Updating your applicant file...

[masterofmonkeys]

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If you have new pubs or other information, is this something to bombard residency programs with?

I'm leaning toward just emailing the program coordinators and letting them know that I have new info, and if they'd like I could send them details. *shrug*

 

[Doc Samson]

If you have new pubs or other information, is this something to bombard residency programs with?

I'm leaning toward just emailing the program coordinators and letting them know that I have new info, and if they'd like I could send them details. *shrug*

Yes, and I'd even e-mail the PD directly.

 

[RaistlinMajere]

Yes, and I'd even e-mail the PD directly.

Does this include step 2 scores? Or is it enough just to re-submit your transcript?

 

[whopper]

I'd let the program know.

If someone passed Step II, or published something, I would put that person up a notch or 2.

The program I where I graduated from one year accepted someone who had not yet passed Step II and took it at the last moment before residency started. He was in orientation, got his results & did not pass. That caused some problems because we already made the schedule planning on him being in that schedule.

Hey, I know, what were they (or we) thinking. Hey, I wasn't the Chief then, and would've been vocal about accepting someone without a Step II score, had I been in that process. When I was Chief, if someone hadn't taken Step II, I did hold it against the candidate, US grad or not, unless their Step I score was high enough to make me very confident they wouldn't fail Step II.

 

[Still Kickin]

When I was Chief, if someone hadn't taken Step II, I did hold it against the candidate, US grad or not, unless their Step I score was high enough to make me very confident they wouldn't fail Step II.

Just out of curiosity - what sort of Step I scores made you feel confident about the applicant's ability to pass Step II?

(I should have my Step II scores back just in the nick of time for Match Day, but was curious how much the Step II info will be a factor with programs [if they are ALREADY working on their rank lists NOW {with my score not yet in}] since I already have a pretty decent Step I score.

Also, did you care about Step II CS? or just CK? (I can't take my CS until mid-Feb, that was honestly the earliest date available when I signed up...)

 

[whopper]

I would only hold it against the candidate if their score was borderline passing or they failed it at least once, and didn't take Step II.

Mind you that I don't really put too much stock in the USMLE. If someone does well on it, that does show something, but I know several who were excellent doctors who didn't do well on it.

I don't try to differentiate candidates based on a filter like the USMLE, unless there were multiple failures, I'm talking like 3 or more. I only really cared about Step I if Step II wasn't taken because the Step II score does tend to correlate somewhat with Step I. If they hadn't taken Step II, didn't do so hot on Step I, then its raises the stakes that you'll accept someone who by residency time starts may get a Step II failure letter in the mail. That's not good for the program.

If the person passed Step II, I wouldn't really care much what their Step I score was. By the time the program I was in started to differentiate between candidates we liked after the interview process, USMLE scores were hardly a factor at all.

 

[masterofmonkeys]

I'd let the program know.

If someone passed Step II, or published something, I would put that person up a notch or 2.

I haven't gotten a whole lot of responses, which is kinda scary. But I don't think my new pub and available working papers really change things that much. I'm previously published as sole author on related work and talked about the working papers (which weren't working at the time) in depth at my interviews.

And boo for not caring about Step 2 that much. My USMLE scores are some of the best parts of my application dangit.

 

[billypilgrim37]

And boo for not caring about Step 2 that much. My USMLE scores are some of the best parts of my application dangit.

At the more competitive programs, the USMLE still means something, although that something probably had more to do with getting the interview in the first place, and probably not too much once you've interviewed.

However, either side of the tail of distribution probably correlates slightly with psychopathology, so a 235 might be safer than a 250...

 

[dianamd]

What about for those of us who will probably not have Step 2 CK scores back in time for the rank list due date (2/25)?

I guess there is nothing to do about this, but hopefully it won't go against me. I did well on Step I so scheduled my Step 2 late so that I wouldn't screw it up!

 

[whopper]

Diana, take what I said with a grain of salt. That's only what I did do at my program. Not everyone had the same criteria I did.

And boo for not caring about Step 2 that much. My USMLE scores are some of the best parts of my application dangit.

