and over the years I know they have gone back and forth on curving/difficulty of tests.

 

[essence]

I'm kind of in the same boat as OP right now. Got an acceptance from UTH, and debating whether to rank SW first. My main attraction to UTH are also the environment and the TMC (wow!). So I've heard that residency programs do take into account that you have been doing your rotations at the TMC. Is this actually true?...even so, is that enough to compete with the higher ranking of SW?

 

[Boris Badenov]

I'm kind of in the same boat as OP right now. Got an acceptance from UTH, and debating whether to rank SW first. My main attraction to UTH are also the environment and the TMC (wow!). So I've heard that residency programs do take into account that you have been doing your rotations at the TMC. Is this actually true?...even so, is that enough to compete with the higher ranking of SW?

What specialty are you thinking about?

 

[baylormed]

What specialty are you thinking about?

Specialties at this level are not set in stone. Many of us will change our minds, and there is no way to know which ones of us will and which ones won't.

 

[kemper]

one thing that should be considered with your class ranking chances is that almost half of your overall GPA is going to be largely dependent on your people skills and not just how well you regurgitate facts....many people shine in their third and fourth years when they must interact with patients, hospital staff, and fellow students, even though they may have struggled in the classroom their first and second years.

 

[essence]

Well, I don't know for certain what specialty I would want to go into as it's hard to decide before experiencing everything in rotations. However, I do have a great interest in psychiatry and am considering pediatrics too.

So I'm not really leaning towards anything really competitive such as derm or orthopedic surgery so I'm thinking that I don't have to go to Southwestern. However, going to a school w/ a better reputation could never hurt, so I'm just wondering how much does being in the TMC really count?

 

[Rocket3004]

I'm surprised no one has done a Baylor vs. UTSW thread (or at least I haven't seen one personally)

 

[interstellar]

i guess b/c baylor is taking its sweeet sweeet ol' time... man i didn't even interview there, but their acceptances would have implications on a lot of us (ie move slots around)

Honestly IMO, i can understand the lure of UTH---TMC, the people, houston summers (jk hehe) But given the choice, im thinking the long term effects of attending UTSW override the short term of UTH. and you mentioned $$$ is also an issue that favors UTSW... so +1 point for them. Also if you have family issues that should help you lean one way or the other.

Good luck! Whatever you decide, you'll still be a doctaah 🙂

 

[kerplunk112]

i think ppl are deluding themselves when they think attending swt will hurt them in the long run...based on an inability to obtain a high class rank.... obviously the difficulty of the school is considered when applying to residencies

how about clinical experience ? from what i hear ms3's and 4 get more hands on experience at parkland than any of the other schools... legitimate reasons to consider are location cirriculum etc.

 

[SportsMedMD]

i think ppl are deluding themselves when they think attending swt will hurt them in the long run...based on an inability to obtain a high class rank.... obviously the difficulty of the school is considered when applying to residencies

Tell that to the 44% of the applicants from UTSW that are going into primary care.

 

[kerplunk112]

well is must be ranked 19th on us news primary care list for a reason...maybe more students are simpy more interested in primary care after their parkland experience. We cant assume simply because lots of ppl chose primary care its because they couldnt get more competative residencies....anyways and im not sure about this..but dont most schools count internal med as primary care? especially not knowing if these individuals will up completing a fellowship in cardio, infectious disease etc?

 

[SportsMedMD]

yea but they probably group like that for a reason. I would say most schools primary care %'s are internal medicine anyway, and you cant really say one school has better internal medicine group than anothers. UTSW primary medicine group is comparable to all the other texas schools. All things being equal, i'm guessing ranking matters more, reputation less.

 

[Texas Doc]

To me, the competitiveness of a particular school is related less directly to average MCAT scores and the grading system but more directly to the number of students seeking to enter competitive specialties. Generally, 40% of each class goes into primary care whether they want to or not. If less than 40% of a class desires to enter primarily care, then a competitive environment results. Some schools seem to balance a class better than others resulting in a less competitive environment.

Unfortunately, there is no way of knowing going in how your class will shape up. It could be that a particular school could match you into a more prestigious residency but decrease your chances of getting into the specialty of your choice. Perhaps another school could increase your chances of getting into the specialty of your choice but decrease your chances of getting into a more prestigious residency. Each must decide where their best chances lie and there is no one best school for everyone.

 

[future_dr_house]

where's the thread for the UTMB vs UTSA? I searched but couldn't find it.

Thanks!

 

[sprinkibrio]

To essence: (bc i've already decided on my school--this is no longer my thread)

Go where you are limited the least. If you're interested in a competitive field, go to UTSW. If you know you're not going to try for derm or optho, go to UTH. If you don't know at this point, choose UTSW because scores and rank being equal, a graduate from UTSW will be chosen over a graduate from UTH. Now, no one knows how well you will actually do at either school, so don't let that factor in on your decision unless you have a hunch that you will undoubtedly do bad at one or the other. For this, ask yourself do you work well surrounded by others who are equally dedicated and push you or do you work well around those who take a more casual approach? Do you prefer more structure or more personal study? Are you more interested in interacting/feel more comfortable with patients at a public hospital or a non-profit (I think most people would agree that the clinical education at these two hospitals is more or less equal)? These are the few things that can help you predict your grades ahead of time.

