Transfering to school's PA program

[yesyay111223]

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I am starting med school this fall. However, I am a bit worried about the 300K debt I am looking at. Also I noticed that PA programs are shorter, less debt, and I can earn more earlier.
I want to do PA for the same reasons I am going to medical school. Just worried about the financial burden and a strong desire to be working and earning sooner.
My school has a PA program, and I was thinking of asking if they would let me change programs. But I don't want to lose my spot unless I can actually transfer. The program has slightly different requirements and I wouldn't have the 500 hours of experience before entering. Not sure if this has ever been done.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Why are you asking us? Ask your school. Also, it's pretty troublesome you didn't figure it out before.

 

[DoctorKrieger]

I'd be really surprised if the PA school class has spots left this close to the fall semester, and they may have already started classes. My guess is you'd have to give up your seat and go through the PA school application process this year with no guarantee of acceptance. Have you called the PA program with these questions? They're the only people who can give you a real answer, not random SDN people.

 

[Brownman55]

The program has slightly different requirements and I wouldn't have the 500 hours of experience before entering. Not sure if this has ever been done.

The clinical hour requirement is the big factor here. I doubt they would let you switch without the prior experience. Most, if not all PA programs, require a huge amount of these clinical hours before letting anyone in.

Obviously no one here will be able to answer the question better than your school, so just ask and see.

 

[Low Flow]

I am starting med school this fall. However, I am a bit worried about the 300K debt I am looking at. Also I noticed that PA programs are shorter, less debt, and I can earn more earlier.
I want to do PA for the same reasons I am going to medical school. Just worried about the financial burden and a strong desire to be working and earning sooner.
My school has a PA program, and I was thinking of asking if they would let me change programs. But I don't want to lose my spot unless I can actually transfer. The program has slightly different requirements and I wouldn't have the 500 hours of experience before entering. Not sure if this has ever been done.

It's pretty short-sighted to make this kind of decision based solely on the "financial burden" of medical school loans. Even with interest, a physician will earn substantially more over an entire career than a PA. If you don't want to be in school as long or want to practice sooner, that's another decision entirely. Just remember, it would be unfortunate if you were to trade a career as a physician for that of a PA, only to regret your impatience later on in life.

 

[mpdoc2]

It's pretty short-sighted to make this kind of decision based solely on the "financial burden" of medical school loans. Even with interest, a physician will earn substantially more over an entire career than a PA. If you don't want to be in school as long or want to practice sooner, that's another decision entirely. Just remember, it would be unfortunate if you were to trade a career as a physician for that of a PA, only to regret your impatience later on in life.

But in reality this sort of person would never be able to complete medschool. So s/he should drop out and enroll into an easier program next year.

 

[W19]

I am starting med school this fall. However, I am a bit worried about the 300K debt I am looking at. Also I noticed that PA programs are shorter, less debt, and I can earn more earlier.
I want to do PA for the same reasons I am going to medical school. Just worried about the financial burden and a strong desire to be working and earning sooner.
My school has a PA program, and I was thinking of asking if they would let me change programs. But I don't want to lose my spot unless I can actually transfer. The program has slightly different requirements and I wouldn't have the 500 hours of experience before entering. Not sure if this has ever been done.

I will give you the PA phone number that I worked with who made such decision 25+ years ago and still regret it to this day... Both him and his brother got accepted to med school the same year, but he decided to go PA because of the same concerns in your post... His brother is successful interventional cardiologist making half a million a year. That PA is working for a county department of health in FL making less than 80k/year according to him... I had no way of verifying if that was a true story, but I know his brother is a cardiologist...

 

[OnePunchBiopsy]

I am starting med school this fall. However, I am a bit worried about the 300K debt I am looking at. Also I noticed that PA programs are shorter, less debt, and I can earn more earlier.
I want to do PA for the same reasons I am going to medical school. Just worried about the financial burden and a strong desire to be working and earning sooner.
My school has a PA program, and I was thinking of asking if they would let me change programs. But I don't want to lose my spot unless I can actually transfer. The program has slightly different requirements and I wouldn't have the 500 hours of experience before entering. Not sure if this has ever been done.

