UCLA vs. UoP vs. UCSF

[KillaCam]

---

Members do not see this ad.

I was told that UCLA was the best at my school, so it must be. And that's not biased at all. I also heard that UoP was only ok, so it must be.

 

[YoHomey]

Using the perspective of the 4th year, the total cost of UoP will be the cheapest.

Say the UoP student spends (using hypothetical numbers here) $360K for his 3-yr education, but since he'll be working in Year 4, his total cost after four years is actually less. Thus, if he earns $100K in his first year as an associate, his total cost after four years is essentially $260K (which will be cheaper than the UCLA/UCSF student who will have a 4-yr cost exceeding this amount).

This is an interesting way to view it.

 

[poki]

Sorry but your math is flawed there, when you do your financial aid session, the schools will tell you that every dollar borrowed will actually translate to nearly 2 dollars over the life of the loan...combine that with the fact that you are getting taxed on that 100k income means you will only take home about 60k after taxes your first year out...

Thus, the 100k difference in tuition is more like 200k while your first year income is more like 60k

At todays interest rates of 6.8% for direct loans and over 8% for grad plus, 100k more in educational loans is pretty painful...

 

[YoHomey]

Sorry but your math is flawed there, when you do your financial aid session, the schools will tell you that every dollar borrowed will actually translate to nearly 2 dollars over the life of the loan...combine that with the fact that you are getting taxed on that 100k income means you will only take home about 60k after taxes your first year out...

Thus, the 100k difference in tuition is more like 200k while your first year income is more like 60k

At todays interest rates of 6.8% for direct loans and over 8% for grad plus, 100k more in educational loans is pretty painful...

Sorry bud, but your math is off. I forgot to factor in income taxes so instead of $360K - $100K, the correct net amount should be $360K - 60K = $300K. Where do you come up with $200K? But you also forget to factor in the repayment of loans one year earlier, meaning one year less of accrued interest and one year of paying off principal, and thus one is saving more $$$.

But whatever, you're pulling hairs. The point of the posting is that one year of not being in school and earning $$$ in private practice translates into higher savings over that 4 year time span.

 

[poki]

Yeah well my point was that the difference between UOP and UCLA tuition is almost $100,000...this does not translate into a straight $100,000 difference you need to consider that you are borrowing at either 7% or 8% interest...over 30 years at a 8% interest rate you will be paying a total of $264,000 with $164,000 of that in interest...

so yeah, 1 extra year of associate salary will not offset the tuition difference...

Sorry bud, but your math is off. I forgot to factor in income taxes so instead of $360K - $100K, the correct net amount should be $360K - 60K = $300K. Where do you come up with $200K? But you also forget to factor in the repayment of loans one year earlier, meaning one year less of accrued interest and one year of paying off principal, and thus one is saving more $$$.

But whatever, you're pulling hairs. The point of the posting is that one year of not being in school and earning $$$ in private practice translates into higher savings over that 4 year time span.

 

[YoHomey]

Yeah well my point was that the difference between UOP and UCLA tuition is almost $100,000...this does not translate into a straight $100,000 difference you need to consider that you are borrowing at either 7% or 8% interest...over 30 years at a 8% interest rate you will be paying a total of $264,000 with $164,000 of that in interest...

so yeah, 1 extra year of associate salary will not offset the tuition difference...

Student loans are not as long as the traditional 30 yr home mortgage. Student loans are either 10 or 15 years. Also, you make an assumption that a borrower will only make the minimum monthly payment during the life of the loan payback. The fact is most successful dentists pay off their loans quicker, meaning less interest accrued and smaller interest payments since the principal is decelerating faster.

 

[poki]

$100,000 paid over 15 years at 8% interest

Cumulative payments: $172,017.73
Total interest: $72,017.73

you would have to earn over $300,000 before tax to cover that amount

 

[John Durian]

$100,000 paid over 15 years at 8% interest

Cumulative payments: $172,017.73
Total interest: $72,017.73

you would have to earn over $300,000 before tax to cover that amount

Get back to studying for Foundations and answer my texts for once...

UOP is great. UCLA is greatER 🙄

 

[A6project]

Student loans are not as long as the traditional 30 yr home mortgage. Student loans are either 10 or 15 years. Also, you make an assumption that a borrower will only make the minimum monthly payment during the life of the loan payback. The fact is most successful dentists pay off their loans quicker, meaning less interest accrued and smaller interest payments since the principal is decelerating faster.

that's absolutely true pal
but have you punched in numbers for ~350k loan? for 15 years? and saw how much a monthly payment is? around 3400 dollars.

not to mention federal taxes (28%) and state tax (don't know cuz i dont live in CA assuming you get a job in CA).

Plus, i have heard from dentists getting a job in CA as a new grad is very competitive and depressing paywise. (if someone shadow in CA, plz ask to "recently graduate" dentists to see what average salary is.) I have heard its less than 100k.

