Unmatched IMG...try again next year or not?

[p1k14]

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Hi all,

I'm posting this on behalf of my brother. He is an IMG, needing visa and did not match this year. He seems to have given up but I'm trying to encourage him. He is concerned because my parents and I have financed this whole endeavor for him. He hesitates because my parents had to take out loans to pay for most of his expenses while in the US and they are having difficulty paying it back. He hesitate to burden my parents further because of the uncertainty in matching and does not really want them to take on more debt to pay for this.

Here is his credentials:
YOG 2012
Needs visa (currently on F1 so he can't find work...if he were to get H1b from a job it'd be too late because he won't be able to start work until Oct)
Step 1 244
Step 2CK 243
Step 2CS Pass all first attempt
USCE: 1 month obvership with IM MD and 2 months observership + 6 months research at pretty well known teaching hospital in CA
LORs 1 from said hospital; 1 from IM MD in US; 1 from country of origin
Applied to 95 IM categorical program; only got 2 interviews (1 pre-matched) and obviously did not match.

Should he try again? What are the chances of him matching if he takes Step 3? Honest opinions please. Thank you so much.

 

[doctr1]

I am sorry about your bother. The fact the he did not match is not surprising when he had only 2 interviews!! Based on his board scores he should have had more interviews. I think he applied to few IM programs where he actually have a shot of matching as an IMG. The fact the he did his observerships and research in CA make me guessing that he applied mostly to programs in CA and maybe top programs across the country where the competition is extraordinary high (even for AMGs with high board scores).

I know it is financially difficult, but if he want to apply next year then he should apply broadly (+150 programs across the country), applying to programs who takes IMGs, and there are plenty of them in IM. At this point, and if he plans to do this thing again, Step 3 is definitely a bonus, at least something added to his application for the next year.

Good Luck.

 

[evilbooyaa]

Depends on where he applied. He is already at a huge disadvantage being 3 years post-YOG. He should try to get a job in a clinical setting as he goes through the application process this year. If he applied to only CA then he really needs to branch out and focus on getting a residency rather than being in a certain location (or even a certain specialty).

He should apply to a mix of low-end community IM and FM programs (and broadly, agree with 150+ across both specialties as posted above) that historically take IMGs. His Step 1 is OK for IMG, but no increase in Step 2 score is unfortunate. Him taking and excelling at Step 3 would help his application for sure. At least he has first attempt passes on all Step exams.

 

[p1k14]

Thank you for your responses. I know he didn't apply to any CA programs because he doesn't have SS, therefore he couldn't get PTAL and apply to any of those. We knew not matching was a high likelihood due to lack of interviews but it still didn't make it any easier to accept. I don't think he applied to any of the competitive programs but I know he probably could've been better in his selections. The first sentence he told me after not matching was "I should've applied more to NY programs and less to those who are questionably IMG friendly".

It's impossible for him to get a job because he's here on F1 visa and if he can get H1b visa, he wouldn't be able to start work until after visa has been approved (which will be Oct 2015 based on my research).

I have never personally read the LORs but I would assume that they are as good as the usual LORs.

Due to financial constraints, it's cheaper that he takes Step 3 in 2 months, go back to our country in May and then come back if he gets invited for interviews. I don't think he'll be able to get any more USCE experience than he already has one. He'll fill the gap with being in the US studying for Step 3 and precepting with MD in our home country until he gets the IVs invitation. Will it look bad on him? I know the more USCE the better but how will this look? It is just financially impossible for my parents to support him living in the US the whole year.

His other options is trying to get residency spot in our home country or Philippines. He'd first have to take exams to get into programs in either countries. Plus, there is still the uncertainty of getting a spot in either countries and even if he did, he wouldn't be paid (not even a penny) for the next 3-4 years while he goes through residency program.

Any thoughts? Your feedback is appreciated.

 

[Taurus]

In my opinion, because residency positions are funded by US tax dollars, US citizens should fill as many of those slots as possible. Anything left over then FMG's can fill.