MOM-from what you've told me about your transcript & CV-it was very impressive, and your scores were to the point where I would actually take notice on them becuase they were very high.

 

[billypilgrim37]

I guess there is nothing to do about this, but hopefully it won't go against me.

There's plenty you all should be doing about this. You should be demanding that your medical schools properly convey that it is the utmost importance that Step 2 be taken care of in the first half of the M4 year. They give you outdated information, y'all sit on your tails thinking you'll worry about it at the last minute, and then you and all your classmates have one more thing to worry about when you already have MORE than enough on your minds.

Seriously, you all should march on your offices of student programs and demand to know why their poor advising might make a difference in where you spend the rest of your medical training.

It was a requirement at my school that these things be taken care of before December, with strong recommendation to take them September or earlier. That's perfectly reasonable, and kept any of us from having to worry about Step 2.

 

[dianamd]

There's plenty you all should be doing about this. You should be demanding that your medical schools properly convey that it is the utmost importance that Step 2 be taken care of in the first half of the M4 year. They give you outdated information, y'all sit on your tails thinking you'll worry about it at the last minute, and then you and all your classmates have one more thing to worry about when you already have MORE than enough on your minds.

Seriously, you all should march on your offices of student programs and demand to know why their poor advising might make a difference in where you spend the rest of your medical training.

It was a requirement at my school that these things be taken care of before December, with strong recommendation to take them September or earlier. That's perfectly reasonable, and kept any of us from having to worry about Step 2.

Wait, are you serious?

I am not worried about passing or even doing well on Step 2. I am sure that I passed and feel confident that I did well (not ridiculous, but hey, it's ok).

I am not so worried about Step 2 as much as hoping that the lack of a score doesn't work against me -- for the programs I am considering, which are some of the more competitive programs out there.

Anyway, for me, during this application cycle, my score will not be in before 2/25. They will rank me using only my Step 1 and my otherwise interesting application. C'est la vive!

 

[billypilgrim37]

Wait, are you serious?

I'm entirely serious. In the past two years, there have probably been 15 threads with people with some concern about whether their Step 2 will be in on time, or whether programs will rank them differently if their Step 2 scores aren't available. In most situations, this is a result of medical schools failing to advise their students properly. You don't pay 160k for an education to receive bad advising. That's unacceptable.

 

[CaMD]

My school told us that it used to be that programs didn't care about step 2 but that more and more programs are slowly starting to require it. (Of course, they told us this after I already had my 4th year schedule in place with step 2 scheduled for December...)

 

[dianamd]

My school told us that it used to be that programs didn't care about step 2 but that more and more programs are slowly starting to require it. (Of course, they told us this after I already had my 4th year schedule in place with step 2 scheduled for December...)

OK, yes. But only one program I know of requires Step 2 (Longwood). And they said, if you don't have your score, please let us know when you are taking it.

So I don't think the issue of Step 2 being "REQUIRED" will be an issue, at least for me.

Whether it is quietly examined, searched for, discreetly wondered about -- That is my bigger concern.

This thread is stressing me out, even though I can't do anything about it now (unless I move up my test from 1.5 weeks from now till tomorrow -- probably impossible!).

As Homer might say, D'oh.

 

[billypilgrim37]

So I don't think the issue of Step 2 being "REQUIRED" will be an issue, at least for me.

I'm sure it won't be. The kids deciding between UCLA and Columbia and Cornell, etc, aren't the kids who get screwed by this dynamic. I remember the kids from Cornell interviewing last year talking about how none of them were even planning to take Step 2 before the match, and I'm sure it never mattered. Of course not. But that is a minority of applicants.

And even at whichever good medical you're at, you'll have friends who are at risk for failing Step 2. I had a friend get her fail result back in December, and she decided to take a year to do research instead of scrambling to interview with a fail hanging over her head. This was at a top 10 med school, and she was no marginal candidate. She had a terrible day, and was a little worried. Heck, I had a terrible day and my score dropped 9 points from Step 1. That was still six zip codes away from fail, but still. S*** happens.

