To those who did not get in clinical this year

[psychdocstudent]

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I haven't been visiting this site for a little while after I have known that I failed in 3 clinical doctoral interviews. I am somewhat struggling whether I should apply again this year as I am weighing options between a potentially new doctoral program in our department (not in clinical) or apply again. My concerns is mainly about age as I am in my early 30s.

I am not sure whether there is a thread that discusses about options now that you've already known you did not get in doctoral programs (in clinical and/or counseling). I would truly need some encouragement as the process and the wait afterwards has been pretty frustrating and somewhat demoralizing. Now when I tried to reply to a professor's feedback about interview I felt pain as I thought I could have worked harder in preparing this particular interview. For whatever reason I did not prepare well enough for this one and from the feedback that I received I felt that I get caught off guard. I found that I need a lot of motivation to start this process once again.

I hope to get some encouragement from those who have tried again and succeeded and/or those who are going to try again this year. For those tried again and succeeded, did you apply to the same program that interviewed you? What did you do differently to get in? IF I finally decide to apply again I am thinking of broadening the choices to include clinical, counseling, and psyDs. I applied to only clinical this past year.

 

[PsyDLICSW]

I haven't been visiting this site for a little while after I have known that I failed in 3 clinical doctoral interviews. I am somewhat struggling whether I should apply again this year as I am weighing options between a potentially new doctoral program in our department (not in clinical) or apply again. My concerns is mainly about age as I am in my early 30s.

I am not sure whether there is a thread that discusses about options now that you've already known you did not get in doctoral programs (in clinical and/or counseling). I would truly need some encouragement as the process and the wait afterwards has been pretty frustrating and somewhat demoralizing. Now when I tried to reply to a professor's feedback about interview I felt pain as I thought I could have worked harder in preparing this particular interview. For whatever reason I did not prepare well enough for this one and from the feedback that I received I felt that I get caught off guard. I found that I need a lot of motivation to start this process once again.

I hope to get some encouragement from those who have tried again and succeeded and/or those who are going to try again this year. For those tried again and succeeded, did you apply to the same program that interviewed you? What did you do differently to get in? IF I finally decide to apply again I am thinking of broadening the choices to include clinical, counseling, and psyDs. I applied to only clinical this past year.

I have been in your position before. It is demoralizing, painful, and difficult to feel like your best isn't enough for clinical psychology. Clinical psychology is extremely competitive, especially PhD programs. I applied to doc programs in clinical psyc, mostly PhD and some PsyD my first time around. I got rejected from everywhere except a professional school (which I don't recommend going to) and an unaccredited counseling program. So, I applied for an MSW program in my area and got an MSW instead becasue you can practice psychotherapy with an MSW. My second time around, I was much more successful because I was mroe realistic about what program I qualify for (PsyD programs mostly). I get so nervous at interviews that I decided to practice hard core with family and friends. I researched professors at the school I was applying to and read their articles to have something to talk about and ask questions. So, I applied to attainable programs and practiced my interviewing skills. I used the Insider's Guide to Graduate programs in Clinical and Counseling Psychology to see what schools I would be a good fit for.

When I got rejected the first time I applied, I reevaluated my career goals. I wanted to be a mental health practitioner and got an MSW just in case. I applied again and was successful. What are your career goals? If teaching and research is a career goal, then you can try for PhDs in otehr branches of psychology, but they are still competitive. You can get a PhD in other mental health fields like social work, counselor education, and marriage and family therapy if your research is mental health related. If you just want to be a therapist and don't have much desire to do assessments, then go for a masters in social work, counseling, clinical psych, counseling psyc, or marriage and family therapy. You do not need to have a doctorate in clinical psychology to do therapy. If you are more intersted in doing clinical work than research, you may want to apply for a PsyD. If you decide to do a PsyD, apply to programs housed in universities such as IUP, Indiana State, Rutgers, Marshall, Wright State, Xavier, Baylor, Pepperdine, and others. Do not apply to professional schools such as Argosy. Just trust me on this one.

I've been there and I know it's hard, but don't give up.

 

[ClinicalTrainee]

I completely agree with the previous poster that it is important to think about what you want to do on a daily basis as your career before you choose a program.

The other thing to think about is that the world of a clinical PhD program is often demoralizing even after you get in. Learning to do therapy can bring up a lot of anxieties and insecurities, getting papers rejected from journals often feels incredibly personal, and there's just a whole lot of work involved. Let's not even get into applying for internship.

I guess what I'm trying to say, in the nicest way possible, is that dealing with rejection and disappointment is par for the course, and this is coming from someone who loved graduate school in clinical. Talk to some students about the realities of the programs and the process and think about if you really want to deal with that. Absolutely there are resources for encouragement and support, but the path is hard enough that if you're really not committed to it, through thick and thin (kind of like a marriage), then it might be best to look elsewhere.

