UIC vs UTSW

[blanktok123]

UIC
Pros

• Location, I love Chicago and I am from nearby, not only do I enjoy, I feel like there is a lot of opportunity in the city itself and I have heard of positive experiences with med schools collaborating with each other, networking with other students and staff at other schools etc.
• I went to UIC for undergrad and have a lot of connections with the research and faculty, I wouldn't feel like I was completely starting from scratch

Cons

• Cost is slightly higher than UTSW, but overall not a big factor
• Lower ranked, not sure about its reputation compared to UTSW, ranks 58 but I don't know if the campus (Chicago) makes a difference in perception

UTSW
Pros

• Good clinical training, only medical school in Dallas so students have plenty of rotation opportunities
• Ranks highly in medical school rankings and residency rankings for many specialties and they take a lot of their own students.

Cons

• Location, I didn't like Dallas and I don't want to end up living in Texas for residency, however it seems that over 50% of students end up with residencies at a UT school.
• Unsure about research, talking to students there I didn't get the vibe that any was super involved in research and that there was a lot of time to dedicate to contributing to significant projects. I'm sure if I carve out my own time it would work out, but it is important to me and I want to feel like the school makes it a priority.

Specialities of interest:

• GI
• Optho
• ENT
• Overall I haven't narrowed down my interests enough to be certain of anything

Summary: I like UIC's location far more that UTSW, but I'm not sure how much I should value my personal experience in an area compared to attending a more highly ranked school.

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[throwaway:)]

utsw
youre interested in competitive specialities, utsw is a t20 with numerous t10 residency programs. how is money

 

[ACKjp]

I’d second Throwaway, if you have any competitive interests I’d go to UTSW

 

[MercifulCamper]

With Optho/ENT you have to go to the best school in my honest opinion, especially if that better school is cheaper! UTSW

 

[obiwan]

Unsure about research, talking to students there I didn't get the vibe that any was super involved in research and that there was a lot of time to dedicate to contributing to significant projects. I'm sure if I carve out my own time it would work out, but it is important to me and I want to feel like the school makes it a priority.

Sorry but found this kinda amusing since I'm quite familiar with UTSW. Let's just say that the school has a wall where it honors the 6 Nobel Prize winners that worked/did research at the institution. UTSW is a research powerhouse. On pen and paper, this is not really a close comparison

 

[m1redsox]

Just matched ophtho, and I’ll play a little devil’s advocate. Illinois Eye and Ear is an amazing institution, and Chicago has the highest density of ophtho and ENT programs outside of NYC, so it’s a great place to network.

With that said, since UTSW is generally considered a T20-25 school, I think you’ll have an easier time matching from there. I also think that most people match in Texas from UTSW because they are from TX and prefer to stay.

 

[Kracin]

UTSW has great reputation and residencies. Those connections / research opportunities will be useful when match comes

 

[deleted1065184]

So many UTSW grads stay in Texas because they want to. Stop trying to compare match lists, they make no sense without context. You can go anywhere you want from UTSW. Wrt research, UTSW is leaps and bounds ahead of UIC. Like...they're not even in the same realm. Having said this, how much do you dislike Dallas? If youll be miserable there, def choose UIC. If you think you can do it, I'd recommend UTSW. Chicago is so saturated with medical schools/hospital systems. UIC, UChicago, Northwestern, Rush, etc. In Dallas, UTSW reigns supreme. That does make a difference regarding what you'll see during rotations.

 

[blanktok123]

So many UTSW grads stay in Texas because they want to. Stop trying to compare match lists, they make no sense without context. You can go anywhere you want from UTSW. Wrt research, UTSW is leaps and bounds ahead of UIC. Like...they're not even in the same realm. Having said this, how much do you dislike Dallas? If youll be miserable there, def choose UIC. If you think you can do it, I'd recommend UTSW. Chicago is so saturated with medical schools/hospital systems. UIC, UChicago, Northwestern, Rush, etc. In Dallas, UTSW reigns supreme. That does make a difference regarding what you'll see during rotations.

Thanks, I think I needed this perspective. It gets easy to get caught up in stats about match but your probably right that people's residency probably also reflects their interests in the region. I'm glad to hear that it's well regarded. In your opinion, does the lack of competition in the area make a big differences in the availability of certain specialized rotations at UTSW?

 

[blanktok123]

Just matched ophtho, and I’ll play a little devil’s advocate. Illinois Eye and Ear is an amazing institution, and Chicago has the highest density of ophtho and ENT programs outside of NYC, so it’s a great place to network.

With that said, since UTSW is generally considered a T20-25 school, I think you’ll have an easier time matching from there. I also think that most people match in Texas from UTSW because they are from TX and prefer to stay.

Congrats on your match! That was definitely something I've thought about. I've been researching with the Illinois Eye and Ear and the UICOM Optho department for years and I know the program is well regarded and I've really loved working with them, but I think UTSW's is also decent so I'm not sure if thats a difference I should consider in my decision

 

[eyeeye_captain]

You need to get through school before you can match. Which curriculum (if either) gives you the best chance to succeed?

Does staying in a place where you have a possible support system, research, and connections matter to you?

Do you want to stay around Chicago long term? Residency and fellowship programs there are pretty notorious for taking local and regional applicants. Texas is similar. Once you reach the job market, this should go away.

