Using benzos during med school

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bak

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Please dont give me any tirades about how bad benzo's are or how they are a crutch or how they affect memory...I am simply looking for some support. I am on a LOA from my first year of med school due to having a manic episode, which was followed by a long phase of treatment resistant depression (bipolar 2). It seems like the only thing that might be able to help me get through med school during the depressive phases of this illness are unfortunately benzos (have tried ssris, snris, maois, aaps, etc). This usually lasts about 6 months, after which I switch into a better mood. So ideally, I would use them in 5-6 month increments.

Has anyone ever used benzos throughout medical school while still being a successful student? Please share any stories, as I would really love to hear some support.

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Honestly it sounds like you know what the correct medical treatment for your condition is but you want to ignore it and do it your own way. Benzos are not the chronic treatment of choice for anything anymore. I suggest you take the LOA and get in with a good therapist and psychiatrist and work through everything you need to. Medical school will be almost impossible if you don't have your bipolar disorder in order and as above poster stated, true mania would represent bipolar 1. Hypomania is bipolar 2.
 
1. A sufficiently dedicated student could easily do so, but 2. such a student would know that benzos are not something you're supposed to take chronically unless you're trying to develop tolerance and dependence and 3. /InBeforeClosedBecauseSDNIsNotForMedicalAdvice
 
a. It was a drug induced manic episode which puts me in a grey area
b. I am on lithium which doesn't touch my depression, neither does lamictal
c. Benzos only serve to help me to go out and interact w pple around me during this period of time, which is an important part of life
 
and already have been on a loa for 7 months
 
How are you gonna study on a benzo? I find it hard to believe you'll be able to function properly as a med student and physician on this class of drug. 😕
 
I appreciate everyone's input, I am more looking for support from anyone who's had to go through med school on these types of drugs. It really sucks that benzos are the only drugs that provide some relief (have tried around 16). My situation is a bitch but id still like to pursue my dreams.
 
I appreciate everyone's input, I am more looking for support from anyone who's had to go through med school on these types of drugs. It really sucks that benzos are the only drugs that provide some relief (have tried around 16). My situation is a bitch but id still like to pursue my dreams.
You're looking for support in the wrong place. If you want someone to sugar coat something, then speak to your mother. Or you know, speak to your actual psychiatrist about this since they're prescribing the med.
 
I know that seems cold, but SDN is not the place for medical advice. Going through your history, someone already advised you to make sure you were well enough to start medical school. If you're sick, you should focus on yourself, and forget about school for now. Don't make the same mistake twice.
 
I appreciate everyone's input, I am more looking for support from anyone who's had to go through med school on these types of drugs. It really sucks that benzos are the only drugs that provide some relief (have tried around 16). My situation is a bitch but id still like to pursue my dreams.

I don't think you'll find many medical students who are on chronic benzos
 
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This usually lasts about 6 months, after which I switch into a better mood. So ideally, I would use them in 5-6 month increments.

Odds are you will make excuses why you need to take them everyday.
 
not looking for medical advice, looking for medical school advice

It's medical advice that happens to pertain to medical school. Look man you are in the wrong place, where you need to go is a doctor. Hopefully this thread gets closed soon
 
Find it odd that you said manic episode and then called it bipolar 2, also that first line treatment is Li and you didn't mention trying it in your list. Red flags going up over here.

OP, you need to decide which do you want: a) to be a doctor or b) continue to delay getting better. I recommend also linking up with a therapist ASAP as it seems you already have a psychiatrist. Forget medical school, improve yourself first. Patients will be COUNTING ON YOU, so you can't half-$@# this... get professional help not help from the internet. Good luck.
 
Had a friend you was prescribed benzos during 1st year med school for 3 months. His grades tanked and he felt like he couldn't concentrate/retain any information. He stopped taking them because of his grades. N=1 and its really individual specific - you might be able to operate normally or at a level good enough to do well in med school. But it's not easy and it depends how you respond to them
 
Had a friend you was prescribed benzos during 1st year med school for 3 months. His grades tanked and he felt like he couldn't concentrate/retain any information. He stopped taking them because of his grades. N=1 and its really individual specific - you might be able to operate normally or at a level good enough to do well in med school. But it's not easy and it depends how you respond to them

Agree with the bolded. I'm only in my first year, so take this with a grain of salt. Also, I don't have bipolar disorder but I've had trouble with anxiety and insomnia since school started back in August. I've been taking different benzos for most of the school year - Ativan and Klonipin, and also Ambien (not a benzo, but a benzo-receptor agonist). Currently transitioning off of Klonipin to hopefully just need my non-benzo anti-anxiety medication.

