USMLE 246; COMLEX 689

[CardiacLion]

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Hi MS-3 DO Student here.

Never thought I'd be in this position to be considering fields other than primary care, but someone up above has been looking out for me and I am grateful for my scores. USMLE Step 1: 246 and COMLEX Level 1: 689.

What fields am I competitive for with my board scores? I am interested in learning more about AOA surgical sub-specialty fields, but have no experience in any of them. I also have a vested interest in ACGME programs for EM, IM, or anesthesia. Would I be competitive enough for a chance at residency at a major academic center?

I have two first-author publications (SAEM), and am looking to bust my ass during MS-3 to honor as many systems as possible, and do well on STEP 2.

 

[Rekt]

Hi MS-3 DO Student here.

Never thought I'd be in this position to be considering fields other than primary care, but someone up above has been looking out for me and I am grateful for my scores. USMLE Step 1: 246 and COMLEX Level 1: 689.

What fields am I competitive for with my board scores? I am interested in learning more about AOA surgical sub-specialty fields, but have no experience in any of them. I also have a vested interest in ACGME programs for EM, IM, or anesthesia. Would I be competitive enough for a chance at residency at a major academic center?

I have two first-author publications (SAEM), and am looking to bust my ass during MS-3 to honor as many systems as possible, and do well on STEP 2.

Don't pick a field because of your scores, pick one because of your interest. "Major academic center" is pretty vague, but it will difficult for anyone, not just DOs. Your scores are good, but you need to figure out what you want to do first.

 

[CardiacLion]

Don't pick a field because of your scores, pick one because of your interest. "Major academic center" is pretty vague, but it will difficult for anyone, not just DOs. Your scores are good, but you need to figure out what you want to do first.

I'm not really sure what I want to do, but I'd like to know what I'm realistically competitive for that is worth exploring and learning more about.

Top 20 Academic Programs for IM, EM, or Anesthesia at all possible?

 

[Goro]

I'm not really sure what I want to do, but I'd like to know what I'm realistically competitive for that is worth exploring and learning more about.

Top 20 Academic Programs for IM, EM, or Anesthesia at all possible?

With scores like those you might be one of my kids. here's what I'd advise you...check this out and get an idea of your baseline as to how DO-friendly a program/field might be, and contact your school's grads or OMSIV's and see what they advise. You might very well be one of those door-opening Lotto winners that I keep seeing pop up more often.

http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/NRMP-2016-Program-Director-Survey.pdf

Congrats, and good luck!

Also keep in mind that just because it's in a Top 20, it doesn't mean it's good. For this, seek out the advice of our wise residents and attendings.

 

[ortnakas]

Never thought I'd be in this position to be considering fields other than primary care

I am interested in learning more about AOA surgical sub-specialty fields

I also have a vested interest in ACGME programs for EM, IM, or anesthesia.

Figure out what you're actually interested in. You're in the fortunate position where your score doesn't push you toward how you have to decide on a specialty. But on the other hand, if you've always actually been interested in primary care, don't let having good scores stop you.

 

[JamesPotterMS-3]

From my conversations with attendings, IM at university programs can be a hit or miss because many are looking for research driven students. Keep that in mind.

 

[W19]

I'm not really sure what I want to do, but I'd like to know what I'm realistically competitive for that is worth exploring and learning more about.

Top 20 Academic Programs for IM, EM, or Anesthesia at all possible?

No...

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

No...

That's not 100% true, if the rest of his app is in order the top programs of Anesthesia are possible. Top IM is definitely out (is for all DOs basically) but for anesthesia OP can get to a top program. Won't comment on EM because I know less about the field and what is competitive for top programs.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

I'm not really sure what I want to do, but I'd like to know what I'm realistically competitive for that is worth exploring and learning more about.

Top 20 Academic Programs for IM, EM, or Anesthesia at all possible?

Unfortunately IM and EM are not possible. Anesthesia are probably not possible either

I think you aren't competitive for anything top 20 besides maybe pediatrics, family medicine and pathology.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Top PM&R is definitely doable with those score, there were DOs on here who had lower board scores and got interviews at these places.

I do think OP has a chance at the upper-mid tier programs for Anesthesia.

Top programs in IM and EM are probably out of reach.

 

[CardiacLion]

Thanks for all the replies guys! I'll take all this into consideration, and reach out to some faculty mentors to help me guide my decisions.