 

[cara susanna]

Yeah, wait until practicum or internship applications.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Yeah, wait until practicum or internship applications.

We're very fortunate in our program in that there is no formal practicum application process (you pretty much just tell your advisor what you'd like to do, and assuming the site is open to taking students, you're in)--one of the advantages to being the only APA-accredited clinical psych Ph.D. program in the area.

I definitely agree with this and the above post with respect to internship applications, though, and with the grad student lifestyle as a whole. Developing a "thick skin" and learning to deal constructively with rejection is definitely a skill you'll eventually develop to save yourself from being perpetually miserable. Not that grad school is all, or even mostly, about rejection; it's just that the rejections you do receive tend to be fairly powerful much of the time.

 

[cara susanna]

You are very lucky for that! Practicum applications were much more devastating to me than grad school applications.

 

[PsychPhDone]

(We don't have practicum applications either.) To the OP, you should know that many people don't get in on the first try. I didn't. I'm interested in a career in research, so I spent 2 years as a Research Assistant. I applied to several of the same programs, including places where I previously interviewed. From my experience, they've already made decisions (at least generally) before interviews, and I didn't prepare much for interviews beyond knowing my stuff and being familiar with each professor's work. I'd look into other ways to improve besides the interviewing stuff...and yes, the rejection stuff sucks, but it's par for the course.

 

[ClinicalPHD5]

I totally echo the sentiment here. Ironically, I didn't feel like I really needed therapy until I started graduate school! Now i need weekly psychotherapy, yoga, alternative medicine, and doctors to manage several health problems that developed while in graduate school. Applying to graduate school was a piece of cake for me personally compared to all the stress and dissapointment encountered on a regular basis. Even though i landed a solid APA internship, I feel that I have some serious resentment/anger and trauma over the process that has affected how I perceive this field overall. I have also heard horror stories about licensure/post-doc hours etc. Plus, we often work with some unstable clients that can affect our mental health as well. I know many people who have had clients attempting suicide or dying while they were in training, generally on internship.

You have to be extremely committed to stick it out or masochistic.....No wonder most of my cohort is on psychotropic medication.

 

[futureapppsy2]

I think in this field you are always getting accepted or rejected for something--grad school, practica, internships, conferences, publications, post-docs, jobs, grants, etc., etc. You really have to develop thick skin and good coping mechanisms. To quote my advisor, "No one gets standing ovations in grad school."

 

[Phipps]

I think in this field you are always getting accepted or rejected for something--grad school, practica, internships, conferences, publications, post-docs, jobs, grants, etc., etc. You really have to develop thick skin and good coping mechanisms. To quote my advisor, "No one gets standing ovations in grad school."

...so true. It seems like I am never good enough. I know I am which is important. I try to not take constructive criticism too personally or just protect myself. A professor in my program once said when I was applying to doctoral programs: if you get a rejection just B it of your A!! Thick skin sounds important to me!!!

 

[Phipps]

I totally echo the sentiment here. Ironically, I didn't feel like I really needed therapy until I started graduate school! Now i need weekly psychotherapy, yoga, alternative medicine, and doctors to manage several health problems that developed while in graduate school. Applying to graduate school was a piece of cake for me personally compared to all the stress and dissapointment encountered on a regular basis. Even though i landed a solid APA internship, I feel that I have some serious resentment/anger and trauma over the process that has affected how I perceive this field overall. I have also heard horror stories about licensure/post-doc hours etc. Plus, we often work with some unstable clients that can affect our mental health as well. I know many people who have had clients attempting suicide or dying while they were in training, generally on internship.

You have to be extremely committed to stick it out or masochistic.....No wonder most of my cohort is on psychotropic medication.

...goodness, gracious...is that something others here on the forum have experienced also? Just to prepare myself...psychotropic meds...that sounds alarming to me.

 

[roubs]

...goodness, gracious...is that something others here on the forum have experienced also? Just to prepare myself...psychotropic meds...that sounds alarming to me.

I don't think it's that bad for most people but I think the reason you see so many jaded opinions on SDN is because we have a some wide eyed applicants that seem to doggedly refuse to consider the downsides of this graduate degree.

 

[Phipps]

I don't think it's that bad for most people but I think the reason you see so many jaded opinions on SDN is because we have a some wide eyed applicants that seem to doggedly refuse to consider the downsides of this graduate degree.

I was partly taking this with some humor and some concerns. In my MS program I noticed that many people have issues, and I believe that many are drawn to the field partly because of that -which, when worked through is not necessarily a bad thing; also, I know of some (serious former substance user, others who take antidepressants, etc.) who were in my program and really struggled due to their issues without working them out...
on the other habd, I was concerned reading that in PO experience, health issues arose related to being in school...would be interesting to do some research around this.

