Too old and lost

[BigLazy]

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Hello all you med school hopefuls out there. I need some advice/guidence. I went to a good undergrad. school but did horribably in its premed. curriculum. When i graduated, my overall gpa. is about a 3.0 and my science gpa. has dropped to a shameful 2.9. Since graduation, I worked in research for about a year, got a couple of good publications. Now I'm in a graduate program earning a masters in biotechnology (which has been really awesome). I got a 29 on the MCAT(could've been higher if I didn't get a freakin 7 on verbal). I calculated my possible GPA after my first year of graduate school and it pulled my AMCAS gpa up to a 3.3 (still too low 🙁 ). My question is that will I still be a strong applicant for medical school. My undergrad. major was anatomy and right now I'm taking really cool classes on instrumentation and even some programming. So I feel like I can offer alot of experience and knowledge that most premeds. are not exposed to. I did my share of volunteer work and such. I just don't know if my GPA is gonna be my achiles heel forever?? HELP!!!

 

[Benign_foodtube]

Hey, the GPA certainly ain't too hot, but I wouldn't sweat it too much. Especially if you can explain it. It may even be worth (yikes!!) taking the MCAT again, but that's on you. In general, though, one thing I've learned about the whole pre-med thing is that there is no real standard rhyme or reason to a school's selection process. There is so much grey area there-- sure, many "top-name" schools and state schools have minimum score that can bar you, but if you apply to a variety of places, especially if you get all your materials in early (DO IT! DO IT! DO IT!), then all you'll need to do is be ready to explain the lower scores in the interview. Your extra activities and endeavors are certainly attractive to a committee. Also, you may wanna do some non-science/non-math activities (beyond the volunteer work, too), to demonstrate some "bredth of character"-- do some painting, get into rock climbing, whatever's clever.

Be yerself, and stand yer ground, and get things in early.

And good luck!

 

[liverotcod]

Unfortunately, graduate courses won't count in with your undergrad GPA.

From my experience, trouble in coursework will indeed follow you around, but isn't necessarily a deal breaker. You should take the MCAT again with a goal of 33+.

 

[BigLazy]

What is the admission's opinion of graduate coursework anyways, do they see it on the same level as undergrad. courses, or do they focus more closely to graduate work since it is more indictive of your academic progress (please be the latter)?

 

[X.O.]

What is the admission's opinion of graduate coursework anyways, do they see it on the same level as undergrad. courses, or do they focus more closely to graduate work since it is more indictive of your academic progress (please be the latter)?

Its the latter if you ace the MCAT and schools look for evidence that you can hack the work if everything else in your application looks good. Having two strikes against you ( a poor UGRAD record and mediocre/low MCAT) is hard to overcome for any competitive MD program here in the US.

 

[liverotcod]

What is the admission's opinion of graduate coursework anyways, do they see it on the same level as undergrad. courses, or do they focus more closely to graduate work since it is more indictive of your academic progress (please be the latter)?

This is a hotly debated question. Some argue that grad school grading is more lenient than undergrad and thus suspect as a measure of your ability. Others argue that success in the advanced coursework of a non-research grad program is seen as a better predictor of med school performance. Sounds like you would prefer the latter. Just be aware that the other position is likely partly true, too.

 

[jtown]

This is a hotly debated question. Some argue that grad school grading is more lenient than undergrad and thus suspect as a measure of your ability. Others argue that success in the advanced coursework of a non-research grad program is seen as a better predictor of med school performance. Sounds like you would prefer the latter. Just be aware that the other position is likely partly true, too.

i feel like it's a little bit "chicken and egg'...

are grad school grades generally higher because they already selected their students from a larger pool? or are the grades higher because grad schools give out higher grades and, thus, 'smart people' get them?

grad schools have a huge, vested interest in not failing their students. in addition to looking bad for their program, it means they wasted money and effort on you v. another applicant and that's not even considering if you're getting some sort of stipend from them..... and since a lot of grad student money/departments require that you get better than a 3.0 or you're out, that's usually how they inflate the grades.

i've got graduate (phd prog) and undergraduate grades on my transcript as well as 6 or 7 post-bac classes and the only comments anyone has ever made have been about my undergrad grades ( 3.4 in mech eng)... positive and negative comments....

 

[medstyle]

Hello all you med school hopefuls out there. I need some advice/guidence. I went to a good undergrad. school but did horribably in its premed. curriculum. When i graduated, my overall gpa. is about a 3.0 and my science gpa. has dropped to a shameful 2.9. Since graduation, I worked in research for about a year, got a couple of good publications. Now I'm in a graduate program earning a masters in biotechnology (which has been really awesome). I got a 29 on the MCAT(could've been higher if I didn't get a freakin 7 on verbal). I calculated my possible GPA after my first year of graduate school and it pulled my AMCAS gpa up to a 3.3 (still too low 🙁 ). My question is that will I still be a strong applicant for medical school. My undergrad. major was anatomy and right now I'm taking really cool classes on instrumentation and even some programming. So I feel like I can offer alot of experience and knowledge that most premeds. are not exposed to. I did my share of volunteer work and such. I just don't know if my GPA is gonna be my achiles heel forever?? HELP!!!

look, not everyone can get into med school. you're close, but no cigar. Either get ur MCAT up, or apply to both US and carribean schools.