Not sure how many new dentists will be able to pay off in 15 yrs... (assuming they get a job in CA)... if someone does, I got mad respect for him/her. (assuming getting no help from family).

I know I will be on a 30 yr plan paying more on interests. Oh well, I will be a 'poor' dentist but dentistry is my utmost passion. I wouldn't have it any other way.

 

[JBieber]

Get back to studying for Foundations and answer my texts for once...

UOP is great. UCLA is greatEST 🙄

fixed.

 

[ehdnwk]

But if you are in the Uop's 5 year program, then this way is way more advantageous/profitable than 8 year ucla way 😉

 

[321931]

Harvard>all.

There's always someone or some institution more "prestigious." Really, all three schools are great, established, and offer a different curriculum each with their own strengths and weaknesses.

Go to the interviews (that is if you get all three of them 🙄) and then evaluate where you would fit in.

Really prestige and the "likes" really doesn't matter when you are actually in school. I admit, I was a "name" guy back when I was applying and was debating which is better due to name just so that I could say "I'm going there." But once you are working, have finals coming up, have this crap due, and have so much crap on your plate, you forget about the name and just survive and in the end, you're going to be an equal dentist along with the hole bunch of other crazy dental school kiddos.

But that being said, there will be alot of people that do have that attitude of "name." You'll see when you meet some of the most arrogant, egotistical people in graduate school.

 

[LittleTomato]

Uop still has to pay the tuition fee 4 times. Pays 4 9-month period tuition fees
But also gotta take in to account that Uop students graduate an year earlier and they get a head start in pay and experience 😉

Also, that's one year less that the loans will be accumulating interest before you can actually do something about it.

I just keep telling myself these things because I am ridiculously excited for my interview there. 😀 I'm just a little worried that I will love the school and not want to go anywhere else. I mean, I didn't study my butt off to go to my second choice institution, right? But the tuition is A LOT of money.

We'll see how it goes.

 

[SLOBrule]

Plus, i have heard from dentists getting a job in CA as a new grad is very competitive and depressing paywise. (if someone shadow in CA, plz ask to "recently graduate" dentists to see what average salary is.) I have heard its less than 100k.

In Northern California, the starting rate for graduating dentists is $550.00 per day. This rate is based off of current rates provided by the temp agencies and what a friend of mine is getting at the office he works at 3 times per week. At 5 days per week that comes out to $143,000 annually (based off of a 52 week year).

However, it is true that it is a bit difficult to find work full-time. My friend works 4 days a week in total for 2 different offices, one day at one office and three days at the other. It did take him about 4-6 months to find his current positions, but it can be done.

 

[A6project]

In Northern California, the starting rate for graduating dentists is $550.00 per day. This rate is based off of current rates provided by the temp agencies and what a friend of mine is getting at the office he works at 3 times per week. At 5 days per week that comes out to $143,000 annually (based off of a 52 week year).

However, it is true that it is a bit difficult to find work full-time. My friend works 4 days a week in total for 2 different offices, one day at one office and three days at the other. It did take him about 4-6 months to find his current positions, but it can be done.

Talking to a lot of current new dentists, I felt CA is pretty though. This basically proves it. Full time positions are not available. So u gotta work part time. That means, no health or disability insurance. You pay your own malpractice insurance. No 401k.

That costs probably 6-8k a year.

Graduate plus loan has no grace period.
4-6 months of loan payment + living cost = roughly 6000-7000 a month. Times that by 4 or 6.
You are in additional 24k or 36k debt.

So much for california dream. Economy better turns around when we graduate

 

[ChubbyBaby]

However, it is true that it is a bit difficult to find work full-time. My friend works 4 days a week in total for 2 different offices, one day at one office and three days at the other. It did take him about 4-6 months to find his current positions, but it can be done.

I think that this experience is typical of any desireable major metropolitan area. I don't live in California, but I live in a major desireable city. 4 months post graduation I am working on average 2-2.5 days a week. I have two more positions developing and I'm certain I'll be working 4 days a week consistently come January, 6 mnths after graduation.

I don't want to work more than 4 days a week: I frankly don't think I can handle 5 days a week. If you're working in a good office that keeps you busy (which I hope you all will) there is no down time, and I frequently don't have much of a lunch. It's stressful, but I'm sure as I gain more experience I will gain a better balance of speed and what to spend time on.

Also, keep in mind that you may have a few false starts. You may start up in an office that later realizes they don't actually need you. This happens more than you may think. Or, you may realize that you don't like their practice philosophy (rampant overbilling, fraud, or treatment dictated by insurance payout) or the commute, and quit yourself.

It takes a few years to really get rolling I feel. Dentistry is such a great career once things are going smoothly.

 

[Charmm]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=865679