Have you ever done research? If not, going to UTH might limit your opportunities to explore it. If you already know you hate it, know that at UTSW you could feel left out from those doing research or like your interests don't fit with the school. If it's a must for you, obviously UTSW would be a better choice.

Which school in more convenient for you in terms of visiting family and friends? Do you already have a support group in one city? If the fancy city life of UTH (with Rice Village, the huge TMC with lots of people around) is what draws you, you can always live in Uptown (a cosmopolitan neighborhood in Dallas close to the hospital).

Look through the material they gave us at the interview. Picture yourself in some of the organizations. Go online and look at their class schedules. Plan out your day at each school including driving or taking the metro, when and where you'll work out, and add study time and activities. Look at the food and bars of the neighborhood you'll live in. Delve into it all at once (b/c you don't have much time left!) and which school you devote more time to researching might tell you something huge. I got only so far as UTH's interview materials and spent all my time planning my life at UTSW. Look up the c/o 2011 and 2010 facebook groups. Look up the myspace groups. See who you'll be spending four years with. Look through some of the old class threads on SDN and see which kind of people you prefer to work and play with.

What is it going to take to pull you of the ladder? Eg. when are you going to stop going to the best school/residency/job you get into and let other factors weigh in? For me the answer was not yet.

 

[SportsMedMD]

From what i've noticed in terms of reputation, outside of a few doctors and pre-med students, most laymen cant even distinguish between any of the texas medical schools besides Baylor... everyone i've talked to seems to know baylor but none of the other schools. It's weird, but understandable i guess. I had a person try to convince me the other day that UTSW wasnt even a school, and UTArlington was the only UT school in dallas... well there is an UTdallas and a UTSW, and he's an idiot, but i can understand how most people dont give a crap cuz there are so many.

That being said, I'm actually starting to not give a crap either... I think the excitment of going to a "reputable" school would soon wear off anyway in a matter of days once you realize how much work and competetive any med school is. Personally, I'm choosing my school based on which city i would like to live in the most, haha.

 

[baylormed]

It is true that most laymen don't have a clue as to which medical school is more reputable than another, unless you bring up big names such as Harvard or Johns Hopkins.

However, if we are going to become medical professionals, we are going to move in academic circles where people do know which school is where and have some idea of reputations. I'm not saying reputation is the most important factor in deciding where to go, or that it will save you if you have low grades. A good student with good grades will be successful wherever s/he graduates from. However, as spinkbrio said, there are some factors to consider based on the school's reputation for research, academic medicine, clinical experience, etc, and how they will affect your future goals.

Everyone has a different system for choosing as school, since everyone decides what's important for themselves, be it reputation, being close to family, cost of living, etc. It's a personal choice in the end.

 

[Texas Doc]

Personally, I'm choosing my school based on which city i would like to live in the most, haha.

I think you're on to something!!!

Its been debated over and over again on SDN and the general consensus is that reputation might have some advantage if you want to go into research or academic medicine. But if you want to be the best Doctor you can be and give your patients the best possible care that you can, then you can get there from almost anywhere.

However, as mentioned over and over, if your misery index is too high, then you may never reach your goal. So in the end, most of us are going to go where we think we will be the happiest and where we think we will have the best chance of getting to where we want to go.

 

[Rocket3004]

From what i've noticed in terms of reputation, outside of a few doctors and pre-med students, most laymen cant even distinguish between any of the texas medical schools besides Baylor... everyone i've talked to seems to know baylor but none of the other schools. It's weird, but understandable i guess. I had a person try to convince me the other day that UTSW wasnt even a school, and UTArlington was the only UT school in dallas... well there is an UTdallas and a UTSW, and he's an idiot, but i can understand how most people dont give a crap cuz there are so many.

That being said, I'm actually starting to not give a crap either... I think the excitment of going to a "reputable" school would soon wear off anyway in a matter of days once you realize how much work and competetive any med school is. Personally, I'm choosing my school based on which city i would like to live in the most, haha.

Right, I agree.
Talking to random family (even a few medical professionals, but not academcailly affiliated):

"I'm thinking about UTSW... in Texas"
"Oh you mean Baylor?"

But, when talking to (for ex.) my Biochem prof. he was like, ohh UTSW is a great program, very strong research etc. etc. and was happy that I might end up there.
Or a residency director: Parkland is a great place etc. etc.

Point is the people who should know of UTSW, did. And [I guess] that's what really "counts".

 

[theunremarkable]

Where is the 35+ MCAT score reported? I never knew it was so high.

 

[potato51]

Where is the 35+ MCAT score reported? I never knew it was so high.

That's because it's not true. The mean for the 2006 entering class is a 32.2, and the median is probably a 32-33.

 

[kerplunk112]

yeah there seems to be a discrepancy between msar or us news and world report...which lists the avg as 35 and the handouts we got during interviews..which is significantly lower..maybe their from different years but i doubt the acceptance pool would change that much .

 

[Anastasis]

yeah there seems to be a discrepancy between msar or us news and world report...which lists the avg as 35 and the handouts we got during interviews..which is significantly lower..maybe their from different years but i doubt the acceptance pool would change that much .

MSAR uses total accepted and they probably gave you total matriculated, which in theory would be lower if some of the higher scores chose to go OOS/Baylor.