For my COMLEX score, do I have a solid chance of matching AOA Urology, ENT, or Optho? Just trying to explore my options.

 

[Rekt]

That's not 100% true, if the rest of his app is in order the top programs of Anesthesia are possible. Top IM is definitely out (is for all DOs basically) but for anesthesia OP can get to a top program. Won't comment on EM because I know less about the field and what is competitive for top programs.

Mostly closed due to being a DO for top EM.

 

[MelMcT2009]

Mostly closed due to being a DO for top EM.

What are you considering "top EM"? Even Denver has one DO right now. Sure, it's obviously not likely, but a lot of the "top" programs (read: big names) do have DOs in them.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

What are you considering "top EM"? Even Denver has one DO right now. Sure, it's obviously not likely, but a lot of the "top" programs (read: big names) do have DOs in them.

Some of the "big names" are not top EM programs.

This is a big name EM program. Here is 5 years of its resident roster, not a single DO. Hell, 90% of them are from top 40 usmd schools.

highland-em

 

[IsWhat]

Some of the "big names" are not top EM programs.

This is a big name EM program. Here is 5 years of its resident roster, not a single DO. Hell, 90% of them are from top 40 usmd schools.

highland-em

Denver Health is easily a top tier EM program.

 

[MelMcT2009]

Some of the "big names" are not top EM programs.

This is a big name EM program. Here is 5 years of its resident roster, not a single DO. Hell, 90% of them are from top 40 usmd schools.

highland-em

Yes,which is why I was asking what they considered to be a top program. I'm applying EM this cycle and am hoping to stay in the south. Other than the Tennessee programs and a few others, most programs had DOs on their list.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

Denver Health is easily a top tier EM program.

Sure. How many DOs make it its class?

 

[IsWhat]

Sure. How many DOs make it its class?

They've had many DOs in the past, in fact I believe their chief resident last year was a DO.

Also, It's entirely plausible that most years their aren't actually any DO students who are competitive for these top tier programs. It doesn't necessarily mean they aren't receptive to the right DO candidate. For that reason we shouldn't tell DO students with 245+ step 1s they aren't competetive for ceiling programs (especially in EM), because they may be.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

They've had many DOs in the past, in fact I believe their chief resident last year was a DO.

Also, It's entirely plausible that most years their aren't actually any DO students who are competitive for these top tier programs. It doesn't necessarily mean they aren't receptive to the right DO candidate. For that reason we shouldn't tell DO students with 245+ step 1s they aren't competetive for ceiling programs (especially in EM), because they may be.

EM competitiveness is very different from just a few years ago. I see one DO in 5 years worth of class with about 15 people each year in Denver EM's roster. I suppose that's relatively friendly as far as good program goes. Still not sure if it's a top 20 program. Can any EM resident chime in?

 

[jw3600]

Their newest class has zero DOs. Too lazy to check further back. Stop talking out of your ass.

 

[jw3600]

EM competitiveness is very different from just a few years ago. I see one DO in 5 years worth of class with about 15 people each year in Denver EM's roster. I suppose that's relatively friendly as far as good program goes. Still not sure if it's a top 20 program. Can any EM resident chime in?

You are 100% correct. It's not DO friendly. And yes it's a top program.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

Their newest class has zero DOs. Too lazy to check further back. Stop talking out of your ass.

1 in 75 or so resident in that program in the roater is a DO grad. I did bother to go back all 5 years.

Hey, at least they match and persumably interview DOs. Many programs don't even interview DOs in my specialty.

 

[MelMcT2009]

1 in 75 or so resident in that program in the roater is a DO grad. I did bother to go back all 5 years.

Hey, at least they match and persumably interview DOs. Many programs don't even interview DOs in my specialty.

Yeah my point wasn't to say that they were DO friendly, but that they at least have one. Meaning that while it's highly unlikely, its not impossible. Whereas the top programs in IM seem literally impossible (ie would not throw my money at those programs at all) to break in to, regardless of what scores you have.

Best of luck to OP

 

[IsWhat]

EM competitiveness is very different from just a few years ago. I see one DO in 5 years worth of class with about 15 people each year in Denver EM's roster. I suppose that's relatively friendly as far as good program goes. Still not sure if it's a top 20 program. Can any EM resident chime in?

