medsRus

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Can someone post the neuro programs that didn't fill this year? The NRMP released the info today. I can't do it right now... Thanks...
 

PhakeDoc

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These are for advanced programs (PGY2) since all categorical neuro spots filled.

Program quota filled

USAlabama 3 2
UCIrvine 4 1
UColorado 5 2
Yale 6 4
GW 2 1
MCG 4 2
Dartmouth 3 2
Montefiore 9 4
Duke 4 3
Case ? 2 0
Methodist,TX 2 1

(I think that adds up to 22)

1) I'm not sure how Case works because I know they did at least 3 prematches. Based on what others on the interview trail were commenting on, I'm not shocked.

2) Colorado - wow, what a surprise. Based on the number of folks getting interviews there and their positive reception, something majorly wacked must have happened there.

3) Yale - same thing...I heard good things about it on the interview trail (though I didn't apply there) so somewhat suprised.

4) Montefiore - NYC. need I say more? :laugh:

5) Duke - wow, 2nd time in 3 years, if memory serves correctly. Not a good sign.
 
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medsRus

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USAlabama 3 2
UCIrvine 4 1
UColorado 5 2
Yale 6 4
GW 2 1
MCG 4 2
Dartmouth 3 2
Montefiore 9 4
Duke 4 3
Case ? 2 0
Methodist 2 1

(I think that adds up to 22)

1) I'm not sure how Case works because I know they did at least 3 prematches. Based on what others on the interview trail were commenting on, I'm not shocked.

2) Colorado - wow, what a surprise. Based on the number of folks getting interviews there and their positive reception, something majorly wacked must have happened there.

3) Yale - same thing...I heard good things about it on the interview trail (though I didn't apply there) so somewhat suprised.

4) Montefiore - NYC. need I say more? :laugh:

5) Duke - wow, 2nd time in 3 years, if memory serves correctly. Not a good sign.
UC Irvine not matching for neuro is also interesting. It actually made me look into their residency list and alumni. I saw that one person went to the Dent Neurologic Institute for a neuro-imaging fellowship. Anyone heard about this? I am really curious about this field and the duties one could feasibly perform post-fellowship...
 

medsRus

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I've never heard of Dent, but I do remember a thread from '08 I believe talking about imaging fellowships for neurology residents.
Well, sure, you're a med student. I would like to hear from practicing doctors in the field.
 

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Is that Methodist in TX that went unfilled? Did anyone interview there and what did you all think about it?
 

medsRus

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Is that Methodist in TX that went unfilled? Did anyone interview there and what did you all think about it?
Program is VERY new, taking transfers from other programs/fields, and is struggling to allow autonomy for residents.
 

I_love_UMKC

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I added the TX to Methodist above.
Thanks :) Why did that program not fill? Is that supposed to be an awesome program like Yale and Colorado, or not supposed to be an awesome program or neither? :D
 

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Program is VERY new, taking transfers from other programs/fields, and is struggling to allow autonomy for residents.
Thanks! What exactly do you mean by struggling to allow autonomy for residents? Do you mind sharing more with me about it and the program in general, since it was one of the programs that I was planning on applying out of state? If you don't want to or don't feel comfortable to put it up here, you can private message me.
 

medsRus

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Thanks! Do you mind sharing more with me about it, since it was one of the programs that I was planning on applying out of state? If you don't want to or don't feel comfortable to put it up here, you can private message me.
Sure, the hospital is just fine with a great former-Baylor partnership. Since the divorce, they have gained Cornell affiliation -- which largely means the faculty have Cornell appointments, nothing more. Really, their main asset is Chairman Dr. Appel and he is most known for work on ALS. The residents really don't manage patients like other residencies, leaving the current staff doing a lot of the work. That could be advantageous for some applicants, I guess. I think they have decent fellowships since the chairman has solid connections. The residents are pretty happy. They have a young female PD who was pleasant. They are moving into a categorical program (I think next year's match) and that will make the program somewhat more attractive. For me, too young of a program with a shaky ground. Suggest to hold off until they get settled and all the kinks out. Now, my question is, why did this program interest you?
 

