UCLA vs. UOP - a 2012 thread

[Teeth12345]

---

Members do not see this ad.

Hello fellow people,

I know that the UCLA vs UOP topic has been debated a lot on here - I've been reading all the past threads over and over again. But they're all mostly from a couple years ago and I feel that so much has changed since then...ie the boards are now pass/fail.

I am having a really hard time deciding between these two schools. I feel they're both great but in different ways and with completely different philosophies. I don't know if I want to specialize yet because I'm waiting to actually go to dental school before setting my mind on a specialty. Here's how I've been thinking about it in my head:

UOP: great clinically, EXCELLENT facilities, students were nice and seemed genuinely passionate about dentistry, it's in the awesomest city in the world; BUT the transition to the new facilities might be rough, 3 years is fast and even at the interview they told us that there isn't any room for reflection

UCLA: great reputation for sending to specialties, has a campus feel/football team (I get to relive college 😀), part of me wants to experience living in LA because I've been in Northern CA my entire life, p/f grading will lessen stress; BUT the boards are now pass/fail so I'm not sure what p/f grading and p/f boards is going to mean for specialties, I've heard rumors that it's not the best clinically, the facilities were not as nice as those of UOP (current students: how important are facilities and should they be a big factor in my decision?)

So what do you guys think? If there are any current UOP/UCLA students who could chime in, I would appreciate it. Thank you!

 

[ushaseos]

I want to know more about this too (for 2013 though). Almighty and brilliant SDN community, we eagerly await your answers...

 

[Double Bonded]

UCLA: $287,182
UoP: $349,479

http://dent.osu.edu/admissions/COST of ATTENDANCE - 2011.pdf

They're 2 of the best schools in the country but go to UCLA because of the cost (....and because I'm on the waitlist for UOP 😀).

 

[385835]

that is a great pdf

 

[aroundthecorner]

UCLA: $287,182
UoP: $349,479

http://dent.osu.edu/admissions/COST of ATTENDANCE - 2011.pdf

They're 2 of the best schools in the country but go to UCLA because of the cost (....and because I'm on the waitlist for UOP 😀).

I think the price says enough.

However, if you do want to take into account facilities, I think it is important to look at the background you are coming from. If you are coming from a public undergrad, you are probably used to okay facilities, but if you are coming from a private undergrad, you are probably used to top notch facilities.

I'm coming from a public undergrad, so I have no problem with the okay facilities. Also you might want to take into account that when you get out of dental school and find a job, not all offices will have top notch facilities, since it is expensive to have the newest equipment and if you are starting your own office you probably can't afford the newest equipment and if you work for someone older, it might not be in their best interest to buy the newest equipment if they are planning on retiring soon.

I also don't think pass/fail on the boards will matter much because dental schools already have their reputations. Same as undergrads, some schools are known for grade inflation, some schools are known to be demanding, and some schools as known to be easy. Even though there is no official ranking of dental schools, I think it is plausible to predict the general order, not exact, but close enough.

 

[peerless218]

The school guarantees the student body that the transition to the new facility will NOT affect students in anyway. They will make sure everything is ready to go 100% and move during one of the 4 breaks we have each year. They're shooting for winter break of 2014 I think. The only thing you will have to maybe worry about is to move to a new apt half way through the year.

 

[John Durian]

Too much debt for UOP. SDN is overrepresented by UOP folks.

My vote always goes to the cheaper school.

And UCLA's facilities aren't bad. I mean, you're gonna be sitting in a chair with a typodont in a mannequin all day anyway... how much technology do you really need?

Plus, we're a 10 minute walk to the undergrad campus 😉

 

[John Durian]

Here is pretty much everything you need to know about UCLA: http://www.dentistry.ucla.edu/about-us/strategic-plan/reports/20102011_Annual_Report.pdf

 

[Timpson]

UCLA all the way. Great school, great location, in a great city to live in while you are young. It is competitive, but P/F curriculum takes out the edge. Easy to specialize, less debt, etc, etc.

 

[JBieber]

can't believe you're defending ucla during finals week...

Too much debt for UOP. SDN is overrepresented by UOP folks.

My vote always goes to the cheaper school.

And UCLA's facilities aren't bad. I mean, you're gonna be sitting in a chair with a typodont in a mannequin all day anyway... how much technology do you really need?

Plus, we're a 10 minute walk to the undergrad campus 😉

 

[dr1989]

i am not a dental student but i have been working as an intern at the dental school for the past 2 years-ive met a few of the professors and know the oral pathologist prof quite well

overall from the vibe i get the dental students seem quite content there-they are always joking and chatting with each other so it doesn't seem to be cut throat..again this could be because of the whole p/f

as some previous members mentioned-the facilities aren't top notch. when i first stepped onto the dental campus a few years back i was quite surprised. Being UCLA and all I expected the dental campus to be a bit newer-theres def a few things that have been there since the 80s. one of the professors even has an old school kodak projector in his office that looks like a huge tv/microwave...clearly it was not that 😕

but if you are someone who is looking for an affordable program that is still top notch i would pick ucla. and it is in a nice area and 10 min away from the undergrad campus...overall i think its a good school. it would be a plus if they did some remodeling though

 

[Nateftw]

UCLA: $287,182
UoP: $349,479

http://dent.osu.edu/admissions/COST of ATTENDANCE - 2011.pdf

They're 2 of the best schools in the country but go to UCLA because of the cost (....and because I'm on the waitlist for UOP 😀).