THats basically the most honest, BS less advice i can give. Most schools won't even interview you if you don't make cut offs. So take the mcat in april, apply early, and see how it goes. No one cares about ur activities until ur at ur interview, and even then they don't care much because they have their own questions to ask.

goodluck on ur mcat.

 

[MrTee]

A low undergraduate GPA is going to follow you around forever, there's no getting around that. A high post-bacc and/or grad GPA combined with a high MCAT can mitigate a lot of the negative effects of that undergraduate gpa, but it certainly won't put you on equal footing with a person who has a 3.5+ undergrad gpa and a similar MCAT. I don't know what's considered a "strong" applicant, but if you mean is it possible to get >10 interviews and multiple acceptances with ~3 undergrad gpa, the answer is yes. You would need to increase your MCAT by 4-5 points and show some serious dedication to your schoolwork as well as clinical work and research.

 

[dswonger]

All the best to you! You need to work on the school you wish to attend. I had mediocre undrgrad, 3.0 n Business, worked for 10 years, took prereqs w/a 3.75, took mcat and did the median. No research, no healthcare experience and i'm in. how?, Why? Focus on getting an interview!! I focused on the school i wanted and found docs in there willing to let me shadow, then interviewed the resident director, residents, students, got to know the admissions people (not in a bugging sort of way), had a couple of friends that are docs and rode all the ponies i had until they gave me an interview. Then u rock em' @ the interveiw 😀. Once you get the interview, you turn everything they give you into a niche you will fill and how your mediocre early life was training for where you are today and you are now with maturity, committment, etc. Remember, this is a sales job. You are selling yourself. Never forget that.

Now, I would try to get an interview with where you are. Study like you life depended on it for the April Mcat, b/c it sounds as though you haven't gotten one or the one you want/know you should be at. The last thing i have for you is to find and know (not just yeah i know, but really KNOW) Jesus Christ! It is truly supernatural that I have been admitted. I rely on Him daily and if you knew the my whole story 😱 , you would be on your knees @ this very second. No BS.

 

[AnotherDork]

Hi... I'd like to offer you some encouragement. Your story is pretty much the same as mine (your GPA stats are identical). I applied two years ago and didn't get in anywhere, then started a grad program in medical science, and now am happy to say I have gotten a couple of acceptances for the class of 2009.

Basically, if you can show them you are motivated, and that a little adversity didn't make you quit, you are more valuable to them than someone who kicks ass in school but just sort of picked medicine because their parents told them to or whatever, because you will be a better doctor in the end. And that makes the school that chooses you look better too.

Of course, the question "How come your undergrad grades are so low?" DID come up in every single interview, so have a good answer for that.

So, keep at it! Perseverence counts for something. Good luck.

 

[NontradICUdoc]

set up a meeting with adcoms to discuss. Get the info from the horse's mouth


nuff sed

 

[liverotcod]

set up a meeting with adcoms to discuss. Get the info from the horse's mouth


nuff sed

Only problem is, which school? The advice you get will vary greatly from school to school, and most applicants don't have a whole slew of adcoms sitting around waiting to meet with them. I actually think the variety of viewpoints here on SDN is a better information source, if approached with maturity and skepticism. With a little self-confidence and several months of regular reading, you can become quite expert in the application process and the "odds."

 

[NontradICUdoc]

Only problem is, which school? The advice you get will vary greatly from school to school, and most applicants don't have a whole slew of adcoms sitting around waiting to meet with them. I actually think the variety of viewpoints here on SDN is a better information source, if approached with maturity and skepticism. With a little self-confidence and several months of regular reading, you can become quite expert in the application process and the "odds."

while the information here on SDN is valuable you need to take things with a grain of salt. Don't forget that we are competing against each other for spots in medical school. While I am sure that many people are not that mean, there is always the possibility.

What you need to do is start going to open houses of schools you are interested in, see if you can sit with a dean to discuss your situation, and visit the school.

As a non traditional student, I am a member of the National Association of Non Traditional Students (oldpremeds.org) and there is a convention coming up. There will be speakers from medical schools. That is where you can get the info from.

My UG GPA was piss poor (2.5), I am months from getting a Masters degree with a GPA of 3.7 while working full time and raising a family. My meeting with the Dean of admissions of my #1 choice went well. His response was that as time goes on the UG GPA is more and more ancient history. And because of my GPA now he KNOWS that ifI get in I can do the work.

Point is, talk with the schools before getting discouraged by the people on this board. Not for nothing, this IS the PRE-ALLO forum, we are APPLYING to medical school and NOT on any admissions comittee.


P.S. Nice Histone