Have you shadowed PA's as much as physicians? Just curious, because from what i have learned so far, salary and debt may not be the best indicators for the job you would be happiest with.

 

[DokterMom]

What were your reasons for discounting PA in favor of MD in the first place? For me, as appealing as some aspects of PA work are, I could never sign up for a lifetime career knowing my [controllable] qualifications would forever doom me to 'second fiddle' decision making.

 

[ACSurgeon]

I am starting med school this fall. However, I am a bit worried about the 300K debt I am looking at. Also I noticed that PA programs are shorter, less debt, and I can earn more earlier.
I want to do PA for the same reasons I am going to medical school. Just worried about the financial burden and a strong desire to be working and earning sooner.
My school has a PA program, and I was thinking of asking if they would let me change programs. But I don't want to lose my spot unless I can actually transfer. The program has slightly different requirements and I wouldn't have the 500 hours of experience before entering. Not sure if this has ever been done.

PA school is very competitive. I would be shocked if they just took you without a full application just like everyone else. And be prepared to answer some difficult questions about why PA and not MD, and how you know for sure you won't change your mind about PA like you did about MD

 

[ACSurgeon]

I will give you the PA phone number that I worked with who made such decision 25+ years ago and still regret it to this day... Both him and his brother got accepted to med school the same year, but he decided to go PA because of the same concerns in your post... His brother is successful interventional cardiologist making half a million a year. That PA is working for a county department of health in FL making less than 80k/year according to him... I had no way of verifying if that was a true story, but I know his brother is a cardiologist...

And I'll give you the number to 10 PAs who are thrilled to have done PA and not MD.

I'm sure having a brother who's an MD influences your outlook. Probably having had an acceptance and knowing that you "could have" been a doctor will also change outlook on things

 

[ACSurgeon]

But in reality this sort of person would never be able to complete medschool. So s/he should drop out and enroll into an easier program next year.

Probably true

 

[GrapesofRath]

Good chance this is just troll at work here but if it's not a) if you don't want to go to med school don't rush into whatever else you want to do because if you couldn't take the time to realize the commitment medicine was before doing it your going to make more stupid mistakes rushing into whatever field you feel like pursuing today b) The 500 hour clinical hour thing is kind of like how a school will list you need a 24 MCAT to apply. A 24 isn't competitive to any MD school unless we are talking extreme circumstances. Say with the hour requirement for PA. There are many many PAs who accumulated 2000+ hours of clinical exposure. Hell when PA schools list the percentile rank of clinical hours, the 75th percentile at a number of schools is in the 4000 range.

 

[DoctorLacrosse]

Good chance this is just troll at work here but if it's not a) if you don't want to go to med school don't rush into whatever else you want to do because if you couldn't take the time to realize the commitment medicine was before doing it your going to make more stupid mistakes rushing into whatever field you feel like pursuing today b) The 500 hour clinical hour thing is kind of like how a school will list you need a 24 MCAT to apply. A 24 isn't competitive to any MD school unless we are talking extreme circumstances. Say with the hour requirement for PA. There are many many PAs who accumulated 2000+ hours of clinical exposure. Hell when PA schools list the percentile rank of clinical hours, the 75th percentile at a number of schools is in the 4000 range.

it always blows my mind that you can become a physician with barely any clinical experience whatsoever other than handing out blankets in the ER, but need thousands of hours to be a PA. MD programs should have some higher clinical experience requirements also IMO.

is it because we'll have more rotations/residency to make up this experience later, where they need it on the front end to make up for lack of exposure through their training?

 

[slopes23]

it always blows my mind that you can become a physician with barely any clinical experience whatsoever other than handing out blankets in the ER, but need thousands of hours to be a PA. MD programs should have some higher clinical experience requirements also IMO.

is it because we'll have more rotations/residency to make up this experience later, where they need it on the front end to make up for lack of exposure through their training?

Specifically though, only 500. Not quite thousands, but carry on. Please expound on how you feel med students should jump through more hoops because that "clinical exposure time" is going to be helpful for medical school.

