To re-transmit or not before ROL deadline? CS pass on 2nd attempt

[step2cs01]

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Just got the pass on 2nd attempt. They already have Step 1 and Step 2 CK. They do not know I failed first CS attempt. (AMG, above avg step 1, slight below avg CK)

My Question:

1. Do you think withholding CS exam hx is going to influence/hurt my ROL position for program if they do not contact about sending CS ?

2. How do you think re-transmitting and showing I failed and then passed will influence my ROL for programs?

cheers for any input 🙂

 

[ExcaliburPrime1]

I have no idea. I hope program directors / senior folks here can advise you.

I just wanted to say congratulations on passing!

 

[OldPsychDoc]

Well, they interviewed you without knowing that you'd passed, and you've passed, so now that's the main thing.
A few of us might give a grumble about the concealed fail, but most of us would dismiss it and move on once the pass is in hand.

 

[HarryMTieboutMD]

Ouch... the NBME double scammed you- glad you passed, though. Yeah most PDs (on the board and the ones I know in person) like to see the P so they know that if an applicant matches, he or she will indeed be able to start on time (ie, that an absent passing board score will not delay training licensure)

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

There are so many applicants without CS, it would take a very compulsive PD to go back and look. I think a fail will stick out, but few of us worry about the absence of it. What is the AMG pass rate for that thing anyway? I haven't seen it hold anyone up even if someone does fail it. About ten years ago I didn't invite an applicant with a CS failure and this person wrote me a compelling request so I invited them. He/She became the best chief resident I have had in a long time.

 

[bbkl123]

I also failed my CS and passed on 2nd attempt. I just noticed on the website of my #1 program which states that applicants must pass CS/CK on the first attempt without exception. I emailed the program coordinator with a PDF of my pass report for the CS, but didn't re-transmit on ERAS so they don't know that I failed CS the first time. Should I let them know what happened?

 

[Psychotic]

I also failed my CS and passed on 2nd attempt. I just noticed on the website of my #1 program which states that applicants must pass CS/CK on the first attempt without exception. I emailed the program coordinator with a PDF of my pass report for the CS, but didn't re-transmit on ERAS so they don't know that I failed CS the first time. Should I let them know what happened?

No.

 

[FlowRate]

There are so many applicants without CS, it would take a very compulsive PD to go back and look. I think a fail will stick out, but few of us worry about the absence of it. What is the AMG pass rate for that thing anyway? I haven't seen it hold anyone up even if someone does fail it. About ten years ago I didn't invite an applicant with a CS failure and this person wrote me a compelling request so I invited them. He/She became the best chief resident I have had in a long time.

The pass rate was 98-99% for US and Canadian MD students until a few years ago, when there was serious talk of no longer requiring US/Canadian students to take the exam. Instead, they changed the exam such that there's now about a 5% fail rate on the exam for US and Canadian students. It's really opaque what they're actually looking for now, which makes it all the worse if a student fails.

I don't remember why Canadian students were included in the statistics when I was reading about this, or if that was just a figment of my imagination.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Thanks FlowRate, now that the pass rate is 95%, maybe failing it might mean something but I'm just not sure what. It seems like it largely replaces the language proficiency test since the pass rates are so disparate between IMGs and AMGs.

 

[FlowRate]

Thanks FlowRate, now that the pass rate is 95%, maybe failing it might mean something but I'm just not sure what. It seems like it largely replaces the language proficiency test since the pass rates are so disparate between IMGs and AMGs.

My feeling is that it has more to do with how they score the test and less to do with actual clinical competence.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Just looking at how things have changed in medical education, there are several places where old folks can point and talk about walking to class up hill in both directions and in snow drifts that were higher. The two places were things are tougher I think are the CS and self tests.

 

[step2cs01]

hm, so transmitted it bc did not want to run into problem later. Partic bc my #1 wanted the pass reported so didn't want to look lame by sending pdf report and then them asking to re-transmit anyway. I prefer to be transparent within reason, as it would've been self sabotage to just update with a fail result prior to.

Eh, dunno how 'opaque' it is flow, given the one blurb in the content description for grading of exam. That being said yeah, pass rate is epic being 95% like you said so felt **** to fail.


thank you all for your srs helpful input.

 

[psychattending]

Back to the original question:
I care more that you passed it than you failed it once and then passed it. I try to tell all the applicants to send me their scores once they receive them. I tend not to send them a reminder later on about the CS unless I am having an email conversation about something else.

As of this moment I have about 15% of the interviewed applicants who have not supplied me with a CS result. A fair number of them were scheduled to take it in the Oct-Dec time frame. When I don't see a result for them, then I become concerned that they have not passed it. This concern is aggravated if the school's policy is to not give a student a MD until CS is passed. Given the high pass rate for AMGs, the concern is usually not enough to have a drastic effect on the ranking of an applicant. However, all things created equal, I will rank somebody with a CS pass above somebody without a score as the person without a score is a higher risk.

As an aside, I also have a small number of applicants (<5%) that have not released their CK score, yet. Not having that score will have a significantly greater negative impact especially if the Step 1 score is low. As with the CS, I don't care so much what the score is but that it was passed. Not releasing it suggests to me, that the exam was not passed.

 

[downwithDTB]

I try to tell all the applicants to send me their scores once they receive them...A fair number of them were scheduled to take it in the Oct-Dec time frame. When I don't see a result for them, then I become concerned that they have not passed it... As an aside, I also have a small number of applicants (<5%) that have not released their CK score, yet. Not releasing it suggests to me, that the exam was not passed.

Thanks for the helpful post. CS scores from Oct-Dec. just started getting released this week. I only had a single PD even mention CS/CK during interviews and none specifically asked that I update them. Would you want applicants who have post-interview updated their scores, perhaps with CS coming as late as this week, to e-mail you stating that they have been updated in ERAS or is ERAS enough for you?

 

[psychattending]

Yes, those scores just started coming out. Typically January scores don't come out in time for ranking.

I'm fine if they do update me. It is not required, though. When I have the conversation with the applicant, I just tell them to release the scores in ERAS once they receive them. I just check the ERAS site and see if new scores have come in.

 

[JKinSC]

Just got my CS pass this past week, and resubmitted via ERAS. Do PDs see this automatically, or should I email them? I only had a few ask me when I was going to get results.

 

[NickNaylor]

Keep in mind that there are a small number of programs that require a passing CS score in order to rank you. I looked into this because my CS was originally scheduled such that I wouldn't have my scores prior to the rank deadline. When I was looking, about 15-20% of programs had this requirement. I would maybe take a few minutes to verify that the none of the programs that you're interested in has this requirement as that may have a direct impact on your decision.

 

[psychattending]

PD will see the score if he/she opens your application and looks for it. We do not receive some type of alert. If you are concerned you could send a brief email alerting them to the availability of the score.