Thinking about Med school - many questions!

[msmeow]

Advertisement - Members don't see this ad

I am a 31 year old mom of a 2 year old and will complete my masters in Public Policy and Public Health by Dec 2010 from Cal Berkeley. I have been doing research in global health with UCSF for the past 1.5 years, and had a 5 year career as a business analyst before going back to grad school. I took about 4 years off to complete 2 graduate degrees (still work on them) and to start a family.

Having worked as a global health researcher, I have been in touch/worked with a few MDs and am amazed with both their clinical and research work. I have always aspired to be a doctor, but always felt that I didn't have the caliber and aptitude to go to Med school. However, over the years, the desire to be a doctor has grown stronger by the day and I don't want to look back when I am 40, wondering if I should have given my dream to be a doc a real shot. Moreover, at some point in life I really want to practice global medicine and I think my education in public policy and public health will give me a well-rounded background.

I have been looking into post-bac programs in the area and have the following questions:
1. My grad GPA may end up being somewhere around 3.7. My undergraduate GPA is 3.8 (no science classes, I was a business major). Is that competitive enough for Med school?
2. I will finish my grad degrees in December 2010, which means I cannot start a formal post-bac until Fall 2011 (August 2011). I was thinking of taking Chem 1 this summer 2010, squeeze in Bio 1 Fall 2010, and Chem 2 + Bio 2 Spring 2011. I was then planning on starting at Mills in 2011. That way, I will have completed 1 year worth of sciences courses at the community college and 1 year at Mills (which has a formal post-bac). I am wondering if this is a good idea, and doing 1 year at the cc will put me at a disadvantage. Any suggestions?
3. So basically I will start my Med school at 33 or 34 and start my residency at 38. All the doctors in the extended family have discouraged me so far. They feel that non-trad older students don't add much to medicine and are hard to work with. I was wondering what the opinion on this forum is.
4. Besides research experience, what other kinds of experiences should I be acquiring in order to make my candidacy more competitive?
5. Should I be taking more classes than Chem, Bio, Org Chem and Phy? Do these additional classes help the MCAT scores?

Any suggestions will be so helpful. I just feel so scared even treading this road, but really see myself as a doctor more than anything else.

 

[2010houston]

Welcome! Here's one set of opinions....

1- That's a great GPA. Assuming your science GPA - which will be exclusively your pre-reqs, it sounds like - is as good, you should be in very good shape.

2- Have you considered doing an informal post bacc? I can't think of any reason why you'd need to do a formal one, and then you could start in Spring of 2011 rather than waiting till fall. You can do these as a non-degree-seeking student at almost any school.

3- As a nontrad starting med school @ 32 and daughter of a mom who went to med school at 37 back in the day, I don't think this is a problem at all, personally. Similarly, the docs I interviewed with were almost all very friendly toward starting a little bit older. Can't speak to the hard to work with part, but it seems like that would just vary by individual anyway.

4- Do you have research as a part of your public health background? All my research was in public health, and this wasn't seen as a disadvantage at all. Research is research, so don't discount the stuff you've done while employed and getting your grad degrees!! Do you have any clinical experience and any community volunteering experience? Both of those are almost required as well.

5 - A few schools require Biochem (check the ones you would be planning to apply to), and I think that's considered helpful for MCAT prep, as is physiology maybe? Cell bio? I would try to take a few upper level bios if you have time.

Best of luck!!

 

[tremulousNeedle]

I pretty much agree with what 2010houston wrote.
1. Your GPA is great. Medical schools look at two GPA’s, an overall and a science (or BCPM = biology, chemistry, physics, math) GPA, so make sure that your success continues into your BCPM courses as well.
2. Community college verses a name brand college doesn’t really matter when you are talking about taking extra courses beyond the degree(s) you have already earned. Most admissions committee members understand that not all applicants follow the traditional path to medicine (some big name programs may hold it against you if you took all of your prereqs at a CC, but they are by far the minority).
3. I think it is awfully arrogant for a physician to encourage or discourage anyone from entering into medicine. It is a career decision that requires a lot of sacrifice and only the individual can really decided what they want to do. Don’t get me wrong input from other physicians is priceless, but they have no authority to outright encourage or discourage someone this career path.
So the take home message is do what you want to do. “They feel that non-trad older students don't add much to medicine and are hard to work with.” I could write a 20 page response to why this comment is crap. It is true that the non-traditional student’s experience is different than the traditional student (your supervisors are often 10-15 years younger than you, everyone starts out at the bottom of totem pole regardless of your past experiences, etc). Again, though, if you want to be a doctor despite those potentially negative experiences then go for it. The whole not adding much to medicine comment, I don’t even understand the point they were trying to make. And as far being “hard to work with”, I have worked with many doctors that have followed the traditional path who were the biggest jerks I have ever met.
4. It sounds like you past life experiences as well as the research experience will be a big plus for you. Since you are removed from the undergraduate life and have a family, volunteering may be difficult and is probably not as important as it is for the traditional students. Hopefully, you’ll be able to demonstrate leadership experience with you past career / academic experiences. It is important for anyone considering applying to medical school, to log time shadowing physicians. One of the most important things you need to demonstrate in your application and during the interview is your motivation towards medicine and basic understanding of what you are getting into. Other experiences besides shadowing can accomplish this, but shadowing is by far the most common means to this end. There are other good threads on this site for non-traditional applicant preparation.
5. Beyond chem, o chem, bio, and physics: Some schools require or like to see biochemistry, genetics, and/or calculus (usually just one semester). These additional requirements are usually school specific. Other common courses are cell bio and micro.
-admissions committee interviewer / senior medical student (3 days left J)