PhakeDoc

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Thanks :) Why did that program not fill? Is that supposed to be an awesome program like Yale and Colorado, or not supposed to be an awesome program or neither? :D
I have no idea why it didn't fill. I only interviewed at one TX program. IMHO, there's only one program in that state that could justify my living in a red state such as TX, and that's a few hours drive north-northwest of Houston.
 

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Colorado has a terrific residency program! I thought they had a solid program, terrific faculty, and happy residents. Not to mention Denver is absolutely gorgeous. I ranked it in my top 3 programs. In fact, when I finished my interview I tried to urge my parents to move there. The only reason it was not #1 for me was because I don't have family in Colorado. I am shocked that they had so many open spots. Would have been an excellent spot to get from the scramble.
 

PhakeDoc

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Iliopsoas - my thoughts exactly. I'd say that is the biggest surprise in this year's match. Heck, even 1 unmatched spot would be surprising, much less 3! Perhaps they were too overly optimistic in their chances of getting folks, who were also highly considering other great places, and thus not interviewing enough people?

I guess the same goes for programs as applicants - apply and interview at more places than you think you really need.

Actually, I think Duke not fully-matching again is as big of a surprise - you'd think they would have learned their lesson from the not-so-distant past.
 

I_love_UMKC

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Sure, the hospital is just fine with a great former-Baylor partnership. Since the divorce, they have gained Cornell affiliation -- which largely means the faculty have Cornell appointments, nothing more. Really, their main asset is Chairman Dr. Appel and he is most known for work on ALS. The residents really don't manage patients like other residencies, leaving the current staff doing a lot of the work. That could be advantageous for some applicants, I guess. I think they have decent fellowships since the chairman has solid connections. The residents are pretty happy. They have a young female PD who was pleasant. They are moving into a categorical program (I think next year's match) and that will make the program somewhat more attractive. For me, too young of a program with a shaky ground. Suggest to hold off until they get settled and all the kinks out. Now, my question is, why did this program interest you?
Thanks for the reply, as people have posted about other TX programs, but I couldn't find any reviews for Methodist. That's why I asked. So, since according to you, the residents don't manage the patients like other residencies, are they not well-equipped to handle once they are out in practice? How clinically proficient are they? I was interested in TX programs, because I did my schooling up to high school back in TX, and I want to go back there for residency...
 
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Wow and Case is one of my top choices for next year's match. That can't be a good sign. :(

What is the second number? The number of positions still remaining post-scramble??
 

I_love_UMKC

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Wow and Case is one of my top choices for next year's match. That can't be a good sign. :(

What is the second number? The number of positions still remaining post-scramble??
Edit: Answered below.
 
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PhakeDoc

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Wow and Case is one of my top choices for next year's match. That can't be a good sign. :(

What is the second number? The number of positions still remaining post-scramble??
I agree with your first assessment. As to the numbering, I added a heading (assumed wrongly everyone would know...my fault since obviously more than just M4s and above are reading these threads). First is #positions quota, second is the number actually filled, so difference is the spots open in the scramble.
 

medsRus

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I agree with your first assessment. As to the numbering, I added a heading (assumed wrongly everyone would know...my fault since obviously more than just M4s and above are reading these threads). First is #positions quota, second is the number actually filled, so difference is the spots open in the scramble.
I thought that was the unfilled number. Now, that really makes some of these stats dismal...

UCIrvine 4 1 -- 75% unfilled rate! THAT IS terrible, can anyone shed light on this??? Cali programs are really tough to get by (except UC Davis & LLU).
 

lanzarlaluna

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IMHO, there's only one program in that state that could justify my living in a red state such as TX, and that's a few hours drive north-northwest of Houston.
UT-Southwestern? The residents there were some of the most unhappy I met on the interview trail. Overall, I am baffled that there aren't some great programs in Texas, especially with the effing Texas Medical Center. It's like the qualities of a great residency program are spread out between them. Programs with the happiest residents are the weakest educationally; places with the most resources have the least happy residents. I really wanted to love the hell out of a program in Texas, because, quite frankly, I love this state (and this is coming from an insanely liberal person such as myself.) But, alas, I am headed out of state for 4+ years (but to an institution and city I am truly excited about!)
 