I'm aware EM has gotten more competetive. It also has some interesting safe guards like the SLOE (and now video interview) that somewhat deters programs from outright rejecting what may be a better candidate simply based on the letters after their name. I don't believe any DO with excellent board scores and a presumably excellent all around application should be persuaded from applying to top tier EM programs. This isn't IM.

 

[surfguy84]

1 in 75 or so resident in that program in the roater is a DO grad. I did bother to go back all 5 years.

Hey, at least they match and persumably interview DOs. Many programs don't even interview DOs in my specialty.

Why would a program interview DOs if they don't plan to rank them to match?

 

[DrfluffyMD]

Why would a program interview DOs if they don't plan to rank them to match?

I mean a program can still interview DOs and say, rank in the bottom 50% of their list. When the specialty is competitive, they will always match people in the top half of their list. When the specialty is less competitive, they will match DOs. Simple as that.

 

[W19]

Strange that people are even using Denver Health is DO as a program that take DO when they have accepted 1 DO; I repeat 1 DO student in past 5 years. 1/75 = 0.013% 😛

 

[JamesPotterMS-3]

OP, honestly, most of the advice on this thread is crap. Your numbers are solid for ACGME EM, IM, gas, GS, etc in most cities. Depending on how many sub-I slots your school gives you, you can honestly also try AOA (or formerly AOA) surgery programs.

 

[JamesPotterMS-3]

Strange that people are even using Denver Health is DO as a program that take DO when they have accepted 1 DO; I repeat 1 DO student in past 5 years. 1/75 = 0.013% 😛

Welcome to SDN.

 

[kenjixshadow]

Yeah my point wasn't to say that they were DO friendly, but that they at least have one. Meaning that while it's highly unlikely, its not impossible. Whereas the top programs in IM seem literally impossible (ie would not throw my money at those programs at all) to break in to, regardless of what scores you have.

Best of luck to OP

This is absolutely correct. My mentor was a chief resident there. Denver program cares less about the letters behind your last name. They care if you are the best of the best. Speaking of which, if there is any DO can break into Denver EM again, I can see that person be either you and/or @PianoMedic since you both have the calibers for it. Keep me update on that lol.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Strange that people are even using Denver Health is DO as a program that take DO when they have accepted 1 DO; I repeat 1 DO student in past 5 years. 1/75 = 0.013% 😛

This is controversial question. If it has even taken a DO at all, it means two things 1) there was that one DO who was "that competitive" amidst the beasts of UCSF, John's Hopkins and the likes or 2) their program or the field of EM has gotten less competitive. However, I am doubting the latter and believe its more the former.

EDIT: Seems kenjixshadow has got this covered...

 

[Event_Horizon]

Not to hijack the OP's thread, but would I be able to apply all the information stated here to myself as well? I am also just beginning to unravel what specialty I may actually want to do and find myself in a very fortunate situation with board scores. Originally, I had a lot of interest in Rads/Neuro/PMR due to loving imaging and anatomy and I definitely knew I didn't want to have a surgeon's life. However, now I am considering IM sub-specialties (one with good work/life balance) and perhaps ENT or anesthesia. USMLE: 250s, COMLEX: 800s

I am just struggling with where to start and what I should be looking for in a program or if I am even competitive for a program as a DO with great board scores. Sifting through all the info on this site as well as FRIEDA is very time consuming. Any help appreciated!

 

[DrfluffyMD]

Not to hijack the OP's thread, but would I be able to apply all the information stated here to myself as well? I am also just beginning to unravel what specialty I may actually want to do and find myself in a very fortunate situation with board scores. Originally, I had a lot of interest in Rads/Neuro/PMR due to loving imaging and anatomy and I definitely knew I didn't want to have a surgeon's life. However, now I am considering IM sub-specialties (one with good work/life balance) and perhaps ENT or anesthesia. USMLE: 250s, COMLEX: 800s

I am just struggling with where to start and what I should be looking for in a program or if I am even competitive for a program as a DO with great board scores. Sifting through all the info on this site as well as FRIEDA is very time consuming. Any help appreciated!

AOA subspecialty surgery programs should be open.

 

[Robotfishbrain]

No...

After taking just one second to look at a residency program near me that is always top 20 (according to Doximity) in EM and I found DOs in it.

Current Residents | Residency | Emergency Medicine | IU School of Medicine

You are part of the ignorant mass that posts on this forum. Please use sources when replying to people's post asking for information about their futures, or just don't post at all.