I'd imagine it could be difficult to do handle med school while taking benzos - they have some side effects, especially Klonipin (sleepiness / "hazy" feeling). That being said, I think any trouble I personally have run into keeping up or focusing on schoolwork has probably been due more to mental health issues than to taking the medication. Even though it hasn't been an easy school year, I've been able to do very well up to this point (again, n=1), so it's certainly possible if you're regularly meeting with a psychiatrist and therapist. You want to make sure you're seeing a provider on a regular basis to help you, to make sure it's an appropriate medication for you at that time, to make sure you're doses are right, etc.

Don't mistake my post for medical advice. I'm not a medical professional and my experience with mental health is different from yours. I just wanted to let you know about my experience so far and to let you know that it is possible to be in medical school while taking these medications. You should look to a provider (preferably one you'll be able to see regularly), discuss this with them and hear what they have to say.
 
c. Benzos only serve to help me to go out and interact w pple around me during this period of time, which is an important part of life
This is called avoidance, and will only cause your problems to persist.
But to answer your question yes I know of a student who took clonazepam while in med school. He had to take a leave of absence, and when he came back, he was no longer taking that drug and was on long-term medication/counseling. Benzodiazepine dependence is incompatible with participation in patient care activities.
 
You really, really need to work this out with a psychiatrist. The advantage is they've been through med school and they will actually know you, and how to treat you...
 
Talk to your psychiatrist (I'm assuming you have one). However, I would exercise great caution and recognize that just in your posts here, you 1) have a history of a drug-induced mood disorder (I suppose this could be due to medications, but reading between the lines I'm guessing illicit drug use) and 2) you are using a medication which has absolutely nothing to do with controlling mood to "feel better." If you have an anxiety disorder, then get in some therapy and start controlling your symptoms that way. Absent that, I would look at your situation objectively, think about what you're actually getting out of the benzos, and react accordingly.

There's nothing wrong with taking benzos if you have crippling anxiety that has otherwise been resistant to treatment and they allow you to function. You seem to recognize there are long-term risks involved with that treatment. But your story gives me the flavor of "current/future substance abuse," and as a future physician that is unlikely to end well.
 
Please dont give me any tirades about how bad benzo's are or how they are a crutch or how they affect memory...I am simply looking for some support. I am on a LOA from my first year of med school due to having a manic episode, which was followed by a long phase of treatment resistant depression (bipolar 2). It seems like the only thing that might be able to help me get through med school during the depressive phases of this illness are unfortunately benzos (have tried ssris, snris, maois, aaps, etc). This usually lasts about 6 months, after which I switch into a better mood. So ideally, I would use them in 5-6 month increments.

Has anyone ever used benzos throughout medical school while still being a successful student? Please share any stories, as I would really love to hear some support.
See a psychiatrist. There are new drugs out today that will not affect your concentration and thinking, while helping your condition...
 
This is called avoidance, and will only cause your problems to persist.
But to answer your question yes I know of a student who took clonazepam while in med school. He had to take a leave of absence, and when he came back, he was no longer taking that drug and was on long-term medication/counseling. Benzodiazepine dependence is incompatible with participation in patient care activities.

I have another name for it. Drug abuse.

Red flags go off everywhere when I see somebody defending use of a substance that makes them high.
oxycodone for unbearable back pain
xanax for anxiety
adderall for ADHD
marijuana for literally just about anything

If you could take away the euphoric feeling from use of these drugs but somehow retain their ability to treat the conditions they are used for, their use would drop precipitously.
It's about getting high for the vast vast majority of people.
 