 

[imgtointern]

Sorry to hear about your brother especially since on paper, he is a good candidate. Has he applied for optional practical training visa? He is eligible for a one year OPT visa for every level of degree he gets, i.e. one year for master's level even if he gets two master's degrees, one year for PhD level, etc. OPT is something every student gets and is not sponsored by the employer. So he can get the OPT visa which can start anytime and he can work full time on it. That will help solve some of the financial issues. But I would caution against working full time and trying to study for the steps. Maybe he can finish step 3 before he starts working. Also if he studied a STEM subject then he would be eligible for an extension on the OPT. He can also try and get a CPT visa after his OPT finishes. He should talk to his school about that. These are all ways to extend his stay and work while he waits to match.

If he matches next year while on OPT, the program can then sponsor his H1B. I hope this helps. And if he hasn't already, he should try and reach out to the PDs of the programs where he interviewed and ask for feedback. He should also try and contact any and every program that is close to him and ask them for feedback.

 

[p1k14]

@Taurus: While I may not completely agree with your opinion, I respect and understand why you feel that way.

@imgtointern: Thank you for your response. He can't get CPT/OPT because technically he is on F1 visa for taking Kaplan prep for his USMLE and then started taking business courses because it was cheaper. CPT/OPT would then have to be related to business because that's the course he is currently taking.
Thanks for your encouragement. I appreciate it. I think asking for feedback from PDs would be helpful so he can learn from it.

 

[Over9000]

I'd suggest applying for a pathology residency in New York or thereabouts.

Your bro's stats are good, and I wonder what it was that sunk him, but as far as getting "a job" goes, pathology is a good bet for an FMG (just don't expect a good job after residency's done)

If you check out the Buffalo NY program for pathology, it is possible that 100% of the residents are FMGs. Try applying to programs like that, if only for a backup.

 

[imgtointern]

Hi all,

I'm posting this on behalf of my brother. He is an IMG, needing visa and did not match this year. He seems to have given up but I'm trying to encourage him. He is concerned because my parents and I have financed this whole endeavor for him. He hesitates because my parents had to take out loans to pay for most of his expenses while in the US and they are having difficulty paying it back. He hesitate to burden my parents further because of the uncertainty in matching and does not really want them to take on more debt to pay for this.

Here is his credentials:
YOG 2012
Needs visa (currently on F1 so he can't find work...if he were to get H1b from a job it'd be too late because he won't be able to start work until Oct)
Step 1 244
Step 2CK 243
Step 2CS Pass all first attempt
USCE: 1 month obvership with IM MD and 2 months observership + 6 months research at pretty well known teaching hospital in CA
LORs 1 from said hospital; 1 from IM MD in US; 1 from country of origin
Applied to 95 IM categorical program; only got 2 interviews (1 pre-matched) and obviously did not match.

Should he try again? What are the chances of him matching if he takes Step 3? Honest opinions please. Thank you so much.

Sorry, I thought he was in a degree program. I didn't even think about Kaplan. I hope things get better soon. It usually takes IMGs a couple of tries before they get in.

 

[PlutoBoy]

I guess IM is really becoming more competitive. That's crazy.

 

[p1k14]

@PlutoBoy, imgtointern & Over9000: Thank you for your feedback.

I honestly don't know why he got such few interview invites. His grades are good. We're trying to revise his PS and are gonna have professionals look at it. Anyone has any recommendations? Has any of you worked with IMGAngel? They offer such services.

@imgtointern: no worries...it's reasonable to make that assumption

So we decided that he's gonna take Step 3 in a few months and we're currently seeking observership opportunities so he can get more LORs.