To OP: Your future is too valuable to be asking random strangers on the internet. Take @Goro 's advice and speak with your school and OMSIV students.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

After taking just one second to look at a residency program near me that is always top 20 (according to Doximity) in EM and I found DOs in it.

Current Residents | Residency | Emergency Medicine | IU School of Medicine

You are part of the ignorant mass that posts on this forum. Please use sources when replying to people's post asking for information about their futures, or just don't post at all.

To OP: Your future is too valuable to be asking random strangers on the internet. Take @Goro 's advice and speak with your school and OMSIV students.

You can't go by doximity dude. Don't rely your future on doximity either. Either way my buddies in EM said they aren't aware IU as a top program.

 

[Robotfishbrain]

I understand the issues with doximity. But to say that your buddies aren't away of IU being a top EM program is a bit odd. Even people on SDN believe IU ranks in at least the top 15 -- Residency Rankings Emergency - US News Best Hospitals.

I honestly can only find 2 lists that don't include IU in it.

The point of my post was to direct OP to his school's resources instead of this random thread.

 

[ThreeCheers]

Current Residents | Residency | Emergency Medicine | IU School of Medicine

"She earned her MD from the University of Arizona College of Medicine."
"She earned her MD from Kirksville College of Osteopathic Medicine."
"She earned her MD from Rocky Vista University School of Osteopathic Medicine."

LOL.

 

[IsWhat]

You can't go by doximity dude. Don't rely your future on doximity either. Either way my buddies in EM said they aren't aware IU as a top program.

Indiana is a top 10 EM program.

 

[W19]

After taking just one second to look at a residency program near me that is always top 20 (according to Doximity) in EM and I found DOs in it.

Current Residents | Residency | Emergency Medicine | IU School of Medicine

You are part of the ignorant mass that posts on this forum. Please use sources when replying to people's post asking for information about their futures, or just don't post at all.

To OP: Your future is too valuable to be asking random strangers on the internet. Take @Goro 's advice and speak with your school and OMSIV students.

Doximity is your source... Great!

 

[Robotfishbrain]

Doximity is your source... Great!

Yup, see how posting a source is really important? Now people can discuss my info based on that instead of one word answers.

 

[CardiacLion]

For my COMLEX score, do I have a solid chance of matching AOA Urology, ENT, or Optho? Just trying to explore my options.

So guys to answer my original question lol.... what do you guys think about AOA surgical sub specialties and optho?

Where's the best place to get info on the above programs like average board scores, past residents (a lot of this is not available on AOA program specific sites.

 

[AlteredScale]

So guys to answer my original question lol.... what do you guys think about AOA surgical sub specialties and optho?

Where's the best place to get info on the above programs like average board scores, past residents (a lot of this is not available on AOA program specific sites.

AMA FRIEDA


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Mad Jack]

Unfortunately IM and EM are not possible. Anesthesia are probably not possible either

I think you aren't competitive for anything top 20 besides maybe pediatrics, family medicine and pathology.

Anesthesia is definitely doable with those scores. You'd be surprised how much anesthesia has fallen these days.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Yup, see how posting a source is really important? Now people can discuss my info based on that instead of one word answers.

You know how doximity works right? I will use an analogy that I learned from a teacher in high school. Its like a beauty pageant amongst residency programs. Its not the most beautiful woman that wins, but the most popular. This is what doximity is...

 

[Robotfishbrain]

You know how doximity works right? I will use an analogy that I learned from a teacher in high school. Its like a beauty pageant amongst residency programs. Its not the most beautiful woman that wins, but the most popular. This is what doximity is...

Yup it has already been said on this thread. Keep reading though, IU is definitely considered a top 20 EM program that takes DO's. My point still stands.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Yup it has already been said on this thread. Keep reading though, IU is definitely considered a top 20 EM program that takes DO's. My point still stands.

I don't disagree with that being a top program. I disagree with you using doximity as a trustable resource when its not. Just because it matches up with the responses doesn't mean its trustable. A more naive member will see it as such as gospel if not warned.

 

[Event_Horizon]

AOA subspecialty surgery programs should be open.

I am going to assume that I would be in the same position as OP in looking at academic ACGME residencies - eg. limiting factor noting being board scores but whether or not the program actually interviews/ranks DOs? I am at a program in the Midwest, but I am from CA, so I would be looking to mainly stay in the midwest or go back to CA. Obviously, I am looking to get into the best program I can.