Only up to a certain point is it beneficial. There is are reason why being an EMT helps but, not all that much really. Why? Because its a different mindset and training, and its honestly easier to teach a blankslate student how to think like an MD than to retrain an EMT-B the same thought process because the entire time they thing oh I rode in the back of an ambulance for 6 months, I got this, you don't need to show me.

 

[OnePunchBiopsy]

it always blows my mind that you can become a physician with barely any clinical experience whatsoever other than handing out blankets in the ER, but need thousands of hours to be a PA. MD programs should have some higher clinical experience requirements also IMO.

Considering PA applicants need only the GRE, the MCAT is the great equalizer. I'll stand by my statement like Heimdall in Thor!

 

[Dr. America]

If you're that concerned go for PA school and open up an MD spot for somebody who can handle delayed gratification. You don't want to wake up in the middle of M3 and realize that you have another 4+ years of masochism until you start making decent money. Though as others have said you almost certainly would not be able to just "switch programs" for the fall

 

[Psai]

it always blows my mind that you can become a physician with barely any clinical experience whatsoever other than handing out blankets in the ER, but need thousands of hours to be a PA. MD programs should have some higher clinical experience requirements also IMO.

is it because we'll have more rotations/residency to make up this experience later, where they need it on the front end to make up for lack of exposure through their training?

So doing thousands of hours of blankets is better than tens of hours and somehow constitutes training

 

[ACSurgeon]

So doing thousands of hours of blankets is better than tens of hours and somehow constitutes training

Most PAs didn't accumulate their hours folding blankets. Most had jobs of varying experiences. Obviously none are as rigorous as rotations or residency.

The real argument here is that MDs do thousands of meaningful hours of training in medical school and residency that PAs don't, hence not needing to accumulate much before starting medical school.

 

[ACSurgeon]

it always blows my mind that you can become a physician with barely any clinical experience whatsoever other than handing out blankets in the ER, but need thousands of hours to be a PA. MD programs should have some higher clinical experience requirements also IMO.

is it because we'll have more rotations/residency to make up this experience later, where they need it on the front end to make up for lack of exposure through their training?

They only get two years of school including rotations. They need more pre-reqs to make up for that. They do a good job requiring courses to make their one didactic year efficient. Not sure there can be a substitute for rotations, as any clinical experience you get before med school or PA school is before you know anything.

 

[GadRads]

it always blows my mind that you can become a physician with barely any clinical experience whatsoever other than handing out blankets in the ER, but need thousands of hours to be a PA. MD programs should have some higher clinical experience requirements also IMO.

is it because we'll have more rotations/residency to make up this experience later, where they need it on the front end to make up for lack of exposure through their training?

You are yet to see the hoops you will need to jump.. We need less hoops, not more.

 

[DoctorLacrosse]

So doing thousands of hours of blankets is better than tens of hours and somehow constitutes training

I don't think it would be realistic to get thousands of hours handing out blankets. like most PA students, you'd have to get that experience in other ways, like having a real clinical job.

I'm not saying there should be more hoops as it's already crazy enough. I'm saying the current prioritized hoops seem to be off.

EDIT: I admittedly failed to really think about the major differences in training between the two fields prior to making my initial post, so I currently find myself disagreeing with myself partially too lol. I guess I mostly just expect people to have some idea of what health care really entails to make sure medical school is for them. I see too many regret posts these days.

 

[Darth Doc]

I am a PA about to start my MS2 year. I don't regret doing PA first because I didn't know I'd love medicine as much as I do. I know a lot of PA's who love what they do and are glad they didn't go to med school. Some, like me, decided to become MDs and others wish they could go back but they're at a point in their lives where they can't. It's a decision you need to make - make it for the right reasons.

You will need to apply to next year's PA class with experience hours and won't be able to just jump into a class. It's not like changing from a major in sociology to english. Here's a link to the application service most PA programs use: http://help.unicas.com:8888/caspaHelpPages/about-caspaoverview/index.html It will give you details on what it takes to apply to physician assistant schools. Yes, you would have to give up your med school slot.