Well, getting out a year early is AT LEAST worth 50k. I won't get into exactly how much it's worth because there are just so many factors. So now you are comparing 299k (UoP) to 287k (UCLA)...in which case, the difference shouldn't be a deciding factor for the school.

Anyways, to the Op. Go to the school that you interviewed at and found to be the most comfortable. Do you like LA? Do you like SF? 3 years or 4? UoP is moving, that can be a downside (during the move) or a benefit afterward. UCLA is as always going through budget cuts and they will likely continue due to the crappy economics of california (and the US). These threads are kind of pointless because both are great schools and which one is "better" is entirely subjective. You can't go wrong with either.

 

[Nateftw]

The school guarantees the student body that the transition to the new facility will NOT affect students in anyway. They will make sure everything is ready to go 100% and move during one of the 4 breaks we have each year. They're shooting for winter break of 2014 I think. The only thing you will have to maybe worry about is to move to a new apt half way through the year.

Ferillo said the move will be in the Summer of 2014 even though the new school will be completed by winter break. So you will not have to move to a new apartment half way through the year, you can move during the 3-4 week summer break

 

[dantemac]

I really think you have a dilemma here between a shorter program/more expensive school. I would go to Pacific just because it is 3 years. The debt may be a little more, but you will be out quicker and into your career.

 

[iralex801]

Definitely UCLA. Both are great schools and one is cheaper. Furthermore, UCLA has a beautiful campus. Plus socal >>>>>>>>> norcal.

 

[dantemac]

Definitely UCLA. Both are great schools and one is cheaper. Furthermore, UCLA has a beautiful campus. Plus socal >>>>>>>>> norcal.

This is the flip side of the argument lol

 

[iralex801]

This is the flip side of the argument lol

haha yeah you can't go wrong with either. Just depends on factors that you as person would personally like. For example, if I was an older applicant with a family, I'd def choose UOP. Or If I knew 100% sure that I did not want to specialize (not sure how'd you know without some experience in dentistry first hand lol), I'd choose UOP also b/c UCLA's clinic is said to be alright.

 

[Nateftw]

haha yeah you can't go wrong with either. Just depends on factors that you as person would personally like. For example, if I was an older applicant with a family, I'd def choose UOP. Or If I knew 100% sure that I did not want to specialize (not sure how'd you know without some experience in dentistry first hand lol), I'd choose UOP also b/c UCLA's clinic is said to be alright.

I never really understood why people say that... You can specialize at UoP just as easily. The reason why UoP has less people specializing is because the school tends to attract a lot of people that don't want to, not because they can't...The acceptance rates to specialty programs at UoP are just as high as other schools...Why not get good clinical experience and specialize? Not really sure why specializing would be a determining factor on these boards...

 

[385835]

that is a great pdf.

Which PDF are you talking about?

 

[iralex801]

I never really understood why people say that... You can specialize at UoP just as easily. The reason why UoP has less people specializing is because the school tends to attract a lot of people that don't want to, not because they can't...The acceptance rates to specialty programs at UoP are just as high as other schools...Why not get good clinical experience and specialize? Not really sure why specializing would be a determining factor on these boards...

I don't think you understood what I was saying. I am saying that if I for 100 percent sure do not want to specialize, then I would go to UOP b/c I believe UOP's clinic would make you a better GP than UCLA's clinic would. I can see how my previous post was unclear though. Sorry about that.

I am a firm believer that if you are smart/driven enough to specialize, you can specialize at any school.

 

[JBieber]

I never really understood why people say that... You can specialize at UoP just as easily. The reason why UoP has less people specializing is because the school tends to attract a lot of people that don't want to, not because they can't...The acceptance rates to specialty programs at UoP are just as high as other schools...Why not get good clinical experience and specialize? Not really sure why specializing would be a determining factor on these boards...

uop like most other scohols rank their students... good luck specializing at middle to bottom of your class

ucla: screwed up a couple classes? = a couple of "passes", no rank (assuming you don't mess up so bad you fail, which is pretty hard to do)

 

[Sunspear]

Definitely UCLA. Both are great schools and one is cheaper. Furthermore, UCLA has a beautiful campus. Plus socal >>>>>>>>> norcal.

Just out of curiosity, and I absolutely do not mean to spark a flame war or whatever (lol), lemme ask you this -- have you spent a considerable amount of time in both norcal and socal to be able to make such a stark comparison? Like, why do you feel so strongly that socal is sooo much better? lol. Just curious.

