UPenn Post Bacc Program

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I cannot find the LPS gen chem recitation either 🙁 There doesn't seem to be a level -600 one for recitation...

Right now I have Chem-001-601 T
Chem-053-601 Thurs
Biol-101-602 Fri
Biol - 101-601 Sat morning
 
I couldnt see a recitation either. No idea what thats about. Maybe Ali can help out as she is Pre-Health.

Can you guys enroll for summer? or is it not letting you? If you wanted to take summer classes and can sign up, go for it. Whats the worst that happens? they dont let you lol

Realize tho if you are taking stuff over the summer its with regular UG and a lot more expensive - the LPS summer program is the 12-week program and you'll have to pay like 1.5x as much to take non-LPS classes
 
Thank for the help I had a terrible head ache last night from trying to figure it out- haha.
 
robflanker said:
I'm taking physics this summer at Penn. I am doing Physics in the summer, gen chem and bio during the year, and then orgo over the summer. Hopefully, then I can studying for the Mcat in the spring semester and summer and take the MCATs in late july or early august. I think I saw that I'll have to take orgo lab the following fall semester - it's not offered in the summer right?

I was going to take chem this summer but then I'd have to take physics next summer instead and I feel like there would probably be more physics than orgo 2 on the Mcat.
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Orgo in general is only like 1/3 of the BS section and its mostly Orgo 1; so you should be ok in general.

I dont think Orgo lab is offered over the summer but i might be wrong as I am not taking it here.
 
robflanker said:
Is there a recitation required for gen chem? If so, you'll have to sign up for that too.

And when you are searching for classes there is a drop down that says like "program" or somehting like that. and you can select LPS to make it easier for yourself.

Anything that comes in the LPS section is what you want but yes, emtdan, it sounds like thats the chem class you want. Our classes are ranked 600-ish for the most part
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Last year, the professor just added the recitation to the end of Gen. Chem. Lecture, but I think this may be a new thing they are doing. I never signed up for an actual recitation before. I had this issue signing up for physics. What I did, was simply find an undergrad recitation to compliment my post bac Physics lecture/lab. This allowed me to set up my classes. I don't think that it should effect billing since the recitation is 0 credits and my actual class is LPS.
 
Just to clarify - because I don't want to have to take an extra course in the future. If I take Chem 001 I can then take Chem 102 in the spring? I looked at the pre-reqs for Chem 102 and it says Chem 101 only. Thus, is Chem 001 and Chem 101 essentially the same, just taught at different speeds?
 
emtdan, this is confusing me as well... unless the LPS gen chem ends up being titled 002 or something...
 
I've no idea what you guys are referring to.

Just click the programs and select LPS and then search for chem classes. There should only be 1 and the lab listed unless the 2nd half is offered to which is unlikely.
 
On the LPS website where it says pre-health certificates, it lists the courses and it is CHEM 001 and CHEM 102 that are required. The course description states that CHEM 001 is satisfactory to meet preprofessional program requirements, so I assume it is satisfactory, and because there is no LPS Chem 101 I am assuming we are in the clear. I can call the Penn tomorrow and ask, they'll probably know me by the caller ID by now...haha
 
emtdan said:
On the LPS website where it says pre-health certificates, it lists the courses and it is CHEM 001 and CHEM 102 that are required. The course description states that CHEM 001 is satisfactory to meet preprofessional program requirements, so I assume it is satisfactory, and because there is no LPS Chem 101 I am assuming we are in the clear. I can call the Penn tomorrow and ask, they'll probably know me by the caller ID by now...haha
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Okay so I take it that you 2 are core students to be? robflanker is special i believe 😛 aka special sciences. I am core. As such, you should, if you're starting in the fall, take Chem 001 and Biol 101 in the fall and Chem 102 and Biol 102 in the spring. Some, very few, like 2 students i know from the core are taking Chem I, Biol I, and Phys I in Fall and Chem II, Biol II, and Phys II in the spring. If you're not in a rush, the advisors advise against this since all three classes are not only demanding but has a lab section each... thus 9 hours of lab in total a week plus lecture/recitation. Also, you will probably have Dr. P as your chem professor... great professor, but demands a lot of work... you will have his lecture + recitation + workshop + lab + some sunday classes per week :\

I know, intro bio is on saturday mornings... that was always a killer for me as I was known as the party boy first semester I enrolled in the program.