You're fine. But tell your medical school that you and your compatriots would have less fuel for your neuroses if they'd update their advising to match the fact that passing Step 2 now matters some times, even if at some point in the past it didn't at all.

 

[2tall]

It is a safer bet to have all requirements out of the way before ranking begins. A passing CS and CK prior to January is optimal, since it removes potential risk. If I had similar applicants - one with scores and one without - I'd probably rank the have higher on my list.

I was advised by a dear friend to get everything out of the way ASAP so programs would know you're ready to begin in July with no strings attached.

If one has a history of academic excellence, I wouldn't think it'd be that big a deal. Could be wrong though...

 

[dianamd]

If one has a history of academic excellence, I wouldn't think it'd be that big a deal.

Oh, man, banking on my history of academic excellence yet again. Don't let me down...

Seriously, people, am I the only one (willing to reply) that won't have my Step 2CK score back by 2/25?

 

[masterofmonkeys]

I won't have CS but I have CK.

 

[whopper]

Seriously, people, am I the only one (willing to reply) that won't have my Step 2CK score back by 2/25?

I feel bad now, because I think I might've mentioned something that may have given you a scare.

Wish I could say something that could make you feel better.
I've also noticed several during the MATCH process to over-worry, and were on much better standing than they thought they were.

Look at it this way, if its something you are worrying about that you can fix--then channel that anxiety & try to fix it. If not, then let it go, only because you deserve better than to worry about things you cannot change.

I'm sure it won't be. The kids deciding between UCLA and Columbia and Cornell, etc, aren't the kids who get screwed by this dynamic.

Probably true. The pressure on IMGs to get Step II out of the way is more, because they have to prove themselves, and because if I remember correctly, the MATCH requires a Step II from IMGs (been awhile so I don't remember).

My Step II sentiment was also not shared by many others in the program. I'm of the sort where if a major problem happens, I try see if there was something that was preventable about it to incorporate into my schema so next time it happens I'll detect it before it becomes a big problem. That one year--we accepted a guy who didn't have Step II in yet, and when residency started, he got a failing Step II score. I figured to myself, to prevent this problem, we need to be more on top of the Step II score situations. I however noticed that during the group meetings on applicants, I was pretty much the only guy mentioning that the lack of Step II was of concern. The attendings didn't seem to care much. I didn't know why that was. That one year-the loss of a first year did cause pretty big scheduling problems & headaches so I thought the attendings would be more on guard, but hey, what do I know. I don't know how every single program would handle it...I could only tell you how I handled it.

 

[redclarissa]

hi!
i have a specific question.
i did better than average on step1 and bombed step 2 (203/83).
i just didnt put in enough time and was very busy with another elective.

i am very hesitant to send the score to the top programs that i am applying to. i already feel like a sub-par applicant on paper.

what are your feelings about this type of situation?

 

[2tall]

P is for Psychiatrist!

I wouldn't bring additional attentino to it by e-mailing about it, but hasn't it already been sent? Doesn't your USMLE transcript automatically update?

 

[CaMD]

What do you guys think is the lower cut-off for a step2 CK score high enough to email about?

 

[2tall]

I'm not sure if the score matters. I just remember distinctly that one PD stated I should e-mail/update the coordinator when my scores had arrived. I did just that. A quick e-mail to say my ck score is in.

I don't think it was a matter of score...just more about having an additional aspect checked off.

 

[whopper]

I don't think it was a matter of score...just more about having an additional aspect checked off.

That's what it would've been on my list.

One thing to clarify is I was impressed with a very high USMLE score, but I didn't hold it against anyone if they failed once or twice or had borderline passing scores.

By the time it got to the level where we narrowed down the top 50, we were considering the whole candidate. Scores only made a difference if they were exceptionally well. People showing a sincere interest in psychiatry was the most important thing. We had plenty with scores that were not on the highest order, but for example had done research with top researchers in the field, not just some token research for the CV. Someone being able to show excellent insight into the field was also something I was very impressed with.

 

[cleareyedguy]

I wouldn't "bombard," but I would send a brief note to the PD indicating your continued strong interest along with a mention of the additional info.