 

[pd1112]

I don't think it would be realistic to get thousands of hours handing out blankets. like most PA students, you'd have to get that experience in other ways, like having a real clinical job.

I'm not saying there should be more hoops as it's already crazy enough. I'm saying the current prioritized hoops seem to be off.

EDIT: I admittedly failed to really think about the major differences in training between the two fields prior to making my initial post, so I currently find myself disagreeing with myself partially too lol. I guess I mostly just expect people to have some idea of what health care really entails to make sure medical school is for them. I see too many regret posts these days.

Basically no one knows what it really entails, because there's no experience like the real thing. Other than having an s/o or older sibling go through it in front of his/her eyes, typically no amount of witnessed/shadowed experiences or stories heard from others would be enough of an alarm to turn someone away.

 

[DoctorLacrosse]

Basically no one knows what it really entails, because there's no experience like the real thing. Other than having an s/o or older sibling go through it in front of his/her eyes, typically no amount of witnessed/shadowed experiences or stories heard from others would be enough of an alarm to turn someone away.

I anecdotally know two ER techs and a CNA who decided medicine wasn't for them based on their couple years of work experience in health care. they're all going into law enforcement and other things instead of health care, so maybe it would only be helpful to tell you "health care or no". hard to say

 

[pd1112]

I anecdotally know two ER techs and a CNA who decided medicine wasn't for them based on their couple years of work experience in health care. they're all going into law enforcement and other things instead of health care, so maybe it would only be helpful to tell you "health care or no". hard to say

Agree, I should've been more clear - I was speaking more to not knowing what medical school entails.

 

[ACSurgeon]

I am a PA about to start my MS2 year. I don't regret doing PA first because I didn't know I'd love medicine as much as I do. I know a lot of PA's who love what they do and are glad they didn't go to med school. Some, like me, decided to become MDs and others wish they could go back but they're at a point in their lives where they can't. It's a decision you need to make - make it for the right reasons.

You will need to apply to next year's PA class with experience hours and won't be able to just jump into a class. It's not like changing from a major in sociology to english. Here's a link to the application service most PA programs use: http://help.unicas.com:8888/caspaHelpPages/about-caspaoverview/index.html It will give you details on what it takes to apply to physician assistant schools. Yes, you would have to give up your med school slot.

Unless his acceptance can be deferred for a year. Some schools allow that with no strings attached. Others might have stipulations about doing something productive or not applying to other programs.

 

[takeurmeds02]

What were your reasons for discounting PA in favor of MD in the first place? For me, as appealing as some aspects of PA work are, I could never sign up for a lifetime career knowing my [controllable] qualifications would forever doom me to 'second fiddle' decision making.

omg, this entirely. This is what turns me off so much to the profession.

 

[razor]

What were your reasons for discounting PA in favor of MD in the first place? For me, as appealing as some aspects of PA work are, I could never sign up for a lifetime career knowing my [controllable] qualifications would forever doom me to 'second fiddle' decision making.

This.

OP, I was troubled with this same decision a few years back and I decided that if I follow through with medical school I really doubt that I will ever wish that I had only gone to PA school. While if I had gone to PA school there was a good chance that I was going to feel like I am doing the same job as my supervisor except can't call myself a doctor and have limited my salary for the rest of my life. Also, it's not that uncommon for urgent and primary care clinics where the evening and weekend shift staff are the non-physician providers while the physicians work 9-5 mon-fri.

There are plenty of pros to being a PA if you have lots of clinical experience, are older and don't have the energy for 4 yrs med school plus 4 yrs residency, and on and on. They still make a very good living and can have lots of autonomy depending on their supervising physician.

 

[zeppelinpage4]

I also had some uncertainty with choosing.

As difficult as the 8+ years of training for med school are. Remember that, after the schooling is done, that is the career you'll be pursuing for the rest of your life. So, when all is said and done and you're practicing day in and day out, which do you see yourself enjoying most? If it's PA, then great, the less years of schooling is an added bonus. If it's MD/DO you'd prefer, then yeah, you'll need to go through a lot of training, but in the end you'll be doing something you like.