So a bunch of us, including myself, are doing orgo in the summer. then doing physics our second year along with orgo lab with some upper bio classes. Second year will also be prepping for MCATs.

so to answer your question specifically, chem 001, as i just checked my transcript, is what LPS students take as chem I and chem 102 is LPS student's chem II. Also, **you do not need to sign up for recitation** he just incorporates that into his lecture and makes it an hour longer 😛 lol so your schedule will say lecture 630 to 930... well you're staying till 1035. Recitation is for the TAs to go over problems, some people don't stay for it... as it may help or not help depending on how you study and how good your TA is at explaining it. More people skipped it as the semester went on, as it proved to be somewhat useless - since Dr. P posts very VERY detailed answers.

Hope this helps, PM me if you guys have more questions... I am a core student, but I actually know a lot of special people, hopefully, I can extend my knowledge to you guys

its a great program, I am more than satisfied with it. I love the city!!! but a bit of a warning... advising here isn't as good as most of us thought lol
 
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SM64##: lol

so to refer to your "schedule"
M: off (find volunteer)
T: Chem lecture from 630 to 1035 (includes recitation)
W: (Chem workshop 6-8 or workshop 8-10) and maybe Bio optional discussion
R: Chem Lab 630 to 930
F: Bio Lab 4-7 and (Chem workshop 6-8 -choose one of these workshops)
S: Bio Lecture 9-12

Dr. Witmer will keep you there till 11:40ish, sometimes later, sometimes earlier.

You guys admitted for the following Fall 2010?
 
Thanks for the responses. I think I've got it figured out, other than the computer not letting me schedule chem without a recitation. Oh well... I will just leave it as-is and see what happens. Audman, what is this workshop? Emtdan, if u have any luck calling let me know...caller ID lol.

So for volunteering, I plan on doing the HUP pre med program... Anyone think I will have time for other volunteering as well? Don't want to over-commit, but I just got an email about researching for the abramson cancer ctr... It's like 6-10 hr/wk...
 
sm640739 said:
Thanks for the responses. I think I've got it figured out, other than the computer not letting me schedule chem without a recitation. Oh well... I will just leave it as-is and see what happens. Audman, what is this workshop? Emtdan, if u have any luck calling let me know...caller ID lol.

So for volunteering, I plan on doing the HUP pre med program... Anyone think I will have time for other volunteering as well? Don't want to over-commit, but I just got an email about researching for the abramson cancer ctr... It's like 6-10 hr/wk...
Click to expand...


The workshop is when you go for two hours and Dr. P will give you a set of questions (usually 2-3). You have the first hour to work in pairs/groups/individually in order to figure out the solutions to the problems as well as place them on the board. The second hour you review the answers, but he does not review any questions that have not been placed on the board.

As for volunteering and such, it really depends on you. I think you should be fine with the pre-med at HUP as well as at the cancer center. I work and volunteer at HUP, as well as for other things here and there while taking Chem and Bio. The HUP program is easy/busy work in the first tier anyway. The second tier gets a little more interesting though pending which department you are in.

Just to comment on the Chem 101 as opposed to Chem 001, Chem 001 is expecting you to not have any Chem experience, which is why post-bacs take it. The undergrad, Chem 101, expects you to know something from your highschool chem classes. Each class is supposed to prepare you for Chem 102, which is why we all filter into the same class, but different section.
 
ali answered what the workshop is...

the HUP pre-med volunteer is pretty standard volunteer. I have yet to partake in it... will start over summer or fall for that. I heard it is just busy work... the only thing possibly good about it is you get a letter from them at the end of your service. Some people may argue that that is useless since they don't know you well? lol The volunteering coordinator at HUP are also not very nice... not helpful... so some also may argue, do you really want a letter from them? :\

You can find volunteer work other than that program... As I have. It is probably on a more personal level with a doctor, nurse, and staff. Not to mention you're probably doing more "useful" things than fetch things, wheel patients around, refill gloves... etc.

If you're already from the philly area, why don't you start volunteering somewhere now? before you even start the program?
 
I am all for volunteering and such but I prefer to do research. I already of thousands of hours of volunteering at my local ems so I'd rather not do busy work volunteering unless its for the name HUP or unless med schools will questioned why I stopped. I have no research background though. I'll have to look into different opportunities for the fall. I know I saw a document with volunteer/research opportunities on the LPS website, is there elsewhere I should look?


I'm obviously not from philly so I know nothing.
 
I am filling out the application now for the fall semester and was generally wondering how long most people's essay answers were. I feel like I am writing a book at this point and am just worried about making it too long or too short! Any feedback would be great, thanks! 🙂
 
policydc said:
I am filling out the application now for the fall semester and was generally wondering how long most people's essay answers were. I feel like I am writing a book at this point and am just worried about making it too long or too short! Any feedback would be great, thanks! 🙂
Click to expand...