So he & I got into a debate earlier today. My bro had ~1 year gap in his CV because he was attending Kaplan at that time to study for his USMLEs. He told me that he never explained it to PDs because he was never asked about his gap during the interviews. He didn't explain it in his PS either. He told me that he was told by other IMGs to avoid addressing his gap unless asked because PDs or interviewers may end up asking questions he wouldn't want them to ask.
He was also told that PDs/interviewers may miss seeing it on his CVs because of the sheer number of CVs they receive during the matching process therefore he shouldn't bring it up just in case they missed seeing it. What do you guys think?
I've done my research and I've never heard that you shouldn't address the gap. I would imagine that despite the large number of applicants, PDs would really look at the CVs of the ones they are interviewing and the ones they decide to rank. I personally think he should address it without being asked to try to turn the gap into a positive (or at least less negative) thing and prevent them from making assumptions about the gap (which would end up being worse than it actually is).

Many thanks again for your feedback

 

[choc_mint]

Hi all,

I'm posting this on behalf of my brother. He is an IMG, needing visa and did not match this year. He seems to have given up but I'm trying to encourage him. He is concerned because my parents and I have financed this whole endeavor for him. He hesitates because my parents had to take out loans to pay for most of his expenses while in the US and they are having difficulty paying it back. He hesitate to burden my parents further because of the uncertainty in matching and does not really want them to take on more debt to pay for this.

Here is his credentials:
YOG 2012
Needs visa (currently on F1 so he can't find work...if he were to get H1b from a job it'd be too late because he won't be able to start work until Oct)
Step 1 244
Step 2CK 243
Step 2CS Pass all first attempt
USCE: 1 month obvership with IM MD and 2 months observership + 6 months research at pretty well known teaching hospital in CA
LORs 1 from said hospital; 1 from IM MD in US; 1 from country of origin
Applied to 95 IM categorical program; only got 2 interviews (1 pre-matched) and obviously did not match.

Should he try again? What are the chances of him matching if he takes Step 3? Honest opinions please. Thank you so much.

I'm sorry to hear about your brother's experience.. I understand not matching is difficult to swallow after all those efforts and hard work.. It is very nice of you to support your brother financially and mentally during this tough time.

Your brother's stats are actually good. My first thought would be whether he applied broadly, in terms of univ/Univ affiliated/community programs. Sometimes our credentials are good but not competitive enough compared with other applicants applying to the same institution.

If he already did that, have you asked a native American to read his eras CV and personal statement? I wonder if there was any glaring mistake that he did not realize, like odd syntax/grammar, spellings, word choice, etc? It seems odd to me that he only got 2 IV with that stat. Did he apply on time? Sorry if this has been addressed before and I missed it.

Personally, I think he should try again. I second other's opinion of taking step 3.

I wonder if working as a physician back home while he prepares for next cycle is feasible? Last year I attended a panel discussion of several PDs talking about what they look for in an applicant. One of many is continued clinical experience, be it in your country or in US. Of course USCE is better, but I get that not everyone can afford the expensive fee. Maybe @aProgDirector can clarify on this?

Best to your brother!

 

[deleted500612]

I'd suggest applying for a pathology residency in New York or thereabouts.

Your bro's stats are good, and I wonder what it was that sunk him, but as far as getting "a job" goes, pathology is a good bet for an FMG (just don't expect a good job after residency's done)

If you check out the Buffalo NY program for pathology, it is possible that 100% of the residents are FMGs. Try applying to programs like that, if only for a backup.

I am wondering the same. Looking at his stats, he appears to be quite a strong candidate. I find it hard to believe he was only offered 2 interviews with those kind of scores, especially since you say he applied to 95 relatively uncompetitive IM programs... I have a feeling that there is some sort of red flag that programs are seeing that is being omitted here (perhaps something he isnt telling your family about). Either that or for some reason his LoR are significantly weaker than he thinks. I know IMGs with scores in the 220s that not only got 10+ interviews in IM, but also matched. Something just feels off here.

 

[doctr1]

The whole match thing is immensely unpredictable ... especially for IMGs, no body knows whats happening behind the scenes ..

 

[p1k14]

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