Talk to your psychiatrist (I'm assuming you have one). However, I would exercise great caution and recognize that just in your posts here, you 1) have a history of a drug-induced mood disorder (I suppose this could be due to medications, but reading between the lines I'm guessing illicit drug use) and 2) you are using a medication which has absolutely nothing to do with controlling mood to "feel better." If you have an anxiety disorder, then get in some therapy and start controlling your symptoms that way. Absent that, I would look at your situation objectively, think about what you're actually getting out of the benzos, and react accordingly.

There's nothing wrong with taking benzos if you have crippling anxiety that has otherwise been resistant to treatment and they allow you to function. You seem to recognize there are long-term risks involved with that treatment. But your story gives me the flavor of "current/future substance abuse," and as a future physician that is unlikely to end well.

To be fair, PLENTY of BPAD sufferers have their first manic episode induced by prescribed SSRIs or steroids. Hypomania by its definition can easily go under the radar, and most BPAD 2 sufferers spend their time depressed, and meet their final diagnosis after seeking help and having a bad experience with a prescribed SSRI. Of course illegal substances can as well, but in my experience physicians forget to screen for patients at high risk of manic switching (family history of BPAD, history of hypomanic symptoms) often. I'll go out on a limb and say I've seen way more manic episodes precipitated by a patient seeking care than illicit drug use but we need a citation here instead.

I have another name for it. Drug abuse.

Red flags go off everywhere when I see somebody defending use of a substance that makes them high.
oxycodone for unbearable back pain
xanax for anxiety
adderall for ADHD
marijuana for literally just about anything

If you could take away the euphoric feeling from use of these drugs but somehow retain their ability to treat the conditions they are used for, their use would drop precipitously.
It's about getting high for the vast vast majority of people.

OP, my note to you is at the end of this
Med students/physicians, a few notes

I have seen these drugs used appropriately and inappropriately. I'm not seeing an issue with using xanax for anxiety or adderall for ADHD.

Lithium is still considered "first line" as it is most *effective* however depending on the full psychiatric picture many psychiatrists do not use it first if they can find success with say, an atypical to "calm" a manic episode and then maintenance on lamotrigine or depakote. Most of the anticonvulsants have less downsides with side effects or levels monitoring/toxicity than lithium. Clinical severity will play a role too. Effectiveness of a medication is not the only consideration so it is not always lithium that is started.

The way OP phrased needing benzos for depression and to go out with friends raised my eyebrow TBH.

However, I will say that anxiety is frequently comorbid with bipolar disorder. Sometimes the two can be treated as though they are seperate disorders, meaning you could treat the anxiety like you would in someone without bipolar and have total success.

Last research I saw on pharmacological therapy for GAD supported benzos as more effective and still first line over SSRIs that are also effective. Not really what any doctor wants to hear. However, last research I saw still supported psychotherapy as more effective long term over benzos for GAD. So the truth is that the use of benzos in psychiatry is more complicated than "these drugs have abuse potential therefore they are bad and shouldn't be used." Studies still support they have medical application.

Let's remember that *agitation* is a standard symptom for mania/hypomania/mixed episode. What makes agitation so different than anxiety? Easy to mix them up. They don't feel very different from what I can tell. And it's very naive to think BPAD + Li or any other mood stabilizer = resolution of all symptoms. While I wouldn't expect benzos to act as a mood stabilizer for a mood episode in BPAD, I wouldn't be surprised if benzos had some effectiveness for some symptoms of anxiety/agitation. If fact, I know they do.

Li can cause tremor and I've heard of some people having anxiety on it! I've seen more than one patient *stuck* on seroquel/other atypical as a mood stabilizer, which then gives them akathisia for which I see neurologists and psychiatrists prescribe - you guessed it - a benzo. I know one patient taking Seroquel for BPAD nightly, taking clonazepam for the akathisia that kicks in acutely when the Seroquel hits them. They started to develop daytime anxiety, their psychiatrist said this was likely rebound anxiety for which he prescribed - you guessed it - daytime benzo.

Prescribing one medication to deal with the side effects of a first one is *never* ideal and to be avoided wherever possible.
The reality is, some people with BPAD effectively "luck out" and can take one medication, however, for most they need to a find a combination of medications for the primary mood disorder and also for not only lingering symptoms but also medication side effects!!