Hey. I'm applying too, just waiting on my LOR's. With 1.5 spacing my essays come out to be 5 pages. I dont know how that compares to people who are already in the program though.
 
wow 5 pages? I don't remember how long mine was to be exact... but I think mine was around 3... 2 and a half. Of course, granted the questions are the same...

I think its important to be concise yet to the point. I am not a good writer, but if you read "how to write well" articles or articles of that sort, generally, they tell you to be short and to the point.

Think about it this way, if you're reading someone's essay... and it doesn't interest you, would you want to keep reading for 5 pages?
 
It's 7 questions total, and it can get quite long if you let it. That's why I'm trying to edit down and just keep it to the essential info. They seem to ask for a lot more information than other post-bac apps, so it's interesting.
 
Mine was long-ish. ~4 pages, single spaced. I copied the questions into a word doc, and reformatted it... first question was one word answer, 2nd question was 1.5 pages alone, 3rd was ~1 pg, 4th was a little over .5, and then 5/6/7 made up the remainder.

The important part is that you get your point across effectively... I'd say length doesn't matter, as long as they are fully developed answers.
 
So I've posted about my UVA v. Penn dilemma, and I imagine that people are getting particularly annoyed that I can't make up my mind. But now I feel especially panicked, as the UVA director told me I will lose my place if I don't make a decision in 48 hours.

First, a little info. I'm coming out of undergrad with a 3.6 with a liberal arts degree. I HAVE NOT TOUCHED MATH SINCE freshman year, and this was a FINITE MATH course that a 2nd grader could do. My Math SAT score is a 500- well below average. Thus, you can see why my confidence level in the math/sci area is also well below average.

So, for those of you who can handle my indecisiveness, I need you! I did the whole pro con thing, didn't help needless to say.

I really want to try for a linkage, but it seems that it's not likely with Penn. I don't intend to try for the top schools, but I am shooting for George Washington, which requires a 3.5 and 30 MCAT. Can anyone possibly tell me straight up, how doable is that with Penn's program? Maybe it's something that only I can answer (as I know my capabilities) but can anyone give me an idea of how doable a 3.5 GPA is in Penn's program?
FOr those who've completed the program, did you find that most your classmates were able to achieve a GPA around there?

With UVA, I get the benefit of excellent academic support and teachers who care (as I'm told), but the chance that I might not do well with 3 class per semester, as the program offers only a 12 month option, as you can see from above, I am coming from a practically nonexistent background in math/sci.


your help means so much, more than i can possibly tell you.
 
No-one can tell you how do-able it is because no-one knows how you are going to perform. No-one has an idea if you can get a 3.5 apart from you.

For the GW link, you can do it in 1-2 years so you dont have to do the fast 1-yr timeframe. You must have a sciGPA of 3.5 to be eligible and you must have a good enough resume to out compete other potential linkees.

Most of my classmates do not get a 3.5. It just doesn't happen; do people do well and link to other places like Jefferson which has a 3.4. I don't think everyone gets 3.5 here otherwise the grading scale wouldn't be respected.

You'll see we have this debate, at nauseum, on almost every page of this thread.
 
Hey coolcait- we have the same issue. That was a major debate for me also. At UVA it seems like there will be a ton of support and I am familiar with the area, Upenn is something new, I think that they seem to have alot more opportunities, I too am just debating how high my GPA will be. do you think that you will do the program in a year or 2, many of the prehealth advisors at penn recommend 2 years for more stability, opportunities and better grades.
 
I wouldn't put a lot of stock in the prehealth advisors at Penn in general....just my $0.02
 
robflanker said:
I wouldn't put a lot of stock in the prehealth advisors at Penn in general....just my $0.02
Click to expand...

Not just there, but a great many of them are not that great. You really have to be your own advisor and follow-up/double check that everything is in order and have as much control over your own credentials, stats, LORs, etc. The application process for Med School and for that matter, any of the other health professions is really complicated.

I've read a lot of advisors and mentors from both post-bac, biomedical grad programs, and SMPs on here that did nothing or give little to no insight/guidance to the students enrolled in their programs. You basically have to take everything upon yourself to do and make sure it gets done.

Its a real shame considering how ridiculous the tutition is for some of these post-bac and SMPs are that they should be helping out with mentoring and advising then they are.
 