 

[PsyDLICSW]

I totally echo the sentiment here. Ironically, I didn't feel like I really needed therapy until I started graduate school! Now i need weekly psychotherapy, yoga, alternative medicine, and doctors to manage several health problems that developed while in graduate school. Applying to graduate school was a piece of cake for me personally compared to all the stress and dissapointment encountered on a regular basis. Even though i landed a solid APA internship, I feel that I have some serious resentment/anger and trauma over the process that has affected how I perceive this field overall. I have also heard horror stories about licensure/post-doc hours etc. Plus, we often work with some unstable clients that can affect our mental health as well. I know many people who have had clients attempting suicide or dying while they were in training, generally on internship.

You have to be extremely committed to stick it out or masochistic.....No wonder most of my cohort is on psychotropic medication.

Wow! Bless your heart! I am really sorry you are having a bad expereince in graduate school. I am thinking about doing yoga to decrease stress. Does it help?

 

[graduatingsoon]

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[graduatingsoon]

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[Therapist4Chnge]

"No one gets standing ovations in grad school."

100% true.

If you get a, "that was well written" it'll feel like you just solved world hunger. Graduate school can be a humbling process. I never had to put much effort into my education to do well, though I ran into a few rough classes during my graduate training that made me feel like an idiot. Practica can be like that too, you go into a session with a plan...and then it implodes in the first 5 minutes because life happens. Getting kicked in the teeth a bunch of times "builds character" and helps you get thicker skin. There are great times too, which help make up for the low points.

 

[PsyDLICSW]

When i started graduate school, i was in my early 20's so I was very healthy both psychologically and physically. People would always tell me that I had a positive attitude and was very calm. That's the feedback i typically got from people about my personality. I also didn't feel that I "needed" therapy although i felt it was valuable. While in graduate school, i developed two medical problems (thyroid and another autoimmune illness that are both detected by tests). I do think it had something to do with graduate school since i have no family history of either problem and started during graduate school and i'm young. I do way more self-care than I did prior to graduate school, and still can say that I don't feel healthy and that grad school in clinical psychology is not really a good fit for people with medical problems because of how rigorous the programs are and the lack of support for people with medical problems among faculty etc. Health insurance is another issue as well since you are living in poverty while you attend the program and often cannot afford to pay for the university coverage. There are a few people who finished my program with medical problems but it took them 10-12 years to complete the program part-time (usually people finish in 5-6 years and who can really afford to stay in school for 10-12 years). I attend weekly therapy, yoga etc. and still find that this is not enough to handle the demands of a clinical psychology program. I would say that I am above average in my ability to handle pain and stress in general since i was not very stressed applying to college and graduate school (plus other stressors). Because of my persistence and pain tolerance (and partly because of how much time and money i already committed) i am able to stay in the program, but don't feel that its realistic for the vast majority with medical problems (not sure about psychiatric problems).

Anyways, I noticed that seveal of my collegues and peers developed medical problems (thyroid, migraines, and autoimmune illnesses) during graduate school even though they were young. I also noticed that many graduate students began taking psychiatric medications after they started graduate school as well. I wonder if other people noticed this trend somewhat? Its only after i reveal that i have medical issues that people bring up similar things. I personally don't take psychiatric medications but noticed that many collegues started to while in school to help them cope with the stress. I think that sometimes people with issues are drawn to this field--this has not been my experience in terms of my collegues and cohort (except a few outliers). I would say that clinical psychology can contribute to depression and anxiety in people who didn't have it before if they work with really difficult populations (suicidal clients or abuse victims) or don't match through the internship process ( i have seen this happen to people as well even though i didn't experience it myself). I hope people know about the risks in this field before going into it.

I have also had supervisors with medical problems and serious back issues etc who were young so i noticed that. They felt that the clinical work they did would contribute to flair ups even though they enjoyed the work.

Yoga helps with sleep and pain. I can't take classes at gyms/yoga studios because they are too expensive ($15-22 per class in my location).

Wow, after your story I feel fortunate that i have not developed any serious medical issues (I think). I have two masters degrees and i gained 15 pounds in my MSW program and anotehr 10 in my PsyD program. I exercise and it releives stress. However, in the pain of a clinical psychology program, food has become one of the only pleasures I have left in life. I eat out alot because it's less time consuming and easy and on the weekends, I travel to see my husband who goes to grad school 3 hours away and we eat out again. I am a pretty healthy eater on weekdays, but on weekends, I eat the wrong kinds of foods to unwind. Any advice on how to maintain a healthy diet while in graduate school and in a commuter marriage?