medsRus

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UT-Southwestern? The residents there were some of the most unhappy I met on the interview trail. Overall, I am baffled that there aren't some great programs in Texas, especially with the effing Texas Medical Center. It's like the qualities of a great residency program are spread out between them. Programs with the happiest residents are the weakest educationally; places with the most resources have the least happy residents. I really wanted to love the hell out of a program in Texas, because, quite frankly, I love this state (and this is coming from an insanely liberal person such as myself.) But, alas, I am headed out of state for 4+ years (but to an institution and city I am truly excited about!)
I agree completely. They were totally miserable at UT-Southwestern... the only place I saw them worse was at Case Western.
 

PhakeDoc

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UT-Southwestern? The residents there were some of the most unhappy I met on the interview trail. ...
I should have clarified. That was the only place I applied to a priori in TX, and after interviewing there, I too wasn't impressed with the overall cadre of residents (though there were definitely some exceptions). However, I thought the blend of the various hospitals, including Parkland, made for some amazing exposure to rare pathology. I've also heard great things from a friend already in neurology about the incoming Chair at UTSW. I really did like the faculty as well. Because of some nontangible reasons, having nothing to do with the program, as well as the residents (though much less so of the latter than the former), it was lower on my list.

medsRus said:
the only place I saw them worse was at Case Western.
Wow, we finally agree on something... :laugh: And, Case seems to be prematch central (compared to any of the other programs I went to), something which I as an AMG wholeheartedly frown upon.
 

medsRus

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I should have clarified. That was the only place I applied to a priori in TX, and after interviewing there, I too wasn't impressed with the overall cadre of residents (though there were definitely some exceptions). However, I thought the blend of the various hospitals, including Parkland, made for some amazing exposure to rare pathology. I've also heard great things from a friend already in neurology about the incoming Chair at UTSW. I really did like the faculty as well. Because of some nontangible reasons, having nothing to do with the program, as well as the residents (though much less so of the latter than the former), it was lower on my list.



Wow, we finally agree on something... :laugh: And, Case seems to be prematch central (compared to any of the other programs I went to), something which I as an AMG wholeheartedly frown upon.
With a 93% match rate for AMGs, any little extra help for an IMG is welcome in my book...
 

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UC Irvine not matching for neuro is also interesting. It actually made me look into their residency list and alumni. I saw that one person went to the Dent Neurologic Institute for a neuro-imaging fellowship. Anyone heard about this? I am really curious about this field and the duties one could feasibly perform post-fellowship...

That person did a neurointerventional fellowship afterwards which accepted his neuroimaging training as an equivalent (substitute) of stroke/NCC fellowship and he/she is now is in private practice in Midwest as a neurointerventionalist, not neuroimager.
 

neuroir

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IMHO, there's only one program in that state that could justify my living in a red state such as TX, and that's a few hours drive north-northwest of Houston.
:D Exactly my thoughts six years ago. Only I believe the program you mentioned did not exist back then. And so I never interviewed in Texas. But it is comforting to know the younger generation sometimes applies criteria similar to yours. :)
 

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Great location, great hospital, with almost every subspecialty covered. So what went wrong? Several things in my book. First, several of the residents vaguely alluded to the fact that I may be happier somewhere else (red flag). Many of them were also displeased with the call schedule and stated they go over the work-hours limit. Second, the interim chairman was completely disinterested in interviewing me and had no clue when there would be a new chairman. It was the most uninspiring interview of the interview season. Third, the program coordinator would "pop in" when the residents were talking to the interviewees. It became suspicious and made it seem like they were hiding something.

In my honest opinion, it's a program on the rise. They have the location to attract competitive residents and with a few changes from the program director and a new chairman, it will be a hot spot. But that's far in the future. With so many discrepancies now, it's easy to see why they had so many unranked spots. Med students can read between the lines.
 

medsRus

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Great location, great hospital, with almost every subspecialty covered. So what went wrong? Several things in my book. First, several of the residents vaguely alluded to the fact that I may be happier somewhere else (red flag). Many of them were also displeased with the call schedule and stated they go over the work-hours limit. Second, the interim chairman was completely disinterested in interviewing me and had no clue when there would be a new chairman. It was the most uninspiring interview of the interview season. Third, the program coordinator would "pop in" when the residents were talking to the interviewees. It became suspicious and made it seem like they were hiding something.