That's just how I see it anyways.

 

[Yadster101]

Jc how does med school compare to PA school? Is there a difference in subjects, difficulty, hours studying?

I am a PA about to start my MS2 year. I don't regret doing PA first because I didn't know I'd love medicine as much as I do. I know a lot of PA's who love what they do and are glad they didn't go to med school. Some, like me, decided to become MDs and others wish they could go back but they're at a point in their lives where they can't. It's a decision you need to make - make it for the right reasons.

You will need to apply to next year's PA class with experience hours and won't be able to just jump into a class. It's not like changing from a major in sociology to english. Here's a link to the application service most PA programs use: http://help.unicas.com:8888/caspaHelpPages/about-caspaoverview/index.html It will give you details on what it takes to apply to physician assistant schools. Yes, you would have to give up your med school slot.[/QUOT

 

[Psai]

Jc how does med school compare to PA school? Is there a difference in subjects, difficulty, hours studying?

same general subject topics but longer, more difficult, more depth and breadth, more hours studying

 

[W19]

I looked into some PA curriculum and I don't think they cover neuroanatomy and histology. Maybe neuroanatomy is incorporated into their anatomy course. I am not sure if histology is that useful anyway...

 

[Psai]

my friend took some neuroanatomy as a pa. they covered a lot less though

 

[ACSurgeon]

my friend took some neuroanatomy as a pa. they covered a lot less though

I promise that my knowledge of neuroanatomy is no more than most PAs. I knew more as a student, but it's such garbage that you don't remember most of it anyways

 

[olivarynucleus]

Dude, I shadowed a doc who had NPs and PAs working under him. The NPs/PAs were extremely jealous of the doctors, and to some extent of me( even though I was only a premed at the time) they were like " Oh you want to be a doctor, good for you. I could have been one if I wanted to. We do the same thing but they get paid twice as much" My point is yes, you'll make money, yes you'll have less debt, but 15-20 years from now will you be still happy only being the "assistant"?

 

[W19]

Dude, I shadowed a doc who had NPs and PAs working under him. The NPs/PAs were extremely jealous of the doctors, and to some extent of me( even though I was only a premed at the time) they were like " Oh you want to be a doctor, good for you. I could have been one if I wanted to. We do the same thing but they get paid twice as much" My point is yes, you'll make money, yes you'll have less debt, but 15-20 years from now will you be still happy only being the "assistant"?

I heard that a lot when I worked as a nurse to the point that I 🙄 whenever a midlevel came close to saying it...

 

[MyNameWasUsed]

Hi OP, I was kind of in your situation a year ago, except I didn't apply to med school, I just decided to change to PA instead. It's unlikely you can just transfer to the PA program. You'll have to reapply next year. If your desire to change profession is motivated by money then you should take the MD acceptance. In the long run MDs make more it's just fact. I was pre-med and changed to PA now because I didn't want to spend my 20s in school and then residency. I think PA is a better route if you want to live your youth instead of struggling throughout medical school and god knows how long of a residency.

There are pros and cons to everything in life. PAs saying they regret not being MDs and MDs wishing they didnt even enter the medical profession. I don't think one can base their decision off regretful MDs or PAs opinions because the grass will always be greener. Base your decision off what you want in life. I wanted financial stability and a balanced lifestyle at an earlier point in life.

 

[olivarynucleus]

I heard that a lot when I worked as a nurse to the point that I 🙄 whenever a midlevel came close to saying it...

So is nursing school tougher or med school?

 

[W19]

So is nursing school tougher or med school?

Med school is a beast... I was working 40 hours/wk and partying almost every weekend in nursing school.

 

[Psai]

So is nursing school tougher or med school?

lmao
a more apt comparison would be nurse practitioner school vs med school and even then it's not even close

 

[Kaustikos]

my friend took some neuroanatomy as a pa. they covered a lot less though

Here is the brain. It has vessels and does stuff. The end.