UTSW has more resources overall. That can absolutely lift it above UIC if the questions above don’t bother you. For GI and ENT I think it’s the better spot, but I have no frame of reference outside of Doximity rankings since I’m not in those fields.

I know both ophtho departments reasonably well through friends and interviews, though I’m sure you know UIC better than me. My future colleague in this thread may be able to give you more recent information from the interview trail. UIC is very solid in most departments, retina and cornea especially. UTSW is very solid as a whole, but pretty weak in retina. There’s also the question of the departmental and residency culture there (as can be summed up by them making the subject of the book Waking Up Blind their chair for a while, look it up, it’s insane, also a good book). I think their history may somewhat unfairly influence ophthalmologists’ opinions.

You’ll be fine either way. UTSW has a bigger name, UIC keeps you somewhere you know.

 

[blanktok123]

You need to get through school before you can match. Which curriculum (if either) gives you the best chance to succeed?

Does staying in a place where you have a possible support system, research, and connections matter to you?

Do you want to stay around Chicago long term? Residency and fellowship programs there are pretty notorious for taking local and regional applicants. Texas is similar. Once you reach the job market, this should go away.

UTSW has more resources overall. That can absolutely lift it above UIC if the questions above don’t bother you. For GI and ENT I think it’s the better spot, but I have no frame of reference outside of Doximity rankings since I’m not in those fields.

I know both ophtho departments reasonably well through friends and interviews, though I’m sure you know UIC better than me. My future colleague in this thread may be able to give you more recent information from the interview trail. UIC is very solid in most departments, retina and cornea especially. UTSW is very solid as a whole, but pretty weak in retina. There’s also the question of the departmental and residency culture there (as can be summed up by them making the subject of the book Waking Up Blind their chair for a while, look it up, it’s insane, also a good book). I think their history may somewhat unfairly influence ophthalmologists’ opinions.

You’ll be fine either way. UTSW has a bigger name, UIC keeps you somewhere you know.

Thanks for the insight and thanks for the book rec! I'm pretty set on the fact that I don't want to settle down in Texas, but I know I can be fine there for 4 years, it just getting stuck there longer that worries me haha. Just to clarify, which school was the one that employed the guy from Waking up Blind, UIC or UTSW?

 

[eyeeye_captain]

Thanks for the insight and thanks for the book rec! I'm pretty set on the fact that I don't want to settle down in Texas, but I know I can be fine there for 4 years, it just getting stuck there longer that worries me haha. Just to clarify, which school was the one that employed the guy from Waking up Blind, UIC or UTSW?

4 years go by faster than you’d think, and it’s not like you’re closing doors. Go where you’re setting yourself up to succeed.

UTSW. To be fair to them, the current chair is Dr. Harbour, big name ocular oncology guy who spent years at Bascom Palmer, never heard a bad word about him.

 

[deleted1065184]

Thanks, I think I needed this perspective. It gets easy to get caught up in stats about match but your probably right that people's residency probably also reflects their interests in the region. I'm glad to hear that it's well regarded. In your opinion, does the lack of competition in the area make a big differences in the availability of certain specialized rotations at UTSW?

No, that's more of an aspect of the instruction itself (especially size, funding). But what being the only major medical center within a large geographic radius means for trainees is seeing tons of the rare pathology that many only read about in books. I've seen multiple patients with extremely rare conditions. During the first week of my neurology rotation, I saw two ALS patients (one of whom we diagnosed), two neurosyphlis patients, limbic encephalopathy, and an isolated non-ALS motor neuron disease where a patient came from ~4.5 hours away. Similar experience with other rotations. Saw a patient with a pheochromocytoma on IM, tons of GIST tumors and IPMNs during surgery, uterus didelphys on OBGYN, just so much rare stuff lol

 

[ddhopeful]

With Optho/ENT you have to go to the best school in my honest opinion, especially if that better school is cheaper! UTSW

World's 100+ best Ophthalmology universities [2024 Rankings]

Below is the list of 100 best universities for Ophthalmology in the World ranked based on their research performance: a graph of 20.5M citations received by 919K academic papers made by these universities was used to calculate ratings and create the top.

edurank.org

 

[MercifulCamper]

World's 100+ best Ophthalmology universities [2024 Rankings]

Below is the list of 100 best universities for Ophthalmology in the World ranked based on their research performance: a graph of 20.5M citations received by 919K academic papers made by these universities was used to calculate ratings and create the top.

edurank.org

Thanks for the reference. I’m a little confused about what this list is even measuring as UC Berkeley and MIT do not even have medical schools/residencies? Maybe research?

Let’s pretend though that this list is valid for OP’s consideration. It seems like based on this list UIC is 19 and UTSW is 24. I think that’s basically a wash for Optho. However OP is also interested in ENT and could even change course (like many Med students do). I still stand by my vote for UTSW because it’s an awesome school that will probably give more opportunities to OP given its reputation than UIC will. Plus it’s cheaper. Seems like a no brainer to me.

Plus if OP wants to do GI, UTSW matches IM very well and has an amazing IM residency program that if they were to match at (although they say they don’t want to stay in Texas) would set OP up for fellowship very nicely. Even then the GI/IM connections OP makes will be very helpful down the line.