In my honest opinion, it's a program on the rise. They have the location to attract competitive residents and with a few changes from the program director and a new chairman, it will be a hot spot. But that's far in the future. With so many discrepancies now, it's easy to see why they had so many unranked spots. Med students can read between the lines.
Thanks for the details. I wasn't invited for an interview. Maybe a blessing in disguise.
 

pep45

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Actually, I think Duke not fully-matching again is as big of a surprise - you'd think they would have learned their lesson from the not-so-distant past.
I also find this shocking, however I will be candid that this is the only program of 25 or so that did not offer me an interview. I was actually kind of puzzled by this during interview season but what the hell, I was kind of suspect about them not filling several years ago. Hopefully, they will right the ship and look for more variety in their interviewees and rankees.
 
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for some reason i thought there were no unfilled neuro programs this year? where do you find the list of unfilled neuros? thx
 

medsRus

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for some reason i thought there were no unfilled neuro programs this year? where do you find the list of unfilled neuros? thx
there were no unfilled categorical (PGY1-4) positions, but I think 22 for advanced programs (PGY2-4).
 

marsupial

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yeah, they were sorta famous for having at least 1-2 out of 3 residents drop out on a yearly basis, for years on end. They had residents saying that they were miserable to the applicants on interview day. I think someone mentioned that no one seemed to want to be the chair either.
 
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just for the sake of balanced opinions for future applicants:

I actually LOVED Case and thought the residents were incredibly happy. The training seemed top-notch with the major downfall being Cleveland. The large number of FMGs may also be a turn off for some (though it's a plus for me, I like diversity).

Also surprised by Yale. Enthusiastic (and highly regarded, major researcher) new chairman with lots of money; program director and whole program had a very friendly feel, which I didn't encounter much on the east coast. Seems like a great place for research, my concern was that clinically it seemed a bit slow. But again, seemed like a quality program for the right person.

Just my two cents!
 

WhyMD

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yeah, they were sorta famous for having at least 1-2 out of 3 residents drop out on a yearly basis, for years on end. They had residents saying that they were miserable to the applicants on interview day. I think someone mentioned that no one seemed to want to be the chair either.
I've also heard a resident saying that UCI program was bad but she never told me why. Can anyone tell us why this program is not desirable? What's the situation?

Also anyone knows why UCDavis program is on probation?

I was planning on applying to these programs next year. Any info, even if biased, will be appreciated.
 
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I also find this shocking, however I will be candid that this is the only program of 25 or so that did not offer me an interview. I was actually kind of puzzled by this during interview season but what the hell, I was kind of suspect about them not filling several years ago. Hopefully, they will right the ship and look for more variety in their interviewees and rankees.
I interviewed at Duke - I'll always have good things to say about that residency until I hear something extremely negative. The faculty are seriously top-notch, Dr. Morgenlander may be a little bit cold, but he's a nice guy and is honest, which scores major points in my book. The residents are SO nice! And extremely intelligent and up on their neuro too. I can't believe they didn't match all their spots. I ranked them a little lower on my list because I didn't feel I interviewed well there, and Durham is a little too small of a town. Otherwise, it's an excellent program. If you're ranking next year definitely consider Duke, I'd have been extremely pleased to go there. (Unfortunately for them, they couldn't match 'all this' lol).
UC Irvine - I've heard strange things about that program in general. Not just Neuro, but it seems like people are just not that happy there. Nothing specific to report on studentdoctor.net, just things I've heard from residents and attendings..
 

WhyMD

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UC Irvine - I've heard strange things about that program in general. Not just Neuro, but it seems like people are just not that happy there. Nothing specific to report on studentdoctor.net, just things I've heard from residents and attendings..
BBlue, I will greatly appreciate if you could PM me with those "rumors."
 

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MCG? surprised to see my school post such bad numbers even with the crap location..
 