Let's make no mistake, Lithium and atypicals have side effects and suck and there's a reason BPAD sufferers don't want to take them, especially when they start feeling better (although of course to prevent harm they almost always need to continue them).

OP
All of this is to say, OP, I am not going to call you a drug abuser or make judgements for what you and your psychiatrist have worked out with your meds. You and he/she probably know this is not ideal and that if there's a way to manage your BPAD/anxiety without benzos that would be preferable. Talk with your psychiatrist about your concerns about benzos and your career plans.

I can't say there is any psych drug I have heard of a medical student/physician taking and NOT being able to be a medical student or physician just on that basis, but valid concerns were raised in this thread re: medication side effects and long term. Many people develop a tolerance to benzos where they lose effectiveness, often this ends with the dosage being increased, where there is diminishing benefit in the fact of increasing side effects, and as I mentioned potentially rebound anxiety, the very thing you wish to avoid now occurring between doses of the medication, just because the level is getting low in your blood! Medicine is a demanding career for the most healthy. Those with mental illness, particularly bipolar disorder, face special challenges. Being a medical student and a physician can be very anxiety-provoking, and dealing with people successfully a constant.

Check out
psycheducation.org and share the site and any info you think is interesting with your psychiatrist (Dr. Michael Phelps is a psychiatrist and expert in BPAD)
focus on self-care
feel free to PM me
I have an extensive post history on topics of mental health, disability, and medical administration. Feel free to search it as I am too tired to pick the links out for you at the moment. SDN has a search feature to search through a specific poster's history.
 
To be fair, PLENTY of BPAD sufferers have their first manic episode induced by prescribed SSRIs or steroids. Hypomania by its definition can easily go under the radar, and most BPAD 2 sufferers spend their time depressed, and meet their final diagnosis after seeking help and having a bad experience with a prescribed SSRI. Of course illegal substances can as well, but in my experience physicians forget to screen for patients at high risk of manic switching (family history of BPAD, history of hypomanic symptoms) often. I'll go out on a limb and say I've seen way more manic episodes precipitated by a patient seeking care than illicit drug use but we need a citation here instead.



OP, my note to you is at the end of this
Med students/physicians, a few notes

I have seen these drugs used appropriately and inappropriately. I'm not seeing an issue with using xanax for anxiety or adderall for ADHD.

Lithium is still considered "first line" as it is most *effective* however depending on the full psychiatric picture many psychiatrists do not use it first if they can find success with say, an atypical to "calm" a manic episode and then maintenance on lamotrigine or depakote. Most of the anticonvulsants have less downsides with side effects or levels monitoring/toxicity than lithium. Clinical severity will play a role too. Effectiveness of a medication is not the only consideration so it is not always lithium that is started.

The way OP phrased needing benzos for depression and to go out with friends raised my eyebrow TBH.

However, I will say that anxiety is frequently comorbid with bipolar disorder. Sometimes the two can be treated as though they are seperate disorders, meaning you could treat the anxiety like you would in someone without bipolar and have total success.

Last research I saw on pharmacological therapy for GAD supported benzos as more effective and still first line over SSRIs that are also effective. Not really what any doctor wants to hear. However, last research I saw still supported psychotherapy as more effective long term over benzos for GAD. So the truth is that the use of benzos in psychiatry is more complicated than "these drugs have abuse potential therefore they are bad and shouldn't be used." Studies still support they have medical application.

Let's remember that *agitation* is a standard symptom for mania/hypomania/mixed episode. What makes agitation so different than anxiety? Easy to mix them up. They don't feel very different from what I can tell. And it's very naive to think BPAD + Li or any other mood stabilizer = resolution of all symptoms. While I wouldn't expect benzos to act as a mood stabilizer for a mood episode in BPAD, I wouldn't be surprised if benzos had some effectiveness for some symptoms of anxiety/agitation. If fact, I know they do.

Li can cause tremor and I've heard of some people having anxiety on it! I've seen more than one patient *stuck* on seroquel/other atypical as a mood stabilizer, which then gives them akathisia for which I see neurologists and psychiatrists prescribe - you guessed it - a benzo. I know one patient taking Seroquel for BPAD nightly, taking clonazepam for the akathisia that kicks in acutely when the Seroquel hits them. They started to develop daytime anxiety, their psychiatrist said this was likely rebound anxiety for which he prescribed - you guessed it - daytime benzo.