 

[BTown DDS]

uop like most other scohols rank their students... good luck specializing at middle to bottom of your class

ucla: screwed up a couple classes? = a couple of "passes", no rank (assuming you don't mess up so bad you fail, which is pretty hard to do)

My opinion is that class ranking will actually be much more of a deciding factor when trying to specialize. P/F schools had the board scores that the students could rely on to distinguish them from other candidates. I want to see how some programs are going to distinguish you if you go to a school without class ranking and without board scores.

 

[Teeth12345]

Thank you all for your helpful responses! It's a good point that once I graduate, the place I work at may not have state of the art facilities. When I ranked the schools using my objective numerical system (can you tell how tough a decision this has been for me? 🙂), UOP scored 1 point higher. I graduate a year earlier, facilities are better, students were nice. So in my mind, it seems that UOP should win. But for some reason, every time I flip the coin, I secretly wish for UCLA. I think that my mind reasons for UOP, but my heart wants to go to UCLA and experience life down there. The dentists I talked to told me that in the long run, it really doesn't matter which school I graduate from and I shouldn't be so picky in choosing based off of curriculum, facilities etc. I guess the hardest part of this decision is knowing that I have to say no to UOP.

Thank you all again for reading and responding 🙂

 

[poki]

My opinion is that class ranking will actually be much more of a deciding factor when trying to specialize. P/F schools had the board scores that the students could rely on to distinguish them from other candidates. I want to see how some programs are going to distinguish you if you go to a school without class ranking and without board scores.

If anything, P/F boards will favor students from P/F schools over those who are not ranked in the top ten at ranked schools for specializing. Previously those students from the ranked schools could make up for a mediocre rank with a high board score but now you HAVE to rank high to get into a competitive specialty at a school like UOP. In that sense, a student from the bottom 1/3rd at UCLA will be more competitive than a student in the top 1/3rd at UOP (and not in the top 15-20) because there is no class rank at UCLA.

Currently the schools that are P/F are also the schools that have the highest specialization rates (UCSF, UCLA, Columbia, Harvard, etc)...the residency programs who have traditionally taken mostly students from these programs are not going to stop accepting students from these schools just because the boards are changing to P/F...

In fact, I would argue that without a board score, residency programs might just look even more towards the reputation of the school even more to weigh some of the applicants...

 

[BTown DDS]

If anything, P/F boards will favor students from P/F schools over those who are not ranked in the top ten at ranked schools for specializing. Previously those students from the ranked schools could make up for a mediocre rank with a high board score but now you HAVE to rank high to get into a competitive specialty at a school like UOP. In that sense, a student from the bottom 1/3rd at UCLA will be more competitive than a student in the top 1/3rd at UOP (and not in the top 15-20) because there is no class rank at UCLA.

Currently the schools that are P/F are also the schools that have the highest specialization rates (UCSF, UCLA, Columbia, Harvard, etc)...the residency programs who have traditionally taken mostly students from these programs are not going to stop accepting students from these schools just because the boards are changing to P/F...

In fact, I would argue that without a board score, residency programs might just look even more towards the reputation of the school even more to weigh some of the applicants...

You are right in the fact that the schools that have the highest specialty rates come from P/F schools. I think that most of the students choose these schools because they want to specialize. These schools advise these students on whether to apply to specialty programs based on their board scores. Now I would argue what is going to stop more students from these programs from applying to specialty programs without having bad board scores as a deterrent (as in not having 90+). The other schools have class rankings as a deterrent. These top schools will probably see an increase in the amount of applicants applying to specialty programs which I would argue put these students at more of a disadvantage because specialty programs will still be accepting around the same amount of students from these P/F schools.

 

[John Durian]

Just out of curiosity, and I absolutely do not mean to spark a flame war or whatever (lol), lemme ask you this -- have you spent a considerable amount of time in both norcal and socal to be able to make such a stark comparison? Like, why do you feel so strongly that socal is sooo much better? lol. Just curious.

Yeah, and UCLA's didactics are intense. I can't speak for other schools... but it almost seems like I haven't seen daylight/the real world in 3 or 4 weeks

SF or LA, you're gonna find yourself in the library studying your arse off like the rest of us 🙁

 

[ushaseos]

Wow this is a really helpful thread and special thanks for John Durian for the awesome PDF. A lot of good points brought up. I'm going to hope UOP can offer me some financial aid when I apply and it'll be my top pick. I know they give out very little and even that is only to "top applicants" but I can dream can't I? At least until I am awakened rudely 😳

EDIT: I like SF more than LA but like post above this says, that highly matters when you are in the library or dorm room studying 90% of the time. After all, this isn't undergrad where you can say "F*** classes, I'm gonna party for a while" so the location of the dingy room hardly matters!

 

[KillaCam]

I was told UCLA was the best, so it is the best.