Rogue Synapse

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Wow, I interviewed at Duke and Yale and ranked them both in the middle of my ROL, would have been happy to go to either. I've also heard terrific things about Colorado - I know one of the residents, and he's really happy there. I feel for some of these great programs and hope they got some quality residents in the scramble. I do wonder whether ROL arrogance on the part of the programs led to their unfilled spots, especially given Duke's recent track record. I can't think of a glaring reason why people would consistently not rank the program year after year, so I assume the problem is with the program's ranking strategy.

I interviewed at Case and decided not to rank them based on location and apparent happiness of residents. Also super-high IMG percentage was kind of a red flag (nothing wrong with IMGs, happy to have them, just not exclusively). Terrific fellowship opportunities though, and very aggressive leadership in Furlan and Silva.
 
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i forgot to mention this in my previous post:

Montefiore: REALLY surprising that they had trouble filling over half their spots! I understand people have varying reactions to pursuing residency training in NYC, but this program had among the happiest, most laid back residents I met on the trail. They have a hugely diverse patient load, wonderful and accessible attendings and excellent, cheap housing! Very surprising. I really liked this program too.
 

pep45

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Isn't MCG at the city where they hold the Masters?
Augusta, Georgia is the location of the greatest Golf Tournament in the world, but that only appeals to certain people. I am from Georgia and Augusta is kind of viewed as an old money, kind of good ol' boy's club kinda place. The downtown scene is kind of weak from the times I have visited. I have been to the Masters (in 2005) for the whole week and it was an insane party, but most people who are from there try and get outta town for the week because of the influx of people...
Augusta would be a fine place to do residency and the people there are pretty friendly. I have heard great things about the program from both a recent graduate of the program and several students at MCG. I didn't interview there because I just ran outta gas at the end of interview season. They did also lose a couple of notable faculty in the last couple of years who left to go to Medical University of South Carolina--that might have scared some people off.
Georgia summed up: If you are in Atlanta the first thing people will ask you is where you are from. If you are in Augusta people will ask you what your mother's maiden name is. If you are in Macon people will ask you what you do for a living. And if you are visiting Savannah, the first thing anyone will ask you is "What are you drinking?"
 

medsRus

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i forgot to mention this in my previous post:

Montefiore: REALLY surprising that they had trouble filling over half their spots! I understand people have varying reactions to pursuing residency training in NYC, but this program had among the happiest, most laid back residents I met on the trail. They have a hugely diverse patient load, wonderful and accessible attendings and excellent, cheap housing! Very surprising. I really liked this program too.
I must agree, this was one the better NYC programs -- in terms of faculty and residents.
 
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I too am surprised about Colorado. I interviewed there and ranked them highly. Does it have anything to do with how they have a new Chair? Anybody know inside deets?
 

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Duke's problem with filling their positions is becoming a chronic one. It all started with the program's admission strategy. Subsequently, reputation goes down because most people do not want to attend a program that is being perceived as not "attractive". It happened with them before and they had to turn to FMGs with too much frequency.
 
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Duke's problem with filling their positions is becoming a chronic one. It all started with the program's admission strategy. Subsequently, reputation goes down because most people do not want to attend a program that is being perceived as not "attractive". It happened with them before and they had to turn to FMGs with too much frequency.
I agree. I personally liked my interview and month at Duke. The first year they didn't match all their spots- it was a surprise, but every subsequent year not so much. It maybe partly due to them still being a division of medicine - this gives the feeling that any changes to the program have to go through medicine. Just my opinion! :D
 

medsRus

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I agree. I personally liked my interview and month at Duke. The first year they didn't match all their spots- it was a surprise, but every subsequent year not so much. It maybe partly due to them still being a division of medicine - this gives the feeling that any changes to the program have to go through medicine. Just my opinion! :D
That probably wasn't it... Case Western had an whole institute model where Furlan was head of all things neuro... didn't fill.
 
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I agree. I personally liked my interview and month at Duke. The first year they didn't match all their spots- it was a surprise, but every subsequent year not so much. It maybe partly due to them still being a division of medicine - this gives the feeling that any changes to the program have to go through medicine. Just my opinion! :D
Yes, it was a contributing factor for me to not rank them high enough. I have enough connections to both the school and the region to go there. They do have an excellent program but to be medicine's b*t*h is not my idea of fun. :cool: