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what are some types of med school curriculums and what are your thoughts?
Types of medical school curriculums? pros and cons?
- Thread starter don't you dare
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Classic Flexner: Anatomy, Physiology etc are separate classes. ie, MS1 is basics; MS2 is pathologies
Organ systems based, or vertically integrated: MS1 + MS2 go by organ systems, normal and pathologic. Students seem to like this arrangement better than Flexner.
Problem Based Learning, PBL: Students learn about a subject through the experience of solving an open-ended problem found in trigger material. ie, case is presented in dyspnea, and worked outwards through the science and clinical aspects. Very labor intensive on faculty. Seems to be one of those loved or hated things, no middle ground.
Team Based learning, TBL: It's the latest fad in medical education. Curriculum is flipped, lots of self-study. Students work through questions individually, then as a team. Penalizes students who like lecture attendance. Data exists that this style improves retention.
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There are many ways of considering this question. There are the traditional 2 year basic science programs followed by 2 years of research/clinical work. The other main option is the 1.5 year basic science curriculum, followed by 2.5 years of research/clinical work. Schools with this latter option often emphasize research and this compressed basic science curriculum allows for more research time. Some schools encourage or allow a 5th year, with options for dual degrees or additional research. Timing of Step 1 boards is often after the clinical year in the 1.5 programs, and is more typically immediately after 2 years in those with 2 preclinical years.
Some schools have mostly problem-based learning small group sessions, while others still heavily favor lectures. Obviously the small group learning really should have mostly mandatory sessions, or otherwise the students do not learn from each other (and faculty do not want to prepare for small groups if no one shows up). The schools with mostly lectures sometimes record them - and if not mandatory - many students will listen to them later at 2x speed and not go to the lectures. This is a shame bc then students do not get as much of a chance to form a good community with each other and they can not ask questions of a lecturer.
Grading is also different and may affect one's experience as a medical student. A few schools are entirely pass/fail throughout all 4 years. The disadvantage is that residency programs might find it hard to determine which of the students are top students to be highly recruited for competitive residencies. Many other schools are pass/fail in preclinical years and then graded in some way in the clinical years. A prospective student needs to be honest with himself or herself and figure out how they work and study best. Some students really need regular tests with grades to keep up with the material and others work best in a more self-directed manner. As a woman who entered medical school with two children, and had a 3rd as a medical student, I really benefitted from attending a medical school that favored self-directed learning.
Some schools have mostly problem-based learning small group sessions, while others still heavily favor lectures. Obviously the small group learning really should have mostly mandatory sessions, or otherwise the students do not learn from each other (and faculty do not want to prepare for small groups if no one shows up). The schools with mostly lectures sometimes record them - and if not mandatory - many students will listen to them later at 2x speed and not go to the lectures. This is a shame bc then students do not get as much of a chance to form a good community with each other and they can not ask questions of a lecturer.
Grading is also different and may affect one's experience as a medical student. A few schools are entirely pass/fail throughout all 4 years. The disadvantage is that residency programs might find it hard to determine which of the students are top students to be highly recruited for competitive residencies. Many other schools are pass/fail in preclinical years and then graded in some way in the clinical years. A prospective student needs to be honest with himself or herself and figure out how they work and study best. Some students really need regular tests with grades to keep up with the material and others work best in a more self-directed manner. As a woman who entered medical school with two children, and had a 3rd as a medical student, I really benefitted from attending a medical school that favored self-directed learning.
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Colleague, can you share what format your school uses? PM if needed. My school is moving to TBL. As an aside, U VM has eliminated lectures almost entirely for TBL. I think Wright State has done the same, but I don't remember to what degree.
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UVM transinitioned to this within the last year or so, correct? If so, I’d be interested to know what their Step I scores for the class year that started in this curriculum is compared to the few previous years before it. There is a prevailing notion on SDN that students can and do study better for Step I when they have non-mandatory lectures and lessons (because they have more flexibility to self-study/study when and how they want—I think this is a common complaint on the DO side), so I wonder if UVM’s curriculum shift will show any noticeable differences in scores or not.
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There are online tests you can take to see what kind of learner you are , auditory, visual, and whether PBL or lecture based pathways would be best for you.
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UVM transinitioned to this within the last year or so, correct? If so, I’d be interested to know what their Step I scores for the class year that started in this curriculum is compared to the few previous years before it.
You and everybody else in medical education!
There is a prevailing notion on SDN that students can and do study better for Step I when they have non-mandatory lectures and lessons (because they have more flexibility to self-study/study when and how they want—I think this is a common complaint on the DO side), so I wonder if UVM’s curriculum shift will show any noticeable differences in scores or not.
There are plenty of schools that have non-mandatory lectures, so it's the TBL model itself that will be tested for Step I results. For what it's worth, our first cohort of students who were our pioneers with a partial TBL had the best performance ever on COMLEX last year. Their performance on Step I was biphasic. One subgroup scored equal to the MD student median, while a second group scored some 10-15 points less. There was no gradation. Imagine two rocket-shaped peaks on the histogram, instead of a bell-shaped curve. We have no idea why this was.
You and everybody else in medical education!
There is a prevailing notion on SDN that students can and do study better for Step I when they have non-mandatory lectures and lessons (because they have more flexibility to self-study/study when and how they want—I think this is a common complaint on the DO side), so I wonder if UVM’s curriculum shift will show any noticeable differences in scores or not.
There are plenty of schools that have non-mandatory lectures, so it's the TBL model itself that will be tested for Step I results. For what it's worth, our first cohort of students who were our pioneers with a partial TBL had the best performance ever on COMLEX last year. Their performance on Step I was biphasic. One subgroup scored equal to the MD student median, while a second group scored some 10-15 points less. There was no gradation. Imagine two rocket-shaped peaks on the histogram, instead of a bell-shaped curve. We have no idea why this was.
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I've interviewed at 2 schools where the first year is preclinical and the 2nd year are the required clinical rotations. 3rd and 4 the year are used for research and exploring specialty interests. They use a combination of lecture and TBL. Obviously I'm not attending either of these schools just yet, but I found the concept interesting. I'm also applying MSTP so having the clinical years before my PhD might help me decide which specialty is a great for for me and then use that to inform my research.
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What school(s) are these? they sound fun.
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Vandy, Duke, Harvard, Dell, Michigan IIRC all have 1 yr preclinical but with different preclinical formats (HMS and Dell do a rly heavy PBL curriculum, Michigan has PBL but more lecture heavy still iirc).
Personally, the biggest things I am considering curriculum wise are: True P/F without AOA > True P/F > P/F >>>>>>> Grades. And Clinical before Step/PhD > no Clinical before Step/PhD. That’s about it. I figure I’ll adapt to whatever quirks are at any school just like every other student whose ever done it
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Problem based learning. True P/F is a pass fail curriculum where grades and class rank are not internally ranked or reported in any way. Most schools have pass fail but they still track your grades for the purpose of reporting your rank to residencies when you apply or determining AOA. AOA is alpha omega alpha, the national med school honor society, like a md version of pbk. Being aoa can have some effect on your competitiveness for residency. It is typically desirable to eliminate any potential source of competition during med school to increase quality of life, but everyone is different.