Prescribing one medication to deal with the side effects of a first one is *never* ideal and to be avoided wherever possible.
The reality is, some people with BPAD effectively "luck out" and can take one medication, however, for most they need to a find a combination of medications for the primary mood disorder and also for not only lingering symptoms but also medication side effects!!

Let's make no mistake, Lithium and atypicals have side effects and suck and there's a reason BPAD sufferers don't want to take them, especially when they start feeling better (although of course to prevent harm they almost always need to continue them).

OP
All of this is to say, OP, I am not going to call you a drug abuser or make judgements for what you and your psychiatrist have worked out with your meds. You and he/she probably know this is not ideal and that if there's a way to manage your BPAD/anxiety without benzos that would be preferable. Talk with your psychiatrist about your concerns about benzos and your career plans.

I can't say there is any psych drug I have heard of a medical student/physician taking and NOT being able to be a medical student or physician just on that basis, but valid concerns were raised in this thread re: medication side effects and long term. Many people develop a tolerance to benzos where they lose effectiveness, often this ends with the dosage being increased, where there is diminishing benefit in the fact of increasing side effects, and as I mentioned potentially rebound anxiety, the very thing you wish to avoid now occurring between doses of the medication, just because the level is getting low in your blood! Medicine is a demanding career for the most healthy. Those with mental illness, particularly bipolar disorder, face special challenges. Being a medical student and a physician can be very anxiety-provoking, and dealing with people successfully a constant.

Check out
psycheducation.org and share the site and any info you think is interesting with your psychiatrist (Dr. Michael Phelps is a psychiatrist and expert in BPAD)
focus on self-care
feel free to PM me
I have an extensive post history on topics of mental health, disability, and medical administration. Feel free to search it as I am too tired to pick the links out for you at the moment. SDN has a search feature to search through a specific poster's history.

Even in those at "high risk" of affective switch the incidence of switching is actually quite low - something around 10%. But yes, it's possible.
 
Please dont give me any tirades about how bad benzo's are or how they are a crutch or how they affect memory...I am simply looking for some support. I am on a LOA from my first year of med school due to having a manic episode, which was followed by a long phase of treatment resistant depression (bipolar 2). It seems like the only thing that might be able to help me get through med school during the depressive phases of this illness are unfortunately benzos (have tried ssris, snris, maois, aaps, etc). This usually lasts about 6 months, after which I switch into a better mood. So ideally, I would use them in 5-6 month increments.

Has anyone ever used benzos throughout medical school while still being a successful student? Please share any stories, as I would really love to hear some support.
You'll get no preaching from me. I'm 48 years old and my doctor put me on xanax when I was 27 years old, so I've been on them for 21 years. I did get him to switch me to clonazepam recently because they've got a state-wide database that links all pharmacies now and that keeps me from getting one script filled slightly early out of every 3 (I see him every 12 weeks) and my fear of running out of xanax was worse than my fear of dying, because of its ridiculously short half-life, and now with clonazepam I don't worry about running out for one day and having seizures, but I will tell you that it DEFINITELY affects your short-term memory. That is not debatable. That is not my imagination. That is absolute fact. So, if you don't have to be on them, I wouldn't take them under any circumstances. Unfortunately, even after a switch to diazepam and an extremely slow 2 year taper, I was never able to get my brain to operate normally without them after being on them every day of my life for over 10 years. I had to sit in the room with the windows blackened out and no light of any kind on and I still had cluster headaches at worse (yes, real suicide headaches) and migraines at best. I slept, if at all, in micro naps, for about 6 months before I threw in the towel and told my doctor to put me back on the benzos. I've come to terms with the fact that I will have to take a benzodiazepine every day for the rest of my life. The thought of having to take any medication every day for the rest of my life used to be unbearable to me, but now that I have CML and have to take Sprycel every day for the rest of my life, it's just something I have to accept. But I would never tell someone to take benzos and as a doctor, I would actually read the package insert and never prescribe a benzo to one of my patients for more than 4 weeks at a time.
 