My situation is kind of similar, in that I haven't seen math since freshman year. I know this, however, so I'll be brushing up this summer and reviewing gen chem concepts to prepare myself. I think it's possible to do well if u apply yourself. I have a 3.9 going into penns program, but that doesn't affect my sgpa at all... Just the cgpa. No one can make your decision for you... My advice is just go with your gut instinct. Did u visit both places? Where can you see yourself? Etc etc. Pro/con list didn't really help me either lol... I know that I'm going to have to work hard, but this is good preparation for med school. If you really need the support of an advisor, I guess Penn is prob not the best for that right now. But depending on your most influencial decision-making criteria, Penn may be a better fit. Only you can decide...

Good luck!!:luck:
 
Penn has two ben and jerry's close by I just learned. That may make your decision.
 
is it bad that I've never been to Ben and jerry's ... I feel like I missed out or something
 
lol to ben and jerrys. most of us, well most people I hang with, choose Kiwi (formerly known as Sprinkles) over ben and jerrys.... or the italian gelato plce by Radian. and where you from sm### lol that you haven't been to BnJ's?

I know its been past 48 hours but if advising is important to you, I'd stay away from Penn. They are halfway decent, but regardless of how GOOD advising is, it's ultimately your decision. So, in my opinion, Penn's advising, though unhelpful, any advising is... theoretically speaking. Advising here will tell you straight forward, what you need to do, what your chances are... etc. but "some" information have been wrong... flat out wrong.

As far as linkage... linkage is competitive. If you have a withdraw anywhere on your transcript, I hear you will not even be nominated from Penn to link... let alone the school you want to link will pick you. I believe the process is you apply to be nominated by Penn... then amongst the nominees, the medical school you want to link admits you or denies you. So its almost like a two step process. Which means even if you're grades/requirements meet the baseline for that school, you want to apply to a school where you're more than well qualified... can beat out your competition. which means you should apply to a school where the requirements are a bit lower than your credentials (i.e. you're gpa is 3.6 and say Penn Medical school requires a minimal gpa of 3.6, then you probably shouldn't apply to link to Penn). So, the advisors here will more than likely tell you to not link, as you'd have a better chance to get into a better medical school as regular admission...
 
O and one more thing... I've read and heard that Penn along with Bryn Mawr, Columbia are one of the better Post-Bac programs... Sorry don't know much about UVA's.

Not to mention, Philly is a fun city... except that bars close at 2 AM. idk if night life/social things are important to you but you need an outlet to get rid of stress some how.
 
If you choose to not go to Upenn because you can't get your drunk on past 2am, maybe med school isn't the best choice.

And yes ben and jerrys is over-rated, but at least they donate a portion of their profits. In actuality, I am more one for the $2 half gallon special at Sam's club.
 
I disagree with Audman about Columbia and about Penn advising knowing about one's chances of getting into medical school. They are truly beyond useless and don't know their own class offerings so I don't personally trust anything that they say about medical school admissions.

I personally haven't been devastated that the bars close at 2am whilst living in Philly. At my undergrad they closed at 1am. Plus it means you can leave, go get a cheesesteak, and then go to an after-party. Not sure what the big deal is...
 
hey just to check in... early registration closes in a few days. Do you need to do anything other than have the courses in your "cart"? I don't see an option to submit.
 
rock2doc - no submission - the courses enroll based on the cart.

audman - Im from West Chester PA (chester county - like 45 mins away from Philly)... so I've heard of Kiwi. We actually have one right in our town - used to be a Sprinkles also... apparently they were sued because of the cupcake place in CA. Ridiculous... "Sprinkles" makes more sense for a frozen yogurt place, if u ask me... my cupcakes usually don't have sprinkles on them.

rob - I hope the "truly beyond useless" advising doesn't steer me wrong lol... I'm going back there on Tues! :-/
 
rock - just order them in your cart in the preference you want them.

sm - just do as we discussed and you'll be ok
 
a withdraw on an undergrad gpa will destroy all chances of a linkage? is that a fact? I had to withdraw from some courses one semester because I was extremely ill... sigh. I hope that doesn't ruin all of my chances.
 
not that i necessarily have any chances, but theoretically speaking 🙂
 
My interviewer said "there is no reason to think I will not be accepted." It ain't over 'til the fat lady sings but I feel quite swell about the situation down at Penn.

That being said, I was begged for around 20 minutes not to do a one year track. I've got a solid academic background so there is no real reason to be so violently against my potential attempt at it. Why would an advisor say such a thing? I understand 2 years is an easier time frame and success is probably a more sure bet but I would very much like to link and do it swiftly. Perhaps it is Penn advisor routine to say such things, with all of the negative commentary here about their advising.
 
Well that and summer session is filled up so theoretically you cant do the 1-yr track
 
Yeah, that's true I guess, lol.

Question: How prompt after admission is Penn in getting your financial situation arranged? Is it largely up to the student to pursue Federal loans and what have you? Undergraduate institutions work this out for you, and I am curious as to who I will need to call in the coming weeks in order to set everything up in time.
 
Did u fill out FAFSA? I think I read somewhere on Penns site that they start evaluating FAFSA and determining aid on March 31 or April 1... So if you filled everything out I'm assuming you'll hear back this month... Did you get in? Bc once you do there are places on the Penn Portal to figure out all of the financial stuff
 
Yes, I was accepted to begin in the summer and plan to pursue all funding available but have been reluctant to accept admission without any information about Penn's options (though I do realize a lot of it will be up to my own pursuit of private sources of funding).

I suppose it doesn't really matter and I should happily hop aboard.

Cheers all, I am thankful to have a program to attend this year.
 
emtdan said:
If you choose to not go to Upenn because you can't get your drunk on past 2am, maybe med school isn't the best choice.

And yes ben and jerrys is over-rated, but at least they donate a portion of their profits. In actuality, I am more one for the $2 half gallon special at Sam's club.
Click to expand...

lol late response but I can't help but your response sort of rubs me the wrong way. In case you haven't spoke to people who's in med school... med school kids party crazy dude. the whole "party hard work hard." perhaps you need to know how to prioritize your time... its not all about studying... perhaps if you're a nerd then yes? lol Its more how to efficiently work... party... how efficiently you decide to use your time.

Often in life, people who are well rounded are more successful. In the med school app process, interview is a big part 😉 nothing wrong with being social. Life's about making relationships and networking.

sleep for 5 hours a night. wake up, do volunteer/research, then school work, class, school work again... then relax/drink with people some nights... repeat. lol sleep is waste of time.

sm- yes we still call it sprinkles despite the sign change to kiwi. A friend showed me the sickest combo today... O boy. its a great place 😀

As far as advising goes. You can think they are useless... but the truth of the matter is, wrong info or not, they do know more than you. Anything regarding admissions to any school, whether that be med school, law school, or phd programs, there isn't a set of rules... no guarantees, so take what they say, surf the web, figure it out from there... no one knows the answer, thats what I meant by advising is advising. NO one can tell you, you have x% chance of getting in here and y% chance of getting in there... As the advisors are known to give wrong advices, the bottom line is, the ultimate decision is down to you. Thus, it doesn't matter what they say- right or wrong- just do your best... to increase your chances, use your knowledge and instinct to pick and choose classes, talk to people who's taken it. Thats what i meant by you don't really NEED advising... thus that is true for anywhere. Hence me saying: if advising is the only thing deterring you from coming to Penn, that shouldn't play a factor.

Good luck to all of us!!
 
Audman said:
As far as advising goes. You can think they are useless... but the truth of the matter is, wrong info or not, they do know more than you
Click to expand...
If you are referencing the ones at Penn, then we are going to have to disagree. If you are referencing good advisors than they must be elsewhere or you've not really interacted with the ones here. Have you been to the med school process workshops? the amcas one or the personal statement writing one or another?
Penn advising knows about as much about this process as a your common garden toad.

I suppose there is a scenario where someone doesnt know what a DO is, nor the pre-reqs for med school, nor what AMCAS is, then the advising might know more but i'd like to think we are all a bit more invested in our future than that.
 
Audman said:
lol late response but I can't help but your response sort of rubs me the wrong way. In case you haven't spoke to people who's in med school... med school kids party crazy dude. the whole "party hard work hard." perhaps you need to know how to prioritize your time... its not all about studying... perhaps if you're a nerd then yes? lol Its more how to efficiently work... party... how efficiently you decide to use your time.

Often in life, people who are well rounded are more successful. In the med school app process, interview is a big part 😉 nothing wrong with being social. Life's about making relationships and networking.

sleep for 5 hours a night. wake up, do volunteer/research, then school work, class, school work again... then relax/drink with people some nights... repeat. lol sleep is waste of time.


Good luck to all of us!!
Click to expand...


Hey - I think you misread me. I completely agree someone has to have a social life and go out, relax, party...etc. If a med school admissions committee though asks why you choose East-bumble post bac instead of Upenn? I assume it might come off unfavorably if the person states, the bars closed at 2am which was too early for me. Extracurriculars are imperative to getting into med school, but if someone chose against one school because they couldn't drink at a bar at 2, I question their priorities - this having to do nothing with social life, but more so that comes of as an alcoholic if you base your decisions on when and where and for how long you can drink...

I did not say I am not disappointed I can't drink past 2 - but it wasn't in my decision when accepting Upenn! haha
 
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