 

[Law2Doc]

... All the doctors in the extended family have discouraged me so far. They feel that non-trad older students don't add much to medicine and are hard to work with. I was wondering what the opinion on this forum is....

You may need to get a new extended family, the ones you have are out of touch with reality. There are numerous articles out there about how nontrad older grads are sought after because they have fewer "entitlement" issues. The current generation of traditional grads (as well as college and other professional school grads) is often slammed about having unrealistic expectations in terms of salary and lifestyle workload, and employers (including medical practices) are more often attracted to older grads with prior work/life experience who don't have these notions of what they are entitled to. So the consensus out there, if you actually read the articles about what is going on in the field (rather than make crap up like your family does), is that nontrad older folks are easier to work with, as compared to their younger compatriots.

As for what they add to medicine, I suspect that any physician who is judging what others "add" to medicine probably is part of the problem, not someone really adding that much themselves. The 20 year old who practices for 30 years and retires adds the same as the 40 year old who practices for 30 years and drops dead on the job. It's 30 years no matter how you slice it. There are numerous nontrads who have risen to high level positions in the profession -- to deparment chairs, deans, hospital management -- thanks to some of their prior career background. Folks with prior successful careers have a ton to offer medicine, as compared to a 21 year old college grad who has never held a job. Someone straight out of college to med school simply doesn't bring as much to the table. Based on your above post, I simply would not take any advice from these unhelpful family members. They are focused on their own little tree and missing what has become of the forest around it.

 

[krs881]

It sounds like a great decision! I agree whole-heartedly with the previous posters. I have a similar background with global health and public health research, and I think this was probably one of the most important parts of my application, along with strong cGPA, sGPA and MCAT, all of which you look to be on your way to achieving. While the SO and I haven't had kids yet and I am a bit younger, there are lots of posters on this forum that have made it work for them in situations similar to yours. A few additional comments:
1. As a motivated post-bac student you will probably have a fantastic sGPA. I felt that the drive and focus I had helped me succeed in basic science classes that I probably would have done not nearly as well in while in college given my record at that time in large lecture-momorization classes.
2. I don't think a formal program is necessary. I did it all as a non-degree student. You can do that at a regular 4-yr, doesn't have to be a CC. I would imagine that whether your post bacc classes were taken as a formal program or not is going to be the last thing on AdCom's minds, as long as you excel in them.
3. Agreeing with everything the previous posters said. Though unfortunately we can't choose our family, we can choose who we get advice from -- especially when we know we are doing something a little out of the ordinary, but that we feel is right for us. Talk to doctors that you admire, who practice medicine the way you imagine you might (maybe some of of the MDs you've worked with), or that have taken a non-traditional path. I have never once heard that non-trads are hard to work with or that they don't add to the field -- anyone with your background will MOST DEFINITELY add to the field, and it's my impression that AdCom's know this, which I say because all the med students I know with professional backgrounds in public and global health (primarily former colleagues that applied in their mid to late 20s) got into top-10 or 20 med schools.
4. Agree with others. I never formally shadowed. I worked a couple summers at a peds office in HS-college and sat in on some consults, and I have worked directly with MDs and patients on numerous studies. If you haven't had other clinical experiences professionally, then shadowing is a good idea.
5. In other posts with similar questions I've mostly seen people saying that extra classes are not necessary for MCAT. They certainly aren't tested for on the MCAT, and it is questionable if they would give an advantage. If time is of the essence and your top schools don't require it, and your sGPA is looking great, I would not sweat it. I did nothing but the main 4 -- intro bio, chem, phys and orgo. Never had a school question me about it. Interviewers "got" my application/background and certainly didn't imply that I was missing some higher level science (or bench grunt work or shadowing for that matter!)

Good luck, what an exciting time for you!!

 

[msmeow]

Many thanks for your replies and many thanks for the encouragement. I really do appreciate it.