I have another name for it. Drug abuse.

Red flags go off everywhere when I see somebody defending use of a substance that makes them high.
oxycodone for unbearable back pain
xanax for anxiety
adderall for ADHD
marijuana for literally just about anything

If you could take away the euphoric feeling from use of these drugs but somehow retain their ability to treat the conditions they are used for, their use would drop precipitously.
It's about getting high for the vast vast majority of people.
I doubt it is for people who are on benzos every day for decades. I get absolutely no high or euphoria from them. They don't even help with my anxiety any longer. They keep me from going into benzodiazepine withdrawal and having the worst headaches I've ever had in my life and wanting to kill myself. But that's me. My ex-wife takes 20 at a time and runs out early and I presume that is because she gets some sort of euphoric high from them, but then again, she's a drug addict.
 
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I have another name for it. Drug abuse.

Red flags go off everywhere when I see somebody defending use of a substance that makes them high.
oxycodone for unbearable back pain
xanax for anxiety
adderall for ADHD
marijuana for literally just about anything

If you could take away the euphoric feeling from use of these drugs but somehow retain their ability to treat the conditions they are used for, their use would drop precipitously.
It's about getting high for the vast vast majority of people.
Newsflash, friend. I am one of the unfortunate individuals who has been legitimately diagnosed with ADD/ADHD. I can assure you that I get NO high from Adderall. If anything, it turns me into a damn non-functioning moody zombie. I work in healthcare, so I am just as "judging" as the next provider about things that push my buttons (in my case it is people using heroin... Darwinism has not done its job fast enough IMO) but for people who actually need Adderall, I hate that we are grouped under the "seeker" umbrella.
 
Newsflash, friend. I am one of the unfortunate individuals who has been legitimately diagnosed with ADD/ADHD. I can assure you that I get NO high from Adderall. If anything, it turns me into a damn non-functioning moody zombie. I work in healthcare, so I am just as "judging" as the next provider about things that push my buttons (in my case it is people using heroin... Darwinism has not done its job fast enough IMO) but for people who actually need Adderall, I hate that we are grouped under the "seeker" umbrella.
Strong bump.
 
Newsflash, friend. I am one of the unfortunate individuals who has been legitimately diagnosed with ADD/ADHD. I can assure you that I get NO high from Adderall. If anything, it turns me into a damn non-functioning moody zombie. I work in healthcare, so I am just as "judging" as the next provider about things that push my buttons (in my case it is people using heroin... Darwinism has not done its job fast enough IMO) but for people who actually need Adderall, I hate that we are grouped under the "seeker" umbrella.
Whats a "provider"?

Sent from my SM-N910P using SDN mobile
 
I know this is old and bak probably isn't even reading it at this point, but you might try high fat ketosis. The kind doctors prescribe epileptics, not the kind you find on bodybuilder websites which typically are higher in protein. Nobody should go off their meds or anything thinking keto is the cure, but it's something anyone with bipolar who is still struggling might consider trying.

Good luck.
 
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Has anyone ever used benzos throughout medical school while still being a successful student? Please share any stories, as I would really love to hear some support.

Hi Bak!

First, I'm sorry to hear that you're going through this -- it's a valid question, you're definitely NOT alone, and I do not speak only for myself when I say that I can empathize with your scenario. I was prescribed benzos during my first year of medical school by a family physician for severe insomnia (a direct result of the extreme pressure of the medical lifestyle).

At first, it was a God-send -- no more insomnia, and a clear head. As time progressed, however, I developed a tolerance to what started as a low dosage and my insomnia returned. Over the course of several months, my anxiety worsened and I eventually decided to taper off of the medication... doing this took several months and it was an EXTREMELY uncomfortable process.

Did my grades suffer? No. Did my wellbeing suffer? 100%.

The pros do not outweigh the cons when it comes to benzodiazepines. My advice to you is to avoid them, and to get out of the environment that is likely worsening your mental health. There are so many avenues for a brilliant person like you that will not come at the expense of your health, happiness, and sanity.

Take care of your body, and your body will take care of you